White tux or blacK?

[Transatlantic Tom]

Black Or White Tux?

 

Can I Wear My Tartan(plaid) Tux On Qm2 Formal Nights

 

To:)

 

On average, I've seen approximately four or five gentlemen dressed in kilts on every crossing I have made aboard QE2. My tastes in attire are rather conservative, and I love the formality one experiences on QE2. I love seeing the kilts with ruffled shirts, just as I enjoy seeing a formal military uniform on occasion.

 

I would suggest you wear it.

 

After all, QE2 is a Scotland/Glasgow/Clydebank-built ship, isn't she ???

 

Tom:)

[Fifer]

Hi Tomanduna,

 

As a (fellow?) Scot, I would encourage you to wear the tartan. It always looks striking and - as others have said - is a common enough sight on most voyages.

 

For those you are uncertain as to what 'wearing the tartan' might mean, try this link for a glimpse at the possibilities - http://www.kinlochanderson.com/KAbrochure.pdf

 

Fifer - who may yet show his knees at Christmas on the QE2 but who worries about the consequences

 

PS For Karie, I seem to have fallen into the habit of copying your closing style. My only excuse is that it works so well. My apologies to you.

[pnhmrk]

For those you are uncertain as to what 'wearing the tartan' might mean, try this link for a glimpse at the possibilities - http://www.kinlochanderson.com/KAbrochure.pdf

 

No tartan DJ though. The waist coats on page 11 are about as close as they get.

[Kindlychap]

Malcolm,

I Am Somewhat Bemused By Your Uninformed Comments About Tartan.

A Black Watch Dinner Jacket Was Considered Appropriate Attire When I Was Presented To Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth 2nd At A Gala Ball At Culzean Castle In The Not To Disrant Past.

I Therefore Assumed It Would Be Suitable To Dress In On A Ship Named After Her, But Perhaps, In Your Infinate Wisdom, You Know Better.

 

Tom

 

I think it is rather more important to get things right with Queen Elizabeth 2 than Queen Elizabeth II.

[bobby1119]

I think it is rather more important to get things right with Queen Elizabeth 2 than Queen Elizabeth II.

 

Kindlychap,

 

So does that mean that the movie QUEEN is not about a ship? :rolleyes:

[highcbob]

I have a white tux, 3 black tuxes, and I am having an ivory dinner jacket made for this years cruise. Last year, in the queens grill I saw several gentleman wearing a white or ivory jacket every night. I am from California and never heard of most of these rules.

 

 

Bravo 'Captain' Ol' bean!, I applaude you on putting so much effort into looking 5 star whilst on board. I've always said: if you look great you'll feel great. I might add that at least once on a voyage I will wear a small white bow-tie with a black tux and a black vest ( and yes, pants too ).

 

As to the kilt debate - of course one should, I see them all the time on board - after all, this IS Cunard and not onboard a Carnival 'Circus' ship.

 

cheers!

[highcbob]

If I may also add: I think it's quite entertaining to compare this to one or two other cruise line posts that are asking if it's permissible to wear shorts and flip-fops to dinner in the dining room.

[travel-to-go]

Tom, Wear your taratn proudly, And don't forget your Sporran.

I have a family Tartan somewhere at some point, though I'll be damned if I know what it is. We are such a mixp- English, Iraish, Scots, Dutch, "black Dutch" (a southerner would understand!) Cherokee and who knows what else!

 

And what is all of this business about Disc Jockeys! and why should you drinking a disk Jocky to dinner with you, when they have live hapists and string quartets! I would expect a DJ in the Disco on Carnival! <A>

 

And BTW, I DO know what a Scotsman wears under his kilt!

 

We had a gent on board the Cunard Dynasty with us who was a retired inspector from Scotland Yard (I probably got that wrong, I think he was ranked highly) He now lives in London. He dressed in full regalia. It brought a tear to my eye. It was so stirring in his regimental (or clan) dress! (I don't know the difference!) He looked to be the most formal gent on the ship! We shared more than one "spot of Drambuie!"

 

He and his wife took many a Cunard trip. I hope to cross paths with them again some day. Ian and Doris Spratt- if anytone should run into them!

 

(BTW, shorts and flipflops (more accurately called thongs, where I come from) are perfectly adequate, providing they are both tastefull and not made of denim! <ROTFLMAO!> )

 

Karie,

who is ducking!

and who does not have a trademark on her sigs, and is most delighted to start a trend!

[TOMANDUNA]

I Agree With Karie That There Is Too Much Snobbery Concerning This Topic.

The Duke Of Windsor Often Wore A Midnight Blue Dinner Jacket. If It Is Ok For Him To Buck The Trend Why Not Us Mere Mortals.

Who Wears Black, Who Wears White, Who Gives A Damn.

 

"judge Not A Man By His Clothes, But By His Wifes Clothes"

Thomas Robert Dewar 1864-1930

So Long As My Wife Dresses In Her Usual Elegant Way I Will Be Proud To Have Her On My Arm.

 

Tom :)

[pnhmrk]

And BTW, I DO know what a Scotsman wears under his kilt!

 

It brought a tear to my eye.

 

What did? What he was wearing under his kilt:confused: :D :D

 

(BTW, shorts and flipflops (more accurately called thongs, where I come from) are perfectly adequate, providing they are both tastefull and not made of denim! <ROTFLMAO!> )

 

Now a thong, even one made of denim, would be quite suitable to wear under a kilt if there were ladies present.

 

There is too much snobbery concerning this topic.

 

Is it snobbery or just gentle humour? Is it just a way for men to express that they are worried about wearing the right thing?

[Kindlychap]

The Duke Of Windsor Often Wore A Midnight Blue Dinner Jacket. If It Is Ok For Him To Buck The Trend Why Not Us Mere Mortals.

 

Isn't the question more why the Duke of Windsor was such a cad? ;)

[pnhmrk]

Isn't the question more why the Duke of Windsor was such a cad? ;)

 

I meant to ask wasn't he the one who ran away with an "American":eek: (:D )

[travel-to-go]

I meant to ask wasn't he the one who ran away with an "American":eek: (:D )

 

HORRORS!

 

Love,

Wallis

[highcbob]

Kindlychap,

 

So does that mean that the movie QUEEN is not about a ship? :rolleyes:

 

Keeping it short not to get off topic - did indeed see the movie "The Queen" last weekend - WONDERFUL. Makes one understand that 'Elizabeth' is just as human and vulnerable as any one of us and, as for the 'Queen Mum', ...

'priceless.'

[Kindlychap]

Keeping it short not to get off topic - did indeed see the movie "The Queen" last weekend - WONDERFUL. Makes one understand that 'Elizabeth' is just as human and vulnerable as any one of us and, as for the 'Queen Mum', ...

'priceless.'

 

With the greatest respect, how on earth do you know how "human and vulnerable" the Queen is?

 

You don't. You're being told.

 

And as for the Queen Mother? Gone. Not regretted.

 

You have been taking Brian Hoey too seriously.

 

(Actually, as an aside, does anyone else get an almost irresistable urge to go to one of his talks and ask silly questions? We saw a bit of one of his talks on the in-cabin TV where he was explaining how the Queen liked a "good twelve inches".....)

[fvernet]

There are several possible combinations including the choice of a white or black Jacket (trousers is always black).

 

I wore the white jacket aboard Celebrity one night and was mistaken for ship's company several times. Had a bit of fun with it actually. It would have been so easy to start rumors, and some passengers asked my wife how she managed to be dating one of the ship's officers...already!:D

[TOMANDUNA]

A Brief History of the TuxedoAll variety of fact and fiction surrounds the origin of 'Tuxedo'and the elegant garment that bears its name. It is said, for example, that the custom of the Algonquins was to name a place after the chief whose tribe occupied it, and that there was a sachum named P'tauk-Seet, 'the bear,' who, in the 17th Century, ruled over a tract of land including what is now known as 'Tuxedo.' The name is derived from combing P'tauk-Seet-tough - 'The Home of the Bear.'Another version holds that the Indians called this area of lakes and hills, P'tauk/Sepo, or so it was translated phonetically by the Dutch in their initial land grants. Since the Indians had no written language, these are the best records available.1754It written records dating back to 1754, these are references to Tuxedo Pond and later on, Tuxcito Pond, Tuxetough, Tucksito, Tugseto, Tucsedo, Tuxedo, Texedo and Toxedo. The Marquis de Chastellux, in 1780, writes it as Duck Sider and Duck Seeder. And in histories of the area dated 1857 and 1875, the name is corrupted to Duck Cedar with the explanation that the region is overgrown with cedar trees and is a favorite haunt of wild ducks.1852The Lorillard family began acquiring land in the Tuxedo area in 1800's and by 1852, had come into possession of most of what had been known as the Cheescock Patent. They turned it into an elite hunting and fishing resort. With a labor force largely imported from Italy by Pierre Lorillard, they constructed a series of homes within the walled park in a matter of several months that stand today as a testament to the skill of the artesans. It was known as Tuxedo Park.1885As the gilt-edged society of Tuxedo Park developed its own social schedule, some new names began to appear. For example, there was James Brown Potter, one of the founders of Tuxedo Park, who was elected to membership in the Tuxedo Club at the organizational meeting held at Delmonicos, in New York City in November 1885. According to the archives, Mr. Potter was introduced to the idea of the Dinner Jacket by the Prince of Wales, who later became Edward VII.1886The first Autumn Ball, held at the Tuxedo Club in October 1886, is marked as the official first appearance of the Dinner Jacket. Then, it is said Griswold Lorillard and his friends startled the people attending the Ball by wearing a scarlet satin lapelled Dinner Jacket, without tails, while all others were attired in the traditional white-tie and tails. And thus was born the elegant garment forevermore to be know as the 'Tuxedo.'The tuxedo was adopted by people rich and poor as the symbol of celebration, good times and special occasion. It was designated by the motion picture industry as its symbol for high society, class and elegance, and the tux even became a symbol of hope for better days during the Depression Days of the Thirties. And, it was defined by the tastemakers and standardbearers as the appropriate garb for those events in an individual's life when only a tradition of elegance will do.

 

IF THE ABOVE IS CORRECT, THEN TO WEAR A "AUTHENTIC TUXEDO" WE SHOULD BE ATTIRED IN A BLACK JACKET WITH RED SATIN LAPELS.

SINCE THE ORIGIN OF THE TUXEDO WAS A REBELLION AGAINST THE FORMALITY OF WHITE TIE AND TAILS PERHAPS WE ARE PERPETUATING THE REBELLION BY WEARING WHITE OR DARE I SAY TARTAN DINNER JACKETS.

TOM :)

[pnhmrk]

TO WEAR A "AUTHENTIC TUXEDO"

 

Ah, yes. But an Englishman doesn't wear a tuxedo - only a DJ:p

 

I am rather suspicious that the dinner jacket first appeared in the United States rather than Europe, but I haven't any evidence to verify those suspicions.

 

The original question was black and/or white. As I am conservative and tend to go with the majority (not to mention a Yorkshireman who's outgrown his white DJ and is too mean to buy another:D ) I still feel that black is more suitable for cruising but am looking into Ken's idea of crushed velvet!:)

[Kindlychap]

The dinner jacket (or Tuxedo as it's known in the United States) was the invention of the then Prince of Wales around 1865. It was based on a smoking jacket, in a rich black died wool and sported silk faced lapels. The manufacturer was probably Henry Poole, the Prince's trusted Savile Row tailors. The American's accredit the jacket to tobacco heir; Griswold "Grizzy" Lorillard who first wore the jacket to a function he attended in a country club in Tuxedo Park, just outside New York. However, he is quoted as asking the same Savile Row tailor to make him a jacket "like that worn by the Prince of Wales" making him only the second person to wear one and not its creator.

 

pnhmrk would appear to be correct in his assumption. Having said that, it is implicit in what TOMANDUNA wrote that the American was following the Prince of Wales.

[Kindlychap]

From the same site I found this.....

 

If leather, your watch strap should match the colour of your belt and shoes. Stainless steel watch straps go with everything, brown leather straps do not

 

My nicest watch has a very dark blue strap - help!

 

Most people when attending a black tie function want to add their own personal style to the dinner suit, and, in doing so, break some of the golden rules of formal dressing. All too often they will purchase bright coloured bow-ties, jazzy waistcoats or lerish cummerbunds in an attempt to look more stylish. The truth, however, is that any deviation from that of tradition will have the opposite effect and possibly bring attention of the wrong kind to the wearer. Bowties that look as if they may light up and spin round at any moment are not very James Bond, are they? Likewise, steer clear of any accessories that might make you look like the cabaret act or bingo caller. Instead opt for simple black and white. The bowtie itself should always be a real one, the ready-tied variety that fasten with Velcro simply don't cut it. Ensure that you learn how to tie a bowtie properly before the event. You'll be glad you did at the end of the evening when you can undo it and leave in casually around your neck. The second biggest mistake is that of purchasing a wing collar shirt to wear with a black tie, this is simply bad form. The wing collar shirt should only ever be worn with a white tie and tails, never with a dinner jacket. The correct shirt has a full, turned down, collar and can be either plain or with a pleated front.

 

Okay there then!

[pnhmrk]

I'm mortified:( ! I wear both a wing collar and a clip-on bow tie. I like the wing collar and have you ever tried to tie a bow tie? I spent hours practising and could not manage it. I Know:D I'll just spend all evening with it badly tied - that way nobody will be in any doubt as to its being a real tie:p

[TOMANDUNA]

PERHAPS THIS WILL BE OF INTEREST. I HAVE HAD TO POST IT IN TWO POSTS.

 

TOM :)

 

Why clip on a bow tie when you can tie that bow tie yourself?

 

Who says tying a bow tie has to be difficult? It's easy when you have the right instructions from FineTuxedos. Simply follow the step-by-step color coordinated bow tie illustrations and instructions below. In no time, you'll have the elegant, distinguished look you desire for your wedding, black tie event, or charity fundraiser. But don't wait until the last minute. Practice in front of a mirror before your special event. Have fun!!

 

 

Place the bow tie around your neck. Position it so that "Green" section of the bow tie is longer than the "Yellow".

 

 

 

Cross the "Green" side of the bow tie over the "Yellow".

 

 

 

Bring the "Green side of the bow tie under the loop.

 

 

 

 

Now, double "Yellow" over itself to form the front base loop of the bow tie.

[TOMANDUNA]

.

 

Loop "Green" over the center of the loop you just formed in the bow tie.

 

 

 

Holding everything in place, double "Green" back on itself and poke it through the loop behind the bow tie.

 

Adjust the bow tie by tugging at the ends of it and straightening the center knot.

 

 

Stand back and enjoy your effortsI HOPE THIS HAS WORKED.

 

TOM :)

[Kindlychap]

Stand back and enjoy your effortsI HOPE THIS HAS WORKED.

 

TOM :)

 

No. Dreadful advice. A yellow and green duotone tie? :eek:

 

;)

 

Actually it is a lot easier than you think. I have always had one, ever since I was about seventeen and playing clarinet in a concert band.

[pnhmrk]

No. Dreadful advice. A yellow and green duotone tie? :eek:

 

It'd go well with the tartan DJ though:D

 

Actually it is a lot easier than you think

 

Oh No It Isn't:p I've tried for hours and never got the hang of it. One that clips on is so much easier.