Pod damage verdict

[mufi]

Can anyone enlighten me about the procedures for the investigation into the QM2 pod damage incident.

 

Will there be an enquiry and will the verdict be made public.

 

I am sure anyone with an interest in passenger ships will be interested in the outcome, and it would be a pity if we were never told who, if anyone was responsible.

 

David.

[patwell]

I agree...I'm also curious about the verdict and have watched here and other sites for some inkling of what happened. And in light of the QM2s new winter cruise schedule for 2007, where she will do all the Caribbean trips from NY instead of Lauderdale, I have wondered if the incident is the reason for the change. Disappointing for us as we can easily sail from Florida but not NY...nor would I want a winter cruise to the islands that starts and ends with a couple of days of potentially foul winter-like weather. Plus I'm happy with a 7 day trip vs a 10 day with part of it being in cold conditions. Much as we would prefer to go on QM2 next winter, this change has caused me to make plans to book a HAL cruise to Aruba instead.

 

With all the publicity I can't imagine that this can be kept quiet? Or maybe it can to save face for someone. Anyone know? Cheers, Penny

[smeyer418]

The QM 2 is registered in Great Britain. They have a safety board called the MAIB which I'll find the link for and post it. Its a very public activity. Also the US Coast Guard and the NTSB investigates all damage to ships that occur within US waters. They will have to make available the final report(freedom of information) unless they classify it for some reason.

 

http://www.maib.gov.uk/latest_news/current_investigations.cfm

 

the QM 2 pod damage is NOT listed as an accident they are investigating....

[Bramcruiser]

in light of the QM2s new winter cruise schedule for 2007, where she will do all the Caribbean trips from NY instead of Lauderdale, I have wondered if the incident is the reason for the change. Disappointing for us as we can easily sail from Florida but not NY...Much as we would prefer to go on QM2 next winter, this change has caused me to make plans to book a HAL cruise to Aruba instead.

 

I too first thought that the move out of Fort Lauderdale was related to the pod accident. It made sense as Fort Lauderdale was becoming the winter home and New York was the place of residence the rest of the year. However, there seems to be a trend these days by the cruise lines to bring ships back to New York and do longer, extended cruises from there. HAL has the new Vista-class Noordam doing 10 day winter Caribbean trips and several others are announcing similar moves. So I am beginning to think that the move of the QM2 to winter trips out of New York to be in line with the competition.

 

For southerners I think this is disappointing. For us Arctic people (he he he) its nice to know that we can now go anytime close to home. Yeah a lot of people look at us northerners as being nuts for wanting to take a cruise in the cold but there seems to be enough of them. Would I? Not sure actually but I do like the fact I can cruise closer to home in much the same way Penny would love to find something close to her. Strangely I wanted to be on the QM2 bad enough that we are flying down to Fort Lauderdale to meet it.

 

HAL is a good choice Penny and you likely won't be disappointed. Hopefully the QM2 will return some day after this year. I am finding that with only two ships Cunard turns over its iteniaries faster and offers more variety with each ship than any of the other mass market lines.

[ocngypz]

The lack of affordable airlift from the NE (and seats)at times necessary to make cruiseship schedules is a big factor!!

 

RCL will be making the long haul Caribbean runs as well.

 

THANK GOD!

 

Flying down to FL is a PITA.

 

It also increases the cruiselines per diems as many people no longer have to shell out for airfare.

 

$60 rt takes me straight to Red Hook from PVD and back. It doesn't get much better than that! No driving.. no parking.. I sit back and read!

[ladymacwilly]

Can anyone enlighten me about the procedures for the investigation into the QM2 pod damage incident.

 

Will there be an enquiry and will the verdict be made public.

 

I am sure anyone with an interest in passenger ships will be interested in the outcome, and it would be a pity if we were never told who, if anyone was responsible.

 

David.

 

Interestingly enough, one of our tablemates from Florida, (on the 4/15 crossing), has a son who supposedly works in this area. We were commenting on how the ship is controlled by a "joy-stick", so to speak, and all the computerized mechanisms in place. She could not divluge much but related to us that the captain at the time, chose to disengage the computerized mechanics and decided to show his "expertise" as a seaman by commandeering the ship by his own accord. I stated that I had heard the captain had recently retired.

 

Her answer: "Yes. An early, rather sudden retirement."

 

We took the information with a grain of salt and thought it was an interesting rumour. Two days later we were up in the Commadores Lounge and heard an account from the manager there. He spoke of how normally the QM2 backs out of Ft Lauderdale gently to avoid the shallow water and then heads outward. For some reason that day, the ship backed up, backed up, backed up, an extraordinary amount of time, much further than usual, than BAM! Two blades of the pod ripped off in the sand. The ship was unable to leave for most of the day until the damage was assessed, then proceeded on. The captain retired shortly thereafter...

 

I started thinking our tablemate may have actually been on to something.

[travel-to-go]

Re:

Cruising out of New Yrok (Norfolks/Philly/Bayonne/Baltimore/Galveston/New Orleans)

After 9/11 a lot of people were afraid to fly. More to the point, many, if not most people, hated to fly, due to the increased hassle factor. Additionally, here you are, going on a cruise with formal wear, including extra shoes, make-up, accessories, and jewelry, plus "cruise wear", beach wear, and what-have-you. (not to mention th extra stuff you bring back, including our waiters and room stewards if we could manage to fit them in our luggage! <G>) The airlines, due to increased fuel costs have reduced the number of bags allowed for free, and at the same time reduced and started enforcing the weight limits. People are already paying fuel surcharges and higher airline prices for less leg and shoulder room, fewer airplanes with a 2-2 seat arrangement (which, I would say, the majority of cruise passengers probably travel in twos, or maybe fours, with kids) meaning sharing some very personal space with a stranger. And we all know about the "obesity epidemic!" (Hey! I was an early adopter! I was an innovator!) The new trend is cruisng is, As one line puts it- "Close-to-home cruising."

People do not want to waste the first day of their vacation getting there. More and more people are changing jobs frequently and starting back at the bottom of the totem pole where they only get, at best, two weeks of vacation a year. (In the US, anyway- I realize Europe's attitude towards "holiday" is different) Cruising used to a be for "rich retired people" Carnival popularized cruising for "the great unwashed"- The rest of us! Cruising has become affordable for a greater segment of the population. And of course, Cunard's in its glorious history, from the beginning served the New York, New England.

As for all you Floridians (Hey, I used to be one!) Nyah nyah! You always got to go on cheap last-minutes cruises becasue they were right there. Now it's OUR turn!

 

As for the apochryphal story about whoever was actually piloting the ship at the time, be it the harbor pilot or the ship's master. I would still take it with a grain of salt. No one really knows, or are they likely to, with the exception of a few people. As for the "joystick" vs. manual handling of the ship, sadly, this is the way of so many things today, from computer use to cars, to boats to much, much more. We dumb things down for ease of use to the point that people have lost skills they used to have. I had to think back when the first "personal computers" used DOS. Now, I don't know enough to be able to fix things when they are not working right. How many people can't drive a manual transmission, and don't know the art of housecleaning and cooking that our grandmothers new- like uses of vinegar or lemon juice and salt for both cooking and cleaning. How many of today's women (me included) can't cook a good roast or know how to dress up a cheap piece of meat to be tender and tasty? Too many of us I'm afraid.

 

And ocngypz- Hi neighbor! I didn't realize you were from the ocn state <G>

So how are you getting to Red Hook? is this bus service or scheduled limo or something? I half-heartedly looked at limos and such from Colchester, CT, or even driving into New Haven to take CT limo and decided it wasn't worth it, that having my car at the pier and just taking our time, getting our luggage loaded/unloaded was worth the $180 parking fee. But I'm open to suggestion for our September cruise if there is something better. I assume you didn't fly from PVD to JFK or LGA or something. Is there a high speed ferry? I know there was one planned out of New London, possibly.

Clue me in!

 

Karie,

Who is an amateur at travel consulting, not a knowledgeable pro like ocngypz!

[patwell]

Still disappointed at this turn of events...and no, I don't live in Florida so that's not the reason. What I find unappealing is to have to take a 10 day cruise...and pay for 10 days when probably almost 4 of them will be nasty weather. I've not sailed out of NY in winter, except to cross, but I'm assuming from what I've read here and elsewhere, that's what one would expect.When I go to the islands I want instant gratification...warm sun and all that good islandy stuff. I moved out of New England to leave the cold and snow behind. Not to mention having to lug that kind of clothing along with my warm weather stuff. I read people who call QM2 a mass market ship and shudder a bit but I wonder if this move to NY won't cement that thinking. She will after all have to compete with all the rest of the mass markets.

 

Oh well, better minds than mine have their reasons. I'm still looking forward to our Dec trip but I'm also quite intrigued by the replacement trip I've found for 2007. We're some of those people who don't fly and we're far from enthralled by the NYC area. But this is just one person's personal opinion...nothing more.

Cheers, Penny...who does know how to cook a roast and all those other things!

[NorthernNeighbour]

These days, most cruise ships can go quite fast (if necessary) so they usually make fast time the first day out of New York in order to get into warmer waters.

 

Anyway, assuming one leaves in the afternoon or early evening -- most of the very cold weather takes place during the first night's voyage when one is presumalby asleep or partying in one of the clubs on-board.

 

My opinion -- just treat the first two days out as a good opportunity to unwind, get to know the ship, sleep late and get yourself organized to enjoy the rest of the cruise in warmer waters.

 

Who needs the hassle of en-planing and de-planing through Florida (and the nightmare of airport checkpoints)? Leaving on the ship from New York means one less transfer to do (two both ways) and more time to start relaxing.

 

There will still be plenty of time to strip down to the bikini or bathing trunks once into the Caribbean for those who can stand to be dressed for much of their holiday.

[Kindlychap]

The Queen Mary 2 is not based in Fort Lauderdale. Nor is she based in New York.

 

She is registed and based in Southampton, which is why you'll see the red duster flown from the stern.

 

karie - are you serious that some people only get two weeks leave in the USA? I get six weeks, plus bank holidays (public holidays) plus an extra day at Christmas, half a day for Maundy Thursday and a day for the Queen's Birthday (The monarch, not the ship!)

 

I can't imagine surviving with only two weeks......

[guernseyguy]

some people only get two weeks leave in the USA?

 

Oh yes - in fact, for many its the norm! Productivity is difficult to measure - but undeniably Americans work longer than Europeans! Hence the popularity of 3 & 4 days cruises - which were invented by accountants at Carnival, when they realised that on-board spending tailed off after 3~4 days as people's money ran out - so chuck em off the ship & get another load on......

 

Peter

[travel-to-go]

Penny,

We left in the middle of a snowstorm with ice and freezing cold on 3 January. We ended up driving down a day early and still got caught in 30 mph traffic in snow on the highway. We left late from NYC, due to Cunard holding the ship for some flights that didn't make it in in time due to the snowstorm. Still, by mid-day the next day, we were in warm weather. By the next day, it was downright tropical! By the dawn of day three, we were anchored off of St Thomas! On the way back, it got chilly the last full day at sea, getting icy the last night.

If we had had to fly to Florida, there is a good chance we might have missed the ship, due to cancelled/late flights unless we flew in a day early. I have also had to spend the night in Atlanta and fly in the next day when we were bumped and missed our connecting flight from San Juan. We had planned to be picked up at the airport by my in-laws (I was married at the time) with our winter coats in tow. So we had no cold weather clothing. Since it was now the next day. and they had to work, we were on our own to get home. We took a taxi, and had to climb over a four foot snow drift in nothing but corduroy slacks and lightweight shirts to get into our house. Oh, did I mention our luggage came home on our original flight without us? Either way, unless you live in Florida, you run risks!

 

As for vacation. I get five weeks, four personal days, 7 holidays, two flaoting holidays and 1 desginated floating holiday. But I am in a union and have 27 years of service. Most people get two weeks, and usually have to work there at least a year, sometimes two, before they get it. Europeans have a much different attitude towards work and vacation time (and this means employers in addition to employees) Most employers recognize that a burned out employee is not only less productive, in some careers they can be dangerous. They consider the vacation an investment in a productive employee. Here, employees are nearly considerd expendable these days. My own comapny has laid off experienced technicians, hired youg new people at a third of the pay (in lower cost, non-union supporting states) and given them decision trees to troubleshoot very complex problems. Needless to say, customers aren't satisfied, but the competition is doing the same thing. Eventually, they hire more and more people to do the same work one more experienced and knowledgeable person used to do. But they don't see it that way. They also figure these new people aren't going to stay thirty years and earn a pension, making them cheaper to hire and replace. Also, many Euorpean nations have some form of socialized medicine and retirement. With a much longer history than the young US, many countries also had automatic August shut-downs for a month, when the weather (before air conditioning) was often too brutal to work.

 

So yes, it is very different over here.

 

Karie,

Who often doesn't know what to do with 5 weeks of vacation!

[lansonlady]

karie - are you serious that some people only get two weeks leave in the USA? I get six weeks, plus bank holidays (public holidays) plus an extra day at Christmas, half a day for Maundy Thursday and a day for the Queen's Birthday (The monarch, not the ship!)

 

I can't imagine surviving with only two weeks......

 

Sounds like you could be a civil servant Kindlychap? that list of leave looks very familiar to me - not everyone in the UK is fortunate to have so much leave - particularly those who work in the private sector.

[Kindlychap]

Yes - you're right - I'm a civil servant.

 

It is of course the law that a minimum of four weeks is given for leave over here.

[lansonlady]

Yes - you're right - I'm a civil servant.

 

It is of course the law that a minimum of four weeks is given for leave over here.

 

I thought so - There aren't many other occupations (if any) that recognise Maundy Thursday or the Queens birthday - and hopefully- forever shall we do so!

 

We have all sorts of laws to protect our UK workers but having spent a quarter of a century dealing with employment/unemployment I'm afraid I've seen a lot of employers that disregard the law and bully their employees into accepting far less than they are actually entitled to.

[SeaFlint]

Sorry to chime in on this so late (just signed on). But, I understand that the ship was in control of the pilot at the time and that she did back into something (???) which caused the damage.

 

I was "at sea" for about a year and it was "common knowledge" (watch out) that pilots were/are a curse to shipping. They take control of a ship and bring it in to port. My memory is that they have complete authority and zero responsibility. Which can sometimes spell trouble.

 

Please don't take my "understanding" as Gospel, but that is what I gathered when looking into it soon after.

[ricker]

I ran across this forum when I was trying to find more details on the results of an investigation...maybe someone has some recent news.

Rick

 

http://www.mastermariner.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=145&highlight=pod+damage+port+everglades