NEW TIP POLICY - Automatic Charge & "Alternate Service" tip

[ISABELLA]

I do not mind automated tip charges for personel who provided the services, but in general- DR management and housekeeping supervisors - they are salary employees. Unless they did something special for us during the cruise, I do not understand why they need to be tipped.

During our 11 days cruise we saw Head Waiter twice for 30 seconds and housekeeping supervisor - don't even know who it was, but we really liked our cabin steward and we tipped him extra.

[harz99]

Like you, we've no problem with auto-tipping. In fact, we've taken advantage of it on our last several cruises when offered by X as an option rather than as the norm it is soon to become, as well as on other cruise lines where auto-tipping is routine. Thus, I am curious (rather than troubled) about X's new "Alternative Service Personnel" charge and would love to know who exactly falls into that category. Personnel pax have never been asked to tip until now? Personnel pax routinely tip who may now be feeling the effects of the global recession, falling dollar, loss of pax to alternative dining venues? Service personnel in salaried positions? Just let me know who it is I'm being asked to tip and I'll do so gladly; but so far, no one in this thread has been able to explain who is covered under the rather generic heading of "ASP."

 

Well people; has anyone who is curious or vexed by the addition of this group of staff to the "auto tipping" list actually asked the Cruise Line for an explanation, rather than posting on the forums?

[Inshape]

Is there a choice? Can you remove it from the automatic charge and give them out in envelopes?

[LisaH]

Nobody is talking about wanting to act like the Lord and the Lady... but it is also crazy to think we should all be tipping everyone around the ship. It can't possibly happen. I don't have a problem tipping the people who wait on me... and I do. But... flame me here if you want... I don't feel like everyone shining the ship needs a tip from ME! I pay my fare... and I pay it for a clean ship... clean public areas... other aspects... and those that actually WAIT on me... I tip!!! Those that don't... don't.

 

I agree...I do not like mystery tips either and polishing the mirror or whatever is not something I feel I need to tip for. All of that should be included in the cruise pricing.

[spearmint]

Well people; has anyone who is curious or vexed by the addition of this group of staff to the "auto tipping" list actually asked the Cruise Line for an explanation, rather than posting on the forums?

 

Since this thread has been started, I have written via email to Celebrity to

(1) express my displeasure at the automatic addition to my seapass account (2) ask if the automatic addition can be cancelled after boarding and

(3) find out what the "additional staff deduction" means.

 

I have not received anything from Celebrity to date.

[woodofpine]

Since this thread has been started, I have written via email to Celebrity to

(1) express my displeasure at the automatic addition to my seapass account (2) ask if the automatic addition can be cancelled after boarding and

(3) find out what the "additional staff deduction" means.

 

I have not received anything from Celebrity to date.

 

 

The "Great Karnak" predicts the following response from Celebrity...

 

1) "So Sorry! We are stiffened and sorrowful for your displeasure";

2) "We stiffly acknowledge that it may be deducted";

3) "It means the additional stiffs - er, staff - that contribute to your displeasure."

 

;):D:D;)

[LisaH]

Bottom line I guess is to have them take off that $1.25 per person per day and tip anyone you feel gave you great service - over and above what you normall do. It is too bad to have to go through that hassle but at least it is recoverable if you don't want to pay it.

[woodofpine]

Bottom line I guess is to have them take off that $1.25 per person per day and tip anyone you feel gave you great service - over and above what you normall do. It is too bad to have to go through that hassle but at least it is recoverable if you don't want to pay it.

 

How true! $8.75 per week will buy another Grey Goose! If I don't see'em, f'm!

 

Happy cruising. :p

[Arwenmark]

I'm not too happy to hear about this. With the exception of one terrible room steward on our honeymoon, service has always been excellent and rewarded appropriately. But it was left to our discretion. Call a spade a spade and make it a service charge if you are going to insist that passengers pay a certain rate.

 

Personally, we like to give our staff a thank you card and let them know how much we appreciated their service. I'm not a big fan of the impersonality of the automatic gratuity. Yes, I know we could still give a card, but we all know that the staff is just looking for the cash generally so it wouldn't really be the same.

 

THese comments are not to the quoted person here, but to all the whiners. It does not matter if the cruise line calls it a service charge or auto tipping, because the complainers on these boards still think they should be able to take it off. Doesn't matter how many times they are told that it is mandatory UNLESS there is a darn good reason, doesn't matter how many times they are told that if they take off the auto tip/service charge and give cash that that cash MUST BE TURNED IN and goes into the pool, and if they DON'T take it off and give additional cash the person gets to keep it.

All those who say just raise the fare. UM, that is what they are doing, they are including a service charge IN YOUR FARE, and it is just as much a part of your fare as if you had a room rate of $1000 pp and you said no I don't want to pay $200 of it, take it off. Or maybe, I'll bring my own gas, take off some part of the fare that covers the fuel. and I don't mean fuel surcharge. Or I'll bring my own food take off a few hundred for that.

Tipping/service is a part of your fare, pay it and get over it. Or better yet stay home.

[nannie70]

Have been under the impression you are able to tip either way. On your daily bill or at the end. I have not been informed different. On the last cruise we received envelopes in our room on the last night just as before.

[Sky Sweet]

Do most people think that tipping at sea is different than tipping on land?

 

I am curious because on land I frequently tip the customary amount for very average service (comparable to auto tipping) and will only give less for service that is so poor that the person in question should lose their job.

[BurgerBits]

Do most people think that tipping at sea is different than tipping on land?

 

Can't speak for most ppl, but we certainly think it's different!!

 

In fact, we think it's SO different that we generally at minimum double the recommended amounts. We think the gratuities 'recommended' by the company are astoundingly low, and even at double rates, we're getting a great deal.

[woodofpine]

Accounting 101: Presently, gratuities are not 'booked' as cruise line 'revenue', nor is crew tip compensation booked as cruise line 'expense'. If the line formally puts crew on 'payroll' and adjusts fares then,

 

a) payroll expense on books mushroom, other related liabilities increase too;

b) if only the existing tip revenue is added to fares, then the unchanged net earnings (profit) decline as percent of overall revenue;

c) profit margin declines;

d) less profitable business suffers higher capital acquisition costs, ie. lenders charge higher interest rates to less profitable borrows (financing ships is expensive!)

 

Result: to maintain 'profitability' with crew on payroll, line must increase fares substantially more than $12-15 pp per diem. Ever notice that fares are significantly higher with gratuity inclusive lines...

 

Put another way, the gratuity compensation system keeps your fare a LOT lower than the gratuity. Hence the statement, until you pay the crew they are subsidizing your fare.

 

But - there are those who neither understand this business model nor want to (but naturally, they know a better way to handle this business). For them, its a lot easier to 'stick by principals' (say what? pray tell), and goodness it's tiring packing for disembarkation, what say you we have dinner in our cabin tonight... ;):p;)

[Sky Sweet]

"When tipping first caught on in the U.S., late in the 19th century, it was the old-world, aristocratic overtones of the practice that drew the most ire.

An 1897 editorial in the New York Times declared tipping to be the "vilest of imported vices." The paper lamented not only that "we have men among us servile enough to accept their earnings in this form" but that others were willing "to reward the servility."

Joining the chorus against "flunkyism," the Washington Post denounced tipping as "one of the most insidious and one of the most malignant evils" of modern life. Tipping was seen to foster a lord-and-vassal relationship that the prouder professions resisted.

Well into the 1910s many bartenders refused gratuities as an insult to their status."

[nothriver]

For my family of 3 the mysterious $1.25 amounts to $26.25, which in the scheme of things, isn't really worth worrying about. Normally I'm a penny pincher, but I'm always willing to tip. So, I'll gladly pay the auto tip and leave additional cash tips to the people that serve us well, notably the room seward and the waitstaff. I believe the staff on cruise ships are paid so very little, wherever my $26.25 winds up, I'm sure it will be appreciated even in the unlikely event that it is undeserved.

 

We are traveling with family and I've been afraid that our young family member with his own cabin might not not tip appropriately. I'm actually relieved with this new policy, because I'm able to make sure his tips are prepaid. I'm guessing I could have paid them regardless but this policy makes it easier for me.

[LeftcoastBC]

Thanks for the good read everybody.

On behalf of all the thousands of people that cruise and don't post and don't care I thank you.

Prepaying with an option to not, is so much easier and convenient than previous methods of tipping.

[GreenseyesM]

I'm going to throw a fly in the oitment here: recently we returned from the Solstice. I noticed that a HUGE amount of passengers were not American. I know from extensive experience with people from Europe (UK in particular) that they do not believe in tipping and often refuse to do it. With the dollar making it somewhat more reasonable for those using the Pound or the Euro to cruise perhaps autotiping is to make it a level field for all in taking care of the hardworking folks who care for us. That being said, I agree with the philosophy of some lines (Crystal I think) to pay the workers an adequate salary, add the cost on to the cost of the cruise and be done with it.

[jackdiamond]

How true! $8.75 per week will buy another Grey Goose! If I don't see'em, f'm!

 

Happy cruising. :p

I assume you mean one serving, not a bottle thereof.

[jackdiamond]

McCall and GreenseyesM-You are both right on the money. By the way, I believe that Regent also follows the procedure suggested by GreenseyesM.

[Napi's Mom]

"When tipping first caught on in the U.S., late in the 19th century, it was the old-world, aristocratic overtones of the practice that drew the most ire.

Yes this is the idea I get of some peoples attitude toward tipping...passing out the indulgences to the peasants...and why many wish to actually put these tips in their hands personally to play the Load of the Manor so to speak, rather than having them deducted so you don't actually "present" them to show how generous you are. I'm sure the crew are even more happy to KNOW they'll get their money if it's deducted,without feeling subservient to passengers. You can always "thank them personally" without the money changing hands for that "personal touch" many use as reason.

[warmwinds]

It has always been our experience that we hand the tips in the envelope on the last night, and then not see "our" waiters again (breakfast is usually catch as catch can on the last morning), so while we are always very generous they really don't know what we handed them until we are gone - could be $5, could be $500. We don't give it early or seek them out the next day so they can grovel and thank us for our generosity.

 

We plan on doing the auto tips this time, and then again giving envelopes with any (predicting) deserving extra on the last night in the same manner.

[lysolqn]

Yes this is the idea I get of some peoples attitude toward tipping...passing out the indulgences to the peasants...and why many wish to actually put these tips in their hands personally to play the Load of the Manor so to speak' date=' rather than having them deducted so you don't actually "present" them to show how generous you are. I'm sure the crew are even more happy to KNOW they'll get their money if it's deducted,without feeling subservient to passengers. You can always "thank them personally" without the money changing hands for that "personal touch" many use as reason.[/quote']

 

Prior to the new policy on X, those who pre-paid tips or opted for auto-tipping once onboard still received envelopes to give to dining room/cabin staff, but rather than cash, the envelopes contained pre-printed cards advising the recipients their tips were covered under auto-tip. Not sure whether X will continue giving out envelopes now that all pax will be covered by auto-tip but if they do, those who still wish to retain the "peronsal touch," play "Lord of the Manor" and "pass out indulgences to the peasants" will still have the opportunity to do so.

[C 2 C]

..for cruises after Jan 15, ..addition of an "Alternate Service" tip of $1.25/day. Also the tips will automatically be charged to your sea pass daily - with adjustments made on request.

 

Presently, gratuities are not 'booked' as cruise line 'revenue', nor is crew tip compensation booked as cruise line 'expense'.

 

Celebrity charges 3% for cash advances in the casino. Since the daily "tip" deductions have to be allotted to the correct recipients, could this be the cost to the cruiseline of handling the money that passengers previously handled. Is the "alternative service" for additional payroll and accounting staff?

 

I wish that Celebrity would just print right on the invoice that the anticipated amount will be charged as part of the cruise ticket even though the accounting slight of hand is meant keep the tips/wages off the books. I don't mind the "tips" going to the staff but I do think that tips=wages and should be noted as such on the invoice prior to sailing. If Celebrity is concerned that the recipients of the "gratuity" are being "stiffed" by passengers who don't "understand" tipping policy, then they should charge everyone up front. These hard working people put in long hours for their money and Celebrity should make sure they get it.

 

 

 

[woodofpine]

Celebrity charges 3% for cash advances in the casino. Since the daily "tip" deductions have to be allotted to the correct recipients, could this be the cost to the cruiseline of handling the money that passengers previously handled. Is the "alternative service" for additional payroll and accounting staff?

 

I wish that Celebrity would just print right on the invoice that the anticipated amount will be charged as part of the cruise ticket even though the accounting slight of hand is meant keep the tips/wages off the books. I don't mind the "tips" going to the staff but I do think that tips=wages and should be noted as such on the invoice prior to sailing. If Celebrity is concerned that the recipients of the "gratuity" are being "stiffed" by passengers who don't "understand" tipping policy, then they should charge everyone up front. These hard working people put in long hours for their money and Celebrity should make sure they get it.

 

 

I'm absolutely NOT looking to 'connect the dots' or compare service levels or much of anything else (because I don't think they connect); but your suggested method - mandatory service charge - is how NCL does it (as I understand it; never been there). I think service quality has everything to do with staff hiring, training, and oversight, response to comment cards, etc., and little if anything to do with compensation accountancy and disbursement.

[Sky Sweet]

It may be difficult to get use to something new, but the concept of auto tipping is not unique to Celebrity.

 

Holland America has been doing it for a while now, and Royal Caribbean requires a passenger to prepay their tips if they choose the anytime dining option.

 

Most restaurants automatically add tips, that can't be reduced, to the bill if more than a certain number of people are dining together, and quotes for banquet style dinners are usually price of food plus required tips.

 

Some resorts also include all tips in their basic fee.