burnt on the miracle

[MrPete]

I'm glad that your concern is for future guests. They are just too many people in the world who want to file complaints about anything just to get something discounted or free.

Not Carnival related, but I got off the Disney Wonder in March on a Thursday, and by Friday I had contracted the dreaded Norwalk Virus. I emailed them letting them know I had contracted it, and that they might want to sterilize the cabin in which I was staying.

 

I received what I perceived to be a form letter stating how easy it is to catch it, describing the clinical nature of the disease, yada yada, yada, when they clearly misunderstood I was simply trying to be preventive. I guess their backs were up (or tails).

[GoinCruisin]

OMG! It was COFFEE! LOL, it is supposed to be hot... they have had warnings on the cup that say "HOT", I'm not sure why anyone would order coffee and hope it to be warm... McDonalds has some good HOT coffee, same as many others... I have spilled coffee on my hand and received burns... It was my mistake, I spilled it, I knew it was coffee... I knew it was hot. Most coffee brewed in consumer type machines is not nearly as hot as you get in a larger machine... I don't know about anyone else, but generally I will wait for my coffee to cool a bit and when I get ready to take a drink, I can tell if it is too hot... Just like in the case of "mcdonalds made my kids fat", nope, YOU made your kid fat! Too many people don't take responsibility for their own actions these days and want everyone to spell everything out to them... we as Americans are smarter than that... or should be at least.

[tjevans]

GoinCruisin --

 

I'm sure you had burns from coffee, but were they as severe as the plaintiff suffered in the now-famous case.

 

Her's the facts taken from http://www.centerjd.org/free/mythbusters-free/MB_mcdonalds.htm . Admittedly, it is a site against tort reform.

 

<snip>

Stella Liebeck, 79 years old, was sitting in the passenger seat of her grandson’s car having purchased a cup of McDonald’s coffee. After the car stopped, she tried to hold the cup securely between her knees while removing the lid. However, the cup tipped over, pouring scalding hot coffee onto her. She received third-degree burns over 16 percent of her body, necessitating hospitalization for eight days, whirlpool treatment for debridement of her wounds, skin grafting, scarring, and disability for more than two years. Morgan, The Recorder, September 30, 1994. Despite these extensive injuries, she offered to settle with McDonald’s for $20,000. However, McDonald’s refused to settle. The jury awarded Liebeck $200,000 in compensatory damages -- reduced to $160,000 because the jury found her 20 percent at fault -- and $2.7 million in punitive damages for McDonald’s callous conduct. (To put this in perspective, McDonald's revenue from coffee sales alone is in excess of $1.3 million a day.) The trial judge reduced the punitive damages to $480,000. Subsequently, the parties entered a post-verdict settlement. According to Stella Liebeck’s attorney, S. Reed Morgan, the jury heard the following evidence in the case:

 

By corporate specifications, McDonald's sells its coffee at 180 to 190 degrees Fahrenheit;

 

 

Coffee at that temperature, if spilled, causes third-degree burns (the skin is burned away down to the muscle/fatty-tissue layer) in two to seven seconds;

 

 

Third-degree burns do not heal without skin grafting, debridement and whirlpool treatments that cost tens of thousands of dollars and result in permanent disfigurement, extreme pain and disability of the victim for many months, and in some cases, years;

 

 

The chairman of the department of mechanical engineering and bio-mechanical engineering at the University of Texas testified that this risk of harm is unacceptable, as did a widely recognized expert on burns, the editor in chief of the leading scholarly publication in the specialty, the Journal of Burn Care and Rehabilitation;

 

 

McDonald's admitted that it has known about the risk of serious burns from its scalding hot coffee for more than 10 years -- the risk was brought to its attention through numerous other claims and suits, to no avail;

 

 

From 1982 to 1992, McDonald's coffee burned more than 700 people, many receiving severe burns to the genital area, perineum, inner thighs, and buttocks;

 

 

Not only men and women, but also children and infants, have been burned by McDonald's scalding hot coffee, in some instances due to inadvertent spillage by McDonald's employees;

 

 

At least one woman had coffee dropped in her lap through the service window, causing third-degree burns to her inner thighs and other sensitive areas, which resulted in disability for years;

 

 

Witnesses for McDonald's admitted in court that consumers are unaware of the extent of the risk of serious burns from spilled coffee served at McDonald's required temperature;

 

 

McDonald's admitted that it did not warn customers of the nature and extent of this risk and could offer no explanation as to why it did not;

 

 

McDonald's witnesses testified that it did not intend to turn down the heat -- As one witness put it: “No, there is no current plan to change the procedure that we're using in that regard right now;”

 

 

McDonald's admitted that its coffee is “not fit for consumption” when sold because it causes severe scalds if spilled or drunk;

 

 

Liebeck's treating physician testified that her injury was one of the worst scald burns he had ever seen.

 

Morgan, The Recorder, September 30, 1994. Moreover, the Shriner’s Burn Institute in Cincinnati had published warnings to the franchise food industry that its members were unnecessarily causing serious scald burns by serving beverages above 130 degrees Fahrenheit.

 

<snip>

 

Now, I think that the amount of punitive damages probably was excessive (as the jury awarded them) but I do think the facts warrant punitive damages.

[GoinCruisin]

Yup, read it... still feel the same... how many people would put a hot of scalding hot coffee between their legs to get the lid off? Makes sense that the pressure of your legs and the pulling of the top would cause one of two things to happen, the coffee to overflow or spill... Sorry, but I will never be convinced... common sense should prevail, coffee is hot... none of us need a warning to know this. IMO, placing a cup of steaming (and at that temperature, the steam would have given away the "hot" factor if someone did not realize coffee was supposed to be hot) in between your legs is asking for a spill... Not the place for this kind of debate... Many if not most of us don't think like an attorney and see things differently (nothing wrong with thinking like an attorney, that is how you make your income... just saying you know there is a different way of thinking...)

 

You view things your way, I'll view things mine and it will be all good :D

[tjevans]

Yup, read it... still feel the same... how many people would put a hot of scalding hot coffee between their legs to get the lid off?

 

Last thing I'm going to say on this (then we can go back to being one big happy family :D)

 

My parents for one (I don't drink coffee, so I don't know what's common practice)

[sgriff17]

In the McDonalds case the media thought it was much more fun to say "Someone got 100Million dollars for spilling coffee on herself", rather than report the facts. If you look at the case, what the guy above said was correct. I dont know about 100MM, but McD was negligent.

 

As for the steam, I'm not sure what it's called...but there is some valve that when turned (off/or on or what-have-you) in saunas that have been known to shoot steam out (Unlike it usually does...), so maybe that's what this guy is talking about.

[VentureMan_2000]

I don't remember when it was ever considered proper etiquette (sp?), or even smart, to open your coffee with your knees. Only 20% at fault for not being smart enough to know that hands should be used, and not knees? I'd put the Lady at 100% fault.

You've got to take responsibility for your own actions. Many things are enharently dangerous. Like when I dive into my favorate casserole without letting it cool off enough. Burn the crap out of my mouth every time. You would think I'd learn. Maybe I could sue the Oven manufacturers.

[morriscats]

Totally OT I know but this McDonalds law suit makes no sense when I look at an accident my DH and I were in - inproper guard rail at an intersection, which has since been fixed, allowed our car to land upsidedown in a ditch - DH was killed instantly and I received permanent brain damage - City immune from law suit. Makes no sense to me. Sorry, just venting. Now on to happier topics.

[tinydancer21]

If you have a problem like that on the ship you should tell the pursers desk, my mom had a little bit of metal in her bar of soap that scratched her all up when we were on the Imagination in 1997 and they gave her a 50% off coupon for her next cruise, she wasn't even mad or anything when she came down, she just wanted to let them know, they were very apologetic and nice!

[sgriff17]

Good God, I'm really really sorry to hear that.

[halos]

GoinCruisin --

 

. She received third-degree burns over 16 percent of her body, necessitating hospitalization for eight days, whirlpool treatment for debridement of her wounds, skin grafting, scarring, and disability for more than two years.

.

 

 

 

How big a cup was it??? 16% of her body?????

 

If I sued someone every time I did somethign stupid like that, I could be cruising for the rest of my life and never have to see land again.

[tjevans]

If you have a problem like that on the ship you should tell the pursers desk, my mom had a little bit of metal in her bar of soap that scratched her all up when we were on the Imagination in 1997 and they gave her a 50% off coupon for her next cruise, she wasn't even mad or anything when she came down, she just wanted to let them know, they were very apologetic and nice!

 

 

Too bad I didn't know that on my cruise. I actually did have coffee spilled on me (my hand), but my hand didn't even turn red.

[rocktheboat]

If she didn t know the proper way to pour water in a sauna she should have asked. Anyone who uses a sauna knows steam comes up after pouring the water on the hot rocks. We all need directions when it comes to a new product.

[bethm214]

I appreciate you posting your most recent response and taking the high road in acknowledging that going for a free cruise may not have been a good thing to post. Glad to see it! I certainly hope that Carnival takes your letter seriously and posts a sign or removes the water.

[jgmpuma]

The McDonald's woman had 3rd degree burns (that's the worst) in an area of her body that I hate to think about. The coffee was served at 180 degrees: there was testimony at the trial that the industry standard was 140 degrees. And, eventually, her award was reduced to about $400,000. That sounds like a lot of money, but if you read about what she went through, it isn't.

 

Another legal tidbit is that, if you read your cruise ticket (and it is a legally binding contract), it says that any suit against Carnival must be brought in the US District Court in Miami.

[VentureMan_2000]

Too bad for her injuries. Still her fault. The only reason MCD aidanything is due to what lawyers call "Deep Pockets". It's a shame to.

Opening a lid of a container of hot liquid without using both hands. One word comes to mind: DUH!

Bottom line: She just blew it and didn't want to take responsibility for her actions.

[jncissel]

hey maybe if companys weren't constantly fighting off stupid lawsuits, we'd get charged less :) anyway.. i'm sorry about the sauna burn, that stinks, as for the lady with the mcdonalds coffee... i do feel bad for her and it doesn't make sense about the coffee being so hot, but as everyone else has said.. why put hot coffee between your legs in a car and expect to take off the lid with no spilling?? no sense...oh well.. watch your back everyone...