Tommart

2 hours ago, cruisenewbie1976 said:

I didn't mean everyone, you certainly aren't one of them. It's quite possibly the minority of posters but it's certainly the ones that dominate most of the threads. 

Perhaps that's an indication of the way P&O is regarded these days?  Used not to be that way in these forums, so if it is now that suggests a change of view of the way P&O operates.  It's not remotely what it was in so many ways (OK - the prices are lower) and maybe that's why so many are disenchanted with the product.

11 minutes ago, Pine Man said:

 

That doesn't make any sense.

 

If you cancel and lose your deposit that money is gone - completely.

 

If you cancel and take a FCC the money remains available and usable for a period should you change your mind.

Makes perfect sense to me.  A cash refund is cash in hand.  An FCC is worthless if Carnival goes under.

Rarely can so many people be so keen to return home - I think we need a welcome party.

Holidays in Cornwall and Northumberland again - yippee!

However this ends up, post-Covid cruising is going to look very different indeed from pre-Covid cruising.  A very substantial industry shake up, with not all companies surviving.

This has very little to do with inability to cope with the demand for refunds - but everything to do with the lack of cash to pay up.  Carnival are struggling with cashflow, and trying to preserve what they have.  ABTA are pushing for the 14 day legal requirement for refunds to be extended to 4 months, but as things stand it's still 14 days.

8 hours ago, wowzz said:

Me too, a couple of weeks ago. 

Just like being in Stalinist Russia!

I received this warning.  It might help others to avoid warnings, and where to take the matter up:

Note for member

Discussion of the management of this Community, including post removals, member suspensions, or any rule of participation is not allowed.

We will be answering any questions about moderation of this community via email, please write to community@cruisecritic.com.

1 hour ago, Pine Man said:

These are the generation that will be running the country one day - if it still exists!

They're also, to be fair, the generation who'll have to pay for the economic consequences of what's going on now - essentially to save the 15% of the population at risk of dying from Covid.  They might take the view that the price is too high - though I don't condone the behaviour.

The 30 year old who's been told she can't have cancer treatment because the NHS can't afford it might view the vast costs of saving the lives of people who are going to die anyway in a pretty short time as questionable!

11 minutes ago, phillipahain said:

Its clearly been announced though that ALL the deaths in Itsly also had 3 other illnesses already 

That has very little significance - that's not at all an unusual situation for the elderly, many or most of whom will have other conditions.  It's exactly the same in the US and the UK. 

The point is that these patients would and could have been given intensive care for the lung and other problems (though perhaps not in the UK because of the lack of ICU beds) in 'normal' times.  Coronavirus is creating so many cases that it's swamping health systems.  Italy hasn't coped, and neither has Spain.  Neither will the UK and neither will the US.  The US has come to this very late in the day, because a certain person denied that it was a problem - so it may well be worse there than anywhere else.

13 minutes ago, NoFlyGuy said:

456 known cases out of a population of over 60 million hardly seems to be something to panic over even though that is likely to rise over the weeks ahead.

Of course there are people who will die from this virus and, that's very sad, but thousands die every year from seasonable flu and other viruses and infections. Overaction seems to be the order of the day these days.

456 is likely to be a highly misleading figure - we've been testing much lower numbers than the Italians have, and the real figure is probably a lot higher.  The more you test, the more positives you get, and our testing numbers have been small.  Our figures look to be on a similar trajectory to Italy's, but, unlike Italy, we've run down our health service over recent years by cutting bed numbers and hugely cutting staff numbers.

827 Covid-19 deaths in Italy alone since 21 February, and a lot more to come.  I wonder how sentiment's going to change when we reach that point, perhaps over the next 6 weeks.  This is not overreaction - it's a serious problem for the country.

21 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

To get back on track, would it not be possible for Arcadia to increase the number of Med ports she visits, unless of course she is tied to a Suez canal transit timetable, and can't free up some time there?

You'd have thought so - unless it's become much more difficult to find ports that will accept cruise ships across a much wider area.  The longest I've done without a port is 5 nights - that was too long.  5 weeks would fill me with horror.  It's all about visiting the ports for me, though I know Dai loves his sea days!

Is this all confirmed, or are we just speculating again? Five weeks without a port call seems extraodinary - surely P&O must have offered something to soften the blow?

Just wait for the claims under the Package Travel Regulations - difficult to imagine this isn't a significant change, with a proportional refund.  I wonder how the original port schedule will compare with the actual port schedule.

7 minutes ago, Daveuj said:

Just a thought but have PandO said 48 hours to give them time to adjust the prices (up)?

Probably, as others have said, after tomorrow's COBRA meeting.

30 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

I was correct. BBC also reporting the same this morning. FCO website hasn’t been updated yet, but link to Department of Health & Social Care shows;

 

Stay indoors and avoid contact with other people if you’ve travelled to the UK from the following places, even if you do not have symptoms:

• Italy (since 09 March)

So this presumably means that anyone who has been / goes to anywhere in Italy and returns to the Uk from now on will not be able to join a cruise until they have completed a period of self isolation?

 

EDIT - Sky News also confirming this morning. Anyone returning to the UK from anywhere in Italy must self isolate for 14 days, not just those displaying symptoms. Worrying times. 

Still confusion over this, in that government websites are still not mentioning the period of self-isolation - not sure where Sky got their 14 days from, but the Guardian is saying the same.

"Returning travellers

Stay indoors and avoid contact with other people if you’ve travelled to the UK from the following places in the last 14 days, even if you do not have symptoms:

Iran
Hubei province in China
Special care zones in South Korea (Daegu, Cheongdo, Gyeongsan)

Stay indoors and avoid contact with other people if you’ve travelled to the UK from the following places, even if you do not have symptoms:

Italy (since 09 March)"

I wonder how many people are actually going to heed this 'advice'.

The Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) advise against all but essential travel to Italy, due to an ongoing outbreak of coronavirus (Covid-19) and in line with various controls and restrictions imposed by the Italian authorities on 9 March.

British nationals remain able to depart Italy without restriction. Airports remain open throughout Italy. However, airline schedules are subject to change and some flights are being cancelled. Travellers are advised to check flight details with airlines.

Additional restrictions include the closure of museums, cultural institutions and the suspension of all public gatherings and sporting events. Religious ceremonies and funerals are suspended. Ski facilities are closed. Childcare facilities, schools and universities are closed until 3 April. Restaurants and bars remain open with restricted hours and reduced seating.

If you’re returning to the UK from Italy, consult the latest advice from the Department of Health and Social Care on actions to take.

18 minutes ago, Selbourne said:

Quick question, out of ignorance as we book directly with P&O. We pay our balance 90 days before departure but travel agents often require payment quite a bit earlier. Are TA’s showing flexibility and allowing final payments at the P&O cut off rather then theirs? 
 

In the last few minutes the government has issued new travel advice against non essential travel to all of Italy and anyone travelling back to the UK from anywhere in Italy should self isolate for 14 days. I guess that means more itinerary changes and more passengers who will not be able to join their cruise. 

The Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) advise against all but essential travel to Italy, due to an ongoing outbreak of coronavirus (Covid-19) and in line with various controls and restrictions imposed by the Italian authorities on 9 March.

It also has insurance implications, I believe, and may provide a get-out for some people looking for one.

1 hour ago, glittergal1 said:

So we are all getting the same standard Fob off response 

Give him a little time.  This looks, in view of the Carnival statement today, increasingly positive for customers.

1 hour ago, majortom10 said:

Hasnt the NHS always done that anyway.

 

It has, but in 'normal' times it's just about coped, except in winter.  Ten years of cuts have removed staff, beds, and ICU beds though, and it certainly can't cope with the sort of additional demand now predicted.

No amount of reassurance from the government can change hard facts, magic up the additional 50,000 nurses the PM keeps talking about, or magic up all the additional ICU beds, ventilators and other equipment needed.

I doubt, in fact, whether there are enough trolleys to line people up in corridors!  Or enough corridors!

1 hour ago, Selbourne said:

As if the potential for a Coronavirus outbreak wasn’t enough to make many of us reconsider whether or not to go ahead with our cruises, we now have a stock market crash (down 8% this morning, making a total drop of almost 25% in recent weeks). I’m sure that I won’t be alone in thinking that cancelling a cruise will help offset some of my losses!

20% for me as of now.  Not particularly concerned, though, because I've been through much the same situation several times before and the worst possible thing has always been to sell.  Sticking has always proved the right approach for me.

I take your point about the impact on purchases of cruises though.

11 hours ago, davecttr said:

I think very few people have realized the enormous threat of this disease as it is disturbing how many never see or listen to serious news, it is 'boring' What news they consume is lurid headlines in the gutter press. What their mate said down 'spoons'. Celebrity news and sport etc. 

How true that is.  Very few people, comparatively speaking, now get their news from reliable sources, which is one of the reasons we're still getting all this 'It's just flu, load of fuss about nothing' nonsense - just before they raid Tesco and clear it out of toliet rolls.

5 hours ago, jake 26 said:

Agreed, but they are currently knocking around the £20 - £22 level, and I think it's reasonable to assume they would rise to £30+ in due course, a 50% gain.

I took a similar view some years back in a similar situation with Queens Moat Houses.  The shares didn't rise as I expected them to - the company went under.

Don't forget the TV in your cabin if you run out of stuff to do outside it.  Several channels, including live TV (of sorts), free films, and repeats of the port talks and other talks you might have missed.

9 hours ago, terrierjohn said:

I accept that it will be impossible for the NHS to operate normally if, as predicted, there could be many thousands needing hospitalization. But I am convinced we will cope, we always do in any crisis, it may end up as a very makeshift coping system, but make no mistake it will cope as best it can.

So please can we all stop looking for armageddon, it won't happen just yet.

Sorry, but just how exactly do you think the NHS will cope, given that the Chief Medical Officer said this:

"Modelling suggests that 50 per cent of cases in the UK will probably happen during a three-week period and 95 per cent within a nine-week period, potentially resulting in high numbers of cases “way over-topping the ability of the NHS to put everyone in beds".

Where will the ICU beds come from, where will the staff for them come from (given that 20% may be off sick) and the ventilators?  They can't be magicked up from nowhere.  Even the government is working on the likely scenario of 100,000 deaths - and that's the planning figure given to local authorities.

This is what happens when you run the NHS down over 10 years.

8 hours ago, wowzz said:

Terrier- you can run the country. You would do a far better job than any one else has done for the past 40 years! 

The anxiety gripping the nation, causing panic buying of loo rolls, is due to a virus that has caused the death of 2 (yes 2) people who were already ill.  

Come on people - I lived through the great freeze of 1963 - how is this worse? 

You've not noticed the Italian situation then? Or the comments of our Chief Medical Officer?  We look very much to be on the same trajectory as Italy, which started off with 3 cases and within two weeks had 3000.

"The death toll in Italy has passed 230, with officials reporting more than 36 deaths in 24 hours. The number of confirmed cases jumped by more than 1,200 to 5,883 on Saturday."

"Prof Whitty (Chief Medical Officer) said modelling suggests that 50 per cent of cases in the UK will probably happen during a three-week period and 95 per cent within a nine-week period, potentially resulting in high numbers of cases “way over-topping the ability of the NHS to put everyone in beds”."

7 hours ago, wowzz said:

But you are confusing the directors of Carnival,  who ultimately are responsible for the corporation, with the management at P&O.  

Not at all.  There's UK P&O representation on the main Carnival Corporation/Carnival plc board (it's a dual listed company) and it would be difficult to believe that remuneration isn't linked to performance.

Quite apart from that, though, the Carnival UK people (Josh Weinstein and Paul Ludlow, for example) will without any doubt at all have a performance element built into their salaries.