joelmarj Posted January 19, 2006 #76 Share Posted January 19, 2006 [quote name='NeptunesGoddess']They both had appointments at the spa, my guess is, she thought she would see him there. I don't want to sound like I am all for her and championing her story...I am just playing the devil's advocate here. Does she seem kinda fishy in the way she conducts herself? Yes, a little, but not in the way she is dealing with the grief of the situation. She seems like she is trying to "stay" upset with RCCL so she can get something from them. Do I think RCCL should have paid to fly her home so her father didn't have to wire $1000 dollars to her? Absolutely, but I don't think RCCL needs to pay for any other "damages".[/quote] First off, she showed up at her spa appointment 2 hours early. So why would she assume he was there too? She said on TV that she assumed he was sleeping with friends. Wouldn't you go find that out before showing up to your spa appointment 2 hours earlier? Additionally, if you recall they had to provide her with a change of clothes. This is because she showed up at the spa in her clothes from the night before. Now, if she apparently woke refreshed and ready to go, why not shower and change in to clean clothes before showing up for an appointment 2 hours early and not even bother to phone the friends to see if hubby is there. Sounds very odd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caprcorn28 Posted January 19, 2006 #77 Share Posted January 19, 2006 [quote name='lynyrd']If I remember what she said correctly, she said that she doesn't remember fighting and really doesn't believe that they did. Witnesses say they were fighting and she is having a hard time believing this because they never fought and have always gotten along.[/quote] I suppose you have to understand what [I]they[/I] mean by fighting...does that mean verbal or physical? My husband and I have never physically fought (he would sooo lose!! LOL) but have we fought with words? Heck yeah. And we get a long famously. Been married for almost 15 years... I just don't believe when people say "they never fight"...Then someone is giving in or not communicating their needs or something...You can't live with anyone and not disagree about something once in awhile...especially living together and planning a wedding. Puhleeze. Been there!! Talk about stress. Planning a wedding can be the most stressful thing that some people do! Couples that I have known over the years that have said "We never fight..." have all divorced and those divorces have been nasty. Too much pent up anger....I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeptunesGoddess Posted January 19, 2006 #78 Share Posted January 19, 2006 True Val..I guess I always assumed that the passengers that carried him back were the Russians, but has that ever really been said for sure? Why have these "Russian Guys" not had any focus on them? Is it true I heard they were escorted off the ship later for being under suscipcion for rape? If that is true, it would be interesting to know if, in that case, they believe a "date-rape" drug was used. How come these questions haven't been answered?...or, at least, publicized? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoinCruisin Posted January 19, 2006 #79 Share Posted January 19, 2006 [quote name='lynyrd']If I remember what she said correctly, she said that she doesn't remember fighting and really doesn't believe that they did. Witnesses say they were fighting and she is having a hard time believing this because they never fought and have always gotten along. Another witness says she did not appear to have been drinking. That she did not even seem the least bit intoxicated. I just don't get this. If she was drugged she was probably drinking in order for someone to be able to to this to her. If she was drugged, she would probably appear to be intoxicated. :confused:[/quote] In the interview she said they were drinking... and seemed to dance around the question as to how much saying something like "well I don't remember what happened, so enough to make that happen"... not in those words, but that was how I took it. If it was Royhpnol (roofies), the side effects are: [INDENT]The most common effects include; disinhibition and amnesia, excitability or aggressive behavior, decreased blood pressure, memory impairment, drowsiness, visual disturbances, semi-consciousness, dizziness, confusion, stomach disturbances, and urinary retention.[/INDENT] [COLOR=#cc5fff][B]How quickly does it act on/leave the system?[/B][/COLOR] [INDENT]It is quick acting, with noticeable effects occurring within 20 minutes of ingestion. Mixed without alcohol the effects last 8 - 12 hours, with alcohol the effects last longer, up to 36 hours. After ingestion it can be found in the blood stream for 24 hours and in urine samples for 48 hours.[/INDENT] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobbyfarms Posted January 19, 2006 #80 Share Posted January 19, 2006 While on our 01/01/06 Conquest cruise, a fellow passenger told of a newly wed couple coming to grief. Apparently the wife had been fliriting with three other men. When her husband stepped in, as would be expected by a newly married man, the three men threw the husband overboard. Don't know if this is the Oprah story, but it would fit, and it would explain why the wife is not telling much. Has there been any discussion of the 15 year old girl who jumped off the Costa ship in Cozumel the week of our cruise. There were 5 ships in port the day we were there. Sure sad news for all the passengers. I kept a much more careful watch on my sons the rest of our cruise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ValCat84 Posted January 19, 2006 #81 Share Posted January 19, 2006 While on our 01/01/06 Conquest cruise, a fellow passenger told of a newly wed couple coming to grief. Apparently the wife had been fliriting with three other men. When her husband stepped in, as would be expected by a newly married man, the three men threw the husband overboard. Don't know if this is the Oprah story, but it would fit, and it would explain why the wife is not telling much. Has there been any discussion of the 15 year old girl who jumped off the Costa ship in Cozumel the week of our cruise. There were 5 ships in port the day we were there. Sure sad news for all the passengers. I kept a much more careful watch on my sons the rest of our cruise. Wait, that happened on your cruise?? :eek: that's horrible. people are crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoinCruisin Posted January 19, 2006 #82 Share Posted January 19, 2006 True Val..I guess I always assumed that the passengers that carried him back were the Russians, but has that ever really been said for sure? Why have these "Russian Guys" not had any focus on them? Is it true I heard they were escorted off the ship later for being under suscipcion for rape? If that is true, it would be interesting to know if, in that case, they believe a "date-rape" drug was used. How come these questions haven't been answered?...or, at least, publicized? The 3 men put off the ship in Italy were all Americans... rumors are that 2 of the men had escorted Smith back to his cabin (twice) the night he went missing. Everything is under investigation, which is why all we will hear is speculation, and why you won't see many of these people publicly interviewed for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoinCruisin Posted January 19, 2006 #83 Share Posted January 19, 2006 While on our 01/01/06 Conquest cruise, a fellow passenger told of a newly wed couple coming to grief. Apparently the wife had been fliriting with three other men. When her husband stepped in, as would be expected by a newly married man, the three men threw the husband overboard. Don't know if this is the Oprah story, but it would fit, and it would explain why the wife is not telling much. Has there been any discussion of the 15 year old girl who jumped off the Costa ship in Cozumel the week of our cruise. There were 5 ships in port the day we were there. Sure sad news for all the passengers. I kept a much more careful watch on my sons the rest of our cruise. Yes there has been discussion of the 15 year old girl... as to whether she jumped or fell while throwing up, it's speculation right now. You can do a search and read more about it... As for the story you were told... could be, there are alot of rumors that have floated around over the past 6 months, so it could have been the same couple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobbyfarms Posted January 19, 2006 #84 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Yes there has been discussion of the 15 year old girl... as to whether she jumped or fell while throwing up, it's speculation right now. You can do a search and read more about it... We heard the story while on a shore excursion from people on the Costa ship. They had an unplanned extra day in Cozumel. They tell that that the girl had been drinking. She got into a fight with her parents and jumped overboard with the parents watching. At the time, there was no suggestion that she fell. It sounded very deliberate. As my son put it, "sounds like she had issues". Very sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DqALEX Posted January 19, 2006 #85 Share Posted January 19, 2006 If that was my son I would ask her to come up with a better story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoinCruisin Posted January 19, 2006 #86 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Yes there has been discussion of the 15 year old girl... as to whether she jumped or fell while throwing up, it's speculation right now. You can do a search and read more about it... We heard the story while on a shore excursion from people on the Costa ship. They had an unplanned extra day in Cozumel. They tell that that the girl had been drinking. She got into a fight with her parents and jumped overboard with the parents watching. At the time, there was no suggestion that she fell. It sounded very deliberate. As my son put it, "sounds like she had issues". Very sad. There are also rumors that she was throwing up over the side of the ship and fell... there are alot of rumors about this one. Some of her friends have posted on the Costa forum and have said she would never have jumped. You can't believe everything you hear... I don't think anything definitive has been announced, and there have been suggestions in the media, that she fell while throwing up, and there have been people that have said she jumped.... but until I hear something conclusive, it could have been either... there are just too many "rumors" about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoinCruisin Posted January 19, 2006 #87 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Yes there has been discussion of the 15 year old girl... as to whether she jumped or fell while throwing up, it's speculation right now. You can do a search and read more about it... We heard the story while on a shore excursion from people on the Costa ship. They had an unplanned extra day in Cozumel. They tell that that the girl had been drinking. She got into a fight with her parents and jumped overboard with the parents watching. At the time, there was no suggestion that she fell. It sounded very deliberate. As my son put it, "sounds like she had issues". Very sad. Here are the rumors that were circulating the ship: 1. She had an argument with her parents and jumped, commiting suicide. 2. She fell over board (She was drunk and was getting sick over the railing when she fell) some say she hit a lifeboat on her way down which left her unconcious and unable to save herself Also, here are some news reports... :( http://www.rte.ie/news/2006/0106/mexico.html http://www.utvlive.com/newsroom/indepth.asp?id=68869&pt=n http://www.irishexaminer.com/pport/web/ireland/Full_Story/did-sgmEKKTz4vGMYsgTbBP-2fa91M.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan40 Posted January 19, 2006 #88 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Law enforcement always looks at the spouse long and hard in any case of foul play. Why? Experience has taught them. There may be a trial in this case but I think it will be the state vs. JS. With RCCL only a witness for the prosecution. RCCL will have documentation of everything they did as well as an awful lot of docs. on what the couple did and when. Like bar bills, where, what, how much, etc. They might have some video tape as well. As far as the show is concerned, I think RCCL let themselves be a whipping boy for JS. If there is litigation, they will bring out all the proofs and bury her. Oprahs friend is no reporter, she became involved with one side, even became a spokesperson for JS. That's not reporting, that's yellow journalism. She stunk. Could be Scot Peterson is going to get a cellmate. JS sounds like a fertilizer salesperson too. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncoboxer Posted January 19, 2006 #89 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Oprahs friend is no reporter, No surprise there. Neither is Oprah. she became involved with one side, even became a spokesperson for JS. That's not reporting, that's yellow journalism. She stunk.Dan It's not supposed to be reporting. The Oprah show is like an editorial in a newspaper. It's goal is not to report that facts and nothing else--it's goal is to state an opinion in an entertaining way. All the same, I agree with you. She stunk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halos Posted January 19, 2006 #90 Share Posted January 19, 2006 She stunk. I'm having a hard time getting over that fact. I love Oprah but what was she thinking????????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
planb Posted January 20, 2006 #91 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Just my thoughts, but she did mention they "found her" and took her by wheelchair... She said they had known each other, lived together and it was their honeymoon. Well I cruise with my husband of 8 years and we are on a cruise to be together and I have been very happily drunk and have never lost sight or whereabouts of my husband or of my own morals or senses. Understanding the law ,yes she is innocent and not linked directly to the loss of him, but having been widowed young too as she is , and talking about such a tragic loss, I do not understand her complete composure. Yes we are all differnt, but I saw little emotional loss as much as I saw "what are you going to do or give to me". Just my thoguhts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salty dingo Posted January 20, 2006 #92 Share Posted January 20, 2006 You know, people get drunk at bars all the time, and get knifed or shot. Happens every week, in just about every big city, just look at the newspaper. It happens because the wrong type of people get together and get loaded out of their minds. Why is it difficult to accept that the same sort of thing that happens on land may have happened on a ship? Maybe the victim just fell overboard, or maybe he mouthed off to a thug who beat the $#!* out of him and just tossed him over the rail? That's murder but it is not a scandal. No one is covering it up. As I said, this happens all the time on land. When it does, people do not go on Oprah over this sort of thing, or demand compensation from the bar. It made news not because of what happened, but because of where it happened. On a "luxury" cruise ship. To a "newlywed". Conjures up all sorts of images, but in reality it was just some drunks who got themselves in a world of trouble and got one killed. There is a victim here, but I'm afraid he was not an innocent victim. And as for the FBI telling people to keep quiet... that does not indicate a scandal. It is simply a good policy to avoid compromising their investigation. If too many facts were given out, it would be good for the bad guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hstrybuf Posted January 20, 2006 #93 Share Posted January 20, 2006 You know, people get drunk at bars all the time, and get knifed or shot. Happens every week, in just about every big city, just look at the newspaper. It happens because the wrong type of people get together and get loaded out of their minds. Why is it difficult to accept that the same sort of thing that happens on land may have happened on a ship? Maybe the victim just fell overboard, or maybe he mouthed off to a thug who beat the $#!* out of him and just tossed him over the rail? That's murder but it is not a scandal. No one is covering it up. As I said, this happens all the time on land. When it does, people do not go on Oprah over this sort of thing, or demand compensation from the bar. It made news not because of what happened, but because of where it happened. On a "luxury" cruise ship. To a "newlywed". Conjures up all sorts of images, but in reality it was just some drunks who got themselves in a world of trouble and got one killed. There is a victim here, but I'm afraid he was not an innocent victim. And as for the FBI telling people to keep quiet... that does not indicate a scandal. It is simply a good policy to avoid compromising their investigation. If too many facts were given out, it would be good for the bad guys. Wow! That makes excellent sense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobbyfarms Posted January 20, 2006 #94 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Here are the rumors that were circulating the ship: 1. She had an argument with her parents and jumped, commiting suicide. 2. She fell over board (She was drunk and was getting sick over the railing when she fell) some say she hit a lifeboat on her way down which left her unconcious and unable to save herself Also, here are some news reports... :( http://www.rte.ie/news/2006/0106/mexico.html http://www.utvlive.com/newsroom/indepth.asp?id=68869&pt=n http://www.irishexaminer.com/pport/web/ireland/Full_Story/did-sgmEKKTz4vGMYsgTbBP-2fa91M.asp Thanks Lucy. I looked up the news reports. I would like to think it an accident. As a parent I cannot imagine the alternative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelWorks Posted January 20, 2006 #95 Share Posted January 20, 2006 I was told that they were drinking a very powerful alcoholic drink that sometimes makes you feel like you have been druged. I'm not a bit afraid, but I plan on being aware and careful. Just like any women traveling now a days. Absinthe...is the name of the alchohol...it is illeagel..over 180 proof and has mind altering effects...it was used a lot by artists like VanGough...(He cut his ear off!!!) They snuck the stuff on board and were willingly taking shots of it in the disco bar sometime between 2:30 and 4 am.....this was all in the original testimony given by the "boys" and Jen when they were questioned by the Turkish authorities...It maybe one of the reasons she hightailed it home... Illeagal drugs/alchohol not looked upon favorably by the cruise lines...I am surprised they aren't counter-sueing for this! I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeptunesGoddess Posted January 20, 2006 #96 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Absinthe is not illegal everywhere. It is in the U.S...but they weren't in the U.S. and the ship isn't registered there. It would probably be difficult to sue..not to mention, many believe it is only still illegal in the U.S. because it is an old law that really has no basis. Sort of like the silly laws that are still on the books in many states/cities. Most of the things that people believe about Absinthe are myths because of the way they make absinthe in this day and age. Sorta like how way back when..Coca-Cola had Cocaine it, much of the same is true of the dangers of absinthe long ago. This talks of the myths associated with absinthe. http://www.sallys-place.com/beverages/spirits/absinthe.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelWorks Posted January 20, 2006 #97 Share Posted January 20, 2006 True Val..I guess I always assumed that the passengers that carried him back were the Russians, but has that ever really been said for sure? Why have these "Russian Guys" not had any focus on them? Is it true I heard they were escorted off the ship later for being under suscipcion for rape? If that is true, it would be interesting to know if, in that case, they believe a "date-rape" drug was used. How come these questions haven't been answered?...or, at least, publicized? What kills me is Months ago when I googled this whole messy affair after hearing a small blurb on the news...I only pulled up two articles and one was pretty extensive. I got a reporter that was interviewing everyone and had translated copies of the Turkey interviews...I read it all...like a 40 page report online...now I can't find that stuff anywhere...probably been pulled by the FBI and now everything out there is speculation and gossip and people are saying the darndest stuff~ It is worse than ever. The transcripts and interviews I read ....were down right creepy...and very specific and surprisingly detailed. Right down to the type of shots they were drinking in the disco...because they had smuggled Absinthe on board...and were doing some pretty heavy rounds accourding to the transcripts I was reading. Accourding to the transcripts of the interviews in Turkey that I read... The three Russian "american" boys and another "teen" , an 18 or 19 year old boy, (I believe his name was Josh?) all helped George back to the cabin...they realized Jen wasn't there...and went looking for her...when they didn't find her they came back a second time...still dragging George along half out of it... That is when all the noise starts up that the neighbors reported hearing.... They have this all on video surveylence, which RCCL said they gave to the FBI....according to RCCL's lawyers statements. In the mean time Jen is so messed up she was apparently helped out of an elevator at one point by a maintanence guy...he asked if she needed further help...she declines, wonders off down the wrong hall...later to be found again and taken to her room by wheel chair... & the CRUISE SHIP WASN'T THE ONLY ONES TO SPEED THROUGH THE INVESTIGATION: There was a rush by some being interviewed... Also during the interview transcripts I read...the "Other" teen's parents were with him when he testified...and he said more than once during the interview, something like...I am not going to let them pin this on Jen...the parent's kept consoling him and said stuff to him like ...just tell them what they want to hear...Let's hurry up and get out of here...They just want to know when the last time you saw Mr Smith was....Do not give them more information them what they are asking you dear.... Sadly everyone was on vacation and no one wanted to be bothered...this kid now has his own lawyer accourding to everything I am reading about him now...& the Russian brothers and cousin have there own lawyers too now. My speculation about the spa thing: Maybe she showed up at the spa half awake, still in the clothes from the night before...trying to figure out where the **** her husband was...and sat there in a half drunken stuper for an hour before her appointment started...maybe she went into the massage because they said,"Okay your turn...let's go..Room #2...Here is your robe..." She could have just been following aimlessly... wondering why she felt so funky and too messed up to react when her husband didn't show up~ Once after emergency surgery I had that sort of ~ What happened feeling...Where am I? dazed thing and I literally got up and started to wander away... I really want Oprah to interview the spa person who was giving her the treatment..."Was she alert!?" "Was she anxious?" "Did she mention her husband should be there?" Where is the spa attendants? Has anyone heard that they have been questioned? If she was only half with it maybe she was still not sober...or thinking clearly enough to react wisely the whole dramatic day.... Even so... I would never leave my husband...especially because they were still searching for him in the waters around Greece where they thought he could be.... based on the time frame...RCCL was still looking...Why wasn't she? That is weird to me. Plus, she is worried because she doesn't have the ship's security to protect her during an investigation... Hello! They can't protect you from being questioned if they suspect foul play....Even in America...the spouse and family members are always the first suspected.... Look at what Elizabeth Smart's parents went through! They were the first to be suspected...while the real kidnapper was right under their noses in the hills behind their home! You can't avoid this...not here...not in Turkey...and not on RCCL's ships...the Captain cannot protect you from the Law! Random thoughts...not probably even worth 2 cents...have a nice Friday tomorrow everyone...and I am so glad that i love to cruise....The more people and the media keep saying, "Cruise Ships aren't safe" the better I think the deals will get this year! Hopefully!:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelWorks Posted January 20, 2006 #98 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Absinthe is not illegal everywhere. It is in the U.S...but they weren't in the U.S. and the ship isn't registered there. It would probably be difficult to sue..not to mention, many believe it is only still illegal in the U.S. because it is an old law that really has no basis. Sort of like the silly laws that are still on the books in many states/cities. Most of the things that people believe about Absinthe are myths because of the way they make absinthe in this day and age. Sorta like how way back when..Coca-Cola had Cocaine it, much of the same is true of the dangers of absinthe long ago. This talks of the myths associated with absinthe. http://www.sallys-place.com/beverages/spirits/absinthe.htm Maybe the stuff isn't all created equal... http://www.newspeakdictionary.com/pf-absinthe.html Here is website on how to make it more potent from home and how drink it....and I quote them... "I drink it for the effects. It is difficult to describe exactly what absinthe does to you. The effects are mild when compared to some other drugs available out there, but are very nice none-the-less. The best way I can describe the effects of drinking 5 glasses of absinthe is that it is similar to drinking several shots of liquor, eating a single mushroom cap, and smoking a tiny amount of opium at the same time --" :eek: Nice. Anything that starts with Everclear as its base is bound to have kick...maybe too much! Maybe just a bit OVER BOARD! Pun intended! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeptunesGoddess Posted January 20, 2006 #99 Share Posted January 20, 2006 That is really interesting...I mean about stuff disappearing from the net...but it doesn't surprise me. Perhaps the most telling statement was, "I am not going to let them pin this on Jen." It certainly seems like this teen knows something. Raises even more questions. It is just like an Agatha Christie who-dunnit novel. It has sex, violence, mystery and intrigue. Wouldn't be surprised if someone is seeking out movie rights....which will just add to the sensationalism of it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeptunesGoddess Posted January 20, 2006 #100 Share Posted January 20, 2006 Maybe the stuff isn't all created equal...http://www.newspeakdictionary.com/pf-absinthe.html Here is website on how to make it more potent from home and how drink it....and I quote them... "I drink it for the effects. It is difficult to describe exactly what absinthe does to you. The effects are mild when compared to some other drugs available out there, but are very nice none-the-less. The best way I can describe the effects of drinking 5 glasses of absinthe is that it is similar to drinking several shots of liquor, eating a single mushroom cap, and smoking a tiny amount of opium at the same time --" :eek: Nice. Anything that starts with Everclear as its base is bound to have kick...maybe too much! Maybe just a bit OVER BOARD! Pun intended! I was not talking about homemade absinthe, I was speaking of absinthe that is available for purchase in the mainstream absinthe market. Heck, you can make anything in your own home that can have quite ill-effects. The absinthe that is available for purchase nowadays is not like the absinthe of long ago. I mean..you could say whiskey could be just as bad if someone makes it that way in their home. There is some pretty potent homemade liquors out there, not exclusive to absinthe. In the article you posted the link to...the person who made the homemade absinthe even writes: "And recently, it has improved (her recipe) to the point where I think it taste pretty close to the "professionally" made stuff, but I think my absithe works a little better ;)." With a wink at the end eluding to the fact that she set out just to do that very thing (make it more potent). Later on, she even mentions she doesn't drink it for taste, she drinks it for the effects..again eluding to the fact that, for her, potency is what matters...so I am sure she made it to be so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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