jbuch02

The last poster mentions "price" and we now see problems with X pricing due to large increases over the past couple of years......

Can you elaborate? Cabin class? Itinerary, time of the year, compared to industry increases?

I did a quick search and found these 2017 prices for an OV cabin, 7d Med cruise in June.

NCL: $207 pp/d (no perks)

HAL: $162 pp/d (no perks)

CEL: $199 pp/d (Pick one, GBB)

The Celebrity Perks are worth $55/d pp (or $385 for 7d) for the Classic Beverage Package, $300 for an OBC. The free gratuities don't equal this value until you get over 10d.

If you take the classic beverage package, your price pp/d is $144. If you don't drink and choose the OBC, your price pp/d is $156.

The big thing for me is the assertion that X has applied "large (fare) increases over the past couple of years."

I don't think that is accurate for Inside, OV and Veranda rates. I can't speak for suites and as I've stated in previous posts I don't think those willing to pay for suites are as price sensitive as those that aren't. We had another poster in this thread state that his first Celebrity cruise on Zenith in 1999 was $220 pp/d and his last cruise on Celebrity was considerably less than that. I'd be not so quick to criticize Celebrity management ....... that is good stuff.

I think HAL is very competitive from a price standpoint. I don't think NCL is. Carnival does not sail Med routes in June or July as they concentrate on shorter cruises in the Caribbean. RCL (Jewel) does sail in the Med in the time frame I selected for comparison and does price out at < $140 so, there is that.

But my point is that unless you are flexible and able to book inside 90d which is what you may be doing to get the best rates, and I applaud that, I don't think the assertion that Celebrity Cruises has foisted higher fares on its value customers is a supportable claim.

So, let's talk about booking inside 90d. Celebrity is clearly more expensive on a pp/d basis in most cases but not all. Why do you suppose that is? It is probably because they are filling their ships faster when cruises are first listed. The "yield management" software boogey man that calculates demand pricing is responsible for that and Celebrity is not the only line using it.

I think it has been said elsewhere on this forum if you want or need to book greater than one year in advance, you are going to pay a premium for that if the cruise doesn't sell out. If it does you are going to be one of the lucky ones who took advantage of low, intro fares and perks for onboard booking. It behooves value shoppers to look carefully at the density of cruises on a particular itinerary and time frame and, if you want low fares, avoid these unless that itinerary in that time frame is on your bucket list and it may be.

...... I spent a great amount of time trying to find a way to cruise with one of the high-tier lines for our upcoming Med trip. I even tried to see if I could match with a shorter Caribbean cruise. When I did the cost benefit analysis I couldn't beat Celebrity, by a significant margin. .......Celebrity and RCI are not changing their business model, no way. Run a search on RCI for their last quarter profits.

This.

If your goal is to optimize your available cruising dollars and overall cruise experience Celebrity is hard to beat.

Most of you will recall that on your post cruise survey emailed to you by Celebrity, one of the questions is why did you pick Celebrity. One of the selections is price (among recommendations from others, itinerary, etc.).

I'd like to know how many respondents select this answer. I suspect it is quite a few and I think that drives RCL's/Celebrity's pricing strategy for all their cabins except suites. The market segment paying for a suite is probably not going to be as price sensitive as the market segment looking at less costly options.

I've done comparison shopping just like this poster has, over and over again. What I've found interesting is that when you break down the value of perks that are offered by Celebrity on a per person, per day basis, for comparable accommodations and comparable itineraries, what one finds is that the traditional view that Carnival and NCL are less costly than Celebrity is not accurate.

OK, so what you have, in my case as a Celebrity Loyalists, is that the price differential for trying another line is insufficient to get me to do that. I have sailed other lines (NCL, Carnival, Disney, Oceania, MSC) but there were other factors involved in doing so. At this point in my cruising life I want to cruise as often as possible and that means price, in terms of my perception of the value of the cruise experience and that is going to differ among cruisers, is a major factor for me.

The realty is that Celebrity is tough to beat in the cruise market place all things considered.

Are you sure about that? :)

Sorry ...... NCL is the primary, not Carnival. While NCL is the third largest conglomerate behind Carnival and RCL, it occupies a relatively tiny market share compared to the other two and Oceania a very small portion of NCL's but the point is the same ..... NCL is targeting a niche market with that brand.

Thanks

Great discussion ..... continues to be informative. Newbies should not be discouraged. Most posting in this thread have a lot of cruising under their belts and the different perspectives from this experienced crowd is great.

I found the comments of the poster who has been taking their business to Oceania interesting. We've cruised Oceania twice both times on Riviera - a fantastic ship, crew and food. Cabins (a balcony) were elegant and spacious by a few more square feet, especially the bathrooms. Dining options, food and beverages were tops. On balance, considering perks, the cost per person per day for comparable OV cabin classes is around $240 compared to $170 aboard Celebrity. These are approximate price points for comparable cruise accommodations. Your calculations may vary but the point is, you are going to pay a bit more for a cruise on Oceania Riviera than you are on Celebrity Silhouette, for example. Whether the extra money is worth it is a highly personal decision.

I think those willing to pay the price for suite living on either line are going to find Oceania a little better. OK, having said that, it is worth noting that Oceania is owned by Carnival Corporation and if I remember my numbers correctly while Carnival holds a 42% market share, Oceania holds only 3% of that number. Carnival is targeting a niche market at a higher price point with Oceania. Celebrity within the RCL community of cruise lines holds a much larger market share (about 22% of RCL's overall cruise market share of 30 something %) than Oceania does among its fellow cruise lines. One can argue that Celebrity, within its family of RCL owned cruise lines, is not only competitive compared to the industry but is also delivering a product that seems to be in demand.

My point is that this goes to Lutoff-Perlo's (and RCL's) marketing strategy that some here don't like. Celebrity is selling at a lower price point and have done things to get there that have caused some legitimate griping. I'm fine with what they've done. I see a good deal of out with the old and in with the new thinking. The older you get the less you like change. My 40 year old son tells me, "Dad, deal with it. Change and accommodation of it will keep your brain healthy." I'll be the first to agree though with the notion that what pleases us may not please others. Judging the product and experience is truly a subjective undertaking.

In defending Celebrity, I'm stuck on the notion that, all things considered, cruisers are still getting a very good product at a very competitive price. It's a value thing for me. Fine line for corporate to walk though. In a similar discussion at Cruise Critic forums about targeting a particular demographic, I noted that the over 55 demographic holds some astounding amount of disposable income (I forgot the exact number but it was something like 70+%) and are spending it on travel and leisure. IOW, if Celebrity pisses off this demographic to the point that people who can afford it will pay extra for an Oceania cruise, they'll not only loose that particular demographic but other value cruisers in that age group who might follow or at least start looking around. Brand loyalty is very hard to maintain. We have three cruises planned over the next 9 months. Two of them are with Celebrity (Summit and Constellation because I still love the M class ships) and one with, gasp, Carnival Vista.

Another post starting this thread complaining about the "decline" in the =X= perience.

June 3rd of this year will mark our 31st cruise on Celebrity and fourth aboard Summit. Our first cruise with Celebrity was aboard Century (Southern Caribbean Special) in 2001. Although it gets tiresome to hear the negativity and then post a favorable view, I feel I can speak with some authority on this subject .

Not exactly sure what the OP means by going "downmarket" in marketing and sales strategy terms but I don't believe that is what Celebrity is doing. What they are doing is working to remain competitive and retain market share in the very competitive cruise industry. I do believe the Celebrity experience has changed since 2001 but that change is more a reflection of growth across the industry and a cruising demographic that is quite different and about 100 times larger than it was in 2001.

In business, a company can benefit, in terms of cost savings, from growing (economies of scale) and the cruise industry along with Celebrity Cruise lines has done that. However, the value of growth and the cost benefits conferred by that growth have to be viewed in terms of the potential for a decline in the desirability of the product in the market place. In real terms that's about finding a balance between price control (relating directly to profits) and the perceived desirability of the product in the market place. It's hard.

My view is that Lisa Lutoff-Perlo is working to match what the cruise demographic wants and has done a pretty good job of it all things considered. Value? If you are a value cruiser, you can find it on Celebrity. Luxury? Book suite or Aqua class. Dining venues? Hated to see the Ocean Liner themed restaurants go on the M class ships but there are many more dining opportunities on Celebrity ships now than there was in 2001 and that is an industry wide trend that I think is a good one.

There are all sorts of things being tried on Celebrity ships that are innovative - Movies under the stars with Tapas, Sushi in Bistro on Five, Reflection's Lawn Club Grill and the Porch, Modern Luxury of the Suite Life, Luminae, shore excursions led by Celebrity Chef's wrapping unique dining experiences together. Sure, maybe you'll have to pay more to experience these innovations but I think it is unreasonable to assume otherwise. Two class cruising? Perhaps but you get what you can afford by virtue of what you earn in the work place and are willing to pay for. We aren't offended by this and have never felt like we were treated as second class cruisers on any Celebrity ship for not booking suites. Never.

When viewed at the macro economic level, Celebrity has done a very good job of keeping their product desireable and one to buy. As a leisure and travel experience, cruising is, without a doubt, the best value for one's money. While it's not for everyone, for those who look at value, it is a very good deal. That's from the customer perspective. Despite the negative reports on this web site, far outweighed by positive ones, the Celebrity product, by-in-large, rates high in desirability in the market place. 5 Celebrity ships are ranked in Cruise Critics, 2016 Top 10.

(Link: http://www.cruisecritic.com/memberreviews/cruiserschoice_index.cfm?Category=Overall&sort=large ) That bodes well for Celebrity (and it's parent company, RCL).

From a corporate perspective (in this case RCL), cruise lines are crunching numbers trying to optimize the bottom line as defined by a set of variables (link: http://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/14887-breaking-down-q1-performance-by-the-numbers.html ). I think it is important for readers here to understand what drives resource allocation for RCL/Celebrity.

At the micro or operational level, how well sales go at the corporate level depends to a large extent on how well supervisors deal with the resources they are provided. e.g., this much for food and beverages, this much for staffing, this much for fuel, etc. That's why experiences differ between Celebrity ships. Overall, though, and in my experience, Celebrity has some very good people working for it at the operational level. But they are always resource constrained. Always. That's why you'll sometimes find grumpy staff - the bar tender or waiter that got 4 hours of sleep after working for 12. The harried stateroom attendant that is covering two dozen cabins in his section. The list goes on. We find ourselves giving out a lot more compliments to these tireless employees than finding fault.

As cruise enthusiasts, we should value the opinions of our fellow cruisers, both negative and positive. At the same time, I think it behooves us to keep in mind we are in the 1% - meaning, 99% of the world's population will never experience the luxuries we do. After nearly two decades of cruising, most of it with Celebrity because it feels like home to us, I can say the cruise experience has changed but not, considering the big picture, in any negative way for us. It is still lovely. No cooking, no cleaning, no making your bed, no laundry, great food, fun times day or night. Enjoy!!!

"Yield Management" programs, in use by the airline industry for decades took hold in the leisure travel industry (Hotels, resorts, cruise lines) maybe 5-8 years ago and has had a major impact on the buyer's side while producing sizeable profits for the sellers. It is what it is and makes price shopping/trying to hit the sweet spot hard.

Having said that, most of the "rules of thumb" for finding the best deal (not necessarily the lowest cabin price) for a cruise have already been mentioned. Most cruise lines have added some type of incentive program and this makes it difficult to compare apples to apples ..... but it can be done, takes some patience and requires you to calculate the price per day per person, perks included.

There are a lot of variables involved in finding the "best" deal and I'd agree the most important two are your availability to cruise (how flexible are you) and the ships' itinerary (place and time of the year). For example, Constellation was scheduled to do a Transatlantic crossing in April, was under-booked and cabin pricing dropped dramatically, right about 60+ days out. That's a typical time to start eyeballing cabin prices across the industry. An OV cabin was priced at under $80pp/d. Unfortunately previous commitments prevented me from booking this huge deal. See my sad face.

Some points about Celebrity repositioning cruises in general: My experience is that these itineraries often produce the best value on a price per day basis. You can easily find cabins for under $100/day. There are no perks on these itineraries. Demand, which affects pricing, is spotty and unpredictable. Use ChoiceAir to book your return flight from Europe back to the states if doing a TA on that itinerary and in that direction; booking direct with the airline for one way flights is ridiculously expensive. When I checked airfare with Delta for the Constellation TA Fort Lauderdale to Civitavecchia, from FCO to ATL the one way fare was over $1200. With ChoiceAir it was $450.

There are web sites that do cabin price tracking. They can't be named here. None of them are real time. The airline and travel industry hate them but it will give you an idea of price movement if not actual pricing. Most on line booking web sites will show some type of cabin availability. It's not real time but it's close. It can be worth checking this out as lots of availability in the cabin class you are interested in means lower pricing.

Finally, all of this cruise price shopping can be time consuming and frustrating. For some, its an interesting past time. For others it boarders on an obsession. Once booked, enjoy the excitement building as your cruise departure date approaches, keep a watchful but not obsessive eye out for price drops but don't go nutz if the price for the cabin you booked drops a few bucks.

Somewhat of a hijacking of the thread but ........

Can anyone report that they got an explanation from someone at the corporate level about why the 4 Ocean Liner specialty restaurants were removed from (or will be removed from) all the M class ships?

I am aware from people I know in the restaurant business that a themed restaurant has a life span of 3-5 years. After that customer interest fades and if you own one of these, you re-theme it. Maybe that's what's up.

Regardless, after multiple cruises on the Century class ships before the introduction of the M class ships, Millenium being the lead ship in this class, we sailed Millenium on a Panama Canal itinerary. We were stunned and impressed by the 5 Star quality of the Olympic Restaurant.

Subsequently, we've sailed and dined in all the Cruise Liner themed specialty restaurants aboard the M class ships and loved them. Even as MDR service and food quality took a step back, these restaurants never did.

While we're fine with the Tuscan concept, in my opinion removing these very special and varied by ship restaurants and replacing them with a homogenous brand of the Tuscan Grill was a stupendous marketing mis-step on the part of Celebrity Corporate. I just don't get it. We'll sorely miss these fantastic dining experiences.

As an aside, I had heard talk that these specialty restaurants were experiencing a decline in reservations and that was behind the move. I'd offer it wasn't that the restaurants were not being enjoyed at all, it was the exorbitant up charge associated with dining there that commenced several years back.

I don't think there is any question that Celebrity has redefined itself and will continue to do so. So far, it's not redefining itself in a good way.

Corporations strive for brand recognition. It is the mainstay of successful businesses. The automotive industry is a good example of the importance of this and there are a lot of similarities between that industry and the cruise ship industry. Take Cadillac, GM's flagship brand, for example. It was, beyond question, the most innovative and best selling luxury auto brand from the start. It had the best brand loyalty and number of return buyers in the automotive industry.

Then came the oil squeeze, competition from Japan in the 70s and 80s, the downsizing of the American automobile, labor union difficulties and poor quality. GM and Cadillac set out to redefine themselves and cultivate new markets, build less expensive cars that got better mileage and abandon their loyal customers wo were very willing to pay more for the quality that the Cadillac brand had delivered for 80 years. Does anyone remember Cadillac's Cimeron? No?. Didn't think so. Sort of like The New Coke mentioned above. FAIL.

My view is that Lutoff-Perlo is taking Celebrity in the same direction GM took Cadillac in the 70s and 80s. Searching for new markets and new buyers of their flagship product, they diluted it to the point that it was unrecognizable from other brands in the market. Rather than distinguish Cadillac, they spoiled it. Cadillac lost a very large part of their market share, along with the rest of GM to be sure but Cadillac sales suffered.

Marketing, which is intimately tied to sales, doesn't need to be disruptive or on the leading edge. Celebrity didn't need to reinvent itself. It was fine before all the supposedly innovative things LP, incidentally doing nothing but follow the rest of the cruise industry, has done.

I also think that LP has misread the cruise demographic that is going to spend money on cruising. It isn't the Millennials or the X-Gens who have jobs, kids and mortgages. It is the adults over 50 will control a full 70% of all disposable cash in the United States by 2017. Moreover, given that this entire demographic is either in or preparing for retirement and the fixed incomes that go along with that, this crowd isn't going to blow their annual cruise budget on one cruise in Penthouse Suite and exclusive dining when they can do 4 or more cruises with less exclusivity and spend the same amount, if not more doing that.

With the quality of service cuts and the clear focus on a specific consumer who LP believes will pay the upcharge for exclusive accommodations and dining, she may have substantially reduced the potential for Celebrity sales. That's my bet but who am I to claim that I know. Her ships, however, will not sail profitably with Inside, OV and standard Balcony cabins undersold.

It seems to me that LP has certainly managed to disappoint a large number of brand loyal cruisers who, heretofore, were willing to pay more per day than say, Carnival, NCL or HAL, because fellow cruisers were more to their liking, the food and service were better and X-cellence was everywhere to be found aboard. That Celebrity, like Cadillac in the 70s and 80s, is failing to distinguish itself, the demographic with money to spend and who is looking for value in spending it, is going to pick the lower priced cabin on other lines now that the X-cellence, the excellence that defined Celebrity Cruise lines, is seemingly disappearing.

Found your comment about the Tuscan experience on Summit to be not as good as the Steak House on Carnival Valor interesting.

Before its recent refurb, Summit sported one of the classic ocean liner themed restaurants, Normandy. As you may know, these are being phased out in the M class ships ...... probably one of the stupidest things Celebrity has done although I understand demand was low at the outrageous upcharge they thought cruisers would pay.

I've enjoyed Tuscan but I will dearly miss their really fine ocean liner themed restaurants on the M class ships. I think Celebrity has missed the point with their new approach to specialty dining for cruisers not in Suite or Aqua Class (Blue and Lumier private dining).

Other cruise lines are outdistancing them big time wrt dining choices.

Assume you are talking about the price difference between CC GTY and a booking for a cabin you want.

If that is the case and you want a specific cabin, hold out until inside the final payment date that should be April 22nd or there about. I didn't count.

My sense is that CC has relatively low demand not to mention that the Alaska cruise season has more cabins available than can be filled between all the lines that sail this region.

I'd also point out that there are better places to see the Alaska scenery than from your balcony. If you don't mind the chill, you'll get a better panoramic from deck 12 forward or if you don't like the chill, from the Cosmos Lounge on deck 11. There are plenty of other places as well.

St. Lucia and Antigua are Caribbean favorites of ours. I'd pick that itinerary over the other.

There are always varying opinions on what is and what is not appropriate shipboard dress for dinner .....and this implies there is some sort of Emily Post propriety described for shipboard life.

Emily has been out of the picture since the 60s or so but there are some who would like to preserve the notion of elegant dining along with the golden age of transatlantic cruising that was popular from the early 20th century to the stock market crash in 1929.

The problem for cruise lines is that the demographic that wants a casual resort experience with family and friends where there is no requirement to dress for dinner or after 6 is much larger than the demographic that would like to preserve the golden age of cruising and everything that implies.

We love to dress up for dinner and that has been a major aspect of our love of cruising. We also like elegant dinner service and the observance and practice of proper table manners. I think it is great for people to learn about how to dress and act in a formal setting but that's just me and there are plenty of folks who equally enjoy thumbing their noses at this.

There is no question that elegant dining and formal attire after 6 is a fading fashion in the cruise industry. It's nobody's fault; cruise lines can't be blamed for letting go of it or demphasising it however they choose to do so. Luggage weight and space limitations for those using air travel to get to their departure ports play a roll too. Time moves on. But I'll miss it.

BTW, I still pack a tux and on 8n or longer cruises both a tux and a dinner jacket. I wear a sport coat after 6. My wife has figured out how to go formal, look elegant but still go light by avoiding heavy sequined gowns. Works for us and we up the anti at the Martini bar sipping Martinis and dressed to the nines ..... Fun.

I would hope so as well........ If they eliminated Istanbul as the embarking/disembarking port, they would be able to derive much more revenue for each cabin than what their charging for them now, which indicates to me that they're not going to change.

I'd offer this thought.

Getting dockage in a new port is not as easy as one might think. It involves a whole bunch of moving parts, not the least of which is finding a port with an appropriate terminal for debarkation/embarkation with a pier that's not already occupied. You can bet port authorities are already planning on squeezing what they can out of the cruise lines for any changes they might like to make.

This is not to say that we could argue, as passengers, the "at any cost" axiom should apply. But it doesn't always because these are companies that want to stay on the positive side of the ledger if they can.

I'm willing to give them some leeway at this point.

I'm in agreement with those who are comfortable with inside cabins. That's exactly where we started - inside, 35 cruises ago, 29 with Celebrity.

Since then we've tried OV, verandas and once got upgraded to a sky suite. The OV cabins on the M class ships have a nice little ledge right under a large port hole that is really nice for storing things. We've sort of settled on OVs as the best value for us because we like the perks - namely the beverage package. We actually have a spot we like on the M class ships which is just forward of the most forward elevator on deck 3. We are gym rats so this is perfect for us.

When we have had a Veranda it is usually too hot, too cold, too windy or too rainy to use them. Some love them. We find them nice but unnecessary. However, the current pricing schemes frequently put a Veranda just a small amount above an OV so, if the prices are similar or, there's an incentive in place to book these, we do it.

One thing I've noticed over the last few years, not from experience myself as the Sky Suite we got upgraded to happend before the emphasis on "the suite life," is that Celebrity has made a concerted effort to make suite class passengers, as well as Aqua and Concierge, feel a little more luxury. That's not to say I've felt any kind of snubbing for cruising in "3rd Class" as some have felt, quite the opposite; but from reading the experiences of passengers occupying these cabins on Cruise Critic, it's clear they feel somewhat more pampered or cared for. It's the Xtras. Private dining adds to the perception of exclusivity these cruisers seem to enjoy.

For a long time Celebrity Loyalist like myself that ALWAYS felt the Xtras and one of the reasons I kept coming back, those are not so obvious anymore. It's subtle but the cost cutting measures Celebrity is well known to have undertaken have made a difference outside of the private dining venues and Xtras that seem to be available to guests willing to pay more - a lot more - to get them. That's one of the reasons we are looking around and actually have cruises booked in an OV with Carnival in 2017, a line that in my opinion has really stepped up its game on their newer ships. We've enjoyed both Breeze and Sunshine, once with our grandkids on Breeze and look forward to our cruise on Carnival's newest ship, Vista next January.

Some very insightful posts regarding the risk of being exposed to a terrorist attack in Europe and more particularly in Turkey/Istanbul or Ephesus. Certainly the risks ar real. More importantly, deciding to go or not to go is an individual decision.

I looked to see how many cruises between HAL and Celebrity, the two lines most invested in either originating from or ending in Istanbul or visiting Ephesus there were.

A rough number of cruises doing that is 23 between the months of May and August, 2016. Celebrity Equinox either starts or ends in Istanbul 3X during that period. All the itineraries that involve travel to Turkey, with some exceptions, are discounted in the range of 70-80% from brochure fares and in a few cases more.

IVO, the recent warnings against travel to certain parts of Turkey by the US State Department, it's probably safe to say that cruise lines with stops anywhere in Turkey are in damage control modes.

Given US State Department warnings regarding travel in Turkey, I find it unsettling that any of the cruise lines with ports in Turkey would put profits above passenger safety but by the appearance that they are delaying a decision on canceling or re-routing these cruises, apparently hoping things will change (not likely) so that there is not an implosion of revenues associated with these cruises, they are doing just that.

We are booked on Constellation, Venice to Rome with a stop in Ephesus 8/7 - 8/18. I'm watching the situation and Celebrity's behavior with regard to the known terrorist threat in Turkey. We realize that changing ports of call is not easy to do for the cruise lines and we plan to remain flexible.

I'll give Celebrity and HAL the benefit of the doubt that they are both working hard to deal with the emerging circumstances that will affect this summer's cruises in this troubled region. What I hope is not going on is a plan by either company to preserve bookings for as long as they can to allow them more cancellation and refund options so as to minimize their exposure to revenue losses.

I could not find a verifying link but I believe that installation of Xcellerate on Celebrity ships represents a change over from their past Satellite based Broadband internet service provider to 03b Networks.

O3b is a new face in Satellite based internet service even though they've been around since 2007. It wasn't until 2013 though that RCCL entered into an agreement with 03b to use their service aboard Athem and Oasis of the Seas.

The technology for this service is not new. What is new is that the geostationary satellites that 03b launched over the last several years are in a much lower orbit than their competitors. What this does is reduce the latency of the broadband signals making internet service aboard ship faster. I also think that the bandwidth or the pipe through which the signals travel is larger and that allows more data to be piped - hence streaming video and faster upload and download of photos.

I suspect that the "installation" of Xcellerate on Celebrity's ships involves new modems and WIFI routers to accommodate the features 03b provides. In any event, it's a nice upgrade providing a faster, more robust WIFI experience but keep in mind, it is still a satellite based system and will not be as fast as even lower end land based systems.

Vista is doing alternating 6 and 8 night Caribbean itineraries. I'm pretty sure your comparing apples to oranges when looking at a 7n cruise on Silouhette.

As well, this is Carnival's newest mega ship. Will launch in May. Demand is high at present and commanding higher pricing.

Step down a class of Carnival ships to say Breeze or Sunshine and you'll see some very competitive pricing on some very nice ships.

Great post ....... it's good to see these comparisons.

Last August, we did a grandkids cruise on Carnival Breeze and a few months before that, a test run to see if Carnival would work for a future grand kids cruise on Sunshine. Both out of Port Canaveral. We also sailed Disney Magic and NCL to find a kid appropriate cruise. No question, Disney was tops but it's also 3X more expensive than Carnival or NCL.

Was very impressed with Carnival and yes, their newer ships (Fascination - a Fantasy Class vessel - is one of their oldest) in the Dream and Sunshine Class are somewhat more toned down and, to me, more visually appealing than the older Carnival ships.

If you go to the Carnival boards, there are a lot of gripes about pool size. They are small compared to Celebrity's but our little ones sure didn't care and we're not ones to hang around the pools so, not a biggy for us.

Carnival launched a fleet wide update to their ships about 4-5 years ago called Funship 2.0. One of the major facets of the upgrade was to offer more dining choices. Their newest ship, Vista, has something like 27 different eating/dining venues so, this is a thing for Carnival and Carnival seems to be doing this better industry wide than others. This includes Celebrity who I think has stepped in it by eliminating (two already and the rest in the works) the Ocean Liner themed specialty restaurants on the M class ships doing this in favor of "Olive Garden." That's just me though as I'm a traditionalist, love elegant dining and that just doesn't seem to be in demand these days. So, I go with the flow.

Your point about service and friendliness of staff is accurate. Carnival is a bit more friendly and relaxed all around. You'll note that Europeans, especially Eastern Europeans, dominate the restaurant management staff on Celebrity. There is a reason for that. Europeans know how to deliver elegant dining and a lot of these people are very good at it because they make a career of it. That's not the case with Carnival who tend to have a much more diverse dinning room staff that are a bit more friendly and personally engaging. Moreover, Carnival embarked upon, as a corporate strategy, "Fun Ships." Just as Celebrity has a certain Savoir-Faire to the character of its vessels, Carnival is fun. Definitely felt that difference in a positive way aboard Carnival Breeze and Sunshine.

Nevertheless, we remain Celebrity loyalists for the same reason others have expressed and I'll add, feels like home to us. But we are branching out because along with new experiences, competition is good.

Hello Valencia and Ed and welcome. The place you want to go to talk about your upcoming cruise is the Roll Calls section of Cruise Critic. You have to register to post but you can browse. Here's the link to your November 13th, '16 sailing aboard Eclipse. There are a few posts already:

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2141207

Does anyone know about the spin bikes? Do they have the SPD clip petals? Going on the Summit in a week. Thanks.

Yes, the pedals have two sides. One side has the clips, the other straps.

I've seen two kinds of spin class cycles. The older type are the LeMond brand. These are friction resistance cycles. They're fine as long as you find one that has a range of resistance as opposed to all on or all off.

It appears that the yellow LeMond cycles are being replaced by LifeCycles. These are also friction resistance types. Was on Constellation in March and was told when the ship went into refurbishment the new LifeCycle bikes showed up. I rode several different bikes on that cruise and all of them had uniform adjustments to resistance probably because they are new.

That cruise was the first time I brought my clip on cycling shoes. Weight is always a packing factor but we packed light for this cruise and the cycling shoes got packed. I usually use a good pair of running shoes for weight purposes however, if you do this, make sure the shoe you bring has very good lateral and heel support built into it. The very light weight sports shoes are problematic when you are standing and pedaling against a lot of resistance.

Make sure you go to the gym on the first day, right after you board, and if available, sign up for all the spinning classes at once (we had one recent cruise where the sign up sheet didn't get put out until the day before - it's up to the fitness instructor running the show). Typically, lots of people sign up but don't show up for the class but it's better to get your name on the sheet.

Also, you'll get a lot hotter cycling in the fitness center than you are probably used to in your fitness center at home. The bikes will be arranged on the floor for you. Pick a bike that is not directly under one of the overhead lights. Bring a water bottle you can refill and use this during your work-out.

Sailed Millenim for a month in Janaury so got to know every part of the ship inside and out.

She is the oldest M class ship and, in some respects, it shows. However, constant up keep while at sea and in port keeps these vessels in great shape both from a mechanical and appearance standpoint. Rust is a fact of life on ocean going vessels. So is routine wear and tear. Both were present on our recent voyage but neither was a problem for us.

Declining MDR food quality with Celbrity is a fleet wide issue and one can only assume is revenue driven at the corporate level. IMO, celebrity has still managed to offer very good food, mostly above industry standard, in most venues and specialty restaurants continue to have the same very high quality food and service that I experienced with my early sailings with Celebrity 15 years ago.

I do think the up charges for these restaurants have gotten too high but there are several ways to obtain reasonable pricing by packaging specialty dining options or taking advantage of demand driven discounts which are almost always offered while on board. Moreover, the MDR is entirely acceptable with good, maybe not comparatively great, offerings nicely prepared and served.

The crew were too a man/woman, outstanding. Officers visible and circulating. If Celebrity does one thing well it is training crew members how to interact with passengers on a day to day basis. It makes a difference in how cruisers on Celebrity seem to perceive their cruise compared to other lines, at least that's my perception.

I do think, however, that Celebrity in general, not specific to Millennium, is seeing other industry competitors closing the gap with regard to this perception. With industry wide costs associated with a leisure cruise increasing and Celebrity seeming to increase a little faster than others, it's a hard market within which to keep market share. For me, it's gotten more likely that I'm going to not just shop value Celebrity cabins but also look seriously at their competitors.

1) Before you board the ship....turn you phone to airplane mode. That will stop any accidental use of cellular on the ship or at a port. Keep it in airplane mode until you return home. As long as you keep your phone in airplane mode, you will not get a charge from your cellphone carrier.

 

2) turn on wifi (keep the phone on airplane mode). Don't worry about accidentally connecting to the ship and being charged 75 cents a minute...can't happen unless you sign on to the ship's network using your phone.

 

3) My advice: don't try to use the phone on the ship...you will waste a great deal of time signing on/off the ship's network, starting/stopping your phone application...and fumbling around.

 

4) When you get to a port, find an internet bar/coffee shop/ice cream shop....they are generally easy to find. Order a coke or a coffee and ask for the internet id...and the internet password. If you don't know how to find an internet access point, turn off wifi and then turn it back on. Look for the list of id's...find the one for the shop you're in, click on it and it will ask for a password. enter the password..and it's case sensitive...make sure the caps are caps, etc.

 

5) Once connected, start your phone application. Personally, I use Skype...but there are others. Skype cost is pennies per call...If you are going to use Skype, sign up before you get on the ship and make a call or two to a friend or even to your own landline phone just so you see how it works. If you use a different service...do the same thing.

 

hope this helps..

This is good advise. I'd add these comments.

Using your phones, laptops and other portable devices on board ship and in foreign ports is one of the most frustrating and potentially confusing endeavors associated with cruising.

I wrote this in another thread in response to an iPhone user who was struggling with this issue. It's not so much iPhone specific as it is a brain dump about the different ways your portable devices work. It helps to understand how stuff works - the big picture - to enable you to understand your particular phone's settings.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?p=49534778#post49534778

There are several other communication apps besides Skype, which is good in and of itself. I'd offer one called What's App. Great for texting (data) or voice and seems to me to be very reliable and has good voice quality (texting is a snap).

Of course, you need either a WIFI or data connection (see the link above that explains the differences) to use the App. I agree with the post above that suggests you not try to use voice services via the ships LAN (WIFI). Because you are using a Satellite based ISP (Internet Service Provider) and there is a much larger latency (time delay) in upload and download speeds compared to ground based WIFI or Cellular Networked systems; voice service can be spotty.

If you feel you must have voice services while at sea, the suggestion to buy a cruise ship plan from your home provider that allows you to connect and use the Cellular at Sea Network (this is NOT the ship's LAN (WIFI) but rather a true Cellular Network, is a good one. Keep in mind, it is also Satellite based but this service is much more robust, deals with the latency issues better and voice is pretty reliable. It does not come cheap. Even through your home voice service provider (e.g., ATT, Verizon, etc.) the per minute charge is pretty hefty. Great for emergencies, not for chatting.

It's business and, as another poster noted, it's the price of a bottle of beer.

OTH, it's a reflection of an industry wide pattern to squeeze consumers. For reasons that are not fully disclosed ...... not that it needs to be. The small increase fleet wide translates into a significant revenue increase for RCL. It's like when ATT makes a 2 cent increase in the cost of your monthly service. Sounds small but that translates into millions of dollars world wide.

So, while I agree, no big deal, it brings into question just what corporate is up to. Is the revenue derived from this going to go to improving customer service or is it going to simply increase the profit margin so RCL's stock price will rise?

Tuscan Grill is on deck 11 and as you describe it is accessed from the midship elevators. You can get to it from deck 10 by going to the port side entrance aft and going up the steps from there to deck 11. If your in Tuscan and have to use the restroom, you go down those same steps and there are the usual men's and ladies rooms on deck 10.

We are on Silhouette now also, deck 6, and it has the worst ship design we have experienced. The life boats on deck five block the view on most deck 6 veranda staterooms with large lifting arms right in your view. The lifeboats are mounted directly on deck 5 blocking the view of the water completely from deck 5 and making the walkway narrow. The jogging/walking track on deck 12 is small and crowded with lounge chairs.

 

The glasses in our cabin were sticky, and another couple saw stains in their soap dish which looked like nicotine.

 

No hot dogs for lunch In the Ocean View Cafe.

 

Other ship feature are spread out in a hodgepodge fashion.

 

Carpet and and general appearance are dated and old looking. Hate the blue lights by the elevator.

 

Room was not made up by 10:30 when we returned from breakfast. That never happened on RCI. Back to RCI FOS for us

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Forums mobile app

On your cabin selection. There is so much information available in this forum alone let alone dozens of other resources that are available, you have only yourself to blame for the circumstances you have found yourself in with regard to obstructed views. Do your home work next time.

If you EVER find something in your stateroom that you are not happy with, you need to tell your room steward immediately. Most will report that if you do so, it will be taken care of immediately. If you don't get things straightened out, elevate to the officer who is charge of your room steward. I can guarantee you that it will get fixed to your satisfaction.

Hot dogs are not available in Ocean View. Never have been. They are served on the grill on the pool deck.

I'm sorry you had problems on board Reflection. Don't give up just yet.