Hoopster95

2 hours ago, S.A.M.J.R. said:

 

Let's say a ship has 100 rooms.  That allows 100 "groups" to EITHER select what room they want OR choose "guarantee".  Once 100 groups have picked their rooms, there's no guarantee availability.  OR, once 100 groups have told Royal "pick my cabin", there's no rooms left to select.  

 

Correct. So in your example, and don't quote me on the exact numbers, let's say 50 GTY cabins are booked at the reduced price, RCI's algorithm will see this and determine that all of a sudden they're not a lot of cabins available (depending on how far to sailing date, amongst other criteria)... the algorithm will remove the GTY option leaving only the more expensive pick your own option.

Quantum Class - you can see the ocean almost everywhere

Oasis Class - you can see the ocean almost nowhere

3 minutes ago, peacefrog said:

just booked so we'll see what happens

 

are the promenade view rooms the same price as a regular interior

Sometimes.... sometimes they're less money as RC's algorithm dictates the price. For example if only one interior left, it'll be a silly high price and be listed as "only one left!!!". and then there'll be 50 promenades at cheaper pricing. Happens with OVs and balconys as well.

When you book an interior GTY, you can get any interior.... of higher. You get whatever you get, including the worst possible cabin in the worst location. You just never know.

Royal's public website is garbage for mock bookings. I don't have access to any travel agent booking engines, however the two third party websites I use are extremely user friendly and anyone can easily see all cabins available with an interactive display of each deck. One of those sites rhymes with Tea Planner, the other with Brew On.

For your sailing there are 50 Promenade view interior cabins available as well, so you may get those cabins as well.

Also what hasn't been mentioned is that with the "RoyalUp" program, I assume several interior cabins will come available closer to sail date that you will not see now, These cruisers may win upgrade bids, and thus you may get assigned their cabin very close to sailing date. I'm pretty sure this happened to me a few years ago.... following a ship I booked a GTY balcony and checked daily to watch the cabin inventory. The cabin I received was no way ever available on the list I was watching online leading up to my assignment.

17 hours ago, Biker19 said:

The blue line is the route she actually took:

17 hours ago, Ourusualbeach said:

Thanks, definitely notvyhe route they showed and made a big deal of as a one off route in the presentation they made. 

I posted the following in previous various threads ..... I did a whale watching tour out of Campbell River (Vancouver Island)  and we sailed much of the channel (Georgia Strait)  that the cruise ships go through as we followed a pod of Orcas. There's a specific part of the voyage that enters and goes through the Seymour Narrows... super dangerous swirling currents and there's also aerial electrical lines spanning the passage. At the time, looking up at the wires  I couldn't even believe that a Radiance Class ship can get under those wires. This was also the reason that Capt. Hendrik (at the time Capt. of Ovation in 2019 the very 1st time she did Alaska) answered that Q Class can't do the BC inside passage during Captain's Corner when asked

https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2661933-ovation-may-13-24-live-in-alaska-wlots-of-photos/page/22/#comment-57534562

Note as we get closer to the shortest span between the islands you can see the towers on one side in the first photo. Below we are at about 3/4 way across the channel

As we get closer and go under, the photos aren't the greatest however you can see the visibility marker balls attached to the wires. They're not that high in my opinion, But I guess they're high enough for the cruise ships (Radiance and smaller?) to get under.

9 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

They may not be lining up in Miami for a Windjammer job because they are already in line at the Welfare office.

Yes!!! That’s right!

Welfare is likely better income than Royal, and you don’t have to work 304 days straight at 12 hours per day. 

2 minutes ago, ReneeFLL said:

 

He is correct. If you tip in cash it goes to the person you hand it to. Why would you think otherwise?

Because I’ve asked. Sometimes It’s pooled and Shared. This is first hand face to face employee information, not something”I heard”

1 minute ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Gotcha, sorry I missed the context in your previous post that I quoted.

No worries. 👍

47 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

I certainly would not pay $2000 more for a suite guarantee on a Radiance class ship

+1.

Also I think the chances of Getting higher than a JS are zero with a guarantee booking. RCL is 100% revenue driven, and RoyalUp is built for exactly that. Before they give a free GS to a guarantee they’ll obviously accept a RoyalUp bid for more $$&

6 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

You are painting the entire world with the same economic brush, you can't do that.

 

Let me put it to you in a more realistic way.

 

You are offered to go away and work for 7 months, in exchange you will be paid room and board PLUS three times the average annual wage you could ever think to earn if you stayed home.  Do you take it?

 

That is the real world scenario.

Excellent! Fully agreed. However this was a reply to the other poster who is comparing an American worker, with an American

lifestyle and American expenses… same as I am. 
 

In the end, market forces as always determine the actual truth. If Royal actually pays their stateroom Attendants $35k-$45K then why are there not thousands in line in Miami trying to get such a lucrative job? Thousands???… how about one American in line. There isn’t because the job does not pay what is being claimed here.

Market forces will also determine if they change anything. If 50,000 cruisers per week can magically come Together… every single week…. And remove gratuities on every single sailing, then of course Royal will notice and make a change. That’s not happening… so I don’t wish to hurt those employees on board by removing the auto-gratuities. Those that remove 100% hurt those that they do not see.

4 minutes ago, twangster said:

 

I agree the DSC schema is misleading and it isn't very transparent to guests but it is what it is.  That is one of the reasons why I don't remove the DSC.  Despite not liking it or fully understanding all of it, I believe the safest course of action without hurting crew is let it be.

+1 … especially the last sentence.

5 hours ago, RyderJ201 said:

The other thing I don't get is people who asks these workers about there pay? Would they ask an employee of any business they go into on land? I tip in restaurants at home but would never ask about salary etc. Just because I tip and purchase food doesn't give me the right to stick my nose in.

All of us know exactly what they get paid… minimum wage. There’s no question.

On the cruise lines, lots of questions and in my opinion lots of misrepresentation by the cruise

lines.

5 hours ago, RyderJ201 said:

So if you tip cash, you know where it went. 

This is incorrect. Sometimes you do, sometimes you don’t. This is ship dependant.

5 hours ago, RyderJ201 said:

$40k to $55k a year! Room, meals, and transportation included! Cost of living in their home country half or more compared to here. Average yearly salary a 3rd or a 4th of here! And we are still referring to these people as "those poor underpaid people"? $35k to $55k USD per year makes them no less paid then people in this country. Who I might add have a much higher cost of living. In their youcalown countries this money per year is fantastic.  Why are we endlessly worry about these folks? Feel guilty much 

I demand you take 10 of your closest family, go live in the Philippines or Bangladesh full time, only you out of the ten have a job. You work for the entire family. 
 

Oh, and by the way, “work” Means you work for 7 months every single day without a single day off, 10-12 hours per day. You don’t get to go home and see your family each night or sleep in your own bed.
 

As I said in a previous post, there sure are thousands of Americans lining up in Miami at the cruise line head office looking for a Windjammer job…. NOT. If these jobs were so lucrative, paying for room and board and travelling the world, why is that?

5 hours ago, twangster said:A typical 7 month contract has ~213 working days.  They work every day.  

With 365 days per year if a cabin attendant has two months off and then returns for another contract they will work 304 days per year.  There are no weekends off for these folks, they work everyday.  

 

If I have made any mistakes or bad assumptions please correct me.  

   

You’re too intelligent not to have thought of this, so I hope not to Insult… just wondering if

you factored in the WJ busperson cleaning plates off tables that do not receive a direct tip from an 18% mandatory bill (ie. UDP or beverage package)…. How do they get their gratuities “supplemented” when cruise lines underpay them? How about other “behind the scenes” staff (cooks, etc?)

5 hours ago, twangster said:

The problem, as always, is the ambiguity surrounding DSC and how much actually gets paid to a particular crew member.   

   

Yes, this is the first main point.
 

The second main point is the so called “gratuities” are not gratuities at all… cruise lines just call them that to divert the public from seeing the truth. As was already said, cruise lines pay the employees LESS THAN minimum wage, which is then supplemented by these “gratuities”. If Royal does not get enough gratuities from us the paying customer, they have to increase their substandard payment to these employees in order to reach their contractual minimum salary.

Bottom line…. These “gratuities” are NOT gratuities at all, they are part of these employees wages. All cruise lines should be forced to eliminate mandatory “gratuities” and simply add them to our total cruise fare. This is gross misrepresentation in my humble opinion.

11 minutes ago, read2learn said:

Yes,they issue it that day. It's cutting it close but hoping for the best! 

Sending good vibes your way. If you do miss Jewel's departure in Amsterdam, at the very worst you actually have your passport and you can then arrange to join the ship in Invergordon. I'm ignorant regarding American travel insurance, however I'm just wondering if you have some sort of high-end "cancel anytime for any reason" or "we pay for any issues" type of policy that can give you trip interuption regarding this passport issue? See you onboard! 😉

1 minute ago, Ret MP said:

Anyway, I'm sorry I got involved in this thread.  It's rediculous.  

Words of wisdom. I need to listen to you.

Lurking for months with the very odd post and got drawn to this hot topic.

Just some backgournd... pre Covid, a very well known contributor to CC, ChengP75, is/was a cruise ship captain, and replied to us here on this forum often on legal matters, mechanics of a ship, regulatory matters, Panama Canal, etc when being discussed. He ran circles around those complaining about this "gratuity" and what it really meant, with proof, facts and figures. I do not have the energy to search for these threads.... especially these past two years with the re-launch of a new Cruise Critic Platform (pretty much destroyed all previous cruise reviews and searching for information). He also gave up responding to this topic.

Anyways, happy cruising. 

3 minutes ago, BennyandBo said:

For 3rd world workers that's good money. Look up there cost of living back home. 

Yes I know.

Just know that without this "gratuity" there wouldn't be a cruise for you to go on.

It should really be called a mandatory "resort fee" or "service fee" like some hotels call it.

2 minutes ago, BennyandBo said:

The amounts I have read 

And what are those amounts you have read?

And then let's add that $16 per day gratuity from 6000 cruisers divided into 2000 employees on a per hour basis and see what they really get.

Bottom line is that of the cruise lines had to pay employees a "real" salary (based on North American Standards) without charging a "gratuity", your cruise fare would not be at all competitive. 

Just now, Ret MP said:

Trust me, I have no problem using Google.  I have about 20 years of Googling, the dark web, et al, while I was a criminal investigator.  I just find it suspect when people ask questions like you did.  And I don't really like doing other people's work for them just so they can try to prove a point, related or not.

 

I, for one, would rather have a little say-so over how much I'm being charged or pay for a service.  If my voluntary payment system helps keep the cost of service down, I'm happy to 

pay the gratuity, if I so desire, and based upon the quality of service received.  Where is the motivation for a guaranteed salary for service/hospitality?    A crew member gets the same salary if they work hard or not.  I'd prefer that they get up close, personal, and willing to please.  Not go by the numbers.

Great post. Thank you for being thoughtful rather than reactionary.

I googled the following in ten seconds:

"cruise employee salary maritime labor law"

https://www.google.com/search?q=cruise+employee+salary+maritime+labor+law&ei=A0lYZM-PB_KL0PEP_euFyA0&start=10&sa=N&ved=2ahUKEwiPnc-AwuT-AhXyBTQIHf11AdkQ8NMDegQIBhAW&biw=1565&bih=872&dpr=1

https://www.indeed.com/career-advice/pay-salary/how-much-do-cruise-ship-workers-make

https://highseascruising.com/how-much-do-cruise-ship-workers-make/

https://www.businessinsider.com/carnival-royal-caribbean-norwegian-median-worker-pay-2019-6

"Carnival and Royal Caribbean paid their median employee less than $20,000 in 2018"

"1. Food service worker

National average salary: $31,798 per year

Primary duties: Food service workers are in charge of food and beverage preparation, storage and service. They should enjoy working with people and have basic math skills. They report to restaurant managers and usually work nontraditional hours, especially for opening shifts."

So $31,000 per year.... they work every single day, no days off, most split shifts 10-12 hours per day

2 minutes ago, BennyandBo said:

Nobody is ignorant. Everyone knows the price would be more if they got real pay and not tip pay. I think half don't care and the other half would feel better paying more upfront if they knew 100% the crew were getting it all. 

Excellent points

Everyone knows the price would be more if they got real pay and not tip pay.

I disagree. 

I think half don't care

I agree... probably more

and the other half would feel better paying more upfront if they knew 100% the crew were getting it all.

Totally disagree.

Go back to the last ten years of posts on this forum and read every single tip/salary discussion.

Ignorance is bliss.

2 minutes ago, Ret MP said:

Why don't you do that?  And what would it prove?  What are you getting at?

I'd be insulting you if I instructed you on how to use "google".

What I am getting at is that the entire cruise industry has been a joke in not paying an appropriate salary to employees in order to falsely advertise low prices for cruises to us, the ignorant public. Those "gratuities" are what supplements the extremely low mandated wages

1 minute ago, BennyandBo said:

Why wouldn't be $699 plus the $240 for the automatic gratuities for a party of 2? Your figure is very dramatic.

Nope. The average cruise ship "worker" earns approx $2-3 per hour.

Why do you think every single Cruise ship in the World, other than NCL in Hawaii, is registered in off shore countries? Now figure out American minimum wage for 2000 employees on an Oasis Class ship, and see where your cruise fare ends up. And we see sooooooo many Americans lined up at Royal Caribbean trade shows trying to get a job as a cabin steward.