Delayed flight equals missed cruise

[Cuizer2]

I agree with the above... pretty much the ONLY draw of cruise line air these days is that, like a cruise line excursion, the responsibility to get you to the ship is that of the cruise line. If there are unforeseen difficulties on the part of the airlines with flights booked by Princess, then they are responsible for finding alternative flights.. and if they can't, then it is their responsibility to provide an option in reaching the first port of call. Without this feature, there is literally NO point in even offering cruise line air.

 

Still do not understand what we're missing here, and why Princess did not offer alternative arrangements.... and if it is indeed NOT their responsibility to do so, then what is a SINGLE advantage of cruise line air? Why is it offered?

 

I think you and sever others would do well to read what Princess has to say about arranging transportation for its passengers. This is from Princess' own web site ...

 

18. CARRIER IS AGENT ONLY FOR OTHER TRANSPORTATION, EXCURSIONS AND SHORESIDE SERVICES.

In selling tickets (including coupons or vouchers) or otherwise making arrangements for air, land or local water transportation, or shore excursions, tours or shoreside accommodations and meals, Carrier acts only as an agent for other service companies who provide such services as independent contractors. You agree that Carrier will not be liable in any way for and You release Carrier from any loss, death, injury, delay, or damage to person or property or disappointment arising from or in connection with such services. Any liability for such services will be governed by the terms and conditions of the passage contract and the other contracts and/or tariffs between You and such service companies. A service company shall have the benefit of every defense to which Carrier is entitled under this Passage Contract.

 

Here is the link ... http://www.princess.com/legal/passage.html

 

Princess promises nothing once they book your flights. Of course Princess (and the other cruise lines) will book the least expensive flights they can to maximize their profit. I would be willing to bet that American, United and Continental all have non-stops between Chicago and Houston. But instead, Princess found two flights, on different carriers no less, that cost less than a non-stop from Chicago to Houston. Princess pocketed the difference and Princess could careless that it booked a connection that no sane person would book themselves. This is why I would never book my air through the cruise line.

[Jacqueline]

Yes, many people are under the false assumption that Princess will help. On our March cruise, so many people were delayed that it took over an hour on hold just to get a Princess rep.. I lost my signal and had to start ALL OVER.

[JetsetTX]

We were supposed to be on the Grand Princess (the one with the overboard passengers) last Saturday but due to poor booking of flights by Princess we missed the cruise entirely.

We were leaving Chicago O'Hare airport at 8:20am on American Airlines to a connecting flight in Wichita on Continental to leave at 10:35. This only allowed us 20 minutes to connect in Wichita to a different carrier with our destination being Houston where we were to be picked up by Princess to be transported to the boat in Galveston for a 5PM departure.

When our flight from Chicago was delayed we called Princess right away knowing the booking was tight to begin with. They attempted to get us on another flight directly to Houston but the flights were booked (spring break).

They looked for any other flights but told us that any other flight would get us to Houston too late for pick-up to the cruise boat and asked us if we had cruise insurance. They stated that they might be able to fly us to the first port but we didn't have a passport and then we were told it was up to American Airlines to get us to Houston in time and nothing more could be done by Princess. We subsequently missed the cruise since we ran out of options.

We feel that the travel arrangements were very poor and with any slight delay in either flight (especially the first flight) we were bound to miss the cruise. Had we known this we would have been willing to fly out the night before but we trusted the cruise line to get us there.

Then we were notified by our travel agent that Princess was threatening to charge us a cancellation fee. After what we went through we feel we should be compensated by Princess regardless of cruise insurance... Has anyone had a similar experience??

Katie

Considering both American and United have hubs in Chicago and both have non-stop flights to Houston and also that Houston is Continental's (the better airline of the three IMO... though I'm biased I guess because I work there) it is absolutely unconsciounable to me that Princess would have booked you on two different airlines connecting through Wichita! I am cruising on Princess out of LA this Saturday and even though I can fly standby for free, I used miles I have earned over the years for the tickets for my Mom, her husband, and I to fly there. I can't wait, but I can say thank God for not having to book through them. Honestly, it is unimaginable that a cruise line which I am sure has contracts with all of the above airlines would book a connection when one is not necessary. I think you should definitely be able to get your money back from them and if you don't simply dispute the charge with the credit card company! Also, send a letter to the Better Business Bureau and your state Attorney General's office. Trust me, this will get there attention.

[JetsetTX]

If your original booking was only allowing you a 20 minute connection, it was not a legal booking and you should be allowed compensation or a refund. This also points out the need to, despite the cruise line policies to never travel these days without a passport. Also evidence of another reason to buy insurance. Did you book this yourself or use a TA, as I would have thought a good TA would have given you an explanation of the pitfalls of this plan. I am so sorry this happened to you.

Actually, in Wichita connecting from American to Continental domestic to domestic flight, 20 minutes is a legal connection. It is still incredible that the line would book a connection in ICT when there are non-stop flights on three airlines!

[JetsetTX]

Yes, a 20 minute connection in Wichita (not a metropolis) is legal! And regarding legal and illegal connections these are not legal terms so these are industry terms... don't confuse them with legal rights in court. And for those quick to blame the airlines... the delays at O'Hare 99% of the time are caused by our antiquated Air Traffic Control system and not by the airlines. It was the cruise line that booked a connection when non-stop flights were available on three airlines, YES the cruise line is responsible for this ridiculous booking. Yes the cruise line should own up to the responsibility!

[JetsetTX]

I too would question the 20-minute time to connect. I know we had booked a connecting flight through NWA once, and due to a schedule change, the second leg of the flight was rescheduled and pushed out 3.5 hours. This was because the schedule change for the first leg of our flight now only allowed us 29 minutes to connect to the next flight, and they require a minimum of 30 minutes to make a connection. It sounds like Princess did some creative scheduling ... are AA and Continental even partner airlines? I would check on that. Good luck to you. I am sorry you missed your cruise. :(

The 29 minute connection was probalby too short in one of NW's hubs, Detroit or Minneapolis or Memphis. In Wichita.. a 20 minute connection is permissible. Minimum connect times are the absolute minimum time needed to get from one flight to another if both are on time and do not factor in any delays whatsoever.

[JetsetTX]

Agreed. Continental's terms of carriage require that you be at the gate, ready to board at least 15 minutes before your scheduled departure time, even if you already have a boarding pass. There is no practical way for you to have met this requirement even if your first flight landed on time. (Even if your flight had arrived on time, if you got to the Continental gate ten minutes before departure you could have found that your seat had already been given away.) This should be dumped back into Princess' lap -- they booked you on an illegal connection that could not be made even if the flights were on time. Unless you were travelling first class, you'd likely have been more than five minutes after noted arrival time before you even got off the aircraft. You paid a premium price to have Princess make the travel arrangements, and they messed up. To those who suggest that the OP should have had insurance, while I'm generally strongly in favor of insurance, I don't know that insurance would pay if the connection wasn't a legal one in the first place.

 

Next time, save yourself and everyone you're travelling with great heartburn: arrange to fly in the night before, and buy insurance. I'm also not a fan of connections through really small airports -- if the connecting flight cancels, you're generally really out of luck.

 

Even with this, it still doesn't mean you might not miss a cruise (the Denver airport was closed for three days during the Christmas blizzard this year) but it certainly minimizes the chance and reduces your possible out-of-pocket loss.

 

It must have been incredibly frustrating to watch this all happen.

Nope, again... not an illegal connection and while yes your seat can be given away if not at the gate to board 15 minutes before departure... if you are on a connecting flight your seat will not be cancelled until very close to departure. And in Wichita, I am quite sure you could deplane and get to the next gate within that 20 minute connection and still be in line to board 15 minutes prior to departure, it's not JFK or ORD, or LAX!

[JetsetTX]

Here is my take. Princess knowingly booked you with a tight connection. They should have assisted with alternate travel arrangements and delayed the ship. Since they did not, at a minimum they should offer you another comparable trip with airfare. Those who say Princess is not responsible for AAL are wrong. Did you notice when people were poisoned by the food at Taco Bell that Taco Bell and the supplier were liable, not merely the supplier? Here, Princess chose AAL.

 

As to airlines, whether it is a mechanical, weather, or other delay is always difficult to actually tell. Have you ever noticed an aircraft sitting at a gate, with its door closed? Thats an example of manipulating data, so they can report an on-time departure. I worked for a federal agency, and from my experience, I always said that the only FAA statistic that could be relied upon was the number of aircraft fatalities. Why? Because those statistics are easily monitored by outside groups. I personally observed an FAA inspection where a runway incursion occurred in front of an inspector, and it was ignored by all parties, despite a directive that it had to be reported within a certain number of hours.

 

I would contact a local law firm in Los Angeles (I believe that's where venue lies) to seek if they can affordably assist you. I'm sure there are some that specialize in this area affordably.

 

Now my tongue in cheek reply. Had Princess done the right thing and waited for you, we know it wouldn't have affected their itinerary by a late departure, because they made up time on the actual cruise, after taking many hours to recover the swimmers. Also, had they waited for you, the swimmers would have partied in port, and fallen overboard in port, hopefully falling on the water side of the ship. Princess would have easily recovered the swimmers in port and saved many lost hours of searching for the swimmers. Princess could have kept bars open, and not sent everybody to their rooms. Princess wouldn't have exhausted the workers by having them up in the middle of the night. It looks to me like by Princess doing the wrong thing with you, a direct consequence of that action was the swimmers falling overboard in the middle of the gulf and not in port! You should get a class action together for all passengers who were inconvenienced by the swimmers, since that wouldn't have happened had the ship waited for you! Of course, had the ship stayed in port, and the swimmers fell over on the land side of the ship, they probably would have sued Princess because "but for Princess' actions in delaying departure, the swimmers would have fallen overboard in the open sea, and not 60 feet onto the dock."

 

By the way, I'm an attorney, and any legal advice I may have given cannot be relied upon!

Your theory about an airline manipulating data is off base conisdering it doesn't matter what time a flight shows out because the door is closed and the aircraft is still sitting at the gate. What matters as far as the DOT goes and their statistics is the arrival time. Flights arriving 14 minutes or less from the scheduled time are considered on time and flights arriving 15 minutes or more after the sheduled time are considered late so it really makes no difference how late or early the flight departs, it's the arrival time that counts.

[JetsetTX]

Please read my previous post...only because this is confusing, and several people are mis-stating the passport requirements. The US isn't saying that people need a passport to enter other countries; they require that people leaving the US by air have a valid passport prior to departure, so that they will comply upon their eventual return.

 

My guess is that carriers will face stiff penalties for non-compliance.

"Beginning January 23, 2007, ALL persons, including U.S. citizens, traveling by air between the United States and Canada, Mexico, Central and South America, the Caribbean, and Bermuda will be required to present a valid passport, Air NEXUS card, or U.S. Coast Guard Merchant Mariner Document, or an Alien Registration Card, Form I-551, if applicable."

 

This is quoted from the State Department's website. The key word here is BETWEEN meaning to and from. No, the US government can not legislate what another country accepts and therefore the Mexican Government at their discretion can accept a birth certificate if they wish; however, the US government can legislate what is required to EXIT AND ENTER the US and this is what they have done. They require a passport or green card to enter or exit the US and I for one am glad they finally did!

[JetsetTX]

Hi all. It's Katie who missed the boat. Just to clarify some things-we knew that we had insurance for the trip and called them right away. We didn't think about the connection we had until we knew our flight was delayed and of course didn't know about alot of variables that led to us not being able to get booked on other flights. Of course we will be much more careful and fly out a day ahead next time.

 

American Airlines delayed the flight at 7:50-the time we should have been boarding and told us that the flight crew scheduled for our flight had already logged in the max hours that they could fly. Yes, there was fog and and I think there probably were some delays due to weather-either at O'Hare or other airports. We assumed that this problem was due to weather but now I think it could have been some other reason. Like someone else said, they change flights all the time.. and the connection time was exactly 20 minutes.

Katie:cool::D

At 7:50 in the morning the crew had already logged more than the alllowed amount by contract or the legally allowed hours? Sounds like American has some issues they need to resolve.

[JetsetTX]

Doubtful that they were issued two seperate tickets as airlines have interline agreements. More likely they were issued on one ticket which is done frequently, again 20 minutes is a legal connection in Wichita. Either way, if Princess booked a connection through Wichita which makes no sense when 3 airlines offer non-stops then their customer service as far as air add ons sucks. They should own up to their stupidity! Otherwise a dispute of the charges through the credit card company should do the trick.

[Cuizer2]

Doubtful that they were issued two seperate tickets as airlines have interline agreements. More likely they were issued on one ticket which is done frequently, again 20 minutes is a legal connection in Wichita. Either way, if Princess booked a connection through Wichita which makes no sense when 3 airlines offer non-stops then their customer service as far as air add ons sucks. They should own up to their stupidity! Otherwise a dispute of the charges through the credit card company should do the trick.

 

The cruise lines are not stupid (inept maybe, but not stupid). They require full payment 75 - 90 days prior to sailing. That means that by the time you have missed your flight, the window for disputing the charge (60 days after the original bill is sent) is past.

[AirGorilla]

Actually, there are four airlines flying non-stop from Chicago to Houston: American, Continental, Southwest and United.

 

Why in the blazes a connection was booked via ICT is baffling.

[bobbyd6363]

I learned a long time ago to book my own flights to the departure port and ALWAYS a day or two before! Also I strongly recommend using some kind of insurance. I use American Express' trip cancellation and interruption insurance with baggage protection! They have come to my rescue MANY times and no one messes with AMEX! I have a great story about my partner's luggage being lost by American Airlines enroute to San Juan and boy did AMEX tear them up! They gave us money to buy what we were missing and beat the airlines and Royal Carribean until that bag was found and in our hands! LOL!! As a matter of fact, the baggage rep for RCCL called me the day the bag was brought onboard (2 days later) and told me he never wanted to deal with AMEX again!

[JetsetTX]

The cruise lines are not stupid (inept maybe, but not stupid). They require full payment 75 - 90 days prior to sailing. That means that by the time you have missed your flight, the window for disputing the charge (60 days after the original bill is sent) is past.

I would have to double check... but I believe as long as the amount has not been paid off there is not a time limit. The fine print does state that if it has been paid off then it might not be possible to dispute a charge.

[JetsetTX]

Actually, there are four airlines flying non-stop from Chicago to Houston: American, Continental, Southwest and United.

 

Why in the blazes a connection was booked via ICT is baffling.

True, I forgot about the cattle car.

[JetsetTX]

We were on the ship you missed. We also had flights thru Princess, from O'hare to Minneapolis to Houston, with 25 minutes to connect. I opted to pay extra to change to a direct flight the day before.

 

When we arrived in Costa Maya the first port I counted about 15 people waiting to board who missed the ship in Texas. So you were not alone.

 

Next time I will not use Princess for flights.

Ah, it seems there's a pattern then with Princess. If you were booked through Minneapolis and the people that missed their cruise was booked through Wichita when there are several airlines that fly non-stop then it would seem Princess does this to make a little extra money. Booking a tight connection expecting a lot of people to then pay their $50 fee to change to a non-stop flight. Hmmm... what a scheme. From the sound of it it is definitely better to book air on your own.

[sk8terchick]

So Sorry you missed your flight :( We have always booked our flights with Princess & have never had a problem getting to our destination on time....of course we always go at least one night before & our next cruise in October we will be arriving 3 nights prior, for some extra relaxation. We also always get the travel insurance now just to be safe.

As far as Princess they bent over backward for a friend of ours who missed the ship due to flight(privately booked by him not Princess) and they helped him find a new flight, plus gave him a shipboard credit, because he missed sailaway, a day at sea and Jamaica which is where he was flown into to catch up with the ship. I thought that was pretty nice of Princess and he was very surprised as well.

[JetsetTX]

I think you and sever others would do well to read what Princess has to say about arranging transportation for its passengers. This is from Princess' own web site ...

 

18. CARRIER IS AGENT ONLY FOR OTHER TRANSPORTATION, EXCURSIONS AND SHORESIDE SERVICES.

In selling tickets (including coupons or vouchers) or otherwise making arrangements for air, land or local water transportation, or shore excursions, tours or shoreside accommodations and meals, Carrier acts only as an agent for other service companies who provide such services as independent contractors. You agree that Carrier will not be liable in any way for and You release Carrier from any loss, death, injury, delay, or damage to person or property or disappointment arising from or in connection with such services. Any liability for such services will be governed by the terms and conditions of the passage contract and the other contracts and/or tariffs between You and such service companies. A service company shall have the benefit of every defense to which Carrier is entitled under this Passage Contract.

 

Here is the link ... http://www.princess.com/legal/passage.html

 

Princess promises nothing once they book your flights. Of course Princess (and the other cruise lines) will book the least expensive flights they can to maximize their profit. I would be willing to bet that American, United and Continental all have non-stops between Chicago and Houston. But instead, Princess found two flights, on different carriers no less, that cost less than a non-stop from Chicago to Houston. Princess pocketed the difference and Princess could careless that it booked a connection that no sane person would book themselves. This is why I would never book my air through the cruise line.

You are absolutely right, the have no legal responsibility to do anything. However, as a matter of customer service, they should refund the money paid for the cruise, or at the very least give that amount as a credit toward another cruise. They, not the airlines, decided to book this routing apparently in the hope of making extra money in the fee they charge to change air arrangements.