Denali: TWT Tour versus shuttle buses? Pros and cons; time of day

[barbh2]

Have read that shuttle buses in Denali Park are a good less expensive choice than the TWT tour.

 

Want to be sure that by opting for the shuttle bus we are not missing anything important (other than an included lunch).

 

What are the differences between the shuttle buses and TWT?

For example does the TWT include commentary by a tour guide not available on the shuttle buses, etc?

 

Also, will probably need to drive to Denali from Fairbanks in the morning and take the tour or shuttle in the afternoon. Is this a significant problem compared with a tour/shuttle that starts in the morning?

[SeaDawg]

IMO, the shuttle is the best option for the money. Here are some of the differences:

 

• The tour use the same lightweight buses as the shuttle but are a little more comfortable.
  
• Tour buses have planned narration. The shuttle does not but the drivers have been known to share their knowledge of the region.
  
• Shuttle buses run frequently all day. Tour buses do not.
  
• The shuttle will let you off and on. Tour buses do not.
  
• Tour buses provide a snack. The shuttle does not.
  

HTH

[Budget Queen]

The tour buses also mostly, now have a video type camera and tv screens. This has absolutely no interest for me, since I want my viewing out a window. :) But for those who want to sit back and not bother looking too hard, and definately ones who do NOT take binoculars, this will allow some "viewing".

 

But if a tour bus is stopped along the Park Road, so is EVERY other bus going by. AND they all view the same stuff. In my opinion, farther is what will offer you the most scenery and wildlife, all about distance. Many times on shuttle buses, you have a "different" type of passenger- you are told at the start, to be on the look out, where on tour buses, you may not have this. All you do on the shuttle buses is yell "stop" and the bus does. :)

 

I am on first morning buses. IF going in July, an afternoon bus, is going to have the better wildlife viewing probably on the return. Only you can decide, what you book, but in my opinion, the shuttle buses are the only way to go, and the best bargain in all of Alaska. :)

[Manzy154]

In Mid July how hard is it to get back on shuttles once you have gotten off. Is it a long wait? Can you get stranded late in the day?

[SeaDawg]

In Mid July how hard is it to get back on shuttles once you have gotten off. Is it a long wait? Can you get stranded late in the day?

 

Late in the day, when everyone is trying to leave, you may have to wait if you've gotten off the shuttle and want to get back on. But you're on vacation so relax and enjoy the magnificent scenery.

 

You may want to take the earliest shuttle possible into the park and return around mid-afternoon if waiting is a concern.

[Budget Queen]

In Mid July how hard is it to get back on shuttles once you have gotten off. Is it a long wait? Can you get stranded late in the day?

 

If you get off before Eielson, I recommend getting off shuttle buses on the return anyway, you have also the returning Wonder Lake buses for seats. It will be a matter of returning to the road and flaging down buses as they pass. Many times they can tell you what will be available to you, if they are full. No you aren't going to get stranded in Denali IF you are on the road.

[wolfie11]

In Mid July how hard is it to get back on shuttles once you have gotten off. Is it a long wait? Can you get stranded late in the day?

 

The time most people get "stuck" is mid-afternoon, as most morning shuttles go out packed and those people don't get off. Those are returning between about 2 and 4 pm. After that the shuttles are usually pretty empty. There is a late shuttle that come back from Kantishna in the evening that does the "sweep" to make sure everyone has been picked up.

[wolfie11]

double post

[lpmh919]

We had the same original question. So this board has been helpful to us, as well :) It is sounding like the shuttle is the way to go over the TWT. I was in Denali about 7 years ago and backpacked/tented a few nights in the park near the Savage River/Teklanika River area. It was amazing!! We hiked to the peak of a mountain ridge (I can't remember the name) and tented at the peak overnight in tundra. Bad idea! We froze. I woke up after only a few hours of freezing sleep and my water was frozen solid. But the Dall Sheep were all around us, very close and NO mosquitos that high up.

One our shuttle, we saw Grizzlies (about 8 of them), Caribou, Moose, Dall Sheep.... We didn't go back further then Eielson Visitor Center, but this year I want to go all the way to the back.

 

Is it worth the trip to go all the way back to Wonder Lake? What are good points to get out at and wait for another bus? Thanks, all opinions are helpful!! :)

[PennyAgain]

The good points about getting off the shuttle bus and going along on your own for a while.....

 

peace and quiet once the bus is away

 

chance to experience being truly alone (rare in modern life)

 

walking along a trail for a while

 

wondering where the bears are

 

wondering where the moose are

 

just being there.

[SEPyle]

TWT vs Shuttle bus: Every year this question comes up and of course we all have opinions and often feel our way is the only way: NOT!

 

In my opinion, it all depends on the driver/particular day/and of course the farther you go the better!

 

We have done both: The first time was in very late May 2005. We had an afternoon tour (Tundra Wilderness Tour). I have since learned (and a value of these boards) in general; morning is better! We did see wildlife on the TWT but I have to say our driver was fantastic. The more experienced drivers are assigned to TWT tours and the ones with less experience to shuttle busses. Maybe it was the luck of the draw, but his passion of the park, both of wildlife and geology was incredible! Our driver on the shuttle bus was very nice, but his expertise seemed to be a little story of each place people who came on the bus came from. His humor was great, but I didn't come to hear his humor or where people were from. Was it a bad tour...Not at all. It was a morning tour and we saw more bear and even a wolf! Actually the only thing we didn't see was a moose! So in my opionion...and of course only MY opinion...a morning tour is best...and as to shuttle vs TWT...both are great experiences!

 

Actually here's what I consider the bottom line: What bothers me is when people say they are going on the TWT and people who prefer the shuttle busses tell them they are wasting their money and will be experiencing a "less than" experience on the Tundra Wilderness Tour! I do say the Natural History Tour is a "less than" and have people say the day they went people on that tour saw more wildlife than people on the longer tours...so it boils down to the day you go and the animals that show up...afterall, it's nature; not a zoo!

 

Go, enjoy...and count the days till you can go back again! I sure wish I was going this year!!!!

[PennyAgain]

Every word true and very well said. Thank you!

[frugaltravel]

The more experienced drivers are assigned to TWT tours and the ones with less experience to shuttle busses.

 

This is untrue. Some of the shuttle, and especially camper bus drivers are some of the most experienced in the park. The more seniority they have, the easier it is for them to get the routes they bid on. Some of the more experienced drivers like the shuttle buses better than the TWT and so they drive those. Just like there is no "right" answer as to whether the TWT or a shuttle bus is "best", there is no general statement that is true about which buses have the more experienced drivers. Sorry, your information is wrong.

[wolfie11]

Frugaltravel is correct. The most inexperienced drivers usually end up with the frontcountry shuttles (Riley Creek Loop, Savage River) and the DNHT. The most experienced drivers usually want to drive the shuttles or the camper bus. Many of the TWT drivers are excellent and they enjoy either giving a more formal presentation of the park or the extra money they make on the TWT, where tips are higher (or both). The shuttle drivers can be somewhat hit or miss as to their narration, but most of them are also very good.

 

Also, if you take the shuttle and your driver does a good job, a tip is not unwelcome!

[MercedMike]

The tour buses also mostly, now have a video type camera and tv screens. This has absolutely no interest for me, since I want my viewing out a window. :) But for those who want to sit back and not bother looking too hard, and definately ones who do NOT take binoculars, this will allow some "viewing".

 

 

Yep, that is ME! Frankly, on our TWT, we would have spent the whole day playing, "What's that little dot on the hillside?" if it were not for the 100X video screen in the tour bus. For me, it certainly made all the difference.

 

Check out some of my TV screen pictures at

http://www.bully4.us/ct3.html

 

Also, if you like, the driver will sell you the DVD after the tour! ;o)

[CruisingGoddess]

The good points about getting off the shuttle bus and going along on your own for a while.....

 

peace and quiet once the bus is away

 

chance to experience being truly alone (rare in modern life)

 

walking along a trail for a while

 

wondering where the bears are

 

wondering where the moose are

 

just being there.

 

We are not really outdoorsy people so I was not planning to get off the shuttle other than for bathroom breaks and at Eielson Visitor's Center. Do you think we'd be missing out on a lot if we don't get off? If so, where do you recommend we get off? I'm just worried about walking around by ourselves and then getting on another shuttle.

[frugaltravel]

We are not really outdoorsy people so I was not planning to get off the shuttle other than for bathroom breaks and at Eielson Visitor's Center. Do you think we'd be missing out on a lot if we don't get off? If so, where do you recommend we get off? I'm just worried about walking around by ourselves and then getting on another shuttle.

 

Personally, yes, I think you would be missing something. But 98% of the shuttle bus passengers never get off. Easy to get another bus actually, especially only for 2. And I never get comments from others when I get off. In fact, on one bus last year the driver encouraged people to get off and quite a few didn't take the same bus back.

 

Another reason why I feel lining up 45 minutes early for the bus is not always wisest. If you hop off the bus, you get whatever seats are left for the next part of the journey. Getting off and on, seeing wildlife, hiking, etc are a higher priority than a certain seat on a bus!

[PennyAgain]

I think I get comments because I am an older woman who may look a little lost.

 

Getting down off the shuttle isn't for everyone, but it is also something not to worry about.

[agabbymama]

After seeing a bear on the road right beside the bus, and a herd of about 50 caribou racing across the road right in front of the bus, I had no interest what so ever of getting off that bus. Even at the restroom stops, I was off the bus and back on quickly. I think most visitors to Alaska are not used to the wilds. I know I'm not. I have been camping in the mountains here in California, but Alaska is a true wilderness. If you aren't prepared, bad things could happen.

 

And I also liked the video camera on the TWT bus. We saw lots of animals up close and personal, but there were also Dall sheep on the mountain side

that would have been dots without the zoom.

 

After reading on this site that the morning tours are the best, I was very disappointed that we were given a 2:30 pm slot. We actually entered the park at about 3:00. We saw lots of bear, moose, 1 golden eagle, 1 lone caribou, and 1 lone prairie dog on the way in. On the way out, we again saw bear, Dall sheep, and heard of about 50 caribou and thousands of rabbits. We returned to the lodge at 11:00 pm and we were some tired puppies, but the experience was definitely worth it.

[CruisingGoddess]

frugaltravel & PennyAgain - When would you recommend that we get off the bus? Do you have any favorite hikes along the Eielson shuttle route?

[frugaltravel]

frugaltravel & PennyAgain - When would you recommend that we get off the bus? Do you have any favorite hikes along the Eielson shuttle route?

 

How long of a hike? Highway Pass (about Mile 55?) is nice. Stony Dome/Stony Hill area (mile 62) is nice too. Both have open tundra so it is easy to keep an eye out for bears. Getting off at Toklat and walking south along the riverbed is nice too - can go as long as you want and return the same way. Thoro Pass (about mile 64?) is nice and walk toward Eielson on the north (right side on the way to Eielson) side of the road - just climb up a bit to the bench and walk along the ridge. Great views of the Mountain if out then pick up a bus at Eielson for the return to the entrance.

[PennyAgain]

Here is a good write up. http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowTopic-g143022-i1271-k3604103-Best_Hikes_in_Denali_for_views-Denali_National_Park_and_Preserve_Alaska.html

[frugaltravel]

Here is a good write up. http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowTopic-g143022-i1271-k3604103-Best_Hikes_in_Denali_for_views-Denali_National_Park_and_Preserve_Alaska.html

 

That is good but these are even better too:

 

http://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g143022-c116883/Denali-National-Park-And-Preserve:Alaska:Take.A.Hike..html

 

http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g28923-i349-k3006519-l19635706-Tattler_Creek_and_Sable_Mountain-Alaska.html

 

For non-cruise questions, TA is top notch.

[PennyAgain]

I have a really old printed on paper map that is a great thing to have. I got it from the Park Service at the Visitor's Center. My iPhone doesn't give me much help in Denali. Here's a handy list:http://www.denaliguidebook.com/dayhike_comparison_table.htm

[frugaltravel]

Here's a handy list:http://www.denaliguidebook.com/dayhike_comparison_table.htm

 

That is from Ike Waits' excellent guidebook of the same name. Anyone interested in more than a simple short day hike in Denali would be wise to buy his book.