Carnival to cut pay to agents making own pricing scheme

[VentureMan_2000]

Thank you for a fact based response.

[Snowball]

[quote name='jcanino']I am not sure if anyone realizes it, but if you book a cruise with an agency that deeply discounts the cruise price, for any reason, and that agency goes out of business, the booking reverts to the cruise lines. Once that happens, your price also reverts to the original price quoted to the agency PRIOR to them making a discount adjustment. The cruise line does not care of any "deal" made between the agency and the consumer.[/QUOTE]I'm sure that is probably true, but come on, how often do you think that really happens? I've never read about that happening on any of the cruise message boards that I read. :rolleyes:

[jcanino]

[quote name='Snowball']I'm sure that is probably true, but come on, how often do you think that really happens? I've never read about that happening on any of the cruise message boards that I read. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]
Not everyone reads cruise message boards. You would be surprised of the number of agencies that go out of business. In the last year, another agency in my town just disappeared. No notice to anyone, nothing! I even knew the owner and have not heard a word from her. An agency in the next town over also went out of business. If you were to read the trade press, you would know the numbers.

[triathlete]

Some very smart comments in this thread--thanks, folks.

However, I have to say that this has nothing to do with helping out small agencies--it's about trying to eliminate travel agents all together.

Carnival can't prevent agencies from discounting, as CruisingCo said--not without violating anti-trust laws. But they would if they could, as it would make the agents less revelvant for experienced cruisers. If you can do your own research online and know exactly what you want, why not go with the lowest price?

Keeping prices off web sites just means that you'll have to request actual quotes from each agency, as you can say whatever you want in a private communication. This should also be good for CruiseCompete.com, as they aren't a medium for public advertising, rather a medium for private communication between consumers and agents. If you have to request quotes, you may as well do it in batch mode...

[Cruise News Daily]

[quote name='eroller']Isn't Cruise News Daily owned and published by a travel agent? [/QUOTE]
No Ernie, it's not. Originally CND, when it was free, was a marketing tool for the travel agency, but Cruise News Daily was spun of into its own business, and the agency was divested of a few years ago. Thirty years' experience in the agency and airline field does give me some good perspective for the articles I write about agency affairs, however.

Alan Wilson
Cruise News Daily

[TBR]

This was in travel weekly magazine

RCCL to cut pay, support to rebaters (08/06/2004)

[img]http://www.travelweekly.com/images/x.gif[/img]By Rebecca Tobin[img]http://www.travelweekly.com/images/x.gif[/img][font=Arial][size=2][font=Arial]MIAMI -- Royal Caribbean Cruises will cut back co-op support and base commission pay to agents who advertise non-published or non-contracted rates starting Aug. 16. [/font]

[font=Arial] [/font]

[font=Arial]The program affects rates in ads for both Royal Caribbean International and Celebrity Cruises in mediums like TV, newspapers, radio, catalogs, direct mail and online vehicles such as search engines, Web sites, e-mail and banner and popup ads.[/font]

[font=Arial] [/font]

[font=Arial]"We really feel that rebating is damaging our distribution system," Lisa Bauer, RCCL's senior vice president-sales, told TravelWeekly.com Friday afternoon. [/font]

[font=Arial] [/font]

[font=Arial]Carnival Cruise Lines said Thursday it would reduce agency compensation to retailers who published non-approved rates in public media.[/font]

[/size][/font]

[Salty Dawg]

[QUOTE][font=Arial]Royal Caribbean Cruises will cut back co-op support and base commission pay to agents who advertise non-published or non-contracted rates starting Aug. 16. [/font]
[/QUOTE][QUOTE][font=Arial]Carnival Cruise Lines said Thursday it would reduce agency compensation to retailers who published non-approved rates in public media.[/font]
[/QUOTE]
[b]Gee, what a 'coincidence' ??? or is that 'conspiracy' ![/b]

[Cruising89143]

Unfortunately this is what happens when two companies(Carnival and RCI) own the major majority of the lines and ships that we all cruise. They now call all of the shots. Too bad the FTC and other agencies did not see this when they were approving all of the mergers and takeovers between the cruise lines.

[Ricks]

[font=Times New Roman][size=3]When I look back at the prices that I paid when I used TA’s and also hear what other pay. My jaw just drops. Most people are comfortable using a TA. That fine they would not know what to do other wise, personally I don’t need one. I know what I want and I go fine it, at the best price. I have Timeshare weeks and also like to cruise, when it comes to traveling I do better with pricing myself whether its with airline prices to hotels, cruises. [/size][/font]



[size=3][font=Times New Roman]What Carnival is doing is just price controlling, nothing more than what you see driving down the road looking for a cheap gas price. [/font][/size]

[mohavemommy]

In the past few years, there have been two local TA's go out of business here, leaving just one local one. I wonder if the local one will last long with their $300 cruise cancellation policy...... They are very nice people, but I won't be subject to losing that amount of money just for a friendly person. They never have prices lower than what Carnival advertises, so I am sure they won't be affected by the new policy other than that they now will offer the same prices that everyone else does......

[joannie]

The ploy of not allowing any travel agent to advertise a discounted cruise fare in any media, simply means more clients will be buying directly from each cruise line. Think about it.
.
Where quickly will you be able to check for cruise bargains online? Only at a cruise line website. Do you really want to start calling the same 10 agencies that you used to check online? Nope.
.
Its really simple. This is a way for cruise lines to reduce their commission expenses..
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Who Loses? Only each of us who will now not be allowed to access instant discounts on the internet, like most other major purchases which are made online.

[GoinCruisin]

I think everyone is taking this a bit too far... IMO. They said they are cutting back for TA's that advertise non-published or non contract rates. It does NOT say that all TA's have to advertise at brochure pricing. Carnival doesn't even advertise at brochure pricing. There will always be special and Carnival is just saying that THEY will hold the cards on what the specials are... they will decide what is an acceptable promotion... Until we see a full report and see what effect this will have, there is nothing other than speculation... Cruiseships rely on TA's and they are not trying to pull all the business their way... they can barely handle the ones they do have and I'm sure that when every other enterprise in the country is trying to cut staff to control costs, that Carnival is not going to go out and hire hundreds of PVP's in order to cut off the TA's...

[hdawson]

Goincruzn. Well said. I've read that it's more expensive for direct bookings
(to the cruiseline) than using the TA community.

[Jancruz]

I cant believe how many of you say you are going to book direct..what does that accomplish..you will be paying the same price and getting no service from the cruise line..they wont upgrade you, make sure your price is correct, give you any kind of perks..I think you will be cutting your nose to spite your face..
Jan
cruzunlimited

[Cruising89143]

[url="http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=64741"]http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=64741[/url]

The above is a good thread that is going on over on the Princess board. One poster by the name of "Monk" does a very good job of explaining all of this mumbo jumbo.

[joannie]

For those of you who think cruise lines will be adding hundreds on new staff to handle bookings and thus raise their cost of business....forget it.
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The percent of direct online bookings to cruise lines with booking engines is increasing each day.
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I can see all of us now having to call 10 -15 agencies for discount quotes rather than be lead down the path of a cruise booking engine.
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Stop for a moment..
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Lets see..a travel agency can't advertise a discount, but a travel agent can discount if you call them. What the cruise lines are attempting to do is slow down the mega agencies and others who are using the web to LOWER prices for consumers. The LOWER prices we receive come from the online travel agents commissions and NOT the cruise lines.

Wake up cruisers

[LSUtraveler]

[b][i][size=3][color=darkorchid]It would seem on the surface that Carnival is trying to get a better grip or control on the span of pricing throughout their own industry. I don't think it impacts them too much if a TA discounts a price so low that they eventually go out of business. They don't have to honor the discount the TA's give, I'm pretty sure.[/color][/size][/i][/b]
[b][i][size=3][color=#9932cc][/color][/size][/i][/b]
[b][i][size=3][color=#9932cc]It may be a similar situation as the airlines did with the TA's. I'm not totally familiar with it but it seems the same. I know that when the airlines got together, which I honestly believe they did, that the tickets from my TA took a jump. When I check pricing from the various TA's they seem to be pretty much in the same range.[/color][/size][/i][/b]
[b][i][size=3][color=#9932cc][/color][/size][/i][/b]
[b][i][size=3][color=#9932cc]We'll just have to wait and see what really shakes out in the next few months. Oh well.[/color][/size][/i][/b]

[Cruising89143]

I have a friend that is a PVP with Carnival. The office that she works in down in South Florida has about three hundred reps. She told me that they are working to double that amount. Sounds to me like they are looking for more and more people to book direct.

[Lindajlamarre]

Don't the "online TA's" help fill Carnival ships??? I bet it's the "online TA's" who have made cruising the "thing to do" these days and I think it's due to "competitive pricing"... I think if Carnival "controls" the pricing of online TA's...well...fooey on them!

Linda

[hdawson]

Linda. I disagre. It's the TA's that have been promoting cruising for the last 25 yrs, not the ones that came about in the last 3 yrs. It's the TAs that have taken the time to sit and discuss the benifits or disadvantages of cruising and make the effort to help match cruisers with the line that fits the clients taste and style. Don't think the vending machine type of agents have added anything (except maybe addon fees).

[Cruising89143]

As I stated in a post above, you now have two cruise lines that control almost all of the companies that we all cruise. They are now now working to start controlling the pricing. Do you think that Carnival or RCI would have done this seven or eight years ago when most cruise lines were still independant of each other? In a word "no". The TA's would have simply stopped the sales of certain lines and moved on. Now they can't do this due to the monopoly of Carnival and RCI. People can stick their heads in the sand over this latest move and try to put a positive spin on it but it will only get worse in the years to come as the few cruise lines that are left are either absorbed into the two big boys are fold all together.

[joannie]

Carnival Corp's revenue for last year were some 6 Billion, Lets see for every 1 percent reduction in their commission expense there's an extra $60 million dollars in found profit for Carnival Corp. Yes this not include the other Carnival companies, but how long do you think they are from implementing the same policy?


Let's see commission expenses going down for Carnival, Royal Caribbean and Celebrity. Folks check cruise prices. They are going up.

You can talk all about your local agent and the loyalty we all have to them, however look out for less competition and more price control from the mega lines who now control the cruise pricing distribution system.

[Cruising89143]

My understanding is that this new policy will be in effect for Carnival Corp. not just the Carnival brand.

[Ricks]

[font=Times New Roman][size=3]Face it people we will not be able to buy cheap cabin any longer. I think it great to be optimistic about what Carnival and other big Cruise lines are tiring to do. Bottom line it will cost all of us our hard earned money. [/size][/font]



[size=3][font=Times New Roman]Case in point here in Massachusetts, in the construction industry. Back in the late 80’s early 90’s. A cement company giant went around buying up all the small cement companies in mass. Than in the late 90’s we had the big Dig in Boston, what a surprise!!! All the cement went up… and that’s where it stayed. No competition to control pricing. [/font][/size]



[font=Times New Roman][size=3]AS of late some of the online TA’s have started coming up with their own solution to the new rules. Which makes me happy that they will use their imagination to over ride the new policy. Makes me think of the local Scuba Diving shop was told by Sherwood that they can only sell their product with the companies approved price. He changed all the prices to reflex that and added on a tag that the idem has a very large rebate taken off at the register. He sold all the Sherwood stock and stopped carrying it. [color=orange]Seems like the Online TA can’t do that[/color].[/size][/font]

[font=Times New Roman][size=3]Just my Thoughts:cool: [/size][/font]

[cricket]

This is just another thing that will cause the cruise lines to hurt themselves. I for one will look at their prices and just not go! Others will follow, and at the very least, people will cut down on the amount of cruises they are use to taking, which in return will hurt the cruise business. What will happen next, like on hotels.com....will they have to advertise the hotels prices and not their discounted price? Don't give me that stuff about good service from the cruise lines...that is Bxxxx! I have dealt with TA's and cruise lines and the cruise lines are no better than the private TA's! Sometimes they are worse in the sense that TA's will go out of their way to service you while cruise lines will basically not care about your problem!