HAL Backing Off from Caribbean Cruises?

[sail7seas]

I haven't done a careful 'analysis' but it sure seems like HAL is scheduling fewer Caribbean cruises. I think they are trying to get out of the pricing rat race of how low can we get them to go and will reposition ships out of the Caribbean to the point it will be a small part of their business.

 

Anyone else noticing/thinking that is what is happening?

 

I just learned even Oasis will not be doing a full summer season sailing from FLL. She's going to Europe. Who would have thought?

[mariner]

Not surprised. We noticed it when we were in FLL compared to other winters. HAL's ships are too small to compete.

[sail7seas]

It's not only HAL....... Oasis is most assuredly large enough to compete.

She's going to Europe.

 

I think there will be fewer cruise ships (from all cruise lines) sailing the Caribbean in the near future. I think the days of so many ships doing so many Caribbean cruises are done.

 

 

[sammygoose]

I haven't done a careful 'analysis' but it sure seems like HAL is scheduling fewer Caribbean cruises. I think they are trying to get out of the pricing rat race of how low can we get them to go and will reposition ships out of the Caribbean to the point it will be a small part of their business.

 

Anyone else noticing/thinking that is what is happening?

 

I just learned even Oasis will not be doing a full summer season sailing from FLL. She's going to Europe. Who would have thought?

 

Interesting thought Sail. I'm not experienced enough to have years of cruising to have your perspective to see that but........it makes sense. With the new pinnacle build and the NA and Eurodam available to cruise the caribbean and maybe the Westerdam that would give them 2 ships doing the eastern and western caribbean each.

So, where is the next emerging wave of money? Asia?

It would free up some of the smaller ships for more unique itineraries....

[atljoo]

Oasis is going to Europe on a dry dock. They'll do a couple of European cruises from Barcelona and GB. I believe they're testing the market for the largest ships because RCCL is bringing in 2 additional Oasis-class ships--most likely to replace Oasis and Allure in Caribbean YR.

[Northshorecruisers]

Could be...they have to go where the money is - sadly. So far, Vista class is about as large as I want to go, but will probably do a Signature class at some point to try it out. I would never think of sailing Oasis. The Grand Princess felt crowded to me.

[cruisetrail]

Eurodam Oct 2013 - Mar 2014

Nieuw Amsterdam Oct 2013 - Mar 2014

Zuiderdam Oct 2013 - Apr 2014

Westerdam Nov 2013 - Mar 2014

 

As usual.

 

The Oasis goes to Europe for maintenance + three PR cruises.

 

MSC Divina starts all year round from MIA.

[sail7seas]

They aren't rushing out in the blink of an eye and remember, these itineraries are done up months/years in advance. Think the next two/three years and I think you'll start noticing more European and Asian itineraries. South America also.

 

JMO.....

[SwissMyst]

Crime in the Caribbean could very well be a factor, and the disposable money is now in Asia; not the US or EU. Suspect they are going where the cash is: Singapore, China, Malaysia, India, South Korea, Taiwan -all of ASEAN.

[sammygoose]

They aren't rushing out in the blink of an eye and remember, these itineraries are done up months/years in advance. Think the next two/three years and I think you'll start noticing more European and Asian itineraries. South America also.

 

JMO.....

 

I think that running larger newer ships= more Pax and verandahs = $$$ in the caribbean makes sense. Finding emerging markets with smaller ships makes even more sense.

China is one of those markets.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2013-01/30/content_16185881.htm

 

redeploying some ships to serve those markets even more sense, not for NA customers but other nationals.

[sail7seas]

I think they've had it with the penny pinching and demand for low, low, lower pricing from all of us in Canada/U.S. North Americans are onto how to 'play' the cruise lines and get it about upgrades, upsells, OBC, book late rather than early and they likely will have a number of years in new markets where they can demand and get high per diems and sell cruises for what they should be sold for. The prices 80% of the cabins are sold for make it impossible to have a quality product anymore. Maybe they're getting tired of it?

 

Don't know..... just 'musing'.

[mariner]

I believe the American middle class is quickly dying. No more disposable income and the recession killed the credit to cruise class, just my opinion.

[CoronaCRZR]

I think they've had it with the penny pinching and demand for low, low, lower pricing from all of us in Canada/U.S. North Americans are onto how to 'play' the cruise lines and get it about upgrades, upsells, OBC, book late rather than early and they likely will have a number of years in new markets where they can demand and get high per diems and sell cruises for what they should be sold for. The prices 80% of the cabins are sold for make it impossible to have a quality product anymore. Maybe they're getting tired of it?

 

Don't know..... just 'musing'.

 

 

I think you hit the nail on the head. It is hard to make 'enough' money when you keep having to discount and offer OBC etc.

Not sure this is why HAL is moving, but like was posted earlier, HAL (most all cruiselines) will go where the cash is at. Possibly this is no longer the US or the Caribbean.

 

Also, I do not think the Oasis going to Europe has anything to do with this as it is just going there for a few weeks for a Dry Dock in the Netherlands

[sammygoose]

Here is what I found from CLIA:

 5 Year Change in geographic deployment (2006-2011) bed day percent change /share shift

o Caribbean + 13.5 percent / -5.5 points

o Mediterranean + 109.38 percent / +7.5 points

o Europe/Scandinavia +24.61 percent / -.5 points

o Alaska + 4.66 percent / -1.62 points

o Bahamas +7.2 percent / -1.4 points

o Mexico (West): -32.6 percent / -3.1 points

o Transatlantic: +111.2% / +1.08 points

o Australia/New Zealand/S. Pacific: 101.2 percent / +.93 points

o Trans Canal: -3.91 percent/ -.94 points

o South America: +81.7 percent / +.67 points

o Hawaii: -23.9% percent / -1.5 points

 

http://www.cruising.org/sites/default/files/pressroom/2012CruiseIndustryUpdateFinal.pdf

 

Looks like the Mediterranean, Australia/South Pacific,Scandinavia, South America and trans Atlantic are the target areas with the Med being the clear winner.

[Boytjie]

I just learned even Oasis will not be doing a full summer season sailing from FLL. She's going to Europe. Who would have thought?

 

I thought I read somewhere that Oasis is heading to Europe for a dry dock and staying in the Med for a while since it is there.

[mariner]

Forget Oasis. Bad example. Look at HAL.

[sail7seas]

Here is what I found from CLIA:

 5 Year Change in geographic deployment (2006-2011) bed day percent change /share shift

o Caribbean + 13.5 percent / -5.5 points

o Mediterranean + 109.38 percent / +7.5 points

o Europe/Scandinavia +24.61 percent / -.5 points

o Alaska + 4.66 percent / -1.62 points

o Bahamas +7.2 percent / -1.4 points

o Mexico (West): -32.6 percent / -3.1 points

o Transatlantic: +111.2% / +1.08 points

o Australia/New Zealand/S. Pacific: 101.2 percent / +.93 points

o Trans Canal: -3.91 percent/ -.94 points

o South America: +81.7 percent / +.67 points

o Hawaii: -23.9% percent / -1.5 points

 

http://www.cruising.org/sites/default/files/pressroom/2012CruiseIndustryUpdateFinal.pdf

 

Looks like the Mediterranean, Australia/South Pacific,Scandinavia, South America and trans Atlantic are the target areas with the Med being the clear winner.

 

 

Very interesting.

Thanks for finding and posting this.

Sure does seem like Caribbean is 'over and done with' in comparison to say five years ago.

 

[sammygoose]

I thought I read somewhere that Oasis is heading to Europe for a dry dock and staying in the Med for a while since it is there.

 

Why head the Med for drydock unless you were testing the waters?

[sail7seas]

The notice I read about Oasis doing the crossing left room for lots of speculation about her doing more than just a dry dock in Europe.

 

[mariner]

To carry Greek, Spanish and Canary Island residents to safety????

[Boytjie]

Why head the Med for drydock unless you were testing the waters?

 

Because it is a big ship that can maybe not be accommodated in most of the usual places? ;)

[sammygoose]

Because it is a big ship that can maybe not be accommodated in most of the usual places? ;)

 

True. Happy coincidence! ;)

[mariner]

Read the earnings report

[foodgirl]

Sail interesting that you should bring this up as I have been thinking the same thing. Seems like a very subtle change. Still have ships there but maybe a few less cruises. Not enough where everyone would notice but still a change. I understand the need to go where the money is, but until we retire we can't do those inteneraries that require more than a week. As HAL is our favorite line we would hate to see that happen, but business is business.

[sail7seas]

Sail interesting that you should bring this up as I have been thinking the same thing. Seems like a very subtle change. Still have ships there but maybe a few less cruises. Not enough where everyone would notice but still a change. I understand the need to go where the money is, but until we retire we can't do those inteneraries that require more than a week. As HAL is our favorite line we would hate to see that happen, but business is business.

 

 

I know what you are saying as DH is not retired and we can only be away about 17 days MAX. There will still be cruises to Alaska and Canada/NE.....one for east coasters and one for west coast. Mexico cruises seem to have fizzled to a precious few.