tipping question

[sac2]

Offical Policy: No, you can not remove the service change.

 

Unoffical hearsay: Yes, you can have it removed if you insist.

 

Cruise Critic General Opinion: You are a CHEAP for even asking that question.; You should pick another vacation instead of cruising.; You can not expect to be pampered on your cruise for less than $10 pp/day.; How could you even consider stealing money from all those people?.

 

for your information i cruised once before on r/c and i do believe it was an option there thats why i asked ....and i did tip very generously and have every intention of doing so on any line and have respect for the people who help in every way and i also work with people and understand that situation....and i would not say im cheap..and i dont appreciate you and others implying such u dont even know me..so you can keep your cheap shots to yourself i was just trying to get some information with ncl...buzz off

[sac2]

NCL's policy is that those who serve meals in the buffet deserve a share of the service charge money, along with those who serve in the dining room (there is a good bit of overlap among them, anyway -- those who serve in the dining room often also serve in the buffet), so good news! You won't have to go through the hassle of removing tips, or tip cash every time you use the buffet (which from your post above I assume is what you intended to do? Because you wouldn't be planning just to tip nothing to the crew members, would you?). Your auto tip will reward all those who serve you (wherever on board you dine). You can leave it on your onboard charge and not think about it again, and know that base tips for your steward are also covered.

 

I don't THINK you were saying that you didn't intend to tip at all, but if that really is your intention, NCL probably isn't the line for you... because of Freestyle dining, the pooled service charge is really pretty vital to making the onboard service system work, which is why this is called a "service charge" and not a "gratuity."

 

PS I agree, I thought Cosmo's explanation above was spot-on.

 

well thank you for your sensible answer i now have a better understanding of how the system works..i do believe on rcl they gave me the option of the automatic gratuity or not and i was tipping every person generously..and yes i have every intention of tipping ...it is so funny how some people want to make a judgement on people they dont even know ...again thanks for your sensible approached of trying to explain the situation...i have only cruised once before...

[Cosmopolitan]

Okay but here's MY question....WHEN do you tip? I understand the $10 pp per day but, if you have concierge or butler service, do you tip as you go along or just at the end of the cruise?

 

We tip the butler and concierge on the last day.

 

Several years ago when we had our first butler, we tried to tip him with the first meal he brought and he refused the tip.

Since then, we tip both of them on the last day.

If you will not see them on the last day, tip them the day before:)

[WinnieinWA]

garycarla: My problem is that for months the service charge situation has been confusing to me. At times, different sources seemed to give different answers. The information in mylesf's post could resolve the confusion once and for all if it is the definitive, exclusive statement of NCL service charge policy, but if there are other differing statements, in the contract of carriage, in the cruise booklets, etc., then I shall still not be sure. I don't see why anyone would question my right to ascertain what I'll be buying before I book a cruise.

 

Thrifty,

Why don't you get it from the horses mouth and go to www.ncl.com for the exact answer.

 

Happy sailing.

[sac2]

yes i am right on royal caribbean....i had the option of prepaying the tips on the first day of cruise/or paying on the last day or paying with the envolopes provided in room...plus any tipping that is desired...and i used the envolopes and i tipped who i came in contact with...obviously ncl has a different policy and i was just seeking information...JUDGEMENT OR ASSUMPTIONS SHOULD NOT BE MADE BY PEOPLE ....FALKEN FILL IN THE BLANKS------------------#$%#..HOW DARE YOU ACCUSE ME OF TRYING TO STEAL FROM PEOPLE...@@#$%$#$

[cruizinwithkids]

My post on the service fee came from NCL and is current. To the person that said they now add a tip on the NCLA product is not the case, unless Hawaii changed their law. The law there states that no service fee or tip can be built into the price of adult beverages!

 

A tip/service charge IS added to bar bills. This change went into effect the day we sailed the Pride of Aloha.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=709702

[newmexicoNita]

yes i am right on royal caribbean....i had the option of prepaying the tips on the first day of cruise/or paying on the last day or paying with the envolopes provided in room...plus any tipping that is desired...and i used the envolopes and i tipped who i came in contact with...obviously ncl has a different policy and i was just seeking information...JUDGEMENT OR ASSUMPTIONS SHOULD NOT BE MADE BY PEOPLE ....FALKEN FILL IN THE BLANKS------------------#$%#..HOW DARE YOU ACCUSE ME OF TRYING TO STEAL FROM PEOPLE...@@#$%$#$

 

I beleive RCI/Celebrity is the only mass marketed line or one of them that hasn't gone to the daily auto charges. BTW, NCLs is the lowest as far as I know.

 

Nita

[ChBoxers800]

and i used the envolopes and i tipped who i came in contact with...

 

And therein lies the problem. How many behind the scenes workers that you didn't come in contact with got nothing? Of course you shouldn't run around the ship asking to see the behind the scene workers so you can show your appreciation, that would be ridiculous. And furthermore, I cannot believe that you tip the buffet workers...the ones that are behind the buffet line replenishing the food pans, etc. I know that I wouldn't even think of tipping them.

 

NCL's way spreads the tip money around. Everyone from the laundry worker to the waiter, to the buffet worker to your room steward. Everyone who serves you gets a piece of the tip/service charge money.

 

I wasn't sure when I went on my first NCL cruise if I was going to like the automatic charge or not. I did not remove it, but wasn't comfortable with it. I was concerned about the service I would receive and honestly, thought that the amount of money charged was not enough. There were 3 of us in our cabin, $210 total for the week. Eating 3 meals a day, times 7 days, is 21 meals and on land, I'd tip more then $210 for 21 meals in a restaurant! Not even counting the excellent service our room stewards provided. Plus all the behind the scenes workers.

 

One more thing you may want to consider before even thinking about trying to have the auto tip removed. If you get fantastic service from your cabin steward, and tip him well, are you aware that since you removed the auto tip that he will have to turn in anything you give him to be shared with the rest of the staff? Even those waiters in the dining room who you never used. So unless you end up tipping over the $10 per day per person, they are getting shafted.

 

I was extremely pleased with the service and at the end of the week, did tip extra to certain people who had gone out of their way to serve us. It seemed as if all of the NCL people are happy to serve you under the existing service charge policy and in my opinion, we got a break!

[mylesf]

A tip/service charge IS added to bar bills. This change went into effect the day we sailed the Pride of Aloha.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=709702

 

I was on the Pride of America last month and did not add a service fee to any individual bar tab. Also, I called NCL and they said this is still their policy.

[sac2]

And therein lies the problem. How many behind the scenes workers that you didn't come in contact with got nothing? Of course you shouldn't run around the ship asking to see the behind the scene workers so you can show your appreciation, that would be ridiculous. And furthermore, I cannot believe that you tip the buffet workers...the ones that are behind the buffet line replenishing the food pans, etc. I know that I wouldn't even think of tipping them.

 

NCL's way spreads the tip money around. Everyone from the laundry worker to the waiter, to the buffet worker to your room steward. Everyone who serves you gets a piece of the tip/service charge money.

 

I wasn't sure when I went on my first NCL cruise if I was going to like the automatic charge or not. I did not remove it, but wasn't comfortable with it. I was concerned about the service I would receive and honestly, thought that the amount of money charged was not enough. There were 3 of us in our cabin, $210 total for the week. Eating 3 meals a day, times 7 days, is 21 meals and on land, I'd tip more then $210 for 21 meals in a restaurant! Not even counting the excellent service our room stewards provided. Plus all the behind the scenes workers.

 

One more thing you may want to consider before even thinking about trying to have the auto tip removed. If you get fantastic service from your cabin steward, and tip him well, are you aware that since you removed the auto tip that he will have to turn in anything you give him to be shared with the rest of the staff? Even those waiters in the dining room who you never used. So unless you end up tipping over the $10 per day per person, they are getting shafted.

 

I was extremely pleased with the service and at the end of the week, did tip extra to certain people who had gone out of their way to serve us. It seemed as if all of the NCL people are happy to serve you under the existing service charge policy and in my opinion, we got a break!

 

i am not disputing ncls way of handling tips,,, the issue was what i was familiar with on rcl they gave that option so i was wondering if ncl does that also...they gave a couple of envolopes labelled specifically for who it was intended to,,,and thats their way of handling the tips issue .maybe the tips are hidden in price i wouldnt know ,,,they are other cruise lines who has a tipping not necessary policy but tip if you wish ..maybe you pay more for the cruise and they take care of the tipping anyway every line is different.so there is no problem just things being handled differently just like everybody cant be a plumber..so if i never cruised on ncl before and i asked a question i shouldnt be labelled ..this is a forum where people discuss cruise experience and maybe educate others about the cruise experience

[ohioNCLcruiser]

I was on the Pride of America last month and did not add a service fee to any individual bar tab. Also, I called NCL and they said this is still their policy.

 

You probably just passed up on the line with the auto tip..its right under the tax line or where the tax line would be if we were docked. It was def on it thats for sure though.

[psac]

so if i never cruised on ncl before and i asked a question i shouldnt be labelled ..this is a forum where people discuss cruise experience and maybe educate others about the cruise experience

 

 

I think it was the part about just eating in the buffets and skipping the dining rooms that got everyone going. It certainly made it seem like that was an excuse to not have to tip as much.

[sac2]

I think it was the part about just eating in the buffets and skipping the dining rooms that got everyone going. It certainly made it seem like that was an excuse to not have to tip as much.

 

I don't like to dress up that's why I didn't go the dining certainly dats my choice that's y I'm trying ncl and for your information on rcl I tipped the staff in dining room with the envolope put it like this I utilized all envelopes given to me so u need to mind ur business and fill in the blanks also -------- u piece of **** ....now see how u feel bout dat@&$@&$...u need to know also u just can't make assumptions about people u don't know..buzz off...also yes because the labelled envelopes were in the room I felt like I had to utilized them ..there is nothing wrong with the rcl way its just different u do respect differences in this world do u

[Thrifty]

newmexicoNita: I confuse easily and your post, "I beleive RCI/Celebrity is the only mass marketed line or one of them that hasn't gone to the daily auto charges. BTW, NCLs is the lowest as far as I know" has done it to me again. If by "daily auto charges" you mean auto-tipping from which a passenger can opt-out, I'd think you were probably right. But if you mean a fixed service charge from which the passenger can not opt-out or modify, I have been unable to find more than one other line that does it. If you know of more, I'd be grateful if you'd share your knowledge with us.

[newmexicoNita]

newmexicoNita: I confuse easily and your post, "I beleive RCI/Celebrity is the only mass marketed line or one of them that hasn't gone to the daily auto charges. BTW, NCLs is the lowest as far as I know" has done it to me again. If by "daily auto charges" you mean auto-tipping from which a passenger can opt-out, I'd think you were probably right. But if you mean a fixed service charge from which the passenger can not opt-out or modify, I have been unable to find more than one other line that does it. If you know of more, I'd be grateful if you'd share your knowledge with us.

I can assure you if you want to opt out of HAL or Princess you will need to give them a reason. Yes, in theory you are right as the other lines are still saying auto gratuities, but opting out isn't all that easy. With NCL you still can find a way not to participate, but you need to have a real reason. Why is this? Mostly this has been created by too many looking for reasons not to tip or certainly not to tip the $10.00. On our last Princess cruise we met a couple who had issues and didn't want to take part: I don't know what the outcome was, but I do know they were very upset as the people at the pursers desk were not cooperating with them. Thus regardless as to what you want to call it, most lines are working about the same.

 

Off the subject, but about the only thing NCL does very different from other lines and something that I hate is, the $15 corkage fee for any wine bought on board. This does annoy the hell out of me.

 

Nita

[Thrifty]

newmexicoNita: Do you see anything wrong with my suggestion that all of the passengers could be required to contribute the specified amount, no opt-outs, but they could designate a particular staff member with whom they were dissatisfied to be excluded from a share in their individual contribution with that amount to be redistributed to the others? The only staff members who would suffer would be those who had more than the average number of designations and only to the extent that they exceeded the average. "Freeriders" and the less satisfactory staff members wouldn't like it, but it seems to me everyone else would, especially passengers who would like to have a say in where their money goes. What do you think?

[Tammiko]

newmexicoNita: Do you see anything wrong with my suggestion that all of the passengers could be required to contribute the specified amount, no opt-outs, but they could designate a particular staff member with whom they were dissatisfied to be excluded from a share in their individual contribution with that amount to be redistributed to the others? The only staff members who would suffer would be those who had more than the average number of designations and only to the extent that they exceeded the average. "Freeriders" and the less satisfactory staff members wouldn't like it, but it seems to me everyone else would, especially passengers who would like to have a say in where their money goes. What do you think?

 

Just yesterday I probably would have thought that this was an excellent idea... might have believed that it would help people feel like they were able to control and make a difference... however look at what James just had in his blog about life working on a cruise ship.

 

My coworker was refreshing the breadson the buffet tonight when a guest came up and asked her if she had thisspecific type of bread. Mycoworker said “no but it will be ready in 15 minutes” and the guest said “okbut can you deliver it to my room?” and my coworker took down her informationand agreed. My coworker’s job isto stock the bread and the sushi station so this was way out of her jobdescription but she agreed happily. 15 minutes later the bread arrived and my coworker found a pretty metaltray and placed the bread on it with all types of toppings in little bowls fromolives, hummus, roasted red peppers and slices of cheese. She topped it off with a glass bowl inthe middle of diced tomatoes and a balsamic dip. She was really proud of thisexcellent looking dish and abandoned her station at the risk of getting introuble to go deliver this to the guest in her cabin. When she knocked on the cabin door the woman answered andsaid “you said it would be 15 minutes 20 minutes ago so I don’t want it” and slammed the door. My coworker hadto throw out the entire thing and you could tell her feelings were hurt.

 

So while I know that NONE OF US would ever behave in such a way... if that was available then who knows how many people would be slapped down (have their tips removed too) for reasons that are not even there? And would the purser have to take down every reason/story? The line ups would never end... people would be complaining about the length of time it takes to be able to complain! Eventually what happens is that the person who is docked is simply marked down as someone that 'did wrong' and 'upset' a customer to great lengths without even a story to back it. I wouldn't want to be a staff member in such a vulnerable position!

[cruizinwithkids]

Just yesterday I probably would have thought that this was an excellent idea... might have believed that it would help people feel like they were able to control and make a difference... however look at what James just had in his blog about life working on a cruise ship.

 

I have quoted that story before as I find it just disgusting. James had a complaint against him because they were out of coffee stirrers so he put out chopsticks. The woman actually reported it to his boss. I'm pretty sure I'd be telling the woman where she could put the coffee stirrers and the chopsticks.:)

 

I don't think I agree with Thrifty, but his/her suggestion did involve a trend and one idiot shouldn't have a big impact. I think my objection is really that MY pay isn't based on a bunch of people discussing what I'm doing. My boss knows what I do and to the best of her power pays me accordingly. I work for a non-profit so funds are always an issue.

[newmexicoNita]

newmexicoNita: Do you see anything wrong with my suggestion that all of the passengers could be required to contribute the specified amount, no opt-outs, but they could designate a particular staff member with whom they were dissatisfied to be excluded from a share in their individual contribution with that amount to be redistributed to the others? The only staff members who would suffer would be those who had more than the average number of designations and only to the extent that they exceeded the average. "Freeriders" and the less satisfactory staff members wouldn't like it, but it seems to me everyone else would, especially passengers who would like to have a say in where their money goes. What do you think?

IN theory (spelling) it sounds good, but I am not sure how well it would work in the real world. I do know or have been told, the best way to re-act to a less than satisfactory crew member is to complain to his/her superior or write the complaint on your comment card. They are read and if a crew member gets many complaints their contract will not be renewed. I think this might be better than your suggestion even though yours sounds good.

 

Nita

[Thrifty]

Perhaps in the interest of brevity, I sacrificed clarity.

If my suggestion were adopted, the complaining passenger would say nothing but, "I don't want Joe Smith to get any part of my contribution." No accusation, no re-enactment of the occurrence; just "It's my money and I don't want any of it to go to Joe Smith." The purser's assistant would not evaluate any complaint; he or she would just enter the passenger's name and Joe Smith's name in the computer and press Enter. The passenger would know his or her voice had been effectively heard, but in a limited way; no one's employment would be endangered.

If only one passenger negatively designated Joe Smith and the other staff had an average of one designation each, they would all get an equal share of the pool, including Joe Smith. On the other hand, if Joe Smith accumulated twenty designations and the others an average of one each, there would be no difficult management decision to make or to argue about; the passengers would have already made it and they were percipient witnesses to the staff/passenger interchange, not trying to evaluate it on the basis of some words on a comment card.

Of course, many passengers are arbitrary and capricious, but Joe Smith is not going to encounter twenty arbitrary and capricious passengers and the rest of the staff an average of only one each.

Most passengers are not going to undergo the stress of pressing a complaint while they're trying to enjoy a cruise unless the offense almost amounts to a crime. I don't think that should be the measure of cruise line service.

[salty dingo]

If my suggestion were adopted, the complaining passenger would say nothing but, "I don't want Joe Smith to get any part of my contribution."

 

Yep. That's how it is today. You fill out your comment card, and you name names.

 

Guess what Joe Smith gets when you fill out the comment card and rate him poorly?

 

If enough of your peers do the same, he gets a one-way ticket to Kuala Lumpur!

[Thrifty]

Sorry! I guess I still didn't make myself clear. No comment card, no rating Joe poorly, just I don't want to tip him.

[Cosmopolitan]

I have quoted that story before as I find it just disgusting. James had a complaint against him because they were out of coffee stirrers so he put out chopsticks. The woman actually reported it to his boss. I'm pretty sure I'd be telling the woman where she could put the coffee stirrers and the chopsticks.:)

 

I don't think I agree with Thrifty, but his/her suggestion did involve a trend and one idiot shouldn't have a big impact. I think my objection is really that MY pay isn't based on a bunch of people discussing what I'm doing. My boss knows what I do and to the best of her power pays me accordingly. I work for a non-profit so funds are always an issue.

 

Well, the chopsticks complainers must be the same passengers who complain about NCL when it rains at port and/or it is too hot at port.

Why are they always in my elevator:confused:

 

Tired of hearing them...bring your umbrella/sunscreen... move on and stop complaining:(

 

Cruizinwithkids...I agree, they can place those umbrellas and sunscreens where they should place their chopsticks.

 

I could NEVER handle these "petty" passengers on ONE cruise..God Bless the Staff:eek:

[sstamm]

Perhaps in the interest of brevity, I sacrificed clarity.

If my suggestion were adopted, the complaining passenger would say nothing but, "I don't want Joe Smith to get any part of my contribution." No accusation, no re-enactment of the occurrence; just "It's my money and I don't want any of it to go to Joe Smith." The purser's assistant would not evaluate any complaint; he or she would just enter the passenger's name and Joe Smith's name in the computer and press Enter. The passenger would know his or her voice had been effectively heard, but in a limited way; no one's employment would be endangered.

If only one passenger negatively designated Joe Smith and the other staff had an average of one designation each, they would all get an equal share of the pool, including Joe Smith. On the other hand, if Joe Smith accumulated twenty designations and the others an average of one each, there would be no difficult management decision to make or to argue about; the passengers would have already made it and they were percipient witnesses to the staff/passenger interchange, not trying to evaluate it on the basis of some words on a comment card.

Of course, many passengers are arbitrary and capricious, but Joe Smith is not going to encounter twenty arbitrary and capricious passengers and the rest of the staff an average of only one each.

Most passengers are not going to undergo the stress of pressing a complaint while they're trying to enjoy a cruise unless the offense almost amounts to a crime. I don't think that should be the measure of cruise line service.

 

While I agree with the principle of your idea, it seems to me that Joe Smith would be better off knowing what he did wrong. I mean, in most tipping situations other than a cruise, tipping occurs at the time of service. So someone receiving a poor tip knows what service they provided that resulted in that tip. (For the sake of this discussion, let's assume we're talking about the majority of people who tip based on service and are looking to reward those who provide good service. I'm not assuming anyone is just cheap and wants to avoid tips.)

 

So, with your scenario, Joe Smith doesn't really know why he is being excluded. Although I guess if Joe has enough exclusions, he should be able to figure it out?

 

Using this system, I agree that I would not want a purser questioning my comment or trying to talk me out of it. I would not want to get into a long, involved discussion about it. I'm ok with "It's my money and I don't want any of it to go to Joe Smith," but do you see any harm in providing Joe with your opinion on what he needs to improve?

 

I'm just trying to understand why your method specifically excludes giving any comment. What if you were able to enter it in a computer yourself, excluding Joe, indicating why, and you're sure your objection is entered? It it the interaction with someone who may judge the validity of the exclusion that you are looking to avoid?

[Thrifty]

sstamm: Thank you for a very thoughtful contribution to a discussion that occasionally draws hasty emotional responses.

As you suggested, I also guess that if Joe Smith draws a highly disproportionate number of designations, he is likely to have some idea why. Reading comment cards that give varying explanations is unlikely to do anything more than give him an opportunity to disagree with them one by one (I can imagine myself doing that), when the problem is more likely to be his general attitude. When he gets the disproportionate number of designations, he can then decide whether it is or is not worth it to him to try to be more like the other staff who don't get all those designations. Most of us have to make choices like that sometime in the course of our occupations.

Maybe it's a fault, but I've never submitted a negative comment card. I assumed, perhaps incorrectly, that it would either be disregarded or possibly have too serious an effect. (If I were a cruise line faced with about 5,000 comment cards from each ship every two weeks, I would recycle them as soon as the ship docked. Maybe that's why no one ever asked me to run a cruise line.) And I certainly don't want to send anyone back to Kuala Lumpur.

I think what many of us would like is a swift, sure, but very limited effect from our complaints. Even if we overreacted, we know it will take a lot of others to agree before it has any very significant effect.

I'm afraid that what we'll get instead is a rare staff member who will respond to an our complaints with a facial expression that says quite clearly, "I don't give a darn what you think." I have only experienced that once, with a crew member who didn't get tips anyway. I fear that staff members whose tips are guaranteed may be tempted to react the same way. I don't want that to happen to me again, even once, when I'm paying for a cruise.

Some would say I'm too sensitive, but I doubt that I'm the only one.