Do you tip for drink delivery from ap?

[shorne]

5 minutes ago, CruizinSusan70 said:

It's not like they have a reasonable minimum wage like they do in the states.

 

 

In the US, the federal minimum wage for people in positions that conventionally receive tips (waiters, for instance) is only $2,13 per hour. The employer has to make up any shortfall from the regular minimum wage if tips are not sufficient.

 

[iamaqt2]

11 minutes ago, CruizinSusan70 said:

You do realize that the 46 per day you say that each staff member receives is a good percentage of their total compensation.  It's not like they have a reasonable minimum wage like they do in the states.  People that remove tips and don't tip a little extra for great service are pet peeves of mine.  That's all I'm saying.

And you are privy to the Carnival Corporation structure of crew compensation?  If they tell me that my Daily Service Charge is going directly to the staff who are serving me AND the behind the scenes staff, are you saying that that is NOT what is actually occurring?

Because I'm sure that CCL might have a rebuttal for that.

[iamaqt2]

I feel like there are some people in this thread who fail to realize that federal law states that minimum wage for tipped employees in our own country is 2.13 an hour.  Maybe these people should start caring more about these people getting a living wage. 🤔 

[wrongwaywatson]

7 hours ago, CruizinSusan70 said:

You do realize that the 18% gratuity isn't really part of the Princess Plus option.  It's a true 18% if you're paying a la carte.  It's totally arbitrary as to how much of the 40/50/60/80 is possibly allocated for the drink you got delivered.  And of course you could be a low end consumer and have 5 drinks per day or a very heavy drinker and have a total of 20 drinks or more per day, combining alcoholic and non-alcoholic options.  Nobody really knows how much of the daily charge you paid for the Plus package actually gets allocated to the server on a per drink basis.

 

We like to belly up to a bar to order our drinks so that I can see them being made to ensure that the proper alcohol is being utilized and not substituted with something else.   And since 90% of our consumption is at Good Spirits, we take care of the servers there at the end of the cruise.

That's not how the tips are charged/disbursed.  You  are paying $16/day.  The server at the bar is paid ____ amount daily from the tip pool (total autotip collected divided by the staff number), regardless of how many drinks they poured that day.  If you tip at the bar, but have removed auto tip, those tips will also go into the pool.  They are required to report them, and they will be let go if they are caught not turning them in.   If you tip extra and have left your auto tip on, then they can keep the extra tip.

[iamaqt2]

5 minutes ago, wrongwaywatson said:

That's not how the tips are charged/disbursed.  You  are paying $16/day.  The server at the bar is paid ____ amount daily from the tip pool (total autotip collected divided by the staff number), regardless of how many drinks they poured that day.  If you tip at the bar, but have removed auto tip, those tips will also go into the pool.  They are required to report them, and they will be let go if they are caught not turning them in.   If you tip extra and have left your auto tip on, then they can keep the extra tip.

Deleted.. misunderstood post.

Edited April 29, 2023 by iamaqt2

[CruizinSusan70]

1 hour ago, wrongwaywatson said:

That's not how the tips are charged/disbursed.  You  are paying $16/day.  The server at the bar is paid ____ amount daily from the tip pool (total autotip collected divided by the staff number), regardless of how many drinks they poured that day.  If you tip at the bar, but have removed auto tip, those tips will also go into the pool.  They are required to report them, and they will be let go if they are caught not turning them in.   If you tip extra and have left your auto tip on, then they can keep the extra tip.

The 16.00 per day is divided between your room steward, the MDR staff and a certain percentage goes to behind the scenes miscellaneous people.  Has nothing to do with tipping at the bar.

[CruizinSusan70]

1 hour ago, iamaqt2 said:

And you are privy to the Carnival Corporation structure of crew compensation?  If they tell me that my Daily Service Charge is going directly to the staff who are serving me AND the behind the scenes staff, are you saying that that is NOT what is actually occurring?

Because I'm sure that CCL might have a rebuttal for that.

No, not at all.  The 16.00 daily service charge is split among your room steward, the MDR staff and miscellaneous behind the scenes people.  Has nothing to do with the bar tenders.  

Those that remove their tips and stiff the staff is a pet peeve of mine.  Have seen them line up on the last sea day at guest services en masse on many Carnival cruises and my lone MSC cruise.  By the way some people post on the Princess boards  you can infer that there are some that cruise on Princess do it as well.

[iamaqt2]

8 minutes ago, CruizinSusan70 said:

The 16.00 per day is divided between your room steward, the MDR staff and a certain percentage goes to behind these  scenes miscellaneous people.  Has nothing to do with tipping at the bar.

So you are acknowledging that the staff is already hitting a very good tippingpoint behind the scenes before we even hit the 18% gratuity that Princess adds to drink orders and specialty dining.

[CruizinSusan70]

5 minutes ago, iamaqt2 said:

So you are acknowledging that the staff is already hitting a very good tippingpoint behind the scenes before we even hit the 18% gratuity that Princess adds to drink orders and specialty dining.

No, not at all.  Read my post again.  Not a single penny of the 16.00 DSC goes to a bartender or someone from the specialty restaurants.  The bartenders get their tips from the 18% added to a la carte drinks and whatever percentage of the drinks package pool they receive.  

[iamaqt2]

2 minutes ago, CruizinSusan70 said:

No, not at all.  Read my post again.  Not a single penny of the 16.00 DSC goes to a bartender or someone from the specialty restaurants.  The bartenders get their tips from the 18% added to a la carte drinks and whatever percentage of the drinks package pool they receive.  

And you know that how?  Because Princess makes sure to tell us that our DSC goes to ALL the crew. Show me one shred of evidence you have that my DSC doesn't go to those employees. 

[shorne]

Unscrupulous people can always be found. Some people avoid tipping just because they are stingy, just as some people engage in shoplifting and other improper practices. The possibility of getting away with something does not justify doing it.

 

But there can be legitimate disagreements on tipping. In North America, I give tips in restaurants but not in hotel rooms. Some people insist that the cleaning staff in a hotel should receive a tip. I don't give them one unless I put them to special trouble, which seldom happens. There's room for reasonable disagreement over that, whereas the practice of giving a tip in North American restaurants is ubiquitous and well understood as an expectation (though not a legal obligation). 

 

I see the charge for «tips» on a cruise as part of the cost. I wouldn't take them off the bill. But I don't feel the need to leave additional tips, except for uncommonly good service.

[CruizinSusan70]

4 minutes ago, iamaqt2 said:

And you know that how?  Because Princess makes sure to tell us that our DSC goes to ALL the crew. Show me one shred of evidence you have that my DSC doesn't go to those employees. 

I can reverse it and ask you to show me where it's stated that Princess divides the 16 bucks between everybody.  

Back in the day you handed envelopes to your waiter, asst waiter and room steward.  When things became automated and charged to your credit card, a certain percentage was set aside for misc people such as those that work in the buffet.  

I've never seen any cruise line state that the daily service charge is spread around between all the employees.  And I have cruised on Princess, Celebrity, Carnival, Royal, NCL, & MSC that are currently cruising.

[shorne]

One problem with tipping is that it is in the discretion of the person leaving the tip. Recipients are subject to discrimination on grounds such as race, gender, age, and physical attractiveness. In turn, some workers give greater attention to those whom they expect to give a greater tip.

 

Another problem is that it favours people whose work happens to put them in contact with customers. The person who carries the plate to the table gets a tip; the person who chops onions does not. Now, maybe the person chopping onions or doing laundry or sweeping the floor is paid more, or maybe she isn't. Is this really any of our business?

 

The better practice, by far, is to charge full fare and either disallow tips, reduce them to optional trifling sums, or exceptionally allow them for truly stellar service. This is what is done in much of the world. There are even places where a tip is downright insulting.

[iamaqt2]

2 minutes ago, shorne said:

One problem with tipping is that it is in the discretion of the person leaving the tip. Recipients are subject to discrimination on grounds such as race, gender, age, and physical attractiveness. In turn, some workers give greater attention to those whom they expect to give a greater tip.

 

Another problem is that it favours people whose work happens to put them in contact with customers. The person who carries the plate to the table gets a tip; the person who chops onions does not. Now, maybe the person chopping onions or doing laundry or sweeping the floor is paid more, or maybe she isn't. Is this really any of our business?

 

The better practice, by far, is to charge full fare and either disallow tips, reduce them to optional trifling sums, or exceptionally allow them for truly stellar service. This is what is done in much of the world. There are even places where a tip is downright insulting.

Hence Princess allowing us to bypass all those societal issues by pre-payment with their package offerings. 

[shorne]

Princess sells its cruises on these terms: $X as a flat rate and $14,50 or whatever per day. The flat rate is obligatory; the daily charge can be varied upon request. For a cruise of Y days, the total cost $Z is $(X + 14,50×Y). That's really what Princess is charging; it just takes a more complicated approach than stating a fixed price, probably because many people will think that they are paying only $X.

 

Since the cost is $Z, I pay $Z. I'd prefer to be charged $Z outright, rather than getting the chance to weasel out of paying anything beyond $X. But I don't make the rules, and I know that the discretionary portion goes entirely to the workers and that therefore they would lose out if I underpaid. So I pay $Z.

 

That said, since Princess offers the option of not paying $Z, people cannot be criticised for availing themselves of the option. I would not do it, but some people do, for reasons ranging from stinginess to abiding dissatisfaction with the service provided. Princess could end that practice by charging $Z and disallowing, discouraging, or omitting to encourage tipping.

 

(I used dollars only because the daily charge for «tips» was listed in dollars earlier in this discussion. Substitute pounds, euros, or whatever else may apply.)

[david63]

The arguments about how cruise staff are paid and where tips fit into the equation has been done to death on every cruise forum that I know - and there is nothing to be gained by going over it all again - and there really is nothing new to add.

 

An interesting observation. I believe that the American based cruise lines keep tips on as an "add on" because of the American culture of tipping so that it makes those passengers "feel good". P&O, another Carnival brand, which caters mainly for UK passengers has had tips included for several years now which is more in line with the UK tipping culture.

 

If tips are additional then that is, in my opinion, part of the cruise cost just as when tips are included. In neither case does it preclude anyone from giving a "genuine" tip where there has been exceptional service or somebody has gone over and beyond but there should not be a perceived expectation, by either party, for a tip just for doing their job.

[justafem]

Here's my take.  Autograts was supposed to take the thought out of tipping.  It hasn't.  There's always going to be those that tip more and there's always going to be those that remove autograts.

 

That said, gratuities are optional, or they'd be called manditories and the cruise lines would have to pay the crew differently.  Current system works for now.  I'm sure it'll change again.  

 

Heck, we could go the Disney way, where they hand you envies, where you're supposed to put the slip of paper that says exactly what your daily grats go to that specific person.  You hand EACH person their envie.  Those envies guilt people into leaving more cash.  SIGH!  If that's not tip-manipulation, I don't know what is.

 

I'll keep cruising my way by keeping my nose out of someone else's wallet. 

[rhblake]

I would like to see all cruise lines, not just Princess, change the terminology from "Gratuities" to "Service Charge" and make them mandatory. That would stop all these discussions.

[david63]

10 minutes ago, rhblake said:

and make them mandatory

And if you do that then might just as well include them in price - which then becomes a win, win for everyone - except those who will still think that need to tip/bribe the crew.

[CruizinSusan70]

6 hours ago, MissP22 said:

There's no doubt that would be responsible but I don't usually take notice of such things. 

You're on vacation, you're not driving, so there's nothing wrong with the consumption of a few spiked coffees.

[CruizinSusan70]

4 minutes ago, iamaqt2 said:

That's not the only misinformation being peddled in here.

Including some posters that are delusional to think that the bartenders receive a certain % of the daily service charge when in fact their monies come from the pool that Princess allocates from the Plus and Premium packages as well as the 18% from a la carte drink purchases.

[iamaqt2]

Just now, CruizinSusan70 said:

Including some posters that are delusional to think that the bartenders receive a certain % of the daily service charge when in fact their monies come from the pool that Princess allocates from the Plus and Premium packages as well as the 18% from a la carte drink purchases.

It's almost like some people have never discovered Google or the internet.