Oosterdam: HAL Experimenting with "Leisure Dining"

[Kansas Travelers]

This is an interesting thread. I have yet to experience either traditional dining or any type of leisure or freestyle dining since my first cruise won't begin until I board the Oosterdam six days from now.

From my inexperienced perspective, I don't see why the solution can't be to have traditional dining on sea days when everyone is confined to the ship, and have leisure dining on port days when so many pax are on different schedules and many might not be able to meet the more rigid dining schedules.

 

Bruce Muzz, I appreciated your 'reality check' about the "old days of ocean travel". In those days many classes of people were using ships for transportation, not vacations. The segregation of classes was expected. Modern cruising has little to do with transportation and the class segregation of the past is now confined to the types of cuise lines, cabins and ammenities one can afford to purchase and doesn't include the main dining rooms.

[Pudgesmom]

I am in the minority on this one. I would really prefer anytime dining or some form thereof. I think if we could eat when we want, it would ease some of the congestion in the gathering areas before and after dinner.

 

People who are interested in the shows (we are not), could be informed of the optimal time to eat in order to go to a show. I think it would be easier for the kitchen not to try to produce all the entrees at the same time.

 

We tried this concept on Windstar last January and really liked it. We met people during the day, and dined with them at dinner. Several nights we requested to dine with others and met new people right at dinner. We also dined alone one night.

 

I'll also go out on another limb and say we don't like to dress for dinner. We would prefer casual elegance. We like so many other things about HAL, but not the formal nights. I think society is going to a more casual atmosphere, and I prefer this, especially on my vacation.

 

I think the current steps towards anytime dining are a good idea, and I hope they continue and/or are expanded.

 

Beth

[kryos]

There's a third school which says that they need to maintain the trappings of tradition to hold their existing customer base while making changes to satisfy those who don't, today, choose the product. In the end, they actually alienate both groups and end up with less market share and no way to regain what they've lost.

That's exactly why I think this new dining concept will probably only be implemented on the Vista class ships. Those are the ones that get a lot of the "new breed" of cruiser ... one not so concerned with "tradition." It would seem that "leisure dining" would be something they would overwhelmingly embrace since the concept is so popular on other mass market lines. I doubt very much, though, that we'll ever have to worry about this on the smaller HAL ships, though, since those tend to draw more of the "traditionalist" type cruiser.

 

So, if HAL keeps "leisure dining" only on the larger ships, doing primarily seven to ten-day popular itineraries, I have a feeling they won't alienate their existing customer base at all.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[kryos]

I am in the minority on this one. I would really prefer anytime dining or some form thereof. I think if we could eat when we want, it would ease some of the congestion in the gathering areas before and after dinner.

Actually, you're probably not in the minority at all ... and that's why HAL is trying this.

 

The only people who really get hurt by this are singles and solos ... and I don't think you get very many singles and solos on the Vista ships' shorter cruises. And for the few who do sail them ... I guess it's just gonna be tough nuggets. :)

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[DesertDiva]

Hi Rita,

 

I don't understand how you feel that singles and solo passengers are "hurt" by the new dining. I sailed recently and ate at my "assigned" space two nights. I joined some new friends and was allowed to join their early dining assignment one evening (late night in port in Puerto Vallarta and dining room wasn't full) and also ate in the Lido Buffet and Pinnacle Grill. I liked the flexibility. Could you tell us why you feel this way?

 

The only people who really get hurt by this are singles and solos.

[Gardyloo2]

My DH and I talked about this subject last night. We think it'd be nice to have some flexibility around the time we arrive for dinner. Sometimes we cruise with our extended family, one of whom is an on-time fanatic. It can get a little stressful trying to get our teens and us all ready at the same time. If we had a few extra minutes, things would be much more relaxed.

 

We’ve also experienced an experimental program on another line where there was completely open seating. But the problem was the Maitre D’ led you to whatever table they had space at, and we dined with completely new people every night at a different table. We didn’t enjoy it at all, and we missed talking with our new met friends over the period of the cruise.

 

It sounds like HAL’s program may be a happy compromise, allowing people to have “their” table, but arrive in staggered groups. It’d also be nice to avoid the crowds that form near the entrance waiting to get in the DR. I just hope it’s not so much extra work for the waiters that they lose their customer service focus.

We’ like to give it a try.

[kryos]

I don't understand how you feel that singles and solo passengers are "hurt" by the new dining. I sailed recently and ate at my "assigned" space two nights. I joined some new friends and was allowed to join their early dining assignment one evening (late night in port in Puerto Vallarta and dining room wasn't full) and also ate in the Lido Buffet and Pinnacle Grill. I liked the flexibility. Could you tell us why you feel this way?

Unless a single is seated at a table with all singles, she could theoretically wind up dining alone or with a different group several nights during the cruise. I can dine alone at home ... in fact, I do it all the time ... but when I cruise, the dinner hour is a major social event for me. Having the same table companions allows relationships to form and it is kind of fun to have familiar faces to share the day's events with each evening.

 

Now, let's say you have a table for six ... two singles and two couples. The couples are traveling together. You all agreed to meet up at 8:00 for dinner each night. Now, let's say that you are in port one day and the two couples decide on the fly to eat at 9:00 that night, so they don't come to the dining room at the 8:00 p.m. meeting time. Since they're not "hanging out" with the singles during the day, they may not even think of alerting the others at their table as to this change in plans.

 

So, now you've got the two singles left out of a table for six. Maybe one decides to have dinner in her cabin that night. Now, you're down to one remaining single, showing up at 8:00, to an empty table. She has two choices ... dine alone or be randomly assigned to another table for the evening. She's gonna dine with people she never met before and maybe those people she is "dumped" with are a group traveling together who pretty much stick together. That single is kinda out of the mainstream conversation if everyone decides to ignore her.

 

With groups traveling together, you won't have this sort of problem. Chances are most members of the group will be spending other parts of their day together as well. If a port day runs long, and some group members decide to eat at a later hour, the whole group will get word of it and can adjust their plans accordingly. No one will be left "out in the cold."

 

Of course, the same sort of thing, of course, can occur at lunch ... or breakfast ... when seating is open. A single would be seated at a large table with others she doesn't know. But at least at lunch and breakfast it's no big deal. Those are relatively quick meals and the single can smile, try as much as possible to be social, finish her meal and bolt. Dinner doesn't work like that. It tends to be a more relaxed, social meal ... and I would hate to be stuck with with a new group of people on several nights ... some of which really didn't want me with them anyway.

 

I like traditional dining in that it lets me form at least relationships, if not friendships, with the people I dine with. You have one uncomfortable night where you are all getting to know each other, but it doesn't take long for the group to meld and dinner becomes a much looked forward to experience. I doubt you'll get that with anytime dining.

 

Of course, I'll be honest ... I've never tried "freestyle," or "anytime" dining. Maybe I am wrong and maybe I will like it. But personally, when I spend a lot of money on a cruise, I don't like to chance having anything erode my good times. That's why I am so hesitant to even try this "leisure" dining ... unless, of course, I happen to be traveling with my own group on that particular cruise.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Pudgesmom]

Rita,

 

While I understand a single not wanting to dine alone, why should others have to be responsible for someone they're not traveling with? This is why I think that the total freestyle concept would work better. Instead of waiting at an empty table, which be the way could happen with traditional dining, too, a sincle cruiser could ask to be seated at a table with others.

 

Beth

[lauderdalebob]

Am on an upcoming May Oosterdam cruise and hope we get the same table every evening. There are three of us and I have already called ships services and requested a specific table number designed for 3/4 right behind the table for 2 (at the railing) we had on two previous sailings.

 

I really do not want to switch around tables every night, nor do I want to dine with different dining companions each evening. Being in a very hectic consumer-oriented job, about the last thing in the world I want to do each night at dinner is to have to make small talk with strangers, nice as they may be. I am on the phone most of the day in my job and enjoy the peace and quiet of dining with companions I know and who are comfortable with periods of silence, not feeling they have to chatter on and on.

 

That said, I'm hoping for the best but will live with what comes. Is there a choice?! Just my two cents.

[kryos]

While I understand a single not wanting to dine alone, why should others have to be responsible for someone they're not traveling with? This is why I think that the total freestyle concept would work better.

I never said others should have to be responsible ... and that's exactly why the single will often find themselves dining either alone or with different people every night with this leisure dining concept. That's just the way it is and singles like myself will simply have to adapt to it. I'm just hoping leisure dining only gets adopted on the larger, Vista class ships ... because I can easily avoid them. If it goes fleetwide, though, then I'm gonna have to start looking at other cruise lines.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Bramcruiser]

Been thinking of this lately. I've seen a lot of great posts. I guess if any experiment ends with flexible times but same table then it might work for me. I think any free fall where you are never in the same place twice and constantly being moved around might be more of the bother than having everyone arrive at the same time in one large crowd. Although........itsn't it exactly that way in the dining room at breakfast? Hmmm!

 

Personally I like the traditional set time for dinner. Its not that much of a bother showing up if you know what time you are supposed to be there. A large crowd outside the door waiting is not a large inconvenience. However, if there was a variation of the traditions that allowed for flexibility I might not be so bothered by it.

 

I have to admit if the NCL freestyle or some other form is adopted then someone is just going to have to take the time to explain it to me as I really truly don't grasp the concept as I have never done it before. Set tables and times are just so obvious that it doesn't need explaining even to a cruising novice. So in the end? I guess its little old me that needs the help.

 

I guess I'll worry about it after this year as my already-booked 2006 cruise is over-loaded with old-style traditions.

[DesertDiva]

You can look at this in a different way - if you are seated at a different table, you have the opportunity to meet other passengers.

 

I was recently on the Oosterdam and here's what I did for dinner each evening.

 

Saturday: Pinnacle Grill with two Cruise Critic members. (Marie and Debbie)

Sunday: Vista Dining Room at my "assigned table" for six. (A couple from Australia, a single woman from San Diego, Marie and her sister Debbie from Cruise Critic, and myself. Marie and Debbie chose to eat in the Lido Buffet and never came to the dining room.)

Monday: Lido Buffet

Tuesday: Lido Buffet

Wednesday: Vista Dining Room at a different seating with four other Cruise Critic members. (Lynn, Buck, Elaine, and John)

Thursday: Vista Dining Room at my assigned table.

Friday: Lido Buffet

 

It was perfect and I loved the flexibility!

 

Now, let's say you have a table for six ... two singles and two couples. The couples are traveling together. You all agreed to meet up at 8:00 for dinner each night. Now, let's say that you are in port one day and the two couples decide on the fly to eat at 9:00 that night, so they don't come to the dining room at the 8:00 p.m. meeting time. Since they're not "hanging out" with the singles during the day, they may not even think of alerting the others at their table as to this change in plans.

 

So, now you've got the two singles left out of a table for six. Maybe one decides to have dinner in her cabin that night. Now, you're down to one remaining single, showing up at 8:00, to an empty table. She has two choices ... dine alone or be randomly assigned to another table for the evening. She's gonna dine with people she never met before and maybe those people she is "dumped" with are a group traveling together who pretty much stick together. That single is kinda out of the mainstream conversation if everyone decides to ignore her.

[Pudgesmom]

I never said others should have to be responsible ... and that's exactly why the single will often find themselves dining either alone or with different people every night with this leisure dining concept.

 

 

--rita

 

I think a single would more likely find themselves dining alone in the traditional method. If they go to an assigned table and the tablemates are absent, they potentially dine alone.

 

If they arrive at the dining room under leisure dining, and ask the maitre d' to be seated with others, they NEVER have to dine alone. If they don't want to switch tables, then they can make plans during the day or at dinner to return with tablemates. It seems to me that this solves the problem for everyone. Each can dine when and with whom they wish. If you're willing to try "luck of the draw," which is what you get with traditional dining anyway, at least you're not stuck with bad dinner companions every night.

 

Beth

[BruceMuzz]

Bramcruiser,

 

If you want a clear explanation on how Freestyle, Personal Choice, and most of those other controversial types of shipboard dining work, you can go to nearly any restaurant in the world, nearly any night of the year.

That's how it works.

 

Most of the people who run those restaurants - and most of the people who dine in them - are pretty happy and comfortable with the concept.

 

Rumor has it that straight old traditional dining will ALWAYS be available on ALL HAL ships - regardless of any experiments or alternatives offered.

 

A bit of trivia:

What is by far the number one request in just about every cruise ship dining room in the world this year?

 

A table for 2.

[kryos]

If you want a clear explanation on how Freestyle, Personal Choice, and most of those other controversial types of shipboard dining work, you can go to nearly any restaurant in the world, nearly any night of the year.

That's how it works.

Yeah, but at a restaurant, it would be unlikely you would be seated at someone else's table without their express invitation. If you walk in alone, you generally dine alone in a restaurant ... unless, of course, it is a "diner type" establishment with a counter that all singles are directed to when the place is busy.

 

With "freestyle" dining on a cruise ship it's a bit different. If you walked into the dining room alone, you could ask to be seated at a large table with others. In fact, I'd be willing to bet you would get seated a lot faster that way. If the particular shipboard restaurant was busy, they would not allow you to take up a table for two by yourself ... and you'd probably have to wait until the crowd thinned out if you were insisting on a solo table.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[kryos]

I think a single would more likely find themselves dining alone in the traditional method. If they go to an assigned table and the tablemates are absent, they potentially dine alone.

You might have a point there, though I guess my experience with traditional dining has always been that you and your tablemates develop a relationship over the first couple of nights where if someone is planning on absenting themselves from the dining room, they usually alert their tablemates the night before. With "flexible" dining, I would imagine your tablemates wouldn't feel a need to do that. If they wanted to change their plans on the fly, well ... it is flexible dining, isn't it?

 

I've never been left at the table myself on any of my cruises ... not without forewarning. In fact, on my 30-day Amsterdam cruise this past January, there was only one night where I would be dining alone ... and I knew that several days in advance. My tablemates were planning to eat shoreside at a luau on that particular night ... so I just made plans to dine at the Lido. It actually worked out very well since I was quite tired after my own activities onshore that day (skydiving) and wouldn't have been up to a two-hour dining experience.

 

I guess I have my own personal prejudices about this "leisure" dining concept ... maybe I am wrong and it actually wouldn't be that bad. But I just know that if I have my preference, it would be to keep things as they are ... maybe offer leisure dining as an option, but still keep the traditional dining ... sort of the way Princess does it.

 

But, of course ... the majority will rule in this case, and we'll just have to see what the "verdict" is when it comes in.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Himself]

Call me what you want, but don't call me late to dinner.