Can't even to tell you how upset I am with our Inspiration cruise.....

[rvrgirl]

But ultimately Carnival is a business' date=' and their goal is to make money. You make money by sailing with your ship as full as possible, so I don't see them ever doing that.[/quote']

 

:D Indeed:D

[Mollycat]

I've just done some searching for my Liberty Cruise on April 28/07. So far I've found Miss Pensylvania (sp?) Pagent Group and a Deaf and Hard of Hearing Group. Shouldn't have any problems with those two.

[hstrybuf]

I had skipped this thread before and wondered why it was so long. Now I know! Good grief! I would have been uncomfortable at the very least if I had seen something like this on any of our cruises! I remember Groups Ahoy too. Guess I'll have to do another Google search to see if we have any formerly unknown groups on our upcoming cruise. :eek:

 

Seriously, Carnival shouldn't allow this to happen, or any other cruiseline for that matter, unless the group has chartered the entire ship. I'll have to go check out the thread about the Bears too. Wow! I remember the last time they cruised and the uproar over that one.

[Leo Jay]

I am always impressed with your threads. They are well thought out, informative and usually amusing. however I must disagree with you on a few points....

 

 

Thanks for the compliment -- I do make an effort to be reasonably lucid and occasionally amusing. Also, my posts were in response to the OP's comments, not yours.

 

I don't disagree at all that the cruiselines should enforce their own rules. In fact, I absolutely demand that, and I've got the OBC to prove it. ;) I don't think I suggested otherwise.

 

As far as suggesting that cruiselines should disallow group cruises (meaning officially sanctioned groups, with discounts, special events, etc.), I guess my feeling is that since the cruiselines can't really justify concealing the information (in my opinion), they'd have to start making decisions about which groups to 'endorse'. You can't ethically justify not allowing the 'Black Lesbians of America' or 'Evangelicals United' to sail on your cruiseline. But as soon as you start (in a sense) officially endorsing them, you run into the practical concern of alienating a lot of potential customers. So then you'd end up having to make ethically indefensible judgements about which groups to endorse.

 

As far as facilities, I personally don't see any reason every room should be available to the public at all times. Your fare actually does not entitle you to access all public areas of the ship at all times. Besides, activity rooms go unused all the time. Discos and evening lounges aren't open for regular business during the day -- I don't see why they shouldn't be used for special activities. Of course you would expect the cruiseline to use good judgement -- if there's only one library on the ship, it's stupid for them to use that for a special group activity during a key part of the day. But if the Black Lesbian Evangelicals are using one of the nightclubs from 2-4pm, who cares? Anyway, I was arguing against group cruises in the first place, so this is all kind of moot point for me. :o

 

And as far as photographic evidence, my point regarding the OP's experience was that it just seems odd that this activity was as rampant and depraved as she suggests, yet there's little to substantiate it. I would be less skeptical if there were more substance in the descriptions, but "hearsay" about sex acts coupled with repulsion at things as potentially benign as 'crocheted dresses' 'sheer clothing' and 'thongs' leaves me wondering what exactly was going on. Sheer? As in a woman in a completely see-through top with no bra? Or just sheer?

 

"Complaints to staff were blown off." What staff? The bartender you griped to? And why in the first paragraph does she say she had no complaint with the staff?

 

Some people are strongly offended by things that other people find relatively benign, so when someone describes "offensive" behavior that they themselves have seen without providing key specifics, it's hard to separate facts from reaction.

 

This is specific:

 

"I reported the incident to the purser's desk and the supervisor told me that individuals engaging in oral sex in public areas were not Carnival's concern, as long as they were consentual."

 

"A man was walking around the Lido deck with no pants or underwear sporting an erection. When Security arrived, they simply stood around laughing and told me, 'he's harmless -- get over it, prude'"

[cruzegirl]

I don't think anyone cares what a person does in the privacy of their own stateroom. But this cruise sounds like pornography afloat and the last time I checked...that kind of stuff around children is indeed illegal. Of course, hindsight is 20/20....but for future reference...I would have a digital camera ready and a local TV newstation's phone number on speed dial and watch how fast any cruise line would clean that up!!

 

Gee, maybe calling "20/20" would get the info. out there.... And give some embarassment to Carnival...

That is so inappropriate.... I'm no prude either... and I don't care what sex you are, what perversion you want to do, what orientation you are, keep it to yourself.... I don't need to see or want to see it....

And we as passengers do have the right to have that behavior dealt with.... Their group isn't a priority over our rights.... But goes to show how alot of people have no manners anymore.... If your allowing families on the cruise, not listed as adult only, then the cruiseline has an obligation to the safety of all the passengers... How rude and how tacky.......I enjoy Carnival but I would have been very angry too.......

[tinktink78]

Someone posted information on our roll call stating that there is a "group" cruise that we didnt seem to know about and posted the link to this thread, and to the "groups" website.

 

Many of us on our roll call are confused.

 

And I am trying to get more information about the "group". But maybe someone on here could help us

 

The "group" has something to do with HASHING. The website, mentions it as a HASH CRUISE. Please excuse my ignorance, but is this a "form" of "swinging"? Or is it just a "run" and at the end a loud party, and fun?

 

Thanks so much!

[caribbean dreams]

Could the name "seven naughty nights" have to the with the behavior?

and actually they got a really good deal, $100 onboard credit and a $25 open bar.

Sorry i Just got a little nosey.

[caribbean dreams]

Someone posted information on our roll call stating that there is a "group" cruise that we didnt seem to know about and posted the link to this thread, and to the "groups" website.

 

 

Thanks so much!

 

UMMMMMMM, somebody's looking for trouble.

 

A beer drinking group?

Hash house harries

 

and trust me, after reading about all the other group cruises that are going on in the future, A hashing cruise is nothing to worry about.

[tinktink78]

 

and trust me, after reading about all the other group cruises that are going on in the future, A hashing cruise is nothing to worry about.

 

 

That is what I was thinking... But then someone in our roll call thought that it was a "cover up" for swinging.

[derf5585]

The "group" has something to do with HASHING. The website, mentions it as a HASH CRUISE. Please excuse my ignorance, but is this a "form" of "swinging"? Or is it just a "run" and at the end a loud party, and fun?

 

To hash or not to hash, after that all choices are made for you.

from

http://www.taichunghash.com/

 

Hash House Harriers offers visitors an excellent opportunity to meet the locals and make new friends. Join in on one of their running/walking rallies and get fit at the same time. For more information contact them via: 0960-243-299 on arrival.

from

http://www.hoteltravel.com/taiwan/hsinchu/guides/activities_sports.htm

[caribbean dreams]

That is what I was thinking... But then someone in our roll call thought that it was a "cover up" for swinging.

 

No, it's a real group

http://www.sailshare.com/KeyWestHashHouseHarriers.htm

 

But after all this, I will be checking group cruises on google before i book.

[salty dingo]

You know, I think a lot of people automatically assume that having swingers around are incompatible with "normal" vacation enjoyment. I know a lot of people would feel the same way if the group was gays instead of swingers. Or Puerto Ricans (see the Destiny threads recently.) These are just intolerant people, if not bigots.

 

I think, no, I know that these swingers are good, honest, hardworking people just like everyone else, and they are on that ship to have a good vacation. They mean no ill will toward anyone else and would not want to dampen anyone else's fun. They should be respected and welcomed. However, the *mere thought* that these people are nearby is triggering such a backlash!

 

Everyone needs to conduct themselves appropriately in public. Carnival has an obligation to enforce decent behavior. It makes no difference if it is a drunk teen on Spring break or a lewd adult -- bad behavior is what it is, and it should not occur. When it does occur, it should be dealt with consequeces.

 

I think the majority of posts here have been the sort of "I don't want to cruise with swingers", and that misses the point. The issue is "did Carnival not enforce its rules on behavior." I know they do kick people off for getting too drunk, etc. So I wonder if these swingers were really doing anything wrong, or if the *true* problem lies with the passengers who are upset they had to spend a week with swingers. Those passengers, in my mind, are very small people.

[ChrissyBTX]

The cruise line industry has been growing over the past number of years as a result of promotion and denial ... they promote the well being of their passengers and deny that anything wrong can happen as a result of their actions or in-action to deal with a situation on board. The United States Government has started to hold accountable these corporations who register their ships in countries where the laws we all live by as either US citizens or us as Canadian citizens, don't apply. It has become more and more apparent that they need to be held accountable simply by the number of incidents which have been happening, and not just because of an unhappy customer, but the rapes, the thefts, the murders, the missing persons.

 

For those of you who have never heard of a board called www."Cruise Bruise".com, no quotes and no space, I suggest you visit it and see just what kind of things are going on and keep yourself abreast of the activities which these monoliths almost always deny.

 

I AM NOT HERE to promote this site, I just read it to keep informed. Check out the different things which have happened, and be sure to pass around this link, NOT TO SCARE people, but to simply give them an opportunity to keep informed. I am not here to slam or slander one cruise line over another, that would be the same as hating a nationality because someone robbed my house and I found out what country that person was from.

 

I simply wanted to make people aware that things do happen, sometimes they are beyond the control of the cruise line and it simply comes down to cleaning up the mess. But in the case of your cruise, where people were performing acts in public which should have been a chargeable offense and jail time to follow ... then it was the responsibility of every crew member to put a stop to it. Surely if they were at a resort with their children and walked into the resturant with their 7 year old child and someone was performing an act on another in the resturant, they would demand it be dealt with.

 

This is where my post comes in ... The US Government is beginning to hold accountable those cruise lines which carry passengers departing from a US port when something goes wrong and is not dealt with appropriately.

 

Check out the link on the "Cruise Bruise" site referring to the Governemt.

 

I know that each of us has the same idea .... "I can write a letter, but they won't do anything about it" and that is true, because you are writing to the very organization which is making money from the paying public you are complaining about. As a collective body, individuals need to come together somehow and voice their opions or raise their concerns to the parties who can make a difference. I don't have the solution on how to get your voice heard or your statement read, but I know that if you are as passionate as you seem, you will find a way to get your story to the right person as long as you keep trying ... Remember the history lesson about the first Black woman in America to refuse to give up her seat to a White person? Well I am neither American or Black, but I will tell you this:

 

I not only agree with her decision but I support the fact that being denied what is rightfully yours as a fellow human being, is not only worth fighting for, but worth following if for nothing but to change the way people think. Now comparing the historical event of that Black woman so many years ago with what you experienced on your cruise, is not my intent, I only wanted to say that we should all stand up for what we believe to be right and honest and know that if we stay the course, we can make a difference.

 

Find the time, make the effort and get your story heard, it will only make this industry a better place for all those who enjoy it and for the future of cruising as well. If you try to get your information to the Government body who is trying to make a difference, you just might succeed in doing so.

 

Very Interesting post Mr. Bill. Thank you. That's a great website and I've saved it to my "favorites" and will read more later. I found something else very interesting on this site and I think alot of people should take note, especially women. On the main page of this website, scroll down and look for a link on the left side that says "Passenger Wall of Shame". Then scroll to the bottom of that page to see the section on CCdotcom. People should proceed with caution on the cruise forums and not always believe what they read in here. And, don't give out too much informaton. Stay safe! Thanks again Mr. Bill!

[PhoenixCruiser]

I would have been uncomfortable at the very least if I had seen something like this on any of our cruises! I remember Groups Ahoy too. Guess I'll have to do another Google search to see if we have any formerly unknown groups on our upcoming cruise. :eek:

 

Seriously, Carnival shouldn't allow this to happen, or any other cruiseline for that matter, unless the group has chartered the entire ship. I'll have to go check out the thread about the Bears too. Wow! I remember the last time they cruised and the uproar over that one.

 

I agree Deb, any large group can seriously affect one's cruise, this includes locals getting large discounts to fill an empty ship :mad: :eek:

 

###

[Guest rfrenchbaxter]

That website was www.groupsahoy.com Sadly it had been out of commission for several years. I guess it was just to info intensive to keep up. It was wonderful to use to not only avoid groups that offend you, but to let you know about groups you may want to join.

 

I don't think anyone cares what a person does in the privacy of their own stateroom. But this cruise sounds like pornography afloat and the last time I checked...that kind of stuff around children is indeed illegal. Of course, hindsight is 20/20....but for future reference...I would have a digital camera ready and a local TV newstation's phone number on speed dial and watch how fast any cruise line would clean that up!!

 

 

CHEERS TO YOU MY FRIEND!!! I agree and and I would have taken pictures and waited for the cruise line to ask for those pictures back! If my kids or grand kids would have been on a cruise like this you can bet the cruise line would have heard from us! No probelm if the groups want to go but keep the sexual aspect inside the cabins! :mad:

Rebecca

[Guest rfrenchbaxter]

Whats that old saying .....

 

 

If you Cant Beat em Join em !!!!!!

 

:p :p :p

 

John

 

 

:eek: :eek:

Rebecca

[bonniemari]

Josee I feel for you.

 

Had almost the same thing happen to us on our annual girl's vacation to Cancun in May. We have been doing this for several years and we always stay at " adults only" resorts. We were a little late this year for booking cause every year the group gets bigger.

 

They place we usually stay was already sold out so we choose another all adult resort. Now from previous visits to Cancun we were all aware of the topless situation. I am not a prude and although it is not for me I can live with. Imagine our surprise when we were walking thru the resort and came across naked volleyball and yes I mean totally. It was at that point we knew something was up. I won't go into the rest of it but we ended up finding out the if you google swingers resorts this one came up. We still have a good laugh about it almost everytime we get together.

 

Needless to say we have already booked out trip for this coming May and will NOT be staying there again.

[kavanaugh77]

Have sailed on 13 cruises I have been on many cruises with large groups. from nuns to 911 call operatorws to EMT's etc... they always have there meeting in rooms that are closed off to the rest of the ship no big deal. I also Love how so many of the threads say how "I dont care if they are gay or str8".. this is like saying i am not prejudice by best friend is ______.

(fill in the blank... black gay fat short blonde etc).

while I agree sex in public is wrong I feel I have seen many str8 cruisers just about "doing" it on the deck on at dinner but nothing is ever said about them.. HUMMMM I am turned off just as much by a group of religous zealots making everything stop to say a prayer when it may offend many of the passengers but this again doesnt make it into the threads. HMMMMM... once again on the RCCL page its the "Bears" group it seems unless the passenger fits into the White christian conservative profile no one else is able to enjoy themselves either.

I agree kids SHOULD NOT be forced to expierence any of these items from the sex to forced anything. we have to remember this is still a business for Carnival and all other ships and if they turn down groups they would be either out of business or be charging three times the amount they do now. the groups help keep our prices down for everyone. lets all be a little more caring and loving

thanks for listening to my rant:eek:

[caribbean dreams]

I agree Deb, any large group can seriously affect one's cruise, this includes locals getting large discounts to fill an empty ship :mad: :eek:

 

###

 

Yes, it really doesn't matter what kind of large group they are, any one of them are able to cause trouble.

 

I think people are so alarmed at the this group because of their reputation, i can tell you first hand that some swingers groups are totally out of control, i have seen what happens during the Exotic Erotic Expo in san Francisco first hand.

and living so close, i have a few friends that attend, they are the nicest people in the world until the group gets together, than all their morals fly out the window.

[Andrearae]

I would strongly suggest you call carnival diretly and tell them you want to speak to someone to lodge a complaint, They will at least have it on record because in all actuality they wont do much for you because there guaranty is that you must complain before the first port and then disembark at the first port. I travel with my 8 year old and let me tell you if i saw that i would be more than upset and i would have demanded to speak to the captain immediatly, Hopefully carnival will take you serious and maybe you can get some of the other cruisers you happened to meet to call in as well. I am going to write to customer service myself and suggest that they formally announce these cruises to travel agencies and on their websites, its not fair that you book a family trip then are subjected to such behavior! I am booked on the Conquest here pretty soon and I pray my child doesnt witness anything like that!

[DreDay]

OH MY GOODNESS..... This is beyond belief for me. We travel with our children 100% of the time and if if they would have seen anything like what is being described here, I complained about it, and my complaints were ignored, I would have Carnivals head. There is just no doubt about it. I would expect to have those people thrown off the ship at the next port. I don't care if it was the acts of swingers, a monogomous couple, or otherwise. That is irrelevant.

I do not know what Carnivals policy is on posters on the door but I simply cannot believe that anything of pornographic nature would have been allowed to stay up. That is just so much liability for Carnival.

 

Like many others before me have said...it doesn't matter what group these people were a part of it's simply unacceptable (and illegal) behavior.

[nckvilledudes]

You know, I think a lot of people automatically assume that having swingers around are incompatible with "normal" vacation enjoyment. I know a lot of people would feel the same way if the group was gays instead of swingers. Or Puerto Ricans (see the Destiny threads recently.) These are just intolerant people, if not bigots.

 

I think, no, I know that these swingers are good, honest, hardworking people just like everyone else, and they are on that ship to have a good vacation. They mean no ill will toward anyone else and would not want to dampen anyone else's fun. They should be respected and welcomed. However, the *mere thought* that these people are nearby is triggering such a backlash!

 

Everyone needs to conduct themselves appropriately in public. Carnival has an obligation to enforce decent behavior. It makes no difference if it is a drunk teen on Spring break or a lewd adult -- bad behavior is what it is, and it should not occur. When it does occur, it should be dealt with consequeces.

 

I think the majority of posts here have been the sort of "I don't want to cruise with swingers", and that misses the point. The issue is "did Carnival not enforce its rules on behavior." I know they do kick people off for getting too drunk, etc. So I wonder if these swingers were really doing anything wrong, or if the *true* problem lies with the passengers who are upset they had to spend a week with swingers. Those passengers, in my mind, are very small people.

 

Nice post Salty Dingo. Agree with you.

 

Dan

[Jumbiecruiser]

Have sailed on 13 cruises I have been on many cruises with large groups. from nuns to 911 call operatorws to EMT's etc... they always have there meeting in rooms that are closed off to the rest of the ship no big deal. I also Love how so many of the threads say how "I dont care if they are gay or str8".. this is like saying i am not prejudice by best friend is ______.

(fill in the blank... black gay fat short blonde etc).

while I agree sex in public is wrong I feel I have seen many str8 cruisers just about "doing" it on the deck on at dinner but nothing is ever said about them.. HUMMMM I am turned off just as much by a group of religous zealots making everything stop to say a prayer when it may offend many of the passengers but this again doesnt make it into the threads. HMMMMM... once again on the RCCL page its the "Bears" group it seems unless the passenger fits into the White christian conservative profile no one else is able to enjoy themselves either.

I agree kids SHOULD NOT be forced to expierence any of these items from the sex to forced anything. we have to remember this is still a business for Carnival and all other ships and if they turn down groups they would be either out of business or be charging three times the amount they do now. the groups help keep our prices down for everyone. lets all be a little more caring and loving

thanks for listening to my rant:eek:

 

I have read this thread and the thread on the Royal Caribbean thread. No where does it mention that anyone is expecting a person to be part of a white christian conservative group. Please do not go around this board and lecture any of us on what we want on our cruises. You are not us. How about you showing a little love and care?:rolleyes:

[MonaCD]

.....Remember most of these lounges are in the back of the ship and they in all their glory paraded in front of everyone in their sheer clothing, crocheted dresses and thongs...........that is what offended me. My child as well as many others were on the Lido deck watching the thongs walk back and forth to the towel station and bathroom. I statement about the purple bands was just a way they could have been indentified. Yes, it was their vacation as well as mine but why if you into that sort of public behavior would you go on a cruise line that continually advertises their childrens program? It should have been no surprise to them to see children but it was a total surprise to all of us about them.

 

I know people might to want to flame me on this one. I’ve been keeping up with this thread over the last couple days and I have to say you had my sympathy until that statement. Actually I am sorry that your holiday was ruined, it’s not nice when you’ve spent you’re hard earned money and expect to have a nice relaxing, joyful time only to come back upset and more stressed.

 

I know group behaviour or mob mentality can sometimes cause people to behave in the extreme, a couple people have already commented on that. I think maybe salty dog hit the nail on the head with his post. Until we get some actual witnesses to these public sex acts I’ll have to reserve my judgement on the illegality of what actually happened. I can see how stories get passed around the ship, might start with someone’s assumption "they probably were performing sex acts on each other in the lounge" turns into "I heard they were performing sex acts in the lounge." Reminds me of that game Telephone we played as children.

 

This whole thread brings to mind the saying "No sex please, we’re British" In the real world people are not so uptight about their sexuality. Have you ever been to a Caribbean resort? Most are advertised as family resorts with Kids Clubs and you will find all manor of dress and undress. On my last resort vacation in Cuba, there was an Italian grannie with here family sat next to us on the beach every day topless. Was it pretty, nope, was I offended, not at all. In Dominican Republic there were plenty of men and women (some topless) walking up and down the beach in thongs, no one bats an eyelash. Have you ever seen a gay pride parade, doesn’t get more public and in your face then that. Do watch television? Have you seen what the censors allow theses days to pass for entertainment?

 

My friend still laughs about the first time she took her son to a resort in the Dominican Republic. It was mostly Europeans and there were topless women everywhere. Her son was eight years old at the time and spent the first couple days ogling. She explained to him that it wasn’t such a big deal and by the end of the week he was pretty blase about it, was actually encouraging her to go topless cause hers were just as nice as any of the others.

 

Just wait til you go to a Scandinavian country where the public washrooms are not separated into ladies and gents. Finally the men have to wait in line with us women!

 

I’m not a parent but there has been talk in the media here and my sister is a teacher who has mentioned this several times to me. Perhaps we are protecting our children too much. Taking away every responsibility so that they are so sheltered as to not be able to cope when it comes time to take responsibility for themselves. Maybe if everyone was as relaxed about their bodies and sexuality, there wouldn’t be all those men tripping over each other to get up to the F deck to get a glimpse of a little boob. :p

[Guest cvbart]

Have sailed on 13 cruises I have been on many cruises with large groups. from nuns to 911 call operatorws to EMT's etc... they always have there meeting in rooms that are closed off to the rest of the ship no big deal. I also Love how so many of the threads say how "I dont care if they are gay or str8".. this is like saying i am not prejudice by best friend is ______.

(fill in the blank... black gay fat short blonde etc).

while I agree sex in public is wrong I feel I have seen many str8 cruisers just about "doing" it on the deck on at dinner but nothing is ever said about them.. HUMMMM I am turned off just as much by a group of religous zealots making everything stop to say a prayer when it may offend many of the passengers but this again doesnt make it into the threads. HMMMMM... once again on the RCCL page its the "Bears" group it seems unless the passenger fits into the White christian conservative profile no one else is able to enjoy themselves either.

I agree kids SHOULD NOT be forced to expierence any of these items from the sex to forced anything. we have to remember this is still a business for Carnival and all other ships and if they turn down groups they would be either out of business or be charging three times the amount they do now. the groups help keep our prices down for everyone. lets all be a little more caring and loving

thanks for listening to my rant:eek:

 

Thank you for a wonderful post.

 

While folks will deny it all over the place the "White christian conservative profile" probably fits quite a few of the poster out here.

 

The rest of us would probably just let it pass and have a good time on our cruise.

 

If all this bothers you so much do a little research on your cruise. Most group cruises are listed somewhere on the internet so do you homework.