Saga Rose Greenland Voyager August 2007

[Conte Di Savoia]

Sorry that it has taken me awhile to reply to some of the inquiries but I've been having computer problems. Why did I ever attempt to set up a new wireless system?

To BCScot.

We were on the "new" Oriana in September of 2000 on a transatlantic crossing from Southampton to New York. This was before Carnival assumed control of P&O. The crowd was almost totally British of course, on their way for a few days in New York or New England. Many were well heeled passengers who traveled often on P&O. The atmosphere was refined and elegant. (When given the choice between simple or elegant, I opt for the latter). The ship had excellent flow and the public rooms were beautifully decorated. Again that is a major plus. The David Linley designed table in the library is emblematic of the care taken in the design of the ship. Lord's Tavern is fitted out with cricket memorabilia which had been on board Canberra. Unfortunately, we would only go into this bar when it was not in use since it was otherwise smoke-filled.

I have a couple of stories about the trip on Oriana. Shortly after embarking we went to the dining room to check on our table assignment. While on queue two English dowagers, obvious veterans of P&O were chatting, totally unaware that two of perhaps the only Americans on board were standing in front of them. One lady was talking about friends of hers, "Yanks, BUT really quite nice." I couldn't resist the temptation, so I turned around and replied, "sometimes we can really be well behaved!" She was very gracious. A few days later, while we were experiencing rough North Atlantic swells, I overheard another veteran P&O passenger complaining "we NEVER had weather like this on Canberra!!" Alas, I too regret that when Canberra went to the breakers she must have taken the fair weather with her. I recommend a trip on Oriana. I think she is superior to QE2.

To All:

Another excellent, and I think definitive book on ship travel is The Sway of the Grand Saloon. A Social History of The North Atlantic by John Malcolm Brinnin. It recounts the story from 1818 (when the rat hunt on board ship was considered entertainment) through 1968. Brinin wrote another book with Kenneth Gaulin, Grand Luxe. The Transatlantic Style. It is a "coffee table" book but excellent of that genre with wonderful historical photos and well written text. Neither book was written to garner favor for the author from the cruise lines.

[Druke I]

When we get back from our Danube cruise, Budapest to Constanta, I'll post a short report on this thread, if it is still going.

 

Reference Disney and Celebrity - I've been on both, and think Disney has a much better product. We thought Celebrity over-rated, in our opinion certainly not an equal of HAL, and the food only marginally better than Princess. (I do recognize that opinions of food are extremely subjective.)

[bcscot]

Thank you for returning to share your stories with us. Maybe 'Marconi' can help you out with your 'wireless' problems!!!

I enjoyed your stories of the Oriana. I must remember in future to book on those 'good weather' ships! Regarding the 'dowagers', I could relate a few 'mirror image' stories from HAL, but not wanting to get into hot international waters, I wont! I definitely have Oriana & Aurora on my list though.

Thank you for the reading suggestions. My reading list is so long now that I will need a few long ocean voyages to catch up!

Do you remember those top deck balconies on the Sagafjord? Someone mentioned a book about the Saga Sisters. Maybe that would tell us if the top deck was added. Where is Doug. when you need him?!

I hope that you too, will give us a report on your Saga cruise around the British Isles, on your return.

 

Michael: Disney V Celebrity!! I have heard that the Disney alternative restaurants are very good & that the adult only areas are also very good. I imagine though, if you were not with young children, the 'themed dining' could get a little wearing! I believe that adults do go on Disney cruises without having kids with them.

I will look forward to reading your Danube report when you return. We were thinking about the Rotterdam Black Sea cruise for next year, but the QE2 sale changed that. Once upon a time, long long ago, when I was a student, I was going to catch a river boat up the Danube from Vienna with my 'Inter-Rail card' but quite literally; 'I missed the boat'!

I understand that you have a bit of a 'transatlantic family' & no doubt have a few 'transatlantic stories' to tell also.

 

Marconi: I take it that the picture at the top of your post is THE 'Marconi'; a good looking ship.

 

Donald: Any pictures of the Marconi? Also, how about the 'Uganda'?

 

Graham.

[Conte Di Savoia]

Do you remember those top deck balconies on the Sagafjord? Someone mentioned a book about the Saga Sisters. Graham.

When I was aboard in 1976 the ship had its original appearance and the balconied cabins had not yet been added. I loved to sit where those cabins now are. They were added during the 1980 refurbishment which also transformed the ballroom into an orange and red room with curved fiberglass valances around the windows giving the room the appearance of a 747 cabin. It was awful IMO.

I was the one who mentioned the book on the Saga Sisters. The details are in one of the posts above.

[marconi]

Thank you for returning to share your stories with us. Maybe 'Marconi' can help you out with your 'wireless' problems!!!

I enjoyed your stories of the Oriana. I must remember in future to book on those 'good weather' ships! Regarding the 'dowagers', I could relate a few 'mirror image' stories from HAL, but not wanting to get into hot international waters, I wont! I definitely have Oriana & Aurora on my list though.

Thank you for the reading suggestions. My reading list is so long now that I will need a few long ocean voyages to catch up!

Do you remember those top deck balconies on the Sagafjord? Someone mentioned a book about the Saga Sisters. Maybe that would tell us if the top deck was added. Where is Doug. when you need him?!

I hope that you too, will give us a report on your Saga cruise around the British Isles, on your return.

 

Michael: Disney V Celebrity!! I have heard that the Disney alternative restaurants are very good & that the adult only areas are also very good. I imagine though, if you were not with young children, the 'themed dining' could get a little wearing! I believe that adults do go on Disney cruises without having kids with them.

I will look forward to reading your Danube report when you return. We were thinking about the Rotterdam Black Sea cruise for next year, but the QE2 sale changed that. Once upon a time, long long ago, when I was a student, I was going to catch a river boat up the Danube from Vienna with my 'Inter-Rail card' but quite literally; 'I missed the boat'!

I understand that you have a bit of a 'transatlantic family' & no doubt have a few 'transatlantic stories' to tell also.

 

Marconi: I take it that the picture at the top of your post is THE 'Marconi'; a good looking ship.

 

Donald: Any pictures of the Marconi? Also, how about the 'Uganda'?

 

Graham.

 

Yes Graham it certainly is the Guglielmo Marconi sister ship to the Galileo Galilei which later in her years was known as the Meridien until it was bought by Singaporean interests and renamed Sun Vista.It sailed till 1999 until it sank in the malacca straits after having caught on fire in the engine room.The Marconi on the other hand was bought by Costa Line after it was used as an ITALIA LINE ship (the last passenger liner for for the great ITALIA LINE) and it was renamed Costa Riviera and cruised the carabian and then the mediteranean until 2001.It was scrapped in ALANG INDIA in late 2001 ending my dream of going on her again.

[CGTNORMANDIE]

HI GANG!!!

 

HI GRAHAM!!!

Yes the EUROPA is getting very high marks but my German is not good enough to keep up with the other pax onboard...LOL. Doug Ward can be a real task master when it comes to rating ships...sometimes a bit too harsh. He used to relish the QE II Grill rooms but he ignored the Tourist Class wastelands...that had declined so precipitously...LOL. I have also found ways to bypass Doug Ward's pronouncements and find true happiness on ships he panned...LOL.

 

You are correct Graham (and I would never flame anyone who is as "shipdaft" as I am...LOL). The Disney people hit the mark with their ships. Too bad they do not have one for us adults...LOL. They did a great job in mixing the classics and the Art Deco era together. It just goes to show you what can happen when Carnivore Cruise Lines is not in the picture...LOL!!!

 

The Polish Ocean Line disappeared when they lost the battle for the Stephan Batory. They were never able to recapture their place on the Atlantic.

 

HI CONTE DI!!! Malcolm Brinnin's books are great. He is/was a professor at Boston University.

 

HI MARCONI!!! The GALILEO and the MARCONI were beautiful ships with very graceful lines...and they were fun to sail on. I really liked The Winter Garden on the GALILEO...a pleasure to sit and watch the sea go by.

 

ROSS

[bcscot]

They did a great job in mixing the classics and the Art Deco era together. It just goes to show you what can happen when Carnivore Cruise Lines is not in the picture...LOL!!!

 

ROSS

 

:) ! I had not heard that one. Very appropriate.

I believe that they have to be given credit for continuing Cunard & building the QM2, but these will have been sound business decisions. I am sure that they could have found a way to preserve their first ship, the old Empress of Canada, but that would have been an emotional decision; 'no heart'!

 

I certainly agree that Douglas Ward does appear to be a little harsh in some of his comments. I will choose to ignore his "for tabloid reading adults" comment of the Oriana, & will take Conte's advice instead & put her on my "to do" list.

 

Conte: Thank you. You were certainly the man to tell us about the Saga Rose. Next year on the QE2, I will have to look out for the Saga Sisters book. I hope that they have since changed the ballroom & that it is no longer an 'orange & red 747'!! That is as good as Ruby(our Ruby), & her parent's 'Howard Johnson' coloured suite on the France! We met a man on the Prinsendam recently who spoke very highly of the ballroom on the Caronia (Saga Ruby). I hope that is untouched.

These 'add on' bits on ships, do tend to stick out & be rather ugly. They are noticable on the Rose & Ruby, but were very ugly on the Norway & the QE2. They have also recently extended the 'spa' on the HAL Amsterdam (& presumably the Rotterdam also) resulting in a new addition sticking out above the bridge. It does not follow the same graceful line as the rest of that part of the ship & so it just looks like what it is; a box stuck on: ugly; utility rather than stylish (carnivore rather than HAL)!

 

Marconi: Most of the ships we have discussed have tended to be transatlantic ones. Please tell me about the Lloyd Triestino Line. Did they specialise in the Australia route. Presumably they were based in & sailed from Trieste? Do you have an Italian background? How long was the trip to Australia?

I could not find the Costa Riviera in my now famous dust cover poster! She must have joined Costa later in the 80s.

I remember reading an account recently, by a survivor of a cruise ship which caught fire & sank in the Far East, sometime in the last ten years or so. It was a bit of a shambles, reminiscent of Titanic, with disorganisation, a lifeboat being lowered ontop of another, etc. Could this have been the 'Sun Vista'?

 

Does anyone think that there are any other ships in current service that have the beauty, grace & classic lines of the Saga Sisters, & if so, will they survive SOLAS?

 

Graham.

[Kapricorn]

Hi to everybody, and a big welcome to Marconi!

 

Graham, I agree with you that the Disney ships are beautiful (too bad that they aren't marketed for adults), and that the Infinity is not all that great-looking. The Mercury has much more graceful lines than the M-class ships. I dined in the SS United States restaurant on the Infinity and it was a marvelous experience. However, I haven't bothered with specialty restaurants since then, because the food is just as good in the regular dining rooms, and I prefer to be serviced by waiters who know my preferences.

 

Here are photographs of the beautiful Galileo Galilei (sister-ship of the Guglielmo Marconi) and the Uganda.

 

Ross, my Uncle Frank also sailed on the Bremen during the early 1970s, and he really enjoyed it.

 

Donald.

[Druke I]

Well, I'll weigh in again regarding Disney.

 

My wife and I took a Disney 4 night cruise on the Magic, 12-98, as part of a package which included 3 nights at Disneyworld. We travelled without kids (ours are adult), and we found separation between children and adults to be very good. We told ourselves we were taking it as a preview to going with the grandkids.

 

Their dining concept is really unique. Three different dining rooms in rotation, and your waiters move with you.

 

The cabins were very large, with fairly spacious bathrooms.

 

When their new ships come on-line, we very likely will try Disney again, particularly if they have a cruise/park package that includes the park in France, Hong Kong, or Japan.

[Kapricorn]

Their dining concept is really unique. Three different dining rooms in rotation, and your waiters move with you.

 

That's really an excellent concept! At least the diners get to have the same waiters who are familiar with their dining preferences.

 

Thanks for that information!

 

Donald.

[bcscot]

Well, I'll weigh in again regarding Disney.

 

My wife and I took a Disney 4 night cruise on the Magic, 12-98, as part of a package which included 3 nights at Disneyworld. We travelled without kids (ours are adult), and we found separation between children and adults to be very good. We told ourselves we were taking it as a preview to going with the grandkids.

 

Their dining concept is really unique. Three different dining rooms in rotation, and your waiters move with you.

 

The cabins were very large, with fairly spacious bathrooms.

 

When their new ships come on-line, we very likely will try Disney again, particularly if they have a cruise/park package that includes the park in France, Hong Kong, or Japan.

 

 

Well michael, as an ex-MP, if you are going to weigh in, I for one, am going to give you a bit of space!!!

However, I have to say that the idea of dining with Disney every night of my cruise(all be it a short one), gives me cause to pause & consider! According to Douglas Ward, the noise levels in the dining rooms are 'extremely high', so maybe I will try Celebrity for now & await your further report on the new ships! Nice looking ships though.

 

 

Donald: Welcome back. I thought you had gone back to Alaska for the long weekend! Thank you for the pictures. I knew you wouldn't let us down.

Today I went into a 'used book' store & bought a copy of JM-G's 'The Only Way to Cross'; 1978 soft cover, second addition(no fancy dust cover:( ). However it was only $7.99+tax; a lot of book for $7.99! Nice picture of the Mauretania on the cover. Some while ago, I found a nice print of the Mauretania in an antique shop. It is about 12 inches by 10 inches, in a simple wooden frame. It now hangs on a wall in our house. It was inexpensive & is very nice. I have no idea as to it's history, but I recall that someone mentioned that travel agents used to have similer pictures of ships on their walls. I wondered if this is what it used to be. Has anyone any ideas? Thanks.

 

Graham.

[Kapricorn]

Graham, that's really interesting that you found a framed print of the Mauretania in an antique shop. In an earlier post, I mentioned that about thirty years ago I found a framed print of the Majestic in a downtown Vancouver antique shop. It measured 27" x 21" minus the frames. I asked the shop owner how much it was, and he shrugged and said "$10." So, I purchased it on the spot, and it's currently on the wall above my computer table. See the attached photograph. The text read: White Star Line, S.S. Majestic, World's Largest Steamer.

 

I'm sure that such framed photographs hung in long-gone travel agency offices.

 

I have absolutely no idea if that print is still worth $10 or a bit more. Perhaps Conte or Ross might have some idea, as well as to when that photograph may have been taken? It's more black-and-white than brown.

 

Donald.

[Conte Di Savoia]

Donald

I don't know what your picture is worth but certainly more than $10.

I recently purchased a wonderful new book about Mauretania while I was on board QM2 in May. It is entitled Mauretania. Triumph and Resurrection by Peter Newall. The author not only documents the ship's career but actually developed a Mauretania Heritage Trail. He researched the whereabouts of items auctioned off in 1935 and then traveled to those sights obtaining marvelous photographs of her interiors in their current locations around the UK. Chandeliers, railings, cabin door handles and in some cases whole public rooms were found in hotels, bars and private homes. The before and after pictures are fascinating. I would vote this a "must have" book for the true ship aficionado.

Our Ruby should be in Cobh today.

[Druke I]

Reference noise in dining rooms, we found Disney's less noisy than Regal Princess in its original incarnation. Regal Princess, after remodelling, was somewhat better.

 

The biggest three complaints I had about Disney:

 

1. Adults were not allowed to use the slide into the swimming pool - kids only.

 

2. Seats in main show lounge had little knee room - designed for people less

than 6 feet tall.

 

3. Four night cruise is much too short.

[wynkys]

Hello to All,

 

I have enjoyed reading this thread and check in regularly to catch up.

The mention of the Galileo revived memories for me. As a student at Sydney University in the mid-Sixties, I was always looking for novel ways to travel home to Melbourne and one time travelled First Class on the Galileo. It was a two day trip and because it was the beginning of the return trip, there was a traditional send off from Sydney for those Europe bound with lots of streamers and tears. Even with my short time on board, it was a very nice ship and the meals were memorable.

Twelve years earlier I had sailed with my mother and grandparents from Melbourne on the Stratheden bound for the US via England and partly because we only lived a short distance from the pier, we had what many of the crew maintained was the largest Bon Voyage party any of them had seen. After a month in London where we were on standby for either of the Queens, we finished up doing the Transatlantic on the Georgic.

We eventually returned home across Canada by train and then on the Aorangi across the Pacific.

I did some cruises in the Pacific and Asia in the Seventies and then while working in the US for a couple of years, I flew Concorde to London and returned to New York on the QE2. In recent years I have sailed NCL around Hawaii, Celebrity's Infinity through the Panama, Princess to New Zealand, Silversea's Silver Shadow to Asia and I celebrated my 60th birthday with my mother when we took the Orient Express to Southampton and the QM2's inaugural to New York. We then finished it off taking the QE2 back to Southampton on the Tandem Crossing.

All wonderful memories.

 

Wayne

[bcscot]

Good morning to all, except Wayne: good evening & welcome aboard. How is mid-winter Melbourne & how is tomorrow?!

It sounds like you have had many interesting voyages Wayne. I am sure that the others will know,but for my benefit, please tell us more about the Stratheden, Georgic & Aorangi. Which Lines did they belong to?

Have you also sailed on the 'Earnslaw' in New Zealand?

 

Conte: That Mauretania book sounds very good. I wonder if my picture is in it? It is a print of a painting, not a photo. It is a very dramatic view of the Mauretania at sea looking towards her port bow, smoke billowing from her stacks over to the starboard side, slightly choppy seas, seagulls in the foreground & a small yacht (sailboat) heeling over on the ship's starboard bow.Very nice.

I can picture our Ruby standing on the deck of Saga Rose, wind blasted, as they strike out from Queenstown to cross the vast ocean, as many another has done before throughout recent history, (although not so many heading for Greenland!).

 

Michael: I must bow to your knowlege & experience of Disney. I am still a little hesitant, but would be happy to give them a go for a one week, adult only cruise. I do not doubt however that they do a very good job of their style of cruise.

 

Donald: You got a good deal there, with that lovely picture of the Majestic. A good size too. What were the dates of that ship?

You certainly have an impressive list of West Coast cruising there. I imagine that you could navigate the ship to Alaska by yourself by now! Why the Vision of the Seas?

 

Graham.

[CGTNORMANDIE]

HI GANG!!!

 

I am trying to think...what classic ships are still sailing that will survive the next round of SOLAS??? I cannot really think of any...:(. I just heard a brief blurb on the former BREMEN that HAPAG sold. She was a classic but HAPAG sold her when they got the new EUROPA. I know the old STOCKHOLM is still sailing but will probably not make the SOLAS cut this time. Thank heavens the ROTTERDAM V is going to be a hotel in Rotterdam. So...instead of dwelling on what was why not answer the question: WHAT ARE THE BEST SHIPS (ALL YOUR FAVORITES) CURRENTLY SAILING??? And tell us why you like a particular ship.

 

HI DONALD!!! Where have you been??? I remember that your uncle was on the BREMEN...too bad he did not take you with him at the time...LOL.

 

CHEERS!!!:D

 

ROSS

[Kapricorn]

Wayne: Welcome! You've had some interesting voyages, and you must've been on the Georgic sometime during the early or mid-1950s, as she was scrapped in 1956.

 

Ross: I was away on a one-week cruise to Alaska on the Mercury. Since my return last Friday, I've been sidelined with a muscle spasm in my left hip, which prevented me from sitting for too long.

 

Graham: The Majestic sailed from 1922 until 1936. She was 56,599 tons and 956 feet long. She was the last of a trio of impressive German liners that were given to Britain after the first World War, the others being Berengaria (52,101 tons & 919 feet long) and Leviathan (48,943 tons & 950 feet long). I believe that the Majestic was the largest passenger liner in the world until the Normandie in 1935 (would someone please correct me if I'm wrong?). Therefore, the photograph which I have would be dated anywhere from 1922 to 1935. Someone who is familiar with the evolution of the New York City skyline (or that particular aircraft) might be able to pinpoint the exact period.

 

Conte: I have the book "Grand Luxe", a really most impressive volume. It used to be on my coffee table until one of my cats chewed on part of the spine. It's now up on a shelf.

 

Donald.

[CGTNORMANDIE]

WELCOME ABOARD WAYNE!!!

WOW...you were on the GEORGIC. Funny thing...but many veterans of the Transatlantic ferry preferred the GEORGIC to the larger and faster liners. The GEORGIC was the last of the White Star Line.

 

HI DONALD!!! I hope you feel better!!!

 

CONTE!!! The MAURETANIA Book: I hear it is wonderful!!!

 

ROSS

[bcscot]

Ross: Now that's a hard one. It would be easier for me to tell you which are my favourite 'single malts'!!

I have not been on so many interesting ships as you chaps, so I have less to choose from. I liked all of the older HAL ships, the aforementioned Earnslaw & Waverley, various older ferries & of course I have a soft spot for the old Ocean Islander or the Royal Star as she now is (until SOLAS).

I have to say though, even though I have never been on her, the Saga Ruby holds a special place in my heart, ever since I saw her in Ocho Rios. I think she is even better looking than the Saga Rose. She will be even more special after SOLAS as she will be the last of a kind. She is unique in that she is a 1970s ship, built to a high standard in a classic 1950s style. The QE2 & the QM2, I still have to experience, although QE2 is growing on me since I met her in may.

 

Donald: Thank you for the info. I have no excuse now though, I should be looking these things up in 'The Only Way To Cross'!

Sorry to hear that you hurt yourself. I hope you are feeling better now. Now was that too much gymn & promenade deck, or not enough, or was it one of those rather violent Oriental massages in the Spa (beyond that in speculation, I will not go)?!!

 

To anyone in the New York area: sorry to hear that you are the latest recipients of this crazy weather that seems to be endemic in the world these days. I hope that it is not affecting you too badly.

 

Graham.

[Kapricorn]

Why the Vision of the Seas?

Graham.

 

Sorry, I had overlooked your question. I normally cruise on the Mercury two or three times per winter to the Mexican Riviera. Unfortunately, Celebrity has now discontinued that itinerary. I was on the Vision of the Seas to Alaska in 2003, and I enjoyed its layout and ambience of public rooms, with a smooth flow of passengers. I especially liked the Crown Lounge for my pre-dinner martinis. Therefore, when RCCL held its two-day sale a few months ago, I booked on that ship twice, for November and February. Since a week is practically a mini-cruise for me, and I am not willing to fly all the way to San Diego just for seven days, I am doing back-to-backs.

 

You've noticed that I usually cruise the West Coast. That's due to my distaste for lengthy air travel. That's why I truly admire Ruby and some of you for thinking nothing of sitting in an aircraft for ten or 20 hours to elsewhere in the world to catch cruises.

 

Donald.

[Kapricorn]

Sorry to hear that you hurt yourself. I hope you are feeling better now. Now was that too much gymn & promenade deck, or not enough, or was it one of those rather violent Oriental massages in the Spa (beyond that in speculation, I will not go)?!!

Graham.

 

I actually hurt myself simply by wheeling my suitcase behind me during disembarkation. Sorry that it wasn't a much more interesting explanation. "Rather violent Oriental Massages", hmmm ... :D

 

Donald.

[bcscot]

Is that the ten day Sea of Cortez cruise that you have booked on the Ryndam next year, Donald? I would like to do that one. Have you tried the Vistas yet? The Oosterdam is really not so bad.

I know what you mean about flying. I used to love it, but now I hate it, especially the pre & post flight parts. It is only a means to an end now. Oh, ocean tavel, now that's the way to go!

 

Graham.

[Druke I]

For those of you who really dislike to fly, have you looked into P&O's Boomerang trips?

 

Every spring, P&O (UK) sends two ships out from Southampton, each circumnavigating the globe, one eastbound and one westbound.

 

Depending on itineraries, it is possible in some years to depart US West coast, sail out to Australia, spend a week or 10 days there, and then travel back to the US West coast on the other ship.

 

It has often been Oriana and Aurora, although I think Arcadia might have been one of the duo a year or two ago.

 

I've looked longingly at doing that several times, but it has never worked out.

 

I did sail San Francisco to Sydney on Sky Princess' last trip as a Princess ship, but bit the bullet and flew home. I don't care to fly, but do it to get from Point A to Point B when it suits me.

[Kapricorn]

Graham: It'll be the Ryndam's 12-day repositioning cruise that I will be on - departing from San Diego, a week or so in the Mexican Riviera and then north to Vancouver. Only one air travel involved! :)

 

Last year I was on the Maasdam (May, New England/Canada), Zuiderdam (July, Alaska), Veendam (September, Alaska) & Oosterdam (November, Mexican Riviera). I liked all of these ships!

 

Michael: I hadn't heard of P&O's Boomerang trips. It sounds ideal! I'll have to look into it sometime in the near future. Thanks!

 

Donald.