mamkmm2

The quotes come from a business magazine which would be a better citation than casual conversations. I'll see what else I can find.

http://work.chron.com/average-salary-cruise-ship-workers-1932.html

Here are some quotes on payment of crews:

Salaries range from around $800 per month up to $8,000 depending on the position you work and the line for which you work. Entry-level positions such as junior waitstaff are at the bottom of the ladder, while the maitre d'hotel will be at the top. The crew from the captain on down are responsible for running the ship and getting it to each destination safely. They are full time, salaried career staff and do not work on the same contract basis as cruise ship workers. On-board entertainers are not affiliated with the cruise line at and are hired on short-term freelance contracts as well. They are paid somewhere between $450 and $2,000 on average depending on the line and the talents they bring.

When calculating the average salary of any cruise ship worker, it is also necessary to factor in the expenses incurred by taking the job. Cruise workers are required to pay for transportation to the ship, any visas or work permits and medical or legal permits. At the completion of your contract, the cruise line will often pay for your flight home but this is not always the case. Low-cost or budget cruise lines pay the least, and some have even been accused of mistreatment and unfair wage practices. P&O is a British line that was found guilty of paying waitstaff as little as 250 pounds or about $400 per month. When the hours and days are calculated, this can amount to as little as $1.25 an hour or thereabouts. High-end lines might pay more for a higher level of service and a more experienced staff. All cruise lines do everything possible to reduce the cost of operations, including registering ships to nations with lax labor laws that allow for long hours, low pay and few if any benefits.

I think all of the lines are cutting back - forgetting that many of us cruise for the "luxury" we won't get (or can afford) anywhere else.

But I still love my cruises!!!!

It is the sign of the times. For any industry and/or company to survive you MUST adapt. And people must adapt to the changing times as well. I wonder how many of the "old timers" really give consideration to how little most of the crew members were paid so that they could have their luxurious service. Do they really understand the other economic pressures that need to be dealt with and addressed in order to stay in business.

Economy of scale is what is necessary today. That shouldn't preclude well-mannered and skilled staff. Just remember the real luxurious traveling era on ships like the Titanic and similar transatlantic travel during the 1920s and 1930s. And now too is gone the "luxury" that was seen in the 1980s and 1990s. It is a new type of luxury ... and be glad it is being made more accessible to others by trimming a bit here and there otherwise you would lose out all together because either prices would skyrocket out of reach ... or the companies would fold completely.

Great itineraries for a reasonable price. I also like the fact I've never had to deal with drunks in the hallway trying to find their cabins at 3 am or really immature and idiotic contests like "hairiest chest" or "reddest belly flop belly".

Like Thrak, had we done a Carnival cruise first it would have been our only cruise ever.

They require payment in full upon booking but only refund 50% if tour is missed for any reason including if your ship does not dock. See other threads about Holyhead and Liverpool.

So far BusyBus continues to have excellent ratings by most people on all other tours that I've been able to find ... trip advisors to other touring websites. They have won several national awards as well. Yes, there was a snafu for one tour out of holyhead when the captain decided not to stop at the port with less than 24 hour notice and people on both sides got quite bent out of shape about it. I wouldn't throw the baby out with the bathwater. There are many people here on cruise critic that have had excellent experience and customer service with them.

If you read the policies of the shore excursion companies they all have the option of imposing penalties. It usually just doesn't make as big a splash as busybus did this time because of the number of people it affected and because the company chose to take it to the national media. Apparently the company has been shafted by the cruise lines in the past.

I don't want to sound bossy or snarky but take this from a mom of five. Those boys are 14. That's high school. Most high schools are going to dress codes so they should get the concept. And they are old enough to be flexible and understand to get something they may need to "give". Dinner can be a pair of comfortable khakis and a clean button down or polo type thing. It would be a shame for them to miss an opportunity to go experience Alaska because it is assumed they won't conform for a few evening meals. Ask them. If you get major attitude then you know they aren't mature enough for the freedom and adventure you are offering.

Hmmm. Sounds like our husbands have very similar temperaments. Highly energetic, gotta be busy or they are ... wellllll ... a tad cranky. Humph.

LOL.

What we get for marry Type A's. At least your husband likes to be social. My husband is a solitary creature by nature but wants to be out and about doing things. It balances. He can socialize, he simply also needs time away from requiring to be social directly. Know what I mean?

We are taking a 12 day UK tour in July. It is the longest cruise we've ever been on but only two of those days are sea days and are toward the end of the cruise which we'll probably need to sleep in for once and for laundry and repacking. We'll be doing a US Pacific Coastal in October and taking our youngest (12 year old boy) so hubby will stay busy because the two of them are like peas in a pod ... very active. Lord only knows what they'll get up to on sea days. :rolleyes: But the biggie for next year ... in January possibly ... is we want to go to Aus/NZ. I found a decent itinerary on Princess ("our" cruise line of choice). There are a couple of more sea days than I would like but reality is what it is. It is the Dawn Princess and I've heard both good and bad but the bad appears to have been written prior to her 2015 refurb.

Threads like this one and others in this area of the forum are helping us to make the final decision on that itinerary.

Or you can ask the helpful folks in the Computer Center on board to help set it up for you :)

Not to be snarky but I have honestly never met these "helpful folks" on board ship in the internet café. LOL. At most I've seen one harried looking guy that only knows so much and is usually too busy to cover the existing computers on the ship much less people's phones, etc. The one guy I actually talked to on a Carnival ship looked as shell-shocked as most of the passengers did.

The company took several buses, several employees, and drove two hours one way to get to the port. Do I think the manager used PC wording to make his point? Nope. But Busybus has a very high national and international rating because of some of their tours and have won lots of awards. I wouldn't throw the baby out with the bath water.

Best all around answer for everyone is that it is obvious that certain ports, due to percentage of missed tenders, should be avoided by private excursion companies. This addresses everyone's limitations.

I've started using Shutterfly to upload my pictures. I prefer it to Facebook for sharing. You can determine who can see your pics and you retain ownership of them and don't have to worry that something you've deleted is going to suddenly come back to haunt you. LOL

It's free AND there is an app you can download so you can either do it from a desk top or your smart phone.

I map out locations for free wifi when I'm in port. I take a few minutes to hit the free wifi locations before or after an excursion, upload what I can, then carry on. Works nifty and my parents love it because I'm more willing to post pics of our younger kids online where as I'd never do that on Facebook.

Verizon has an option in some locations that you can tie into your existing phone plan by paying X amount extra per day. If you don't use it that day (24-hour period) then you don't get charged. However, it only works in port. Anything on the ship you are going to have to buy ship internet minutes for.

Because we have a family plan and also use our phones for our business we have one humdinger of a plan. (18 gigs of data per month plus unlimited talk and text). The one other additional caveat however for the talk and txt is that you will get charged roaming data if you send pictures in those txts using cellular data.

So I map out a campaign. Yeah, a little silly but useful silliness for us.

At each port I map out locations that have free wifi. I have everything that I want to send ready and in a draft folder. When I hit a free wifi spot I hook up and then spend a few minutes sending stuff out.

Or, I've been experimenting with something new. Shutterfly. You set up your shutterfly. You invite who you want to see your pics. You can set it to anyone with that URL can see them or you set it so only people you specifically invite can see them. Your pictures remain your property and shutterfly houses them indefinitely. You can set up calendars of events. Load new folders to import pictures into. Etc. Limitations are few as far as I've found. So when I have free wifi I will spend some time loading my pics into the shutterfly folders I have set up and then my family will get to see the pics as we go along.

None of the above is totally perfect but it is working better than any system we've used thus far and I don't have to worry about strangers having access to our personal family pictures, especially as we still have two underage kids that I upload pics of their activities for their grandparents to see.

I'm just not that fond of facebook because I like to retain ownership of my stuff and when I want to delete it I want it gone, not hanging around at FB's leisure to use or not use since they get a license to it.

I'll ask again since I am still curious and didn't get any replies:

My question for those that are blowing this off, what is your logical rationale for feeling that you can let your guard down and do things on a cruise ship that you wouldn't do in a land-based hotel or city? I'm not being snarky, I'm honestly interested in the answers.

it's not. Crime is down to levels not seen in 40 years. The fact that people are terrified isn't relevant.

Some areas have lower crime, in some areas crime have skyrocketed. Generalizations are just that ... not necessarily applicable in all areas.

Additionally, you really can't use land-based statistics for cruises because cruises are not required to report all crimes that occur on the ships. There was some change to this based on a 2010 law that came to be in the US, but again only for those crimes that would be reportable to the FBI that affect some US citizens. Lot of gaps in reporting that make any statistics regarding crimes that occur on cruise ships highly suspect.

My question for those that are blowing this off, what is your logical rationale for feeling that you can let your guard down and do things on a cruise ship that you wouldn't do in a land-based hotel or city? I'm not being snarky, I'm honestly interested in the answers.

No one is saying crime doesn't occur on cruise ships. We all know it's out there and yes is under reported in general, although all major criminal acts are reported. The conversation surrounds specifically having your name outside your door, and in that regard there is likely very little chance of it being used in a criminal act or making you a target. You should be more concerned about handing your credit card to your server at a restaurant as it's very easy to skim the card and get more information than just your name.

I already take care of the credit card issue with items like Lifelock, etc. That said, I'm still not going to make it easy on someone to add two and two together. If you wouldn't do it in a regular hotel or on your apartment door (or home door), then you shouldn't be doing it on a cruise ship which is basically just a microcosm of the same thing.

To the right of the Safari's address bar is a square with an arrow pointing up icon & click on it to see an option to "Add To Home Screen" to have the P@S system on your desktop. :)

Ah ha, there that little booger is. I send things to myself all the time via text or email ... I keep forgetting the option to put it on the homescreen. LOL

Recent threads said the P@S app was unavailable to download & on our recent cruise the app was unnecessary to access all of the Princess@Sea functions including Messenger.

You can add a "one click" button for the P@Sea website to your "desk top" area of your iPhone. I forget how to do it because I do it so rarely but there is likely a youtube available for your to watch to figure it out. That's how I did it the first time.

The Princess@Sea messenger app is free to use on ship, just download it ahead of time.

Your phone carrier probably has a package where you can turn on "international," not get charged international roam fees, so you can access your current phone package.

We have Verizon and that is what we are doing with our iPhones. The catch is your phone package is only going to work in-port for most itineraries. We were able to use this on the ship in the Caribbean but have found out it won't work on our UK trip in July so in addition to setting up for our port days we are buying wifi minutes so we can have access on-ship. When we aren't using our phones for the internet, etc. we will turn "airplane mode" on.

Your absolutely correct, however the world has drastically changed in the last 10-20yrs in the respect of criminal behavior. So lets just say I am the "creepy middle age guy". All I would have to do is go up and down the hallways and see who is cruising solo. Then hang out in hallways to see the "solo" cruiser(s) and find an easy target. I know your on a cruise ship and you feel safe but there are a lot of bad people everywhere in this world today.

As someone that has run a business for over 20 years I can tell you it isn't just about the "creepy middle age guy" that you need to guard against. More than once I've read stories here on CC about people that they had problems with. One of the most recent was on a thread on how Princess handled a problem with a young man who wouldn't take "no" for an answer. He was charming, good-looking, on the cruise with his parents, etc. We've all read the stories of abuse of female passengers and children that have taken place on ships ... by other passengers as well as crew. There are stories where people find out after a cruise that their personal information was stolen.

Why, in this day and age, are people so willing to make it easy on the bad guys? Statistics regarding going "down" does not equate with impact going down. It also doesn't mean that all venue crime has dropped across the board.

As a matter of fact the reality is that most crimes that occur on cruise ships are not required to be publicly reported. According to the 2010 Cruise Vessel Security and Safety Act only those cruise ship crimes reported to and closed by the FBI have to be disclosed to the public. Since not all cruise ship crimes are reported to the FBI and the FBI keeps many investigations open the vast majority of criminal incidents that occur on board ships are never reported.

Here are some interesting articles on cruise line crime:

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/do-cruise-lines-have-a-crime-problem-2014-02-21

http://www.internationalcruisevictims.org/

https://www.fbi.gov/news/testimony/crimes-against-americans-on-cruise-ships

I would never want the cabin number on the card. Talk about security, more than once my card has fallen out of my pocket. The last thing I would want is someone picking up the card and entering my cabin.

 

 

 

Just sounds like another cost cutting measure by Princess.

Criminals are getting very creative. If you wouldn't do it on a land-based hotel for security reasons, be doubly careful on a cruise ship where far too many lower their guard.

Don't think of this as a cure-all for crime and safety issues, consider it a layer of protection.

The only thing particularly special about the Captain Cook is the view from the top floor in the restaurant and frankly you can do that without having to be a guest there ... or even eating there. Even the view can be kinda so-so given that you are looking at and down at the utility areas of the surrounding buildings. LOL

I'd take the OBC and run with it.

In an older thread I posed a question about what identification was needed to get back on ship at a port. Sounded like ship card and drivers license would suffice. What about my 13 year old son? Will he be fine with just his ship card or will we need another form of identification for him as well?

 

Thank you in advance for your responses.

Best bet is you might want to call the cruise line directly and ask. But here's a suggestion since your son is now a teen. Having been through this multiple times ... picture ID or no Picture ID, too old or not old enough ... why don't you make this some kind of right of passage?

My kids have all been homeschooled so they never got a student ID until they started college. However, we did run into situations were they needed a picture ID. First we applied for their passports. But for everyday use we took them to the DMV and got them a State Picture ID ... not a learner's permit but just a picture ID. You need to call them to see what they require to issue one such as a birth certificate, etc. but until my kids did get issued their learner's permit it was very helpful.

I am going to try and explain something and not be rude because that is definitely not my intent. I had debated adding my two bits here. And this is gonna be a little long. That said, some people don't seem to grasp the big picture issue at hand.

1. Crew and ship personnel have no say over this. This rule is from corporate and before corporate it is required by the insurance companies. Make of that what you will.

2. It has nothing to do with anyone's parenting. Zero. Zip. Nada. It is however a response to various events that have occurred or that have the potential to occur. It doesn't matter who was at fault ... some creepy pedophile, the cruise ship for not preventing entrance to certain areas by unaccompanied minors, parents, kids not listening to and/or not adhering to rules, confusion during an emergency, etc. What does matter is that those events have occurred and this is the resulting action taken by the cruise lines corporate office to address what happened.

3. The cruise line has always reserved the right to control movement, activities, etc. of all people on board ship ... and explicitly say so concerning minors. This even includes restricting the number of minors on any given ship at any given time. The cruise line is not required to make something easy or comfortable ... they are bound by law however when it comes to safety of ship, crew, and passengers.

4. The insurance companies could care less whether something is "comfortable" or not. Life vests aren't exactly comfortable but they are required under certain circumstances, sometimes to the point of being required by law ... just like helmets and other safety equipment when riding a bike and playing sports.

5. When you buy a cruise, you accept all of the rules and regs ... and you accept them on behalf of any minor children you have in your party. But since we are dealing with minors it is you, as the guardian/parent who are ultimately responsible for requiring the child to not only pay lip service to the rules but to adhere to them to the full extent.

6. Not doing so means you are circumventing the rules and regs (and possibly laws that created those rules and regs) and that is a fairly sucky lesson to be teaching a kid, especially when it will more than likely come back and bite you on the butt at some point when the kid uses the same learned tactics on you.

If you don't like a rule/reg complaining about it here on Cruise Critic might vent your spleen and get you a few thumbs up but otherwise it is a very lame tactic, nor is it the least constructive action to take. Start a dialogue with the cruise line, you might find out that there are things going on and being addressed that you have no clue about. Alternatively, you might find out that you influence someone that actually can address your grievance and it makes a corporate-wide difference. If you can't be bothered to take it up directly with the cruise line(s) then why waste your time about it here?

And before anyone gets in a twist and says that I must not have kids ... wrong. I have five children. Only the oldest child is now 25 with a baby of her own on the way. The youngest is 12 and we have them spread out between those two. I've been through the entire textural, strong willed, don't wanna, tween, teen, hyper indpendent, good kid, yada, yada, yada plenty. I'm well aware of the challenges there are for some kids to conform and/or deal with something that is "uncomfortable." I also know what it feels like to have to enforce a rule even when I think it might be lame, and I did it because I know what the rules /laws are when I sign my name on the dotted line, especially when I am signing on the dotted line on behalf of my kids.

A cruise is not your average vacation. Just because it is a closed environment it doesn't mean that rules can be relaxed. On the contrary, because of the type of environment there are going to be even more rules. The ship crew and personnel aren't out to shake you down or ruin your vacay. But they aren't there to make everyone feel like a special snowflake either. Their job is to relay what the rules are and to enforce them ... not to create them or explain them to anyone's particular satisfaction. They have no control over them beyond enforcement. If they make the mistake of not enforcing the rules they will lose their job and for most that would be a significant impact on their families.

my last cruise I used DropBox to store scanned copies of my passports, insurance, cruise docs. that way you can access them from anywhere with an Internet connection, including phones & tablets

 

 

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You can do the same thing with OneDrive. And thanks for the idea ... definitely a good idea for a location to store extra copies of the documents we'll need.

I get the Disney bands as they have a chip in them that allows you to locate them. However, I'm not sure I really understand the purpose of the paper ones. On Princess, at least, if the kids are in the kids club and there is an emergency the parents are instructed to meet in a certain location - not at their muster stations. Are the bands are to enable staff to identify muster stations for kids not in kids club but without their parents? I would hope that these kids are of an age where they know the location of their muster station and wouldn't need to have a staff member take them there - after all, they have been allowed to roam the ship freely up until that point! Am I missing something? Do parents of YOUNG kids allow them to wander unattended? Not criticizing, just curious!

They claim it is an age identifier and "for safety purposes." My guess is that there has been problems with some unaccompanied young people and that the band could very well be an excuse a crew member needs to step in without really drawing attention to the behavior so much. If you read all the rules and regs it clearly states that cruise lines reserve the right to restrict children and their movements on board for safety reasons.

Between pedophiles, sleezy pick up artists, underage drinking, drownings, and injuries the cruise lines are simply leery of minors. Or should I say the insurance companies of the cruise lines are leery of minors. Those kids programs weren't designed altruistically to keep the poor kiddies from being bored. Nope, they are a way to corral the age groups that can be problematic and give the grown ups more time to put things on their tab ... like the casino and the bars which the kids aren't supposed to be in in the first place.

The bands with a tracker on them is probably the way all of the ships will be going eventually but until they do, the band is at least an identifier so no one can say, "Whoops. I didn't know s/he was underage. My bad." :mad: