Children and Portofinos

[Retired not Expired]

[quote name='jwlane']RCI makes the rules, and they decided to allow an exception. Sovren didn't "DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES". They dined with the ship's blessing.[/QUOTE]

You're right about one thing. RCI makes the rules. And the fact that an employee was willing to break the rules in hopes of a fat tip doesn't make it right. And neither party took the other diners rights into consideration. Like I said before, a ship is a confined area, and adults should have a place to dine and a place to play and relax without kids. This doesn't mean the ship should not be kid friendly. It should. Adults should respect the rights of parents to bring their kids on cruises and to have a good time, but parents with kids should also respect adults rights to certain areas without their kids. And if one goes in then you have to let everyone bring their kids in. That would include the one laying across the doorway and those running around screaming. That would leave just the cabin as a kid free dining area.

And before you say I'm against kids, I'm not. I enjoy having some kids on board. Their joyfulness and energy puts some life back in an old man. But there are times I need just adults around. There were times when my kids were little that my wife and I needed some time away from them. And we love them. And if we needed time away from them, I'm positive it would not be right for me to have forced them on others who were trying to get away from kids.

So it was not with the ship's or RCI blessing. It was with an employees blessing. Employees do not set the rules and if said employee can not follow the rules, he should be replaced.

[Onessa]

I assume everyone who has chimed in on the side of "everyone must follow the rules", really follows every rule?

Do you really drive no more than 55MPH in a 55MPH zone? Do you always come to a complete stop at stop signs? How many threads discuss how to get liquor on board? Smuggling in a curling iron? Who among you have never placed a beach towel on a lounge chair and "forgot" to go back and pick it up (you chair hog :D !), or gone into the pool without having first showered? Had mismatched socks on formal night, but went anyway (gasp!).

When the staff of Portifino's offered to allow his son in, Sovren did nothing wrong by accepting the invite.

[quote name='Sovren']It's funny how heated everyone is on this topic. [/QUOTE]

It's not "funny" it's sad - sad that so many people are looking for reasons to pick apart other people. If someone IS doing something that is against the rules and it is interrupting your ability to enjoy your cruise, deal with that situation. If Sovren and his family had a nice dinner at Portifinos, and YOU were not there - why should YOU care?

If a nine year old is having dinner with his family the next time you are onboard and his hanging from the light fixtures is bothering you. Please let the matre'd know and tell him you expect him to deal with the situation.

[caviargal]

[quote name='Sovren']We are not that far off in our thinking. You feel I am wrong for bringing my son. I feel its fine as long as he is well behaved and the staff allows it. I have no problem with the "rules are rules" argument, per se. If they had said no, then I would have been fine with it.

I put the blame on the staff for saying yes. In fact, I didnt realy ask. The way it happened was I called to see if they had space at 6:00 for me and my wife since my son was going to eat with the kids program. We later found out the kids program was not providing dinner that night. When I called to cancel, I told her the reason and she says just bring him, its not a problem at all. Is that really my fault?

To Retired not Expired:

My son had no idea what the age limit was in Portofino's. He is not being brought up to "break the rules".



It's funny how heated everyone is on this topic. It was such a non issue when it was actually happening. Nobody noticed and we just had a nice meal and left.

Would you have the same argument if you went to a very upscale restaurant in a big city and had kids at the next table? There you are paying $150.00 pp for dinner. Would you complain if kids were disturbing your dinner?[/QUOTE]

Actually, I would ask to be seated somewhere else if the kids were there when I arrived. And, yes, I would complain if kids were disturbing my dinner. In a restaurant where I am paying 150pp for dinner, I should not have to tell someone that there are kids being disprutive; the staff should take of that without asking.

[Onessa]

[quote name='Retired not Expired']So it was not with the ship's or RCI blessing. It was with an employees blessing. Employees do not set the rules and if said employee can not follow the rules, he should be replaced.[/QUOTE]

We don't know that it was not with the ship's or RCI's blessing - RCI allows their employees some judgement in applying the rules. (That's why your room steward can bring you an extral towel for example). The captain/senior crew can set some of the guidelines, including whether the age limit for certain areas is relaxed at certain times. This is why on our cruises to Canada, the rules were relaxed to allow children indoors into the Solarium during specific hours (since the conditions did not allow use of the outdoor pools). The Matre'd and other senior staff at the specialty restraunts have the authority to deal with specific situations as they feel appropriate. In Severn's situation it seems to me the restraunt's staff did "ok" - it allowed them to fill a table at a time when the restraunt was not otherwise full, it allowed them to make a pax's vacation a bit more pleasant, and it did not hurt anyone else. Had Severn wanted to bring four three-year-olds in at 9:30pm; I would hope that the employee would have responded differently.

[caviargal]

[quote name='Onessa']We don't know that it was not with the ship's or RCI's blessing - RCI allows their employees some judgement in applying the rules. (That's why your room steward can bring you an extral towel for example). The captain/senior crew can set some of the guidelines, including whether the age limit for certain areas is relaxed at certain times. This is why on our cruises to Canada, the rules were relaxed to allow children indoors into the Solarium during specific hours (since the conditions did not allow use of the outdoor pools). The Matre'd and other senior staff at the specialty restraunts have the authority to deal with specific situations as they feel appropriate. In Severn's situation it seems to me the restraunt's staff did "ok" - it allowed them to fill a table at a time when the restraunt was not otherwise full, it allowed them to make a pax's vacation a bit more pleasant, and it did not hurt anyone else. Had Severn wanted to bring four three-year-olds in at 9:30pm; I would hope that the employee would have responded differently.[/QUOTE]

Whether or not it dampened the enjoyment of a special evening for anyone else dining there at the time is not something you cannot be sure of.

[Sovren]

AMEN Onessa!

I would complain if a child was bothering me during dinner. Believe me, I love my kid, but there are times I want to be away from him too! That does not negate the fact that I was offered the spot, and I took it.

As it turned out, no harm, no foul. No ruined vacations. No horrible stories. I bet if you asked any of the patrons who dined with us that evening, they would have said "what kid"?

We had a marvelous dinner that we will all look back on fondly. I would (and will, given the chance) do it again.

[terri23]

Bottom line: people who want to break the rules will always find ways to rationalize their behavior.

[bplazo]

I will be writing to RCCL to voice my displeasure about children in the "adult only" areas. It doesnt matter if your child is behaved or not, they advertise adult only areas and they should enforce it.

If they bend the rules for one they will have to bend them for everyone. Should be no exceptions.

[Nliedel]

[quote name='Sovren']TO:Merion_Mom:



How can you say I decided??? I called Portofino's and asked if we could get a reservation at 6:00 for my wife and I and 9 year old son. THEY said, sure no problem.

My son is better behaved than many adults I run into on cruises.[/QUOTE]

While this may be true I have to wonder about the other parents there who think their little darlings are well behaved and may or may not be. Because you were allowed to break the rules they may be too. If the rules say "no" then perhaps everyone should abide by them. How do you know what your behavior engendered? Maybe a couple needed to get away from kids for a night and looked forward to Chops but because your child was in the adult only area it somehow diminished their experience. I have a dear friend who just found out she is unable to have children. While the world is full of children and she cannot avoid happy families all the time she enjoys adult only venues sometimes when the stress of her circumstances get to her. In her case Chops being child free enhances her evening and her experience. While her childless state is not your fault your behavior would mean an evenin of less enjoyment for her.

So someone offered you a spot? So what? That does not mean you can elect which rules apply to you and which don't. Shame on them for breaking the rules and shame on you for asking. You should not have tried to take advantage of someone's kindnes and their attempts to make your cruise more enjoyable by affecting the enjoyment of others. There are people here who take the child free areas of the ship VERY seriously and they have the right to that enjoyment whether you think those reasons are valid or not.

As a parent of two, mostly well behaved, children who are going to cruise with us I would not dream of asking someone to bend the rules so my kids could enter Chops, the Spa or the Fitness Center. My eldest uses my fitness equipment all the time but that does not mean he belongs in an adults only area. My second oldest is a chef in the making and would really appreciate eating there but that is not possible and that is 100% fine with me.

[Sovren]

Nliedel: I didn't ask, I was offered. Why would I turn it down?

Also regarding this part of your reply:

I have a dear friend who just found out she is unable to have children. While the world is full of children and she cannot avoid happy families all the time she enjoys adult only venues sometimes when the stress of her circumstances get to her. In her case Chops being child free enhances her evening and her experience. While her childless state is not your fault your behavior would mean an evenin of less enjoyment for her.

My son is adopted because we couldn't have children. Sure it was tough for us, but not being able to have kids wanted us to be around them even more. This argument holds no weight for me. I've been there.

[Got Out There]

Can someone help me out with a question, where does it say that Chops and Portofinos are adults only? Is it somewhere on there website? As I stated previously, earlier this year on the Radiance the compass stated that guest under the age of 16 (may have been a different age, 15, 17, ..) are welcome before 6:30 pm. I don't remeber if this was every night, however I know on the night my 4 year old and I dined there it was in the compass. When I called Chops to verify, they confirmed it. Have you ever seen this in the compass on any other cruise this way?

[Soxfan05]

;) Should have trusted that I read it right the first time.

[Sovren]

SOXFAN: Not sure if you were asking that of me? If so, I was offered the spot, I did not ask.

[Soxfan05]

[quote name='Sovren']SOXFAN: Not sure if you were asking that of me? If so, I was offered the spot, I did not ask.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, I stand by my original post. I thought after reading ALL of the posts, it was stated you asked. BIG difference in my opinion if it was offered as I stated in my OP.


Me bad.

[Folgy]

[quote name='Got Out There']Can someone help me out with a question, where does it say that Chops and Portofinos are adults only? Is it somewhere on there website? As I stated previously, earlier this year on the Radiance the compass stated that guest under the age of 16 (may have been a different age, 15, 17, ..) are welcome before 6:30 pm. I don't remeber if this was every night, however I know on the night my 4 year old and I dined there it was in the compass. When I called Chops to verify, they confirmed it. Have you ever seen this in the compass on any other cruise this way?[/QUOTE]

Oh cripes!
There is another Venue I can forget about enjoying exclusively for adults. There is nothing left for the *special* ..just adult areas. :(

[raerae]

[quote name='Sovren']We were on the Navigator in May. My wife and I ate a Portofinos one night while my son ate with the kids program. On the last night I called up there to see if we could get in again, but this time with our 9 year old son. No problem was the response. I will say he is very well behaved, but the cruise compass clearly states no one under 14.

He really enjoyed his dinner and the way they catered to him. I have no problem as long as the kids aren't whiney or running around, and apparently, neither did the staff at Portofino's.

I would say go early like around 6:00 when its quiet and I'm sure you won't have a problem.[/QUOTE]

[font=Comic Sans MS][size=3]This is where you said that you ASKED for a reservation for your son. No where in this post did you say they offered for you to bring him. Which story is true, this one or the one where you wanted to cancel and they said come with your son??????[/size][/font]

[Onessa]

"Whether or not it dampened the enjoyment of a special evening for anyone else dining there at the time is not something you cannot be sure of."

My point was whether or not it "dampened the enjoyment" for anyone else is not known. If any of YOU who are complaining now were there when Sevorn and his family dined at Portifinos, I say - you should have brought up the issue at that time.

If someone else's rule breaking is "dampening" YOU, YOU should complain to someone who can do something about it at the time it is happening. YOU should not be complaining about something to which you were not a party.

It appears that YOU are complaining about something which Sevorn did when YOU were not there. I wish that the biggest problem in my life was something that happened a long time ago, thousands of miles away, to someone else - unfortunately I've got other issues to deal with and listening to everyone picking upon Sevorn for sharing his experience just really seems a bit petty and childish.

As a previous poster noted, Onions and Orchids - complain appropriately when appropriate, complement lavishly when due. Sevorn - good job raising a kid who can behave appropriately.:) MarionMom (I think that was the OP?!) - good job following the rules by finding alternate dining arrangements for your twins and voicing your displeasure to the appropriate party when someone else's rule breaking was disturbing your meal. :)

[margu1241]

Yes, I would complain if I was spending a lot of money at a restaurant and was seated near loud, poorly behaved children. We were eating at such a place with my 16 and 13 yo's and there were unruly (and younger) children at the next table. I asked that they move us to a quieter area, which they did. I agree that there should be age limits, but have rarely seen a child over 10 who was a behavior problem, usually much younger.

I have never taken my kids to the speciality restaurants on any of my cruises as 1) I don't think they would enjoy them, 2)there usually are a few nights they can eat with the kids/teen group and 3) We enjoy the break from them.

Patty

[Tra4]

I have followed this topic for awhile. As I see it, Sovren didn't pre-meditate taking his older child to the restaurant. And from what I have experienced in the past 6pm these restaurants are dead. They get busy later hours. And furthermore, if there are kids bothering you in these restaurants, by all means complain--bless you complain to everyone. But if your table is 6 tables away, this child has not said a word, then who really cares that they are in there???

If you follow every absolute rule of the cruiseline: no saving chairs, bringing liquor on board, tipping absolutely everyone you are supposed to, etc., then cast the first stone. Its my opinion, that no one is perfect.

Sovren, I don't think you did anything worth defending yourself. Don't let these comments let you think otherwise. You didn't make reservations for 3, they invited you---so obviously no rules were broken!!!

[bplazo]

Why would you turn it down? Because it would have been the correct thing to do.

[raerae]

[font=Comic Sans MS][size=3]onessa,[/size][/font]

[font=Comic Sans MS][size=3]sovern has posted several stories. Just trying to figure out which one is accurate. You see his first posting clearly states he called to GET a reservation for him and his wife AND his son. The next thing, after getting the guff about even asking when he knew the rule was no kids under 14, they invited his son.[/size][/font]

[font=Comic Sans MS][size=3]Cindy ;) [/size][/font]

[Sovren]

In my original post, I did say I asked. At that time it didn't seem necessary to give full details. Since then, I clarified the chain of events to give the exact details. I was told it was fine to bring him rather than cancel, so I did.

Again, thanks Onessa for being on my side. I am not sure why there is such a stink over this. But I stand by my decision to take my son there.

[JCSM-Mom]

[quote name='pcur']Personally, I have no problem with ANY child ANYWHERE if they behave.[/QUOTE]

I agree here. I have two little ones and when they act up (very infrequently)...out we go. I figure I don't like it .....and neither does anyone else! :D

Having said that....I guess some children are all different. Sometimes my son is such a little man that we've had people come up to us after eating there dinner to tell us how well behaved he is.

We don't intend to take our kids to the dining room though, Main or otherwise. The will dine in the WJ, and Mom & Dad will have late dinner in the Dining room. I have never tried Portofino's....perhaps this trip we will.

[JCSM-Mom]

[quote name='Onessa'] Smuggling in a curling iron? [/QUOTE]

Is this against the rules? :confused:

[DoubleAK]

[quote name='Sovren']

Bottom line is, next time I am on a cruise, I will surely ask if I can bring my son to dinner at Portofino's or Chops. If they say OK, I will take him.[/QUOTE]

I don't care how wonderful and mature your child is... if I'm paying $50 for the privilege of a child-free dinner and see and child in there, I will complain to the managment until either the kid is escorted out or I get a refund.

Just because a tip-hungry employee say's it OK doesn't mean you can disrespect others who expect an adults-only environment.