Hidden Costs

[NHL Philly Fan]

I think we are focusing on different things. You are focusing on the literal definition of hidden. I am focusing more on concept or implementation.

 

Example:

 

*Congrats, you've won a drawing for a free cruise!

 

*All winners must pay a $1,000 service charge.

 

In the above example, there is an express disclaimer of a fee. However, I still consider it a "hidden cost" because one wouldn't expect to have to pay such a high sum for a "free cruise".

 

Of course no cost is entirely hidden, as then it wouldn't be legal.

 

And frankly, I really dislike and disagree with the argument that if it is expressly stated, it cannot be argued with or complained about. I'm not necessarily referring to you, but rather several on these boards who defend NCL to such a degree that I'm beginning to think they are on the payroll. I swear, if NCL put out a disclaimer that said all cruise passengers would get 20 lashings a day, some on these boards would say the passengers had it coming as they were formally warned without adding to the discussion as to whether the policy itself is good or not.

 

 

If they did that and people still booked a cruise knowing that was in the contract then it is on them for agreeing to it. Whether a policy is good or bad is a completely different issues as to whether it is in the contract and by booking we all agree to it.

[triptolemus]

Again, agree to disagree.

 

The definition of 'hidden' that I think applies here (from Merriam-Webster): being out of sight or not readily apparent. If something is concealed within a cruise contract, in fine print, or within the "terms and conditions", etc., it is hidden as far as I am concerned.

 

Usually, "agree to disagree" stands on its own. Most people don't "agree to disagree" then post two paragraphs of counter-argument.

 

The service charges are not hidden. They are listed right on the promotional page. The text says "Applicable service charges apply." and that text is a link.

 

It's not hidden.

 

[stickey_mouse]

Usually, "agree to disagree" stands on its own. Most people don't "agree to disagree" then post two paragraphs of counter-argument.

 

 

 

The service charges are not hidden. They are listed right on the promotional page. The text says "Applicable service charges apply." and that text is a link.

 

 

 

It's not hidden.

 

 

 

 

Again, that's your take on it. Why didn't they state the exact charge on the page of the promotion?

 

Regardless, we are arguing about the wrong thing. What's most important (to me, anyway) is that they charge a mandatory fee on something presented as a free perk.

[swedish weave]

You can argue the legality of this all you choose, but when something is advertised as FREE but compulsory charges are added if you accept the offer, it is at best deceptive advertising.

 

These shoddy marketing tactics may be what is causing NCLH to lose market value.

 

I know it is causing some cruisers to move to other lines.

 

There is no logical defense for this type of deception.

[triptolemus]

For the record, I don't agree with NCLs practice of adding service charges and fees to allegedly free items. It's absurd. But the fees are not hidden.

[stickey_mouse]

You can argue the legality of this all you choose, but when something is advertised as FREE but compulsory charges are added if you accept the offer, it is at best deceptive advertising.

 

These shoddy marketing tactics may be what is causing NCLH to lose market value.

 

I know it is causing some cruisers to move to other lines.

 

There is no logical defense for this type of deception.

Couldn't agree more, well said!

 

Some of you are focused on the term 'hidden' and taking it way too literally. What if a customer booking the promotion didn't see the website? What if they booked over the telephone? I certainly would hope the service charges would be explained to them. But that's not the point. The point is that NCL is advertising a "free" drink package as a perk but yet attaching to it a mandatory service fee. I don't care if it's written all over the website.

[NLH Arizona]

Couldn't agree more, well said!

 

Some of you are focused on the term 'hidden' and taking it way too literally. What if a customer booking the promotion didn't see the website? What if they booked over the telephone? I certainly would hope the service charges would be explained to them. But that's not the point. The point is that NCL is advertising a "free" drink package as a perk but yet attaching to it a mandatory service fee. I don't care if it's written all over the website.

The drinks are free, they never said the 18% gratuity was, but the most important thing is, if one considers this to be wrong in their minds, no one (not even NCL) is forcing them to take the free drinks package as a perk, as there are many others to choose from.

[MikeBTN]

Incorrect. You can not remove it any time at the service desk. You may request, after you have completed your cruise, to have some of our DSC refunded.

 

Ah yes. I forgot NCL is weird about this. Other lines you can just remove. But still.....they can be refunded upon request, making them essentially not-compulsory.

[NLH Arizona]

Ah yes. I forgot NCL is weird about this. Other lines you can just remove. But still.....they can be refunded upon request, making them essentially not-compulsory.

They are non-compulsory on NCL as well, it is just that they have a different system in place to receive your refund.

[westcoastman]

Buy one, get one free coupons for your local restaurants have been quite popular. Terms are disclosed in the fine print, no holidays, one per table but most importantly tips should be based on pre-discount amount. So even if you spent only $20 your tip would be based on the $40 pre-discount amount. I guess you could say that these very popular restaurant coupons is not really two for one discount at all since you still pay a 15%+ tip on the discount although it's not compulsory.

[gary222]

Incorrect. You can not remove it any time at the service desk. You may request, after you have completed your cruise, to have some of our DSC refunded.

Incorrect - you can amend or remove the DSC from the time your final invoice is produced normally around 2200 on the penultimate night of the cruise.

[NYcruzzer]

For the record, I don't agree with NCLs practice of adding service charges and fees to allegedly free items. It's absurd. But the fees are not hidden.

 

 

I agree 100%. However I assume NCL would just raise fares to "cover this surcharge " if not added to promotion.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

[boopsahoy]

Couldn't agree more, well said!

 

Some of you are focused on the term 'hidden' and taking it way too literally. What if a customer booking the promotion didn't see the website? What if they booked over the telephone? I certainly would hope the service charges would be explained to them. But that's not the point. The point is that NCL is advertising a "free" drink package as a perk but yet attaching to it a mandatory service fee. I don't care if it's written all over the website.

 

I booked over the phone and was told specifically what the charges were before deciding which promo-although I already knew being on CC.:D

[StolidCruiser]

Couldn't agree more, well said!

 

Some of you are focused on the term 'hidden' and taking it way too literally. What if a customer booking the promotion didn't see the website? What if they booked over the telephone? I certainly would hope the service charges would be explained to them. But that's not the point. The point is that NCL is advertising a "free" drink package as a perk but yet attaching to it a mandatory service fee. I don't care if it's written all over the website.

 

What about all those "As Seen On TV" advertisements where they scream "BUY ONE GET THE SECOND ONE FREE" and then whisper "Just pay additional shipping and handling." It's essentially the same thing because, under your logic, the second one isn't really totally free.

 

Call it "hidden", call it "false advertising", call it whatever you want. This type of promotion abounds across a multitude of industries. It's not new and it's not going to go away just because you grumble over semantics.

[swedish weave]

What about all those "As Seen On TV" advertisements where they scream "BUY ONE GET THE SECOND ONE FREE" and then whisper "Just pay additional shipping and handling." It's essentially the same thing because, under your logic, the second one isn't really totally free.

 

Call it "hidden", call it "false advertising", call it whatever you want. This type of promotion abounds across a multitude of industries. It's not new and it's not going to go away just because you grumble over semantics.

 

Companies that are honest and straightforward with their advertising don't use these kinds of tactics.

 

That said, this and several other tactics that the new NCL management is using have encouraged me to divert much of my cruising budget to other cruise lines.

 

So -- call it what you like, but it is costing NCL and the decline in their market cap value is showing. Maybe someday they will realize what they are doing and change course.

[Trellaine]

Without a unlimited drink package.....how much does it cost typically for one soda (canned) and from a "soda gun/fountain"?

 

im new to cruising. hopefully this will be my first. and trying to wrap my head around these extra costs that a newbie would think would be included.

 

Example : I wouldn't have guessed for the life of me bottled water wasnt included in a beverage package lol, quite shocking.

 

And of the five perks I really don't know if I should take any?

 

I am not a huge drinker. Casual with alcohol. I do like soda, unfortunately.

 

And what brands of beer etc is included in the beverage package? 2-3 brands or 4-5-6? I am not a huge fan of corporate brands.

 

Thank u

[NHL Philly Fan]

I mildly disagree. I consider fees disclosed in the fine print to be somewhat hidden. I would include with this the aforementioned service fees charged for the UBP/open bar promo. If someone receives a free drinks promotional offer, I would consider a mandatory fee that comes with it to be somewhat hidden, or at the very least, unexpected!

 

 

I've never ever seen any fine print on NCL's web site. All of the terms and conditions are in the same font and size as the rest of the site The fact that the list of details is on a second page and you have to click a very clearly marked link for TERMS AND CONDITIONS does not make the print any different. in your citation, the 18% is only unexpected if one chooses to IGNORE the link and not read the T&C.

[NHL Philly Fan]

Without a unlimited drink package.....how much does it cost typically for one soda (canned) and from a "soda gun/fountain"?

 

im new to cruising. hopefully this will be my first. and trying to wrap my head around these extra costs that a newbie would think would be included.

 

Example : I wouldn't have guessed for the life of me bottled water wasnt included in a beverage package lol, quite shocking.

 

And of the five perks I really don't know if I should take any?

 

I am not a huge drinker. Casual with alcohol. I do like soda, unfortunately.

 

And what brands of beer etc is included in the beverage package? 2-3 brands or 4-5-6? I am not a huge fan of corporate brands.

 

Thank you

 

I think I had done the math at one point and if you drink more than 3 sodas a day the price of the package is cost beneficial.

 

 

As to which you should take, that is entirely up to you.

[swedish weave]

I've never ever seen any fine print on NCL's web site. All of the terms and conditions are in the same font and size as the rest of the site The fact that the list of details is on a second page and you have to click a very clearly marked link for TERMS AND CONDITIONS does not make the print any different. in your citation, the 18% is only unexpected if one chooses to IGNORE the link and not read the T&C.

 

NCL ads have FREE in much bigger letters than the remainder of the ads. This is designed to mislead !!!

[NHL Philly Fan]

I think we are focusing on different things. You are focusing on the literal definition of hidden. I am focusing more on concept or implementation.

 

Example:

 

*Congrats, you've won a drawing for a free cruise!

 

*All winners must pay a $1,000 service charge.

 

In the above example, there is an express disclaimer of a fee. However, I still consider it a "hidden cost" because one wouldn't expect to have to pay such a high sum for a "free cruise".

 

Of course no cost is entirely hidden, as then it wouldn't be legal.

 

And frankly, I really dislike and disagree with the argument that if it is expressly stated, it cannot be argued with or complained about. I'm not necessarily referring to you, but rather several on these boards who defend NCL to such a degree that I'm beginning to think they are on the payroll. I swear, if NCL put out a disclaimer that said all cruise passengers would get 20 lashings a day, some on these boards would say the passengers had it coming as they were formally warned without adding to the discussion as to whether the policy itself is good or not.

 

 

IOW I know it is not hidden but I am using that term to try to justify my absurd position on the matter. :D

[NHL Philly Fan]

Again, that's your take on it. Why didn't they state the exact charge on the page of the promotion?

 

Regardless, we are arguing about the wrong thing. What's most important (to me, anyway) is that they charge a mandatory fee on something presented as a free perk.

 

 

The package IS free. You do not pay the cost of the package in any manner at all.

[swedish weave]

I think I had done the math at one point and if you drink more than 3 sodas a day the price of the package is cost beneficial.

 

 

As to which you should take, that is entirely up to you.

 

If you are basing your figures on NCL's inflated price of sodas, you are correct. However, if you use the price of sodas at the local markets, you are way off base.

 

The market price is what many people paid before NCL decided to restrict guests from bringing sodas onboard.

[Trellaine]

Fountain pop is dirt cheap to serve up. Thus why I ask how much a "can" costs as its much better. Call me a pop/soda person.

 

I wonder why they don't have that information listed on the website?

 

It does somewhat matter to me although it won't change any decision i make on my first cruise.

 

Hmm tough decision on what perks to take. As I am not a huge drinker but always nice to have one or two. Soda i would drink for sure. Two a day or more perhaps. Just wish it was cans.

[NLH Arizona]

Fountain pop is dirt cheap to serve up. Thus why I ask how much a "can" costs as its much better. Call me a pop/soda person.

 

I wonder why they don't have that information listed on the website?

 

It does somewhat matter to me although it won't change any decision i make on my first cruise.

 

Hmm tough decision on what perks to take. As I am not a huge drinker but always nice to have one or two. Soda i would drink for sure. Two a day or more perhaps. Just wish it was cans.

I believed I answered this on another thread for you. I said if you drink more than 3 sodas a day, you would come out ahead if you choose the beverage packages. Tax on the beverage package per day is $14.22 and sodas cost $3.48 (including tax). Your response was that you did think you should be drink 4 sodas a day.

[NLH Arizona]

I believed I answered this on another thread for you. I said if you drink more than 3 sodas a day, you would come out ahead if you choose the beverage packages. Tax on the beverage package per day is $14.22 and sodas cost $3.48 (including tax). Your response was that you did think you should be drink 4 sodas a day.

Meant to say Tips on the beverage package, not Tax, same with the (including tax, it should say including tip).