What do you think is the biggest misconception about Freestyle Cruising?

[Retired not Expired]

The worst service I have ever had at a restaurant land or sea was on NCL.

 

The waiters on NCL just dont give a darn about NCL's customers or service.

 

Princess as "freestyle" dining. How do their waiters do such a better job than NCL? I say this, and still Princess has a lot of improvement to do but compared to NCL, they are a 1,000 times better.

 

On Princess you can get a ice tea and refills, yes refills, something you cant get on NCL. Princess even brings desert, something thats no guarantee will ever happen on NCL.[/

quote]

 

Here's a good example of how myths begin. Someone has a bad experience and blows it way out of proportion with gross exaggerations. Some one reads that and makes a thread, "I heard that you can't get refills of tea with NCL. Is this true?"

 

Before you know it, those who can't live without traditional dining are stating it as a fact. And, of course, those who challenge the credibility of those exaggerations are nothing more than "Cheerleaders."

[hotspur]

Maybe these people who were your tablemates picked up on your arrogant manner and that you were talking down to them from the time you sat down together. I wouldn't want to talk to someone who was "bringing the conversation down". Not all third shift people are lowlifes as you seem to think. There are military officers, doctors and nurses and I am sure of countless others who don't work 9 to 5 and certainly do not need to be talked down to.

 

You should be ashamed and enjoy the QE2 because I hope to never come across you on any of the 5 cruise lines I frequent.

Couldn't agree more. songanddance's postings here are all condescending and I can just imagine how he/she must come across in person.

 

One of the real downsides of traditional dining is the possibility you'd be stuck with someone like this at your table and have to deal with this kind of boorish behavior every night of your cruise. How awful!

 

And, brad1185, we've been given refills on our beverages all the time on NCl. You're simply full of beans.

[socsthecat]

You tell me where you can go to a restaurant on land and for $20 have an intimate environment, impeccable service, an appetizer of crab cakes or jumbo shrimp, a Caesar salad, a 12-ounce filet mignon or a 24-ounce porterhouse with made-from-scratch Bearnaise sauce, steamed asparagus, creamed spinach, baked potato with all the fixin's, butter-sauteed mushrooms, creme brulee or chocolate mousse for dessert and a lovely cappuccino to end the evening? You can't.

 

I assume this is the Cagney's restaurant? I've been wondering how good this place is - where would you put it (especially the actual steaks) on a Sizzler < Outback < Morton's kind of scale?

[Zeno]

When I meet someone new, I am quite polite, I ask about what they do and their lies and dislikes, where they live etc.

 

Are you aware that some people consider questions like this to be TOO personal and instrusive coming from strangers? Your tablemates were probably reluctant to provide you with such personal info.

 

When on the QE2, I find most of the passengers can carry on a conversation about golf, antiques, opera, classical music, current events, history of many different parts of the world, medicine, decorating, engineering, historic homes and other places, fine food and beverage, dance bands and dancing.

 

Did you not attempt to discuss any of these subjects with your so-called "3rd shift" tablemates? That would seem to me to be a better tactic to promote conversation rather than asking highly personal questions. My

"workingman" brother-in-law and his wife would NEVER discuss personal details with strangers but he reads a lot and would enjoy discussing books, news, sports, engineering, contemporary music and cooking (he is a great cook). His wife would love someone to discuss classical music and dance with (not particular interests of his).

[SailAways]

What a Song and Dance This Has Become.

 

There Is No Explaining Manners or Polite Behavior to some - Nor Even Very Necessary.

 

They have their Very Own Little Agenda, and Feel Very Comfortable Within.

[newmexicoNita]

songanddance, My father taught me "money does not buy class" and ones does not need to have money to have class: obviously you daddy didn't teach you the same thing. Being a snob is about the most classless thing in the world. NMnita

[dwrist]

Thought that was interesting:D from dictionary.com:

 

song and dance

–noun a story or statement, esp. an untrue or misleading one designed to evade the matter at hand: Every time he's late, he gives me a song and dance about oversleeping.

 

My DH works the third shift, has for many years and has his MA in Computer Science. I think DH could talk circles around songanddance with computers. Maybe give him some of the rudeness he gives others.:)

[mbisson]

 

And, of course, those who challenge the credibility of those exaggerations are nothing more than "Cheerleaders."

 

NCL, NCL--Sis boom bah

Freestyle Freestyle--Rah Rah Rah

 

-Monte

[Zeno]

NCL, NCL--Sis boom bah

Freestyle Freestyle--Rah Rah Rah

 

-Monte

 

Did you get out the Pom Poms for that cheer?

[songanddance]

Are you aware that some people consider questions like this to be TOO personal and instrusive coming from strangers? Your tablemates were probably reluctant to provide you with such personal info.

 

 

 

Did you not attempt to discuss any of these subjects with your so-called "3rd shift" tablemates? That would seem to me to be a better tactic to promote conversation rather than asking highly personal questions. My

"workingman" brother-in-law and his wife would NEVER discuss personal details with strangers but he reads a lot and would enjoy discussing books, news, sports, engineering, contemporary music and cooking (he is a great cook). His wife would love someone to discuss classical music and dance with (not particular interests of his).

 

Ok I am willing to learn. We enter the dining room and are seated with anywhere from two to six additional people who we do not know from Adam. A perfectly blank slate. I am not supposed to inquire as to what these folks do with the majority of their lives in order to maybe get an an area of interest to have a conversation. I am not to bring up politics, religion etc. Please tell me how one gets into a conversation. Do i simply assume they will have something of interest in my areas of interest and launch into what I care about. I was always told that such actions were borish and rude that one should show an interest in the other fellow.

 

As to computers there is no doubt that anyone with more knowledge than simply being able to turn the d--- thing off and on will be able to talk rings around me.

 

So please educate me on the finer points of talking with strangers so as to not put them off in any way.

 

Thanks for your wisdom in this matter.

[mbisson]

Did you get out the Pom Poms for that cheer?

 

I've been accused so often of being a cheerleader I though it was time to actually join the squad ;)

 

The poms are one thing but my beer gut hanging over the top of that cute little skirt is quite another :eek: . The blue midriff barring top with the white "NCL" is great (maybe I should shave the tummy), but I'm not sure I have the legs to be a cheerleader.

 

-Monte

(I gotta laugh at myself-JUST TO KEEP EVERYONE ELSE FROM LAUGHING AT ME!)

[SailAways]

Ok I am willing to learn.

So please educate me on the finer points of talking with strangers so as to not put them off in any way.

Thanks for your wisdom in this matter.

 

There are a multitude of etiquette books which discuss this topic, even online searches will turn up answers.

 

Basically, you must be nice, not brilliant nor condescending when meeting and introducing yourself to others. Extend your hand first, and welcome them to the table; telling them that you are happy that they are joining you. Most folks will respond accordingly.

Say something innocent - such as how happy you are to be on this cruise, adding if you are with family, and what members are with you - this gives them something to respond to.

Perhaps speak of previous cruises, but if this is your tablemates first cruise, don't bore them with details, nor stay on this subject too long. If they seem interested, and want to learn of your experiences then reveal more - otherwise, you could intimidate them.

Pay them a compliment regarding an interesting necklace or ring;this could lead to conversation.

Make the meeting more about them than you - be a good listener, and never display traits that would cause anyone to feel that you see yourself as superior in any way.

Read the etiquette books - and perhaps attend a class at your local library, or wherever relationship classes may be held.

[SailAways]

Ok I am willing to learn.

So please educate me on the finer points of talking with strangers so as to not put them off in any way.

Thanks for your wisdom in this matter.

 

There are a multitude of etiquette books which discuss this topic, even online searches will turn up answers.

 

Basically, you must be nice, not brilliant nor condescending when meeting and introducing yourself to others. Extend your hand first, and welcome them to the table; telling them that you are happy that they are joining you. Most folks will respond accordingly.

Say something innocent - such as how happy you are to be on this cruise, adding if you are with family, and what members are with you - this gives them something to respond to.

Perhaps speak of previous cruises, but if this is your tablemates first cruise, don't bore them with details, nor stay on this subject too long. If they seem interested, and want to learn of your experiences then reveal more - otherwise, you could intimidate them.

Pay them a compliment regarding an interesting necklace or ring;this could lead to conversation.

Make the meeting more about them than you - be a good listener, and never display traits that would cause anyone to feel that you see yourself as superior in any way.

Read the etiquette books - and perhaps attend a class at your local library, or wherever relationship classes may be held.

[Zeno]

Ok I am willing to learn. We enter the dining room and are seated with anywhere from two to six additional people who we do not know from Adam. A perfectly blank slate. I am not supposed to inquire as to what these folks do with the majority of their lives in order to maybe get an an area of interest to have a conversation. I am not to bring up politics, religion etc. Please tell me how one gets into a conversation. Do i simply assume they will have something of interest in my areas of interest and launch into what I care about. I was always told that such actions were borish and rude that one should show an interest in the other fellow.

 

As to computers there is no doubt that anyone with more knowledge than simply being able to turn the d--- thing off and on will be able to talk rings around me.

 

So please educate me on the finer points of talking with strangers so as to not put them off in any way.

 

Thanks for your wisdom in this matter.

 

I am surprised that you cannot start a conversation without enquiring about personal matters (like a person's job). I try to discuss info like that only if the other person brings it up - I.E. She says "As an engineer, I was interested in the bridge we just passed. The construction is most unusual." Then I think it is safe to discuss the person's career. We have a friend who is a Dr and he NEVER mentions what he does - too many rude people wanting tableside diagnosis.

 

I am not a particularly great conversationalist but I can usually manage a discussion about the weather or mention my plane flight experience or my plans for the next port of call. "We have never been to port so and so but have heard some nice things about it." If the other person responds - i.e. "We loved "port so and so" on our last cruise - then I think we could manage a discussion on their experiences in "Port so and so". All I do is try to mention some things that interest me without interogating the other person.

 

If they are interested in the same things, they usually have something to say.

 

Something as simple as "Did you notice the lovely flowers on island X. I wish I could grow flowers like that." A person interested in flowers or gardening will usually respond. Or "I thought the EL Moro fortress was a wonderful example of Spanish colonial architecture". We took tons of pictures". People interested in architecture or history or photography are likely to respond with comments.

 

As long as you don't try to monopolize the conversation with stuff that interests only you, there is nothing wrong with bringing up your interests and then politely listening to theirs. Being interested in what people VOLUNTEER to tell you is quite different from trying to pry personal info out of people with a barrage of personal questions.

[kdzgon]

I assume this is the Cagney's restaurant? I've been wondering how good this place is - where would you put it (especially the actual steaks) on a Sizzler < Outback < Morton's kind of scale?

 

I have never been to Morton's, but Cagney's is definitely well above Sizzler's or Outback. It is a Ruth's Chris or better, IMO. It was not quite as good as the Steakhouse at the Luxor in Las Vegas, but it was excellent overall. We had several meals there (breakfast, lunch and dinner) as it was open to penthouse guests for breakfast and lunch.

[kdzgon]

I'm going to disagree. Auto tipping is being used or picked up by most of the cruise lines. Why are they copying NCL? They don't have to, or do they?

If you checked out why, you'll discover many International crew members were signing up for NCL instead of staying where they were. The reason, larger salaries with auto tipping. So many "experienced" crew members were switching to NCL, the other cruise lines had to follow NCL's lead just to keep their "experienced" crew members.

As for cut backs, I haven't seen any on existing ships. But, as ships become larger and larger, the rise in numbers of crew members hasn't kept pace. So, the passenger to crew ratio has become less.

For example, cruise critic states the Majesty occupancy is 1462 passengers with 620 crew, a ratio of 1462/620 = 2.35. The Pearl occupancy is 2394 passengers with 1154 crew, a ratio of 2394/1000 = 2.39. That's a siginificant drop in with the newer, larger ships. But that's double occupancy passenger loads, it's worse when you look at maximum passenger loads. The Majesty maximum capacity is close to 1700, the Pearl close to 2850. New ratios being 1700/620 = 2.74 for the Majesty and 2850/1000 = 2.85 for the Pearl.

 

But, I don't think so. But that's my subjective opinion. The service being offered is still there, just not as swift as it once was.

 

Perhaps your explanation is better, but the result is the same, no? More passengers without a corresponding increase in staff amounts to a reduction in coverage at a minimum, doesn't it? Service received under a 1:1.7 ratio is likely to be better than a 1:2.74 ratio IMO.

 

A statement that there has been a reduction in service does not have to mean the employees are less polite - it can mean that the time and attention given per passenger is less, or in the example given, service is "not as swift". I would still define that as a reduction in service - also a subjective opinion, I understand.

 

I really don't object to the auto charge, although while it may be merely semantics, I would disagree with the definition of it as a "tip" in that case IF one cannot easily adjust the amount.

[Don Haynes]

Why would you want to adjust a tip? In the very small town I live in, if I don't tip at least 15 percent, I get no service whatsoever the next time I visit the restaurant. Waiters in my hometown expect more than 15 percent tips. No tip this time, no service the next time. You'll be ignored, last in line, and frankly hated by the waiters and waitresses.

 

Maybe you can adjust a tip in a major city, but in very small town with very few restaurants, the waiters and waitresses inform the others when they are ripped off. It won't be long before a friend tells you you are a heel.

[shoreguy]

I really don't object to the auto charge, although while it may be merely semantics, I would disagree with the definition of it as a "tip" in that case IF one cannot easily adjust the amount.

 

You can easily adjust it and many do. The $10 is a pretty basic amount. Same as the suggested cash tips in 1989 :eek: To adjust just provide additional cash to those that you feel earned it. :)

[electricron]

Perhaps your explanation is better, but the result is the same, no? More passengers without a corresponding increase in staff amounts to a reduction in coverage at a minimum, doesn't it? Service received under a 1:1.7 ratio is likely to be better than a 1:2.74 ratio IMO.

 

A statement that there has been a reduction in service does not have to mean the employees are less polite - it can mean that the time and attention given per passenger is less, or in the example given, service is "not as swift". I would still define that as a reduction in service - also a subjective opinion, I understand.

 

I really don't object to the auto charge, although while it may be merely semantics, I would disagree with the definition of it as a "tip" in that case IF one cannot easily adjust the amount.

 

But that reduction in service, as you call "not as swift", has nothing what-so-ever to do with auto tipping. It has more to do with manning, and management decisions on the operation of the ship. Tips have never been about rewarding management, but rewarding workers who provide great service. As long as the workers are trying to do their best to please me, I'll continue to tip them well.

[above sea level cruiser]

We leave this Sunday on the Dawn for an eleven night cruise out of New York. When we return I will give my honest opinion of Freestyle Dining, good or bad. We are very easy to please so I anticipate that we will join the ranks of NCL Loyalists. (We have been on other lines, just not NCL).

As far as the auto tipping goes, I have no problem with it. We add that part of the bill to our whole cruise bill and it is what it is. Correct me if I am wrong but, I would hazard a guess that the auto tips could be removed if someone wanted. How would that be any different than say, someone takes a cruise on another line and DOESN'T tip in the little envelopes provided?

That being said, it would take away from someone busting their behind and not getting a tip wouldn't it? They wouldn't have known if they were getting a tip or not until they did or didn't get one right?

So, IMHO - I would say that auto tipping is not that much different than the little envelopes you get on other lines. Except for ONE HUGE THING - an inordinate amount of "self tippers" avoid the restaurants (on fixed dining lines) on the last night so as to avoid having to pay a tip.That's what you call: "auto stiffing":rolleyes:

[newmexicoNita]

We leave this Sunday on the Dawn for an eleven night cruise out of New York. When we return I will give my honest opinion of Freestyle Dining, good or bad. We are very easy to please so I anticipate that we will join the ranks of NCL Loyalists. (We have been on other lines, just not NCL).

As far as the auto tipping goes, I have no problem with it. We add that part of the bill to our whole cruise bill and it is what it is. Correct me if I am wrong but, I would hazard a guess that the auto tips could be removed if someone wanted. How would that be any different than say, someone takes a cruise on another line and DOESN'T tip in the little envelopes provided?

That being said, it would take away from someone busting their behind and not getting a tip wouldn't it? They wouldn't have known if they were getting a tip or not until they did or didn't get one right?

So, IMHO - I would say that auto tipping is not that much different than the little envelopes you get on other lines. Except for ONE HUGE THING - an inordinate amount of "self tippers" avoid the restaurants (on fixed dining lines) on the last night so as to avoid having to pay a tip.That's what you call: "auto stiffing":rolleyes:

You are pretty much right about the tips and actually $10 a day is less than the recommended amount for the lines that haven't adopted auto tipping. yes, you can have them removed but you are asked for a reason and it is suggested if there's a problem with service that everyone tries to iron the problem out rather than make the entire service crew suffer. We always keep the $10 per day on our bill and add a few extra $$s to those who we feel have gone above and beyond. NMnita

[above sea level cruiser]

You are pretty much right about the tips and actually $10 a day is less than the recommended amount for the lines that haven't adopted auto tipping. yes, you can have them removed but you are asked for a reason and it is suggested if there's a problem with service that everyone tries to iron the problem out rather than make the entire service crew suffer. We always keep the $10 per day on our bill and add a few extra $$s to those who we feel have gone above and beyond. NMnita

 

 

Just to completely clarify things - we would NEVER remove our tips.

[hotspur]

So, IMHO - I would say that auto tipping is not that much different than the little envelopes you get on other lines. Except for ONE HUGE THING - an inordinate amount of "self tippers" avoid the restaurants (on fixed dining lines) on the last night so as to avoid having to pay a tip.That's what you call: "auto stiffing"

Well...yes.

 

To have the "automatic" tip removed on NCL, you do have to approach someone at the reception desk and explain why you are doing it. I'm sure for some that would represent no problem...just bluster something that might sound plausible in order to justify why you want it done and let it roll off like water off a duck. But it might be a deterrent to others, who on a traditional dining cruise line would apparently have no problem missing dinner in the dining room on the last night in order to save a few bucks at the crew's expense.

 

I guess the other difference for me is that with NCL, when I get good service--which is essentially always on five NCL cruises--I don't have to keep asking myself what's behind the "Oh, you look so nice tonight, mr. hotspur" or "Here are your favorite berries tonight, mrs. hotspur" or "What a lovely dress you are wearing, mrs. hotspur." If I'm being waited on professionally and cordially I am comfortable the waiter is doing it because that's how he or she has been trained, how he or she feels about his or her position, and how he or she feels passengers at his or her tables should be treated, not because of what I may or may not choose to put into an envelope two nights before disembarkation depending on how much I'm buttered-up.

[newmexicoNita]

Just to completely clarify things - we would NEVER remove our tips.

Oh, I don't think I was questioning whether you would or not: actually I never thought about that: I just wanted to make it clear to anyone with such an idea it isn't something to be taken lightly. NMnita

[Duff Man]

You can easily adjust it and many do. The $10 is a pretty basic amount. Same as the suggested cash tips in 1989 :eek: To adjust just provide additional cash to those that you feel earned it. :)

I took kdzgon's comment to mean the opposite, that you don't have the ability to reduce the "tip" in a particular situation of bad service, i.e., a bad waiter. You don't necessarily want to remove the "auto tip" because that affects many others.

 

On the other hand (good thing I only have two!), electricron makes a good point that particular problems may not be due to an individual, i.e., instead of the waiter maybe there is a problem in the kitchen. So it's hard to be quick to judge.

 

I agree on the added tipping for exemplary service. As it is, I over tip (like Vinny Antonelli in My Blue Heaven ;) ). I once tried to add up all the tipping I did in one weekend in Vegas (the capitol of tipping!). Wow! (think about it from the time you leave the airport - taxi drivers, bell hops, the guy at the hotel who "gets" your taxi, restaurant servers, bar servers, pool servers, bartenders, room service, some entertainers like piano players, and of course many dealers, ..) Let's just say it might pay for a short cruise! :D