Conde Nast's 'European River Cruise Revolution'

[editor@cruisecritic]

I was on AMA in the Rhone this spring (great trip, loved it) and I just put the keyboard in the closet :) -- didn't need it, didn't need to waste the space.

 

Carolyn

 

Interesting article. I have been on only of the six riverboats featured and agree with the review.

 

I was puzzled about the comment re the AmaCerto, which we will be enjoying is just 16 weeks. They reference a monitor and keyboard that is used for internet access in the cabins and that takes up needed space. On our AmaDante cruise, it was simply a keyboard used in conjunction with the flat screen TV and not a monitor. I have a difficult time believing that AMA added a separate monitor. Would like to hear from anyone that has actually been aboard to see if this is accurate. If not, it does make me wonder...

[caviargal]

I was on AMA in the Rhone this spring (great trip, loved it) and I just put the keyboard in the closet :) -- didn't need it, didn't need to waste the space.

 

Carolyn

 

We also loved our first AMA cruise last fall and very much look forward to the AmaCerto in a few months.

 

I bring my own laptop so I also stow the keyboard. But that does not explain the writer's comment about the "hulking" monitor as there are not any.

[pacmom]

Could not believe that article--feel that the "bubble" was her own creation. After 15 river cruises and 9 ocean cruises, it is river cruising hands down. Our first trip on the Seine 10 years ago, we never cruised at nite, so we overnited at all of our ports. There was plenty of time to wander on just about all of our cruises and wander we did--stopped for a snack, a beer or a meal--thoroughly enjoyed meeting other travelers. I know that this will open a can of worms, but Ms. Perrin was working and not on vacation. Okay I have vented. Pat;)

[WhansaMi]

Interesting that's she's not really sold on this form of travel, partly because it feels to her like being on a tour, with a boat instead of a bus. Since still, at least until I'm older, I would rather slit my wrists than do a bus tour, I'm thinking this form lf cruise might be out for us, at least for another 5-10 years.

 

Also the remark about the passengers on her Seine cruise--the fact that they were the most interesting must be totally accidental. But what she says will make me look at some of the older, smaller ships if and when we do consider a river cruise in the future.

 

Wendy, we just returned from our first river cruise, and, as I said to my husband, I don't think I'm old enough for a river cruise (I'm 52) and I don't know if I ever will be! I just read the article, and found many of the same problems she did.

[Talisker92]

I am sorry, but I have been doing river cruises for 20 years, and fins most of the passengers very interesting.

One point is that Conde Nast only covers cruise lines that advertise, so some of their reviews are suspect.

You are not in a "bubble", but are free to do what ever you want. In Passau we went to a high mass with wonderful accompaniment buy their organ. In Lyon I wandered through an outdoor market and bought some wonderful cheeses. In Nuremberg we wandered through the Xmas market.

And frankly, you are only as old as your attitude.

[beverlyjack]

We have been long time Conde Nast Traveler readers and long time Grand Circle travelers.

 

Grand Circle DOES NOT advertise in Conde Nast and was covered, while Viking advertises heavily. The two lines received equal treatment.

 

I can't speak to other river cruise lines, as we have only done river cruises with Grand Circle, but whether you feel like you are in a bubble is up to you to a large degree. You can get off the ship and do your own thing, take and orientation walk and then be on your own, or take a full guided tour. Which you do can vary by stop. Some cruises lines allow more time in port than others. Some for example, on the Seine cruise, seemed to dock in Vernon just long enough to take a guided trip to Giverney and departed. Grand Circle docked there for 2 nights leaving time to do your own thing as well as doing the Giverney tour. There was also a home visit to a local resident, if you wished.

 

For a report on our Seine cruise see http://jackthetravelingman-seine.blogspot.com. Wendy Perrin was on part of that cruise, including the time in Vernon.

[WhansaMi]

I can't speak to other river cruise lines, as we have only done river cruises with Grand Circle, but whether you feel like you are in a bubble is up to you to a large degree. You can get off the ship and do your own thing, take and orientation walk and then be on your own, or take a full guided tour. Which you do can vary by stop. Some cruises lines allow more time in port than others. Some for example, on the Seine cruise, seemed to dock in Vernon just long enough to take a guided trip to Giverney and departed. Grand Circle docked there for 2 nights leaving time to do your own thing as well as doing the Giverney tour. There was also a home visit to a local resident, if you wished.

 

For a report on our Seine cruise see http://jackthetravelingman-seine.blogspot.com. Wendy Perrin was on part of that cruise, including the time in Vernon.

 

I am glad to hear that some other lines provide different options within the cruise. It happened occasionally with our cruise, but not often, and usually the options curtailed things significantly.

 

For instance, at a couple of ports, we had the option to get off the bus at a central location, and get back on later, to have time to ourselves. However, the last shuttle was slated for 4:30, even though, in both cases, the ship was not leaving until late that night, or the next day. The time between the end of the tours and the last shuttle was always less than 2 hours. In Vienna, Nuremberg and a couple of others, we just paid for taxis to bring us back. No shuttle ran past 4:30, regardless of how late we were docked.

 

Another thing that happened on more than one occasion was that we were told that the ship would be moving during the tours, and so our options were to either go on the tour, or stay on the ship, as no alternative means of transportation could be offered. Such happened in Visegrad, where we got off the ship, walked to the castle for a Medieval Times-like show (but better, I must say) and then got on the bus for an hours' drive to Neszmely where, according to the literature "you'll discover what living in a typical small town in Hungary is like when you share a community meal with locals", which meant, seriously, that we were taken to a restaurant in the middle of nowhere, and were served a hot soup and pastry by the "locals". Then we got back on the bus for 30 minutes and met the ship at its new berth.

 

I understand that many people like such structure. They don't have to worry about things as the cruise line takes care of everything. That is what my husband originally thought, as he tends to worry about transfers and such. But, the reality was that, while there *were* ports where travelers could choose to go independently, clearly the cruise line's expectation was that most people would not be, and so the options for people who didn't want to travel with the group were limited or more difficult than expected.

 

As far as age being an attitude, I largely agree with you, which is what I meant when I said that I didn't know if I would ever be old enough for a river cruise. Whilst I may become physically unable to do the things I do now, I don't know that I will ever have the mindset that many of my fellow passengers had. We enjoy doing things that allow us to interact more with non-touristy areas and people -- for instance, during the time before we boarded the ship in Budapest, we arranged to go to the home of a cooking teacher, and have a private cooking lesson (our poor taxi driver had NO idea where he was going, and we ended up going around in circles until my husband saw the sign for the street, which was one-way, and our driver solved the problem by going up backward! ;-)). We took a backpack on the cruiseline provided motor tour of Budapest, and after our cake at Grundel's, we walked over to the Széchenyi baths. (Oh boy, was THAT cause for concern! Our PM was worried because Széchenyi is the baths "for the locals" while Gellert, in a hotel, was "nicer" and more for tourists. Our fellow group members was all aflutter with concern for us -- "How will you get back??? How do you know where to go??? Are you sure it is safe??"). By contrast, I am not exaggerating in the least when I say that a serious percentage of our fellow passengers had absolutely no idea where they would be the next day, not because they had dementia, but because they were happy to just go where the ship took them, and not do any research or have independent goals.

 

However, the fact remains is that age, or infirmity, *does* have an impact here. As as former school teacher, I am well aware that moving a group of 30+ people just takes more time than moving individually, or a small group. But, when several of the groups' members walk more slowly, enter into a new space and block the entrance way, or have difficult with transitions, it affects the entire group. All of these things were chronic problems with my group.

 

Our group was probably the most heterogeneous of the groups. I was doing a mental count, and I think that there were probably about 15-20 of us on the ship that were younger than 70 (or at least acted and/or moved like it), and of those, about 8 were in our group (my guess would be because it was the pre-extension group). Perhaps when you are in a more homogeneous group -- and you are part of the majority -- you don't get frustrated as quickly. I guess what I am saying is, age *does* have an impact, but unless you are being personally affected by it, it may not be readily recognized.

 

I have had two trips on HAL, which were my favorite cruises. Clearly, I don't mind being with older people. But, IMHO, the structure of a river cruise (at least ours...and as I read through the reviews on this board of Vantage and other lines, I don't know that it is significantly different on most lines that cater to North Americans) is a double-edged sword.

 

I guess I am writing on this board because, had I read about experiences such as mine, I may have reconsidered if this was the best means of vacation *for us*. The other couple that shared our feelings also said the same (he is a lurker here on CC -- hi there! :-)). People come to boards like Cruise Critic to help them make the best decision regarding a vacation that suits their needs -- just as reading about three day "cruises to nowhere" on Carnival helped me to decide that I never wanted to do that! I wish I had seen this alternative POV -- with specific details about the challenges -- for myself before we booked, as it would have generated some discussion between my husband and myself about our choices.

[tinylady]

I have been reading these posts with great interest as we leave in 10 days for our first river cruise. Will we decide if it is the trip of a lifetime or not for us that remains to be seen. We went on our first cruise to Alaska last year on HAL and had a great time, I don't think we have ever gone anywhere and not had a good time, things we learnt from this;

Alaska is amazing.

Large ship cruising is not for us although cruising is a great means of transportation. Our ship held 1900, so it wasn't that large. I was not keen on the enormous dining room, the casual dining area reminded me of a food court at Christmas.

Herding, we had no tendering in Alaska so that was good. Embarkation in Vancouver was the worst herding I have ever experienced.

We had a suite so space was good. I would not fault HAL in any way, just too many people for us.

As a result of all this we dechided to try river cruising We selected Scenic for a few reasons. They are not a north Americian company so thought the mix of passengers would suit us. The Alaska trip was full of Aussies on extended trips and they were not "slow walkers" by any means and most appeared to be in their fifties. Scenic had real balconies, may not be important but liked the idea of it. I am very much a researcher, my family would say too much so, and in doing my investigation into this trip I noticed that you really had to dig into the excursions as at first glance they all sound the same. However, when you dig deep they are quite different. This also factored into our choice.

As I said we haven't been yet so will we love it? Don't know. I know we will have a good time, we always do. If we decide river cruising is not for us then our other option would be small ship cruising, Regent e,g.

 

Funny reading these boards it appears to me that people that just love cruising, meaning the bigger ships where the trip is the ship, don't seem happy with river cruises.

 

I will post my conclusions on return, we will be gone 25 days, so that others may benefit from one more experience as I have benefited from all of yours.

To each there own, it makes the world interesting.

 

thanks to all of you for posting.

[newlondon]

WhansaMi, Must admit I thought your post was depressing. You don't mention once which river cruise line you went with, but even more important you sound disappointed by the people you travelled with.

I don't want to be too critical, but a river cruise allows people to do more of what they want than an ocean trip. That doesn't mean you have to do it. Flexibility is imo one of the big advantages of a river cruise. You can choose to do things yourself, you can participate in the group; or you can do both. Either way it's your choice and their's. Why bad mouth your fellow passengers (I refer to the end of your paragraph #5)? We have done many cruises and no question about it have been exposed to people we would rather avoid: but, they are in the minority to those who have been terrific- of all nationalities. Tolerance is a virtue I won't go any further.

Let me add just one last annecdote, because you seem to have such an age bias. We went to Egypt several years ago; I was at that time just over 60. Many members of our tour of about 20 were my age or slightly younger except for a lady who lied about her age to get on the tour. The limit was 80, she was 90, she came with her daughter 65 and they ran rings around most of us. Age imo is an attitude; a cruise can have young at heart despite their age or it can have old fogies also despite their age, I've certainly been exposed to both as DW and I travel around our wonderful world. My advice, and it's not worth much, is, enjoy your experience and don't worry about others and what they are doing.

[tinylady]

I have been reading these posts with great interest as we leave in 10 days for our first river cruise. Will we decide if it is the trip of a lifetime or not for us that remains to be seen. We went on our first cruise to Alaska last year on HAL and had a great time, I don't think we have ever gone anywhere and not had a good time, things we learnt from this;

Alaska is amazing.

Large ship cruising is not for us although cruising is a great means of transportation. Our ship held 1900, so it wasn't that large. I was not keen on the enormous dining room, the casual dining area reminded me of a food court at Christmas.

Herding, we had no tendering in Alaska so that was good. Embarkation in Vancouver was the worst herding I have ever experienced.

We had a suite so space was good. I would not fault HAL in any way, just too many people for us.

As a result of all this we dechided to try river cruising We selected Scenic for a few reasons. They are not a north Americian company so thought the mix of passengers would suit us. The Alaska trip was full of Aussies on extended trips and they were not "slow walkers" by any means and most appeared to be in their fifties. Scenic had real balconies, may not be important but liked the idea of it. I am very much a researcher, my family would say too much so, and in doing my investigation into this trip I noticed that you really had to dig into the excursions as at first glance they all sound the same. However, when you dig deep they are quite different. This also factored into our choice.

As I said we haven't been yet so will we love it? Don't know. I know we will have a good time, we always do. If we decide river cruising is not for us then our other option would be small ship cruising, Regent e,g.

 

Funny reading these boards it appears to me that people that just love cruising, meaning the bigger ships where the trip is the ship, don't seem happy with river cruises.

 

I will post my conclusions on return, we will be gone 25 days, so that others may benefit from one more experience as I have benefited from all of yours.

To each their own, it makes the world interesting.

 

thanks to all of you for posting.

 

Typo corrected, their not there

[WhansaMi]

WhansaMi, Must admit I thought your post was depressing. You don't mention once which river cruise line you went with, but even more important you sound disappointed by the people you travelled with.

I don't want to be too critical, but a river cruise allows people to do more of what they want than an ocean trip. That doesn't mean you have to do it. Flexibility is imo one of the big advantages of a river cruise. You can choose to do things yourself, you can participate in the group; or you can do both. Either way it's your choice and their's. Why bad mouth your fellow passengers (I refer to the end of your paragraph #5)? We have done many cruises and no question about it have been exposed to people we would rather avoid: but, they are in the minority to those who have been terrific- of all nationalities. Tolerance is a virtue I won't go any further.

Let me add just one last annecdote, because you seem to have such an age bias. We went to Egypt several years ago; I was at that time just over 60. Many members of our tour of about 20 were my age or slightly younger except for a lady who lied about her age to get on the tour. The limit was 80, she was 90, she came with her daughter 65 and they ran rings around most of us. Age imo is an attitude; a cruise can have young at heart despite their age or it can have old fogies also despite their age, I've certainly been exposed to both as DW and I travel around our wonderful world. My advice, and it's not worth much, is, enjoy your experience and don't worry about others and what they are doing.

 

 

Dear NewLondon,

 

I'm sorry you found the post depressing. I thought I have mentioned the line/ship in each thread, but perhaps not: it was Vantage River Odyssey. Thank you for letting me know about the oversight.

 

Regarding my perspective about age, as I mentioned, I have enjoyed HAL vacations, and I would guess the average age is not that different. In fact, as I think about it, there were much more infirmity among the passengers on HAL (people with walkers/wheelchairs/etc.). No one used wheelchairs or walkers on the river cruise. So, the issue was not simply about age or infirmity.

 

As I spoke more about in my member review, it is true that I was not in sync with many of my fellow passengers. Fortunately, I did find a group of people that I really enjoyed being with (and there were some others I liked, but did not spend as much one on one time with). But, there was a culture *on this ship* (not saying that it is present on all) that people assumed homogeneity of world view, and it troubled me.

 

I have to admit, I did find that to be something I would never do... I don't assume that people share religious or political beliefs with me, and I certainly would not start discussions that made that assumption clear. I thought it rude. I don't know if it had to do with age, socioeconomic status or just an odd confluence of people, but, it is true that I did not find everyone on the ship congenial.

 

That said, I met a lovely lady in her late 60's or early 70's who loved photography, was a free spirit, and made me smile every time I met up with her. There was a couple from Texas who seemed very down to earth and pleasant; she couldn't go on a couple of the tours because of mobility issues, and he hung out with us at a few of the places. A couple in their 70's from Chicago were absolutely lovely, and I loved being with them. When we were on HAL in the Baltics, a couple in their late 60's/early 70's were our tablemates, and they ended up accompanying us on several private tour that we had arranged (and this was when I was in my early 40's).

 

So, I think you are wrong about my "age bias". I do have preference, but they have to do with different things.

 

On *these* threads, I have tried to keep the personalities out of it, but I will absolutely admit that my feelings about many of my fellow passengers has probably shaded my view of the cruise. If I had absolutely **loved** everyone, perhaps I would not have felt the same way about being in a group of 34 people. Perhaps I would not have hated it as much, but I don't think I would have *liked* it.

 

I must respectfully disagree with you about the flexibility on a river cruise vs. an ocean liner. Perhaps it is because we have always either done ports on our own, or with the help of private tour (I counted today, and I have only taken two ship's tours in 7 ocean cruises) but I felt MUCH more flexibility on ocean liners, for many of the reasons that I've put forth on these threads (and can reiterate here, if you can't find them).

 

I realized today that I think I had an expectation that, because it would be a smaller ship, the groups would be smaller (I think I imagined 10-12 people). That was an incorrect assumption on my part, and absolutely my error in not checking. I also think that I imagined docking, having a 2 hour introduction to the town to orient ourselves, and then having the rest of the time on our own. That didn't really happen any place other than in our pre-extension in Budapest.

 

I understand the negative reaction some people have to reading criticisms of my cruise. I have been a member of CC for a long time, and, in fact, have found myself defensive when someone has been critical of my favorite ship. But, ultimately, I think that boards like these are about sharing information so that the readers on here can make the most informed decision they can about where to spend their vacation. Many people are like us -- big vacations occur once every few years, for some, once in a lifetime. It is sad when you choose a vacation that does not meet your needs. I just want the information to be available to people, so that they can decide, for themselves, if this is a good option.

 

As you may be able to see by my signature, we have already scheduled another cruise. I read some member reviews, and, one in particular, sticks in my mind. The person HATED the cruise, but, as I read, I realized that the things that bothered her (I think it was a woman) wouldn't bother me at all. They were things that aren't important to me.

 

I am not trying to convince ANYONE not to go on Vantage or any other river cruise. I AM trying to provide information so that people can decide, for themselves, if the problems I encountered are important enough to look into, so that they can have the best vacation they can.

[newlondon]

WhansaMi, A very modulated and reasonable reply to my comments on your review. I will be honest, however, I still believe your expectations were unrealistic. Everyone must live within their economic realities, now I am being elitist, Vantage does not equal Tauck, just as Carnival does not equal Silversea. Therefore, I'm not surprised that some of your fellow passengers did not match your intellectual curiosity.

My basic issue with your review was that you only spoke about your personal issues and not in more broad generalizations. I have absolutely been on cruises that have fallen far short in terms of fellow cruisers and, therefore, overall ambience. In two cases, however, by shutting out the people problem the cruise turned from a struggle into a pleasant experience.

Conversation is always a touchy issue and we all handle it differently. When on a cruise in Egypt my wife and I had to wait to see table seatings because we are eastern moderates(yes there is such a creature) and we couldn't handle a flaming west coast liberal. You do what you have to do.

I will return to one subject and that is flexibility. We found on our river cruises the ability to either schedule private tours-we're doing that three times on our French cruise upcoming in 3 days, or go with the flow. On our Tauck AMS-BUD cruise we were very happy with the offerings and yet in Vienna we did our own thing. What can be more flexible than that. We cruise SS&RSSC and have found the offered excursions to be reasonable and good so only once have chosen to deviate.

Sorry you had a big vacation that didn't suit; but a more objective discussion of what Vantage offered, I, personally think would help new cruisers more. Don't mistake my comments, I have no intention of using Vantage, but others may find it more affordable than my choices, and, therefore, deserve a rating of the services and not the people.

[WhansaMi]

WhansaMi, A very modulated and reasonable reply to my comments on your review. I will be honest, however, I still believe your expectations were unrealistic. Everyone must live within their economic realities, now I am being elitist, Vantage does not equal Tauck, just as Carnival does not equal Silversea. Therefore, I'm not surprised that some of your fellow passengers did not match your intellectual curiosity.

My basic issue with your review was that you only spoke about your personal issues and not in more broad generalizations. I have absolutely been on cruises that have fallen far short in terms of fellow cruisers and, therefore, overall ambience. In two cases, however, by shutting out the people problem the cruise turned from a struggle into a pleasant experience.

Conversation is always a touchy issue and we all handle it differently. When on a cruise in Egypt my wife and I had to wait to see table seatings because we are eastern moderates(yes there is such a creature) and we couldn't handle a flaming west coast liberal. You do what you have to do.

I will return to one subject and that is flexibility. We found on our river cruises the ability to either schedule private tours-we're doing that three times on our French cruise upcoming in 3 days, or go with the flow. On our Tauck AMS-BUD cruise we were very happy with the offerings and yet in Vienna we did our own thing. What can be more flexible than that. We cruise SS&RSSC and have found the offered excursions to be reasonable and good so only once have chosen to deviate.

Sorry you had a big vacation that didn't suit; but a more objective discussion of what Vantage offered, I, personally think would help new cruisers more. Don't mistake my comments, I have no intention of using Vantage, but others may find it more affordable than my choices, and, therefore, deserve a rating of the services and not the people.

 

NewLondon, my companions on the cruise had done a number of river cruises, many of them on lines other than Vantage. So, I wouldn't necessarily equate the personalities with only those personalities. Perhaps it was just bad luck; perhaps a culture was created early on, and as happens with groups, a specific dynamic was born, and was pervasive throughout the cruise. I don't know.

 

With regard to my companions' "intellectual curiosity", I can only comment on their behavior, but amongst my companions were at least two doctors (one a retired neurosurgeon), several trial lawyers, and a number of successful businessmen (one owned a chain of restaurants, another owned a company that he sold for $22 million, as he told me over lunch), in addition to an assortment of teachers, college professors and accountants. All of these careers would suggest a certain amount of drive, intellect and independence. It isn't as if this were a cruise of people who haven't had a chance to know, or do, differently.

 

While I fully agree that I would have had a better time if I had felt more comfortable with many of my fellow passengers, my criticisms of the cruise would stand. I don't know if they are true of other cruise lines -- honestly, I get a sense of mixed responses on that question, when reading the messages on here, which is why I thought some sort of systematic way of collecting data might be useful. From some of the other responses would suggest, people who have been on river cruises on other lines have encountered challenges with making plans.

 

I do wish that I had taken a little more time with my review. I had an appointment that I needed to go to, and rather than cutting and pasting into a new document, to be reviewed and updated later, I just sent it with, perhaps, too many conclusions and not enough supporting details. I have thought to see if I can edit it; if not, then perhaps I will post an updated review, with additional information, including what occurred in each port, on this board.

 

However, on this, we both agree: people need information. To that end, I think this discussion has proven worthwhile.

[manydogs]

First, let me say that posts like these are really helpful to those people who are trying to decide whether river cruising is for them or not. This post, in particular, really highlights the pros, cons and in-betweens of river cruising. (Not to mention I’m getting lots of information on which other lines to look at … )

 

After reading Ms. Perrin’s review, I think I know what she is saying: Don’t go for the ship, go for the experience. My husband and I are avid ocean cruisers; however, I had always wanted to try a river cruise so, in 2010, we (early 60’s), along with my husband’s aunt and uncle (very young 70-ish people) took the River Royale from Arles to Chalon-sur-Saone. I have to admit, when I read up on the dress code, the upscale passenger clientele, etc., I was skeptical that I was going to enjoy this trip … let alone river cruising. (You see, our favorite vacations are where we get in a car and drive across the country, stopping to soak in the sights, meet people and see how everyone really lives.) So, sitting on such a small ship without anywhere to “escape” had me nervous. Well, I was pleasantly surprised. The ship was beautiful, the staff was efficient and engaging, the fellow passengers were lively and charming and enjoyed being with other people (oh, except for those eight people traveling together who let EVERYONE know they didn’t want to get to know anyone), and the ship-sponsored tours were interesting and informative. And I loved sitting on top of the ship, wine glass in hand, watching the world go by. (One interesting note here: Our Aunt and Uncle had taken a Grand Circle cruise from somewhere near Prague down to Romania and when we commented on how nice it was to sit on the ship in the daytime and just look at the landscape, they said they didn’t have that experience on their GC cruise as they traveled at night. Not sure if this was the “norm” for that route; however, I will certainly check that point when booking another river cruise.)

 

Was there any one thing about our cruise that I loved over any other? Probably not as everything rolled up together made it a memorable experience. Would I only travel on Uniworld again? No. If the itinerary fits, I would definitely consider other lines. Would I take a river cruise “anywhere” just for the sake of cruising? No. For certain countries, driving is our preference (until we’re too old to rent a car). However, for countries which we may be experiencing for the first time and/or where we’re uncomfortable on our own, I think river cruising is a wonderful, relaxing way to travel and still take in the “flavor” of the countryside.

[WhansaMi]

NewLondon, my companions on the cruise had done a number of river cruises, many of them on lines other than Vantage. So, I wouldn't necessarily equate the personalities with only those personalities. Perhaps it was just bad luck; perhaps a culture was created early on, and as happens with groups, a specific dynamic was born, and was pervasive throughout the cruise. I don't know.

 

With regard to my companions' "intellectual curiosity", I can only comment on their behavior, but amongst my companions were at least two doctors (one a retired neurosurgeon), several trial lawyers, and a number of successful businessmen (one owned a chain of restaurants, another owned a company that he sold for $22 million, as he told me over lunch), in addition to an assortment of teachers, college professors and accountants. All of these careers would suggest a certain amount of drive, intellect and independence. It isn't as if this were a cruise of people who haven't had a chance to know, or do, differently.

 

While I fully agree that I would have had a better time if I had felt more comfortable with many of my fellow passengers, my criticisms of the cruise would stand. I don't know if they are true of other cruise lines -- honestly, I get a sense of mixed responses on that question, when reading the messages on here, which is why I thought some sort of systematic way of collecting data might be useful. From some of the other responses would suggest, people who have been on river cruises on other lines have encountered challenges with making plans.

 

I do wish that I had taken a little more time with my review. I had an appointment that I needed to go to, and rather than cutting and pasting into a new document, to be reviewed and updated later, I just sent it with, perhaps, too many conclusions and not enough supporting details. I have thought to see if I can edit it; if not, then perhaps I will post an updated review, with additional information, including what occurred in each port, on this board.

 

However, on this, we both agree: people need information. To that end, I think this discussion has proven worthwhile.

 

Sheesh. Rereading this post, I see I made a number of typographical/revising errors that made sections of this incomprehensible. Sorry, folks. My only excuse/reason is that I was (unknowingly) in the beginning stages of breaking out in shingles. At the time, I was having a fairly substantial pain in my back - I thought I had a kidney stone -- and then Tuesday, I broke out in the rash. Fortunately, I got in to see the doctor pretty much immediately after the rash broke out, so it was diagnosed early, and I was put on the antiviral meds within hours of the outbreak.

 

Given that I am now on pain meds, I think I will avoid writing the review of the ports until I am sure I can think clearly. But, again, I apologize for the problems with this post. <sigh>