Not Allowed Into Canada

[BobBeaSea]

I LOVE IT!

 

Given that this was 1996, I don't think this armed maple leaf uniformed Canadian Customs Official sitting in a Canadian airport 100+ miles from the border was "basically" a "US citizen"! :D (Given the hypersensitivity of our northern neighbors toward the "independence" thrust upon them in 1867, I'll bite my tongue.) I would've LOVED to have seen his driver's license and voter registration, eh! And when the fights are to Mexico or Japan, what's he then? C'mon folks... I can readily take the "we learned it from you, we just receiprocate" line, but take a little responsibility for your own...

 

Ummm! Again, it was American Customs who cleared you to go home. Standard operating procedures at our largest airports. We allow U.S. Customs to do this so you the U.S. doesn't have to clear people flying from Canada at 50+ airports in the States. Think about it, you didn't clear Customs in the U.S. when you landed. I have to wonder about someone who has no idea he is clearing U.S. Customs...not to see the big signs, the American uniforms... tough to miss. And yes, they are American citizens...funny thing is, they enjoy it up here a lot more than you do.

[dmk]

I LOVE IT!

 

Given that this was 1996, I don't think this armed maple leaf uniformed Canadian Customs Official sitting in a Canadian airport 100+ miles from the border was "basically" a "US citizen"! :D (Given the hypersensitivity of our northern neighbors toward the "independence" thrust upon them in 1867, I'll bite my tongue.) I would've LOVED to have seen his driver's license and voter registration, eh! And when the fights are to Mexico or Japan, what's he then? C'mon folks... I can readily take the "we learned it from you, we just receiprocate" line, but take a little responsibility for your own...

 

I have travelled extensively through the USA and I have always cleared your U.S. Customs at my point of departure in Canada. I am sure you can remember be asked questions by your U.S. Customs before departing Canada. Yup, these guys and gals are all U.S. citizens.

I, too, wonder about someone who has no idea he is clearing U.S. customs

[BobBeaSea]

Ummm! Again, it was American Customs who cleared you to go home. Standard operating procedures at our largest airports. We allow U.S. Customs to do this so you the U.S. doesn't have to clear people flying from Canada at 50+ airports in the States. Think about it, you didn't clear Customs in the U.S. when you landed. I have to wonder about someone who has no idea he is clearing U.S. Customs...not to see the big signs, the American uniforms... tough to miss. And yes, they are American citizens...funny thing is, they enjoy it up here a lot more than you do.

 

Sorry, forgot to add, if you saw an armed Canadian in the airport, he or she was a police officer. Our Customs and Immigration people DO NOT carry weapons. He or she was maybe helping you find your way to U.S. Customs :)

[babylene]

Let's not be too hard on the Americans, fellow Canucks! They don't travel to our country on the same regular basis that we travel to theirs. Most of us have been crossing the border by car and by air since we were babies. (Come to think of it, when I was a baby, I crossed by train!!!)

 

But...I find that lately ALL of the immigration people are asking the weirdest questions.

 

I think the clinker was last year, a young Canadian officer asked how many were in our car. He asked the question TWICE!!! Like my husband and I were going to MULTIPLY on the spot!!! It wasn't easy to keep ourselves from laughing (You must NEVER laugh!) We figured he was new. A friend of mine, born in a faraway land, being more suspicious than we are told us it was a TRICK QUESTION!!!!! Some trick!!

 

I bet all of you have good stories!

[Ephraim]

Airports in Canada have 3 zones. Domestic, International and US. No customs officials for domestic (of course) or International. But you clear US customs in Canada and once past that point, you are considered to be in the US.

 

In fact, if your flight was cancelled and you wanted to go back into the airport, you must clear Canada Customs again. It's odd, but it's just easier to do it in Canada at a few airports than to have customs officials clear Canadians all over the US. And it's faster too, since most Canadians can clear US customs rather quickly.

[BobBeaSea]

Let's not be too hard on the Americans, fellow Canucks! They don't travel to our country on the same regular basis that we travel to theirs. Most of us have been crossing the border by car and by air since we were babies. (Come to think of it, when I was a baby, I crossed by train!!!)

 

But...I find that lately ALL of the immigration people are asking the weirdest questions.

 

I think the clinker was last year, a young Canadian officer asked how many were in our car. He asked the question TWICE!!! Like my husband and I were going to MULTIPLY on the spot!!! It wasn't easy to keep ourselves from laughing (You must NEVER laugh!) We figured he was new. A friend of mine, born in a faraway land, being more suspicious than we are told us it was a TRICK QUESTION!!!!! Some trick!!

 

I bet all of you have good stories!

 

Agreed, the folks at Canada Customs seem to asking the same question in two or three different ways :). I still don't honestly know how those 5 litres of booze got into my trunk :D

[OCruisers]

:rolleyes: The SINS-OF-OUR-YOUTH can come back to haunt us! :D

 

Happy Sailing! OCruisers :)

[brigittetom]

Obviously. :D

[tom_uk]

Given that this was 1996, I don't think this armed maple leaf uniformed Canadian Customs Official sitting in a Canadian airport 100+ miles from the border was "basically" a "US citizen"!

 

Nothing to do with Canada, but I once cleared US Immigration & Customs in Dublin..... we then flew with Aer Lingus to Kennedy, disembarked at a domestic terminal and went straight out to the taxi/parking lot.

[Ephraim]

I'm sorry, but someone's memory must be faltering. Canada's border guards are NOT allowed to carry weapons at all. If they have a warning of a criminal trying to come over the border, they have to call the Provincial Police or the RCMP. There is a proposal to train them and arm them, but it hasn't happened, yet. (They have been complaining about this for years, they often leave their posts when there is a threat of violence.)

 

Until 2003, they were wearing simple jackets with the word "CANADA" in a arc on the shoulder. Only in 2003 was that replaced with this. Before 2003, they were comprised of 3 different government offices and departments, Revenue Canada, Citizenship and Immigration Canada and the Canadian Food Inspection Agency.

 

So, they wouldn't have had a maple leaf jacket and they couldn't have been armed, 10 years ago. And the RCMP or Provincial Police, which would be armed, wouldn't have a right to see your documentation, nor would wear a uniform with a maple leaf.

 

I have lived in Canada for most of my life and I have never had to show my documentation at the airport to anyone except for airline employees at check-in and American customs officials if I was flying into the US.

 

(If you are wondering about why they leave their posts when there are threats of violence. We have employment laws in Canada which guarantee an employee the right to safety at their jobs. They can therefore close the border down if they are physically threatened.)

[woodofpine]

You're right; there was no Maple Leaf but there was a shoulder Canada... and I believed a side arm - maybe not. Frankly, if the guy was in anyway identifiable as US, I would've rendered an opinion for him.

 

I guess the U.S. is the source of ALL your problems!

[krusin']

:) I thought maybe a little humour was in order! I (Canadian) cross the U.S. Border to Vermont at least once/week. I drive a Honda CRV and have been asked on more than one occasion (on the back being opened) "where is your spare did you have a flat?" :o Guess what if you know this car the spare is mounted on the back outside! Must have been a trick question!:rolleyes:

[maitlandcruisers]

Both of them carry diplomatic passports. Now, if they were to try to visit Canada without them, they would both legally have problems and need to be "deemed rehabilitated".

 

DUI or Driving While Impaired is an Indictable offence in Canada. Therefore it is a felony (ie criminal), not a misdemeanour.

 

A dwi is not always a indictable offense it could be a summary offence (misdemeanor) in Canada for a first or second dui offence if it is plead. Shouldn't the same standard hold for US citiznes as Canadian.

[Tuna]

You're right; there was no Maple Leaf but there was a shoulder Canada... and I believed a side arm - maybe not. Frankly, if the guy was in anyway identifiable as US, I would've rendered an opinion for him.

 

I guess the U.S. is the source of ALL your problems!

 

Haha...nice backtracking. I wonder how much further it'll go.

 

"Well, maybe the guy had a pen instead of a sidearm. And maybe he didn't talk directly to me. Or to anyone. I think he may have glanced at me once. But I definitely felt harassed!!!"

[usha]

:eek: YIKES! Somehow, I get the feeling that this thread is gonna get padlocked real soon.

[Ephraim]

Impaired Driving is legally an indictable offence. You cannot use supposition and call it a summary offence. You can't tell WHAT the result of a court case WOULD be, only what the maximum sentence. You need the crown to agree in court to plead it down.

 

All citizens arriving are compared based on the maximum sentence, equally, in both countries. In other words, when Canadians ask to visit the US, the US uses their maximum sentence for the crime as well.

 

As I said, this is a tempest in a teapot and only the SF Chronicle reported this. Travel Weekly says something entirely different and quoted several sources. For a very very small minority this is a real concern.

 

Meanwhile, I'm shocked at how few people think that Impaired Driving is a big deal. More than three people a day in Canada are murdered by impaired drivers and over 190 people a day are injured in impaired driving accidents. Any one of these 193 people a day could be your child, your spouse, your parent or your friend.

 

In Quebec, we have Jean-Marie de Koninck to thank for Operation Red Nose (Operation Nez Rouge) which saves hundreds of lives each year.

 

A dwi is not always a indictable offense it could be a summary offence (misdemeanor) in Canada for a first or second dui offence if it is plead. Shouldn't the same standard hold for US citiznes as Canadian.

[Susan-M]

:eek: YIKES! Somehow, I get the feeling that this thread is gonna get padlocked real soon.

 

I hope not because I'm learning a lot from Ephraim's posts.

[Ephraim]

I hope not because I'm learning a lot from Ephraim's posts.

 

 

:o BLUSH :o

[maitlandcruisers]

Impaired Driving is legally an indictable offence. You cannot use supposition and call it a summary offence. You can't tell WHAT the result of a court case WOULD be, only what the maximum sentence. You need the crown to agree in court to plead it down.

 

All citizens arriving are compared based on the maximum sentence, equally, in both countries. In other words, when Canadians ask to visit the US, the US uses their maximum sentence for the crime as well.

 

As I said, this is a tempest in a teapot and only the SF Chronicle reported this. Travel Weekly says something entirely different and quoted several sources. For a very very small minority this is a real concern.

 

Meanwhile, I'm shocked at how few people think that Impaired Driving is a big deal. More than three people a day in Canada are murdered by impaired drivers and over 190 people a day are injured in impaired driving accidents. Any one of these 193 people a day could be your child, your spouse, your parent or your friend.

 

In Quebec, we have Jean-Marie de Koninck to thank for Operation Red Nose (Operation Nez Rouge) which saves hundreds of lives each year.

 

16 percent of the US population has a criminal record. There an estimated 1.4 million driving impaired arrests in the each year in theUS too. You add the fact these ppl are not traveling alone adn you have a very very signifigant population affected.

 

You correct in that DUI is a big issue but it is also very important that people who have sinned in there past are allowed to make amends and move on or they will always see themselves as criminals and always be thinking like one. If they are thinking like one they will act like one.

[Ephraim]

The only problem is that this needs to be in BOTH directions. We need to pressure BOTH governments to agree on this on an equal level. It's not Canada nor the USA's fault.

 

From what someone posted on another thread (about this) Canada is apparently are forgiving people with one blight on their record if they are honest about it and as long as the 5/10 years has passed with no fee, on the spot at the border.

 

From everything that I have seen and heard, neither system seems to forgive and frankly, I'm shocked that neither country seems to accepts each other's pardons. If there is any "crime" in all of this, it's that a pardon granted in either country should just take it off the books. But in Canada the government specifically say that even with a pardon, you must acknowledge that you had a record and that you have been pardoned for it. And the US government website specifically says that a foreign pardon is not accepted.

 

In any case, it's up to the politicians to solve this problem. And they are only going to solve it if people put some pressure on them. It took over two years for the governors of New York and Washington to actually get the administration to even consider looking for another solution to the passports at land crossing issue. Buffalo, NY is admittedly facing imminent disaster (not to speak of many other border towns) and no one seems to be listening. A proposal for an ID card was shot down, already. (Not to mention some of the other stupidity, including a congressman who suggested building a 7000 km long wall between the US and Canada.)

[maitlandcruisers]

The only problem is that this needs to be in BOTH directions. We need to pressure BOTH governments to agree on this on an equal level. It's not Canada nor the USA's fault.

 

From what someone posted on another thread (about this) Canada is apparently are forgiving people with one blight on their record if they are honest about it and as long as the 5/10 years has passed with no fee, on the spot at the border.

 

From everything that I have seen and heard, neither system seems to forgive and frankly, I'm shocked that neither country seems to accepts each other's pardons. If there is any "crime" in all of this, it's that a pardon granted in either country should just take it off the books. But in Canada the government specifically say that even with a pardon, you must acknowledge that you had a record and that you have been pardoned for it. And the US government website specifically says that a foreign pardon is not accepted.

 

In any case, it's up to the politicians to solve this problem. And they are only going to solve it if people put some pressure on them. It took over two years for the governors of New York and Washington to actually get the administration to even consider looking for another solution to the passports at land crossing issue. Buffalo, NY is admittedly facing imminent disaster (not to speak of many other border towns) and no one seems to be listening. A proposal for an ID card was shot down, already. (Not to mention some of the other stupidity, including a congressman who suggested building a 7000 km long wall between the US and Canada.)

 

Very well stated!

[nosmothj]

1 The USA has been doing this for years!!!

2 This is a direct result of Bush pushing Canada to tighten up the boarders.(Any luck we won't let Bush in)

3 It clearly states may not be grated entery, not will not be granted.

4 If you are concerned because you have charges or a record in your own country, apply to have it removed!!

 

 

As someone has stated a lot more money move south than north.

[Davey Interweb]

(Not to mention some of the other stupidity, including a congressman who suggested building a 7000 km long wall between the US and Canada.)

 

I think that was John Hostettler. What a brilliant and entirely practical idea! The delicious irony here is that he pleaded guilty to a concealed weapons charge in 2004 - for attempting to board a Washington-bound aircraft with a loaded 9mm - and would quite possibly be denied entry into Canada because of his record. Heh.

 

Also, thanks for all the good information Ephraim.

[maitlandcruisers]

1 The USA has been doing this for years!!!

2 This is a direct result of Bush pushing Canada to tighten up the boarders.(Any luck we won't let Bush in)

3 It clearly states may not be grated entery, not will not be granted.

4 If you are concerned because you have charges or a record in your own country, apply to have it removed!!

 

 

As someone has stated a lot more money move south than north.

 

I have an Idea - you let Bush in and we won' t let him back. Make sure Cheney is with him.

[LeftcoastBC]

 

But...I find that lately ALL of the immigration people are asking the weirdest questions.

 

I think the clinker was last year, a young Canadian officer asked how many were in our car. He asked the question TWICE!!! Like my husband and I were going to MULTIPLY on the spot!!! It wasn't easy to keep ourselves from laughing (You must NEVER laugh!) We figured he was new. A friend of mine, born in a faraway land, being more suspicious than we are told us it was a TRICK QUESTION!!!!! Some trick!!

 

I bet all of you have good stories!

 

I'll bet you had a vehicle with Darkened rear windows and didn't have them rolled down like all of us folks that cross frequently. :)

 

My best:

Going south into US. 1st. Car in our party Questioned briefly about "Citizenships" chappie was kind of abrupt but smiling a lot when we got to the booth.

 

2nd car: Was Asked "Fish and Chips ?" and was allowed in on the joke. When we all got together it made sence. I don't think that happens much any more..

 

There's a method in the madness to those "Stupid" questions. ;)

 

I am also enjoying Ephram's calm and factual answers and comments. There are ways and means of avoiding the problem IF you have it. And I don't blame either government seperately but both equally. As Canadian we are mostly born and raised close to the border and even if immigrants to Canada the odds are we live close to the border. It's warmer in the south...right? :) and that's where our population is.

America border towns were hard hit when the $ exchange was really high for us. This passport thing or anything that slows the flow will hurt even more.

But..there must be security...there are however costs one does not normally think about.

The article in the paper that caused this thread is but another.