MadManOfBethesda

On 3/18/2020 at 2:44 PM, em-sk said:

 

It becomes a problem for the credit card companies.  You put in a claim that you did not receive the goods ordered and billed to your credit card.  The credit card company does a charge back against NCL.   If there is money or not in the NCL bank account is a not your problem at that point.  

 

That's absolutely correct.

On 3/18/2020 at 2:49 PM, njhorseman said:

If a company goes into bankruptcy, either being restructured or liquidated you are going to be an unsecured creditor waiting on line...and you're going to be far down the queue. The credit card companies should not be legally on the hook for that money because the bankruptcy and the order of who gets paid and how much is under the control of the court.

No, em-sk is correct, and I have personal experience to back it up.  I had a fully-paid-for cruise booked on Renaissance when they went under shortly after 9/11.  At first, I thought I would have to put in a claim with my insurance company to get my money back, but it was refunded directly by American Express for the exact reason noted by em-sk.

5 minutes ago, Pedro22 said:

Call your credit card company and dispute the charges.

On what basis?  You cancelled your cruise and accepted their offer of an FCC for doing so.  Just because you are now unhappy with that decision doesn't mean that the cruise line violated the terms of their contract with you.  The fact that they are offering cash refunds to people who didn't cancel has no effect on their contractual relationship with you.

Now, don't get me wrong; I think that the cruise line as a matter of good public relations and good business practices should provide refunds to everyone who was booked on the cancelled cruises.  But they have no legal imperative to do so and the credit card company would have no justification for ruling in your favor and clawing back the money.

16 hours ago, eldaradoe said:

That is absolutely not true.... Yes they did change their policy as the situation evolved. And if they and another cruise line goes into bankruptcy those cruise credits will do you absolutely no good. They didn't stop the virus they're doing the best they can and your still whole.... You didn't lose anything but you want extra.

16 hours ago, Jancruz said:

Plus 1

Jancruz1

15 hours ago, Pedro22 said:

Precisely why I do not want to sit with FCC - they could likely go BK!

I seriously doubt that the cruise lines are going to go out of business.  If they end up filing for bankruptcy, it will be under Chapter 11, not Chapter 7.  Stockholders will most likely be wiped out, but I doubt that they'd do anything to hurt customers, such as wiping out FCC.  That would actually be counterproductive.  For comparison purposes, I would look to what's happened in the past when airlines filed for bankruptcy under Chapter 11.  Although not an exact comparison, frequent flyer miles remained intact. 

1 hour ago, kent1941 said:

I would take the cash.

My bet is for the cruise companies will file for the organization/bankruptcy

Future cruise credit will probably be worth very little


Sent from my iPhone using Forums

I seriously doubt that the cruise lines are going to go out of business.  If they end up filing for bankruptcy, it will be under Chapter 11, not Chapter 7.  Stockholders will most likely be wiped out, but I doubt that they'd do anything to hurt customers, such as wiping out FCC.  For comparison purposes, I would look to what's happened in the past when airlines filed for bankruptcy under Chapter 11.  Although not an exact comparison, frequent flyer miles remained intact. 

On 3/17/2020 at 11:10 AM, edgekid said:

Thanks to all for your responses. I actually called Allianz insurance this morning and within a few minutes they issued a refund. Thanks again for your help

On 3/17/2020 at 11:16 AM, CarolRoy said:

I also have Allianz.  I was not able to do it online. So the Allianz rep walked me through the process of doing it by mail.  She said I will get a full refund credited to my charge card.  It may take 7-10 days after they receive my request.

I, too, had Allianz and they refunded my policy premium when my NCL cruise was cancelled last month.  That was a nice ~$500 bonus that I wasn't expecting to receive.  Not only was this was not something they had to do, I doubt people would have been angry at them if they hadn't refunded the money.  Hell, if they only offered a credit to be used on a future policy, I would have considered that to be generous of them under the circumstances!

I never paid much attention in the past to which company I purchased my insurance from, but I will definitely be using Allianz 100% of the time going forward.  Their refund policy is a great way for them to build customer loyalty. 

3 hours ago, kernow said:

Wow you did well to last so long. When we arrived to do the cruise a couple of weeks before you we flew overnight. We arrived at our hotel around 9am and crashed for a couple of hours and even then we were asleep by 9pm!

 

Look forward to hearing more.

We did the Jewel of the Seas cruise the week before OP and had a much easier time of it due to our departure and arrival times both being in the evening.  We left Miami at 8pm on a Thursday and arrived in Dubai at 7:20pm on Friday evening after our 14-hour  nonstop flight.  We zipped through the airport thanks to the Marhaba meet-and-greet service, checked into our hotel at the marina, had a nice dinner, went to sleep later that evening, and then woke refreshed in the morning and ready for a day of sightseeing.  This was the first time we've taken an long international flight and arrived at our destination in the evening local time rather than in the morning.  This worked out much better for us and we didn't seem to incur any of the usual effects of jet lag .

20 hours ago, susiesan said:

I am speaking from my experience with travel insurance. I to caught up in the civil war and terrorism in Thailand in 2008. I had just come off a Star Clipper cruise in Phuket when BKK was shut down for a week.

We were stranded there, supposed to be flying on to Cambodia. We had to stay in Phuket for a week until I was able to arrange flights home through a roundabout way. I had an extra $2000 in expenses for hotels, flight changes, incidentals. The insurance company was Travel Guard. They told me I was covered, just turn in all the receipts when I got home and filed a claim. I did and they immediately turned it down. It took 2 months of fighting and ultimately turning the matter over to my state Attorney general office to get them to pay my claim.

That's a special situation and I think you were fortunate to get your money back.  Most, if not all, insurance policies specifically exclude wars and terrorism from their coverage provisions.  I am not a cheerleader for insurance companies in general, but I believe that you are criticizing them unfairly based on your unique one-time experience of being caught up in a war zone.   

On 3/13/2020 at 9:05 PM, Doubt It said:

Never, ever guilty till proven innocent.

 

Democracy requires innocence until evidence, beyond a shadow of a doubt is provided.

 

That is what we are missing on this and many, many other files.

That's not what the U.S. law is in civil matters.  It is based on a preponderance of the evidence.  In other words, if something alleged is more likely than not (>50%) to have occurred, than that party prevails.

17 hours ago, osandomir said:

I understand that if you’re rebooking right away United is OK to waive the fees per their current policy. To cancel award tickets entirely is a different story...

That wasn't my experience a few weeks ago.  I had used United FF miles to book flights with Lufthansa & Singapore Air from MIA-->SIN, and then with Swiss Air for DXB-->MIA for an NCL 20-night cruise from Singapore to Dubai.  However, when NCL cancelled the cruise on Feb. 19th, 2 days before I was scheduled to fly to Singapore, I called United and they waived the fees to redeposit the miles.  These were actually two separate one-way tickets that I had purchased and the agent said right away that the MIA-SIN fee would be waived since it was a flight to Asia, but then he had to check with a supervisor to see if the fee for the DXB-->MIA ticket could be waived.  He put me on hold for about 2 minutes and then came back on and told me the fee would be waived as an exception.  Moreover, United refunded the $186 ($93pp) I paid in addition to the miles when I bought the tickets.  My only out-of-pocket expenses for the since-cancelled flights were the $320 I paid directly to Swiss Air for seat purchases.  Swiss Air would not waive those charges, but NCL reimbursed me in full under their policy to cover up to $300pp in airline "change" fees.

I subsequently decided to fly directly to Dubai for a substitute cruise and hotel stay, and booked nonstop r/t tickets on Emirates using cash.  I have not rebooked anything with United using those redeposited FF miles.

10 hours ago, susiesan said:

All credit card insurance is different. Read your policy carefully. Then if you have to make a claim be prepared to have a gigantic battle with the travel insurance company as they will do all they can not to pay out. They will wear you own and hope you give up and decide its is not worth it to fight. That is the nature and business model of the insurance industry, deny deny deny claims.

You've written that on separate threads now, but that has not been my experience. I had to cancel a cruise once a couple of weeks before departure for medical reasons and I had absolutely no difficulty getting 100% of my money returned to me.  I believe that the company was Travel Guard, but I'm not completely sure.  All I had to do was fill out a form and have my doctor submit supporting documentation. Easy Peasy.

But more importantly, and more on point with this thread, the OP most likely wouldn't even need to deal with an insurance company.  As I responded to you on another thread when you posted about Renaissance going out of business, I had a fully-paid-for cruise booked on Ren when they went under and I received 100% of my money from my credit card company (AmEx). And that had nothing to do with trip insurance; that was simply the credit card company doing a chargeback because I had not received the "services" or product that I had contracted for from Ren.    

On 3/13/2020 at 6:36 PM, susiesan said:

Who remembers Renaissance?  I do. That is why I am leery to make the final payment. If the cruise end sup being canceled by O and I get a refund so be it. But if O goes under I am out thousands of dollars. As posters above said, no one knows what Oceania 's fiscal siuation is. With the publicly traded cruise lines we have some info on financiall health. We have none on Oceania. I don't think the travel insurance that comes with credit cards covers financial default. I can afford to wait 90 days for a refund but I can't afford to just lose the money.

Not only do I remember Renaissance, I had a fully-paid-for cruise booked with them when they went under.  I paid for my cruise with a credit card and received all my money back in short order from American Express.  Moreover, even if I had paid by check or some other means, Ren's bankruptcy would have been covered by my travel insurance policy.  

36 minutes ago, dog said:

It is discrimination, plain and simple 

No, it's not.  You need to look up the definition of discrimination.

If they banned all 70+ year olds, without regard to any other characteristic or qualification, that would be discrimination.  Simply asking for medical certification that people over 70 are healthy, is not.

Plain and simple.

4 hours ago, subaru94 said:

That's discrimination, just because you are over 70 does not mean you are old and fragile.

Of course it doesn't.  That's why the cruise lines are permitting all healthy 70+ year old people to continue to travel.  So where's the discrimination?

4 hours ago, subaru94 said:

 My husband is 70 going on 71 and is fitter than people half his age.

And if you're doctor agrees, he'll still be allowed to cruise. So what's the issue?

5 minutes ago, Magicat said:

  So what happened to the other 62,360 people? 😕

Well, if you haven't recovered and you haven't died, it seems pretty obvious that the remainder are still sick.

4 hours ago, SJunie said:

Really appreciate Princess doing the right thing for their customers.

LOL

You don't really believe that Princess (or any of the other cruise lines) implementing this policy had anything whatsoever to do with trying to do the right thing for their customers, do you?

They just made a business decision knowing full well that if they didn't liberalize their cancellation policy, most of their future bookings would simply dry up.

Their customers' financial well-being was not a consideration at all.

19 hours ago, CruiseVA said:

I just checked all 7 cruises I have booked thru till 3/22, everyone of them is more now (with less bennefits) than my original pricing.  No biggie, just interesting....

Report back when you're within a couple of weeks or so of your cruises. I booked a 7-day r/t cruise out of Dubai in an OV cabin on RCL's Jewel OTS, about 10 days before the cruise was set to set sail, and I paid $175pp.

On 3/4/2020 at 8:26 AM, satxdiver said:

Right now the stock is at a historical low for the last many years.  The stock pays $0.50 dividend/quarter for a 6.05% return on today's price.  CCL will pay the $.50 dividend on 3/13 to all who owned stock on 2/20.  How much do you get from a savings account or other investment.  

 

You do understand that if you bought stock on 2/20 to get the dividend on 3/13 that you haven't made a penny and there is no percentage return on that dividend payment, right?

When a stock goes ex-dividend its share price is reduced by the exact amount of the quarterly dividend. So theoretically (cuz I'm too lazy to look up the correct figures), if CCL closed at $33 on 2/20, it would have opened at $32.50 on 2/21.

The payment of the .50 quarterly dividend to anyone who bought on 2/20 is just a return to them of their own money.  With possible tax consequences I might add.

I am on Jewel OTS and today we are (or rather were) in Doha, Qatar for our scheduled port stop,  but the captain just announced that Qatar made a decision overnight to close the port to all cruise ships, and we had to leave immediately. So now we're headed out for a sea day and then on to Abu Dhabi tomorrow, which is a day earlier than scheduled. After an overnight there, we head back to Dubai where our "cruise" will end with 3 days and two nights docked at their port. That's all fine with me because Dubai has become one of my favorite cities in the world. 

Last week's Jewel itinerary had to be altered as well due to Oman not letting the ship dock. That gives you an idea of what is happening in this area of the world with respect to Covid-19.

The prices are good, but you have to be prepared for changes to the published itinerary. Last week's Jewel sailing had to be changed becsuse Oman would not let the ship dock. Today, we are (or rather were) in Doha, Qatar for our scheduled port stop,  but the captain just announced that Qatar made a decision overnight to close the port to all cruise ships, and we had to leave immediately. So now we're headed out for a sea day and then on to Abu Dhabi tomorrow, which is a day earlier than scheduled. After an overnight there, we head back to Dubai where our "cruise" will end with 3 days and two nights docked at their port. That's all fine with me because Dubai has become one of my favorite cities in the world.

52 minutes ago, ReneeFLL said:

I haven't really seen prices come down so far. If people continue to freak out then they might....

Are you referring to all RCL cruises or just those out of Galveston? Because I can say from first-hand experience that they are definitely falling at other ports of embarkation.  I'm currently on a 7-day sailing on Jewel OTS that I just booked 10 days ago. I paid $175pp for an oversized OV cabin.  And at the time that I booked, next week's sailing (March 9th) was even cheaper at only $159pp.

I think that this is a great time to book cruises to take advantage of unbelievably low prices.

23 hours ago, kelib said:

One thing to also consider with price drops on last minute bookings is that many people who have to fly last minute can get discouraged at higher airline fares. I have seen great last minute cruise fares only to be dissuaded by higher costs and limited airline availability. It works well for people who may be able to drive, but may not work for others. I look at total cost of trip and not just the cruise fare. 

It depends on how you define "last minute." Last minute for a cruise can still be 30-45 days out. Last minute for an airline is usually less than 7 days.  Airline fares 2-3 weeks out are usually no more expensive than 2-3 months out or longer. I've found if I have more than 7 days notice, I can find a reasonable airline fare to match a bargain-basement cruise fare.  In fact, just 10 days ago, I booked a 7-day r/t cruise out of Dubai in an ocean view cabin on Jewel OTS for $175pp. I then found a non-stop 14-hour flight from Ft. Lauderdale to Dubai on Emirates for only $750 all-in including seats & luggage.

If I wanted to take a longer cruise, I could have booked a 22-day cruise on NCL's Jade for only $489 and also not have had a problem coming up with a reasonable return airfare from Rome.

I've been cruising for almost 40 years (first cruise was in 1981) and learned a long time ago to book cruises after final payment date has passed. Although there have been exceptions to that for special cruises or when we're booking with friends, I usually adhere to that policy.

19 hours ago, Artemis said:

Hi, MadMan! Kudos on making lemonade out of your cruise cancellation!

 

I booked the lowest level Marhaba service, as all I really wanted was to avoid the immigration line because a lot of planes arrive in the wee hours when I landed; you might want to check the DXB website to scope out early evening international arrivals--if there's no cluster of incoming flights, you may not experience a long line.

 

You sound like an experienced traveler, so if you opt for Marhaba, I think you'll be fine with the basic service--it's nice to arrive to a sign with your name on it, but I think you'd agree with me that hand-holding through the airport isn't really what you need. DXB is new, well-signed in English, and familiar, e.g., it follows the usual transit patterns. 

 

I realize I dramatized my fast exit--that's because I never check baggage! But all in all, it's an easy airport. 

 

And yes, I did stop in the duty free (it's right there as you exit) to get some alcohol! 

 

 

Thank you for your tips and advice.  That is very helpful!

8 hours ago, csnarpy said:

also, i know its bound to get through but the Virus is in the North, away from the port city's.

 

I'm also on the Allure trip but not till Sept.

It's already gotten through to the south; there's now a case in Sicily. The Mayor of Palermo announced that a woman on vacation who has been traveling with a group of 30 people came down with flu-like symptoms and has now been diagnosed with covid-19. The other members of the group are now quarantined in a hotel there.

15 hours ago, Sail n Snow said:

Yup and now with an outbreak in Italy they may need to calculate what to do with Cruises in the Mediterranean if things spread.   There are still too many unknowns so RC is taking it slow.  It’s unfortunate for those that need to travel to catch a cruise but no one could have predicted this. 

I'm booked on a Jewel r/t sailing out of Dubai next week and I just received an email from RCL stating that there will be mandatory specialized health screenings performed on anyone who has traveled from, to, or through Italy (all regions other than Lombardy and Veneto) in the past 15 days.

I'm booked on a r/t sailing on Jewel out of Dubai next week and I just received an email that RCL will perform mandatory specialized health screenings on anyone who has traveled from, to, or through Italy (all regions other than Lombardy and Veneto) in the past 15 days.