A reporter's view regarding compensation

[DocJohnB]

In the St. Petersburg (FL) Times, there is a consumer column written by a lady named Nancy Paradis.

 

In today's column she tackled a "request for compensation for an altered cruise" I found her response interesting as it was (as her columns are) a dispassionate, "mediators" view. Also because the response from RCI is from a "named" source who appears to be up the food chain a bit

 

Here is the link.

 

http://www.sptimes.com/2004/05/06/Action/Cruise_to_Bermuda_too.shtml

 

 

 

Until we sail on SUMMIT for 10 nights

 

 

Roll Call Summit 11/05/2004 click here

 

 

 

Until MOAGC's on Explorer of the Seas

 

 

 

Seven Cruises last Century, then:

 

Norwegian Sky 2000 GGC2000

Volendam 2001 GGC2001

Paradise 2001

Sensation 2002 GGC2002

Millenium 2003 (Nov 16)

Mariner OTS 2004 (Feb 29)

Summit 2004 (Nov 05)

Explorer OTS 2005 (Jan 09)

[cabostleda]

Personally I think RCI's response was perfectly valid.

[DocJohnB]

cabostleda,

 

As do I. Usually what we get on the boards is an unnamed source, or a CSR's response.

 

 

 

 

Until we sail on SUMMIT for 10 nights

 

 

Roll Call Summit 11/05/2004 click here

 

 

 

Until MOAGC's on Explorer of the Seas

 

 

 

Seven Cruises last Century, then:

 

Norwegian Sky 2000 GGC2000

Volendam 2001 GGC2001

Paradise 2001

Sensation 2002 GGC2002

Millenium 2003 (Nov 16)

Mariner OTS 2004 (Feb 29)

Summit 2004 (Nov 05)

Explorer OTS 2005 (Jan 09)

[Rustynail]

Right or wrong unfortunately that is the current policy of all cruise lines. You really do need to read the fineprint on your contract to understand what you have agreed to.

 

I hope this doesn't ever happen to me (especially since I already live in Canada and want sun and warmth!) but if it does I'll be disappointed but will make the best of a bad situation.

 

Would I rather cruise to a beautiful country or risk our lives cruising into really bad weather? No brainer there.

 

Rusty

 

CARRIBEAN PRINCESS JAN 2005

<IMG

Roll Call.... click here to join the fun!

</applet>

CARNIVAL'S LEGEND JAN 2003

CELEBRITY'S CENTURY DEC 2003

 

 

[hdawson]

Excellent response from Royal Caribbean.

[Chicagomom]

Personally, I think RCI's response was totally inadequate. If I'm planning a trip to the warm Caribbean and they send me to cold Canada, it would be like being told you're being sent on vacation and then getting sent to Siberia. No comparison!

 

And the ports are the reason to get on the ship in the first place, not the ship itself. Naturally the ship is a big drawing card, but this person should definitely have been offered an alternative to a WARM location. I doubt that the hurricane hit every island in the Caribbean.

 

He's just handing out the party line--I'm not biting.

 

'til Enchantment of the Seas cruise!!!

 

[hdawson]

Chicagomom. Hurricanes of course are very unpredictable. They can reverese course and reform very quickly. Having said that, have you looked at a map to see just how far the Caribbean is from Bermuda? It is a long way and would require quite a few additional sea days just to get there. BTW. In four cruises on Royal Caribbean and four on Celebrity, I've never seen dirty public areas or bathrooms.

[Rustynail]

chicagomom,

 

What a ridiculous post. Firstly comparing Canada to Siberia is not only insulting but darn right ignorant. Perhaps if you've ever studied georgraphy you'd realize that most of Canada's climate is more similar to Chicago's then Siberia's.

 

Secondly, "I doubt that the hurricane hit every island in the Caribbean". You have to be kidding right?? Is it your expectation that the Captain sails around and in-between the storms?

Unbelievable.

 

Lastly, it's people like you who don't take the time to read and understand the contract you sign but are the first to kick up a fuss and complain until your blue in the face.

 

If you don't like the possibility of an itinerary change my suggestion would be to only book land vacations in the future.

 

Rusty

 

CARRIBEAN PRINCESS JAN 2005

<IMG

Roll Call.... click here to join the fun!

</applet>

CARNIVAL'S LEGEND JAN 2003

CELEBRITY'S CENTURY DEC 2003

 

 

[hdawson]

BTW. Bermuda is east of North Carolina. The Caribbean is from Cuba south.

[Catnip]

Chicagomom,

I agree with Rusty Nail. There is no other place a ship can get to on a 7-day cruise out of New York other than the New England/Canada area. It would take too many extra days for the ship to cruise all the way down to the Bahamas or the Caribbean.

I would think being on a cruise (no matter where to) would be fabulous, and even though the itinerary had changed, I would go and make the best of it!

One year I was on a Panama Canal cruise and the weather was so bad on the day we were to make the partial transit, the Captain decided it was unsafe to try it. The ship turned around and we had an extra day at sea. Lots of people were mad, but it was for the safety of the ship as well as the passengers. We got over our disappointment and had a great day at sea. The next year, we did the Canal again and this time got to go though!

 

(26 prior cruises & 2 flights on Concorde)

 

It has been said that angels, while on Earth,

aren't allowed to show their wings,

but nothing was ever said

about not showing their whiskers. <^..^>

 

 

[justcruzin85374]

I agree with Rusty.

 

We plan, we save, we make all arrangements and get ready to leave and bam....Mother Nature has other idea's. No getting around it, RCI did the right thing. I'd rather be on the ship than not at all.

 

Soveriegn 92 E. Caribbean

Majesty 95 W. Caribbean

Granduer 97 E. Caribbean

Rhapsody 00 Mexico

Vision 02 Alaska

Radiance 03 Panama Canal

Brilliance 3/29/04

 

 

 

Radiance of the Seas/Panama Canal 10/18/2003

Are we there yet?

 

My bags are always packed!

Brilliance 3/29/2004

[springtxbill]

As was stated in the article, had the person bought thr Cruise Care insurance, they could have cancelled on the last day when they found out about Canada and received a 75% credit for a future booking. BUY THE INSURANCE!!!

 

Bill D

 

RCCL Song of Norway 7/79?

CCL ? 12/84

RCCL Viking Serenade 7/01

RCCL Rhapsody of the Seas 12/01

RCCL Sovereign of the Seas 5/02

RCCL Monarch of the Seas 7/02

RCCL Rhapsody of the Seas 12/02

Princess Grand Princess 6/03

RCCL Voyager of the Seas 12/03

RCCL Vision of the Seas 3/04

 

 Rhapsody of the Seas 5/30/2004

 

 Empress of the Seas 12/20/2004

 

[hstrybuf]

I also agree that RCI did the right thing in this situation. Just because this person/family had been to Canada before should have no bearing on the cruiseline's choice of where to sail - safely! Obviously they didn't read the contract or buy the insurance. Their loss!

 

 

Navigator OTS 10/04

Legend 04/04

Grand Princess 09/03

Dawn Princess 01/03

Enchantment OTS 10/02

Destiny 01/02

Sensation 08/99

[hdawson]

Could someone forward this thread to the reporter? I think she has only considered one position.

[cabostleda]

I don't think this is an issue of not reading the contract properly, most people know the line has a right to do this but for some reason think that they deserve special treatment or compensation.

[DocJohnB]

I did. Thought she would enjoy the discussion.

 

I am not quite sure I understand your last sentence though. Would you elaborate?

 

 

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hdawson:

Could someone forward this thread to the reporter? I think she has only considered one position.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

 

 

Until we sail on SUMMIT for 10 nights

 

 

Roll Call Summit 11/05/2004 click here

 

 

 

Until MOAGC's on Explorer of the Seas

 

 

 

Seven Cruises last Century, then:

 

Norwegian Sky 2000 GGC2000

Volendam 2001 GGC2001

Paradise 2001

Sensation 2002 GGC2002

Millenium 2003 (Nov 16)

Mariner OTS 2004 (Feb 29)

Summit 2004 (Nov 05)

Explorer OTS 2005 (Jan 09)

[bythehex]

Okay, here's my two cents - I agree that unless you have cruise insurance you're at the mercy of the cruise company if there is a change in the itinerary at the last minute. I also understand that when a last minute thing happens such as a hurricane, which is unpredictable, the cruise company has to redirect ships to whichever ports will accept that ship. Their first responsibility is for the safety of their passengers and crew.

 

HOWEVER, that being said, a poster who said cruises that leave from NY have no place else to go other than Canada is incorrect. The Norwegian Dawn leaves from NY and goes to Florida & the Bahamas. Doesn't RCI have ports in Florida? Coco Cay? Would it have been totally impossible to redirect in a Southern route? Maybe they couldn't work that out on such short notice, we don't know. But those would be the kind of questions that are more appropriate to ask RCI.

 

Anyway, this is one more lesson on why cruise insurance is so important!!

 

Sharon

 

[madforcruising]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bythehex:

Okay, here's my two cents - I agree that unless you have cruise insurance you're at the mercy of the cruise company if there is a change in the itinerary at the last minute. I also understand that when a last minute thing happens such as a hurricane, which is unpredictable, the cruise company has to redirect ships to whichever ports will accept that ship. Their first responsibility is for the safety of their passengers and crew.

 

HOWEVER, that being said, a poster who said cruises that leave from NY have no place else to go other than Canada is incorrect. The Norwegian Dawn leaves from NY and goes to Florida & the Bahamas. Doesn't RCI have ports in Florida? Coco Cay? Would it have been totally impossible to redirect in a Southern route? Maybe they couldn't work that out on such short notice, we don't know. But those would be the kind of questions that are more appropriate to ask RCI.

 

Anyway, this is one more lesson on why cruise insurance is so important!!

 

Sharon

 

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

I agree with you Sharon,

this could have been another choice but as you stated RCCL might have their reasons to do the Canada itinerary.

But I think also there may have been people on the ship that already have been to Florida and the Bahamas too. So they would have had the same complaints as the people that have been to Canada.

So I think they can´t do it right to everyone.

In my eyes the response from RCCL is OK and no way for any compensation (OK may be a free drink - Hot tea against the cold ) but thats the maximum they should do.

 

First pics of the undocking of the Jewel of the Seas:

http://community.webshots.com/album/125049819TVWuuS

 

Jewel of the Seas left Meyerwerft Shipyard

See Photos of River Ems passage

http://community.webshots.com/album/131001309cIkOdH

Jewel of the Seas - 05/28/04 Scandinavia / Russia / Baltic

 

Jewel of the Seas - 09/28/04 Canada / New England

 

 

09/2003 - Legend of the Seas Hawaii

06/2003 - Norwegian Dawn Florida and Bahamas

2002 - MS Columbus - Cruise to nowhere

2001 - Grandeur of the Seas Mediterranean and Transatlantic

2000 - Splendour of the Seas Transatlantic

2000 - Viking Star on the Danube River

1999 - Vision of the Seas Panamacanal cruise

1998 - Vision of the Seas Transatlantic

1997 - Crystal Symphonie to Mexican Riviera

1996 - Delta Queen on the Mississippi

1995 - Legend of the Seas to Alaska

[Mark_K]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bythehex:

HOWEVER, that being said, a poster who said cruises that leave from NY have no place else to go other than Canada is incorrect. The Norwegian Dawn leaves from NY and goes to Florida & the Bahamas. Doesn't RCI have ports in Florida? Coco Cay? Would it have been totally impossible to redirect in a Southern route? Maybe they couldn't work that out on such short notice, we don't know. But those would be the kind of questions that are more appropriate to ask RCI.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>At the time they were deciding what to do with this sailing TS Henri was off the east coast of Florida, and Hurricane Isabel was in the Atlantic heading west. I don't think a southerly route was a viable option at that time.

 

----------------------------------------------------------

 

"Nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits" Mark Twain

 

"Nothing so needs reforming as other people's formal night attire, poolside attire, child rearing practices, walk-talkie usage, chair hogging, seat saving, line cutting ..." Mark_K

[superjerryw]

Sorry, but I do not agree that RCCL did the right thing in this case. I perfectly understand the need to alter an itinerary due to weather problems for the safety of the passengers. However, substituting Canada for Bermuda is not a change in intinerary, it is a completely different itinerary. People that book a cruise to Bermuda do not want to go to Canada or they would have booked a cruise to Canada. RCCL should have given passengers the option to back out with out penalty. As to the fine print in the contract, what contract are we referring to? Is it the contract that you get after you have made final payment so if you disagree with the terms you can't change your mind without penalty anyway. As for having insurance, even that would not have been sufficient in this instance. If the passengers had RCCL insurance and decided not to go they would have been given credit for 75% of what they paid. Not 100% credit and not a refund, just a partial credit they could only use on another RCCL cruise. I think RCCL really missed the boat on this one. For those people that say the ports don't matter, do you really book a cruise without considering where the ship stops, I doubt it very much. If you booked a cruise to Alaska and they sent you to Mexico instead I am sure you would be very upset.

 

 

Donuts, is there anything they can't do....

[DocJohnB]

Sorry SuperJerryW,

 

I have to disagree with you here. When you wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>However, substituting Canada for Bermuda is not a change in intinerary, it is a completely different itinerary. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

You are merely playing with words (or a word). It is indeed a change in itinerary. Period. Is it a completetly different itinerary, yes it is (except for embark/disembark), but bottom line it is a change in itinerary.

 

We on these boards go back over and over again (sometimes ad nauseum) about the safety of buying insurance. Putting aside RCI's insurance program, there are other programs that would have negated (or at least lessened) this incident for the cruiser. She chose not to purchase insurance. Her problem, plain and simple.

 

Let's talk about the "terms of contract". Those same terms are listed in each and every cruise brochure I have read (and I always look over the cruise brochure before I buy into a cruise). So, if one is "surprised" to find these conditions for the first time on their cruise documents, they plain just didn't do their homework.

 

People buying cruises should be somewhat intelligent (one would hope) adults (one would suppose). If they get caught up in the "fine print", sorry, IMO, it is their fault.

 

Have I always read the "fine print" - absolutely not, have I ever been burnt for not doing so - absolutely. But the fault lay squarely on my shoulders.

 

People really need to buy into the theory of personal responsibility. Unfortunately too many people do not and find it easier to blame someone/thing other than themselves for problems they could have avoided.

 

You wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>do you really book a cruise without considering where the ship stops, I doubt it very much <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>. Please don't doubt it. It happens. I spent a major part of my younger days at sea and in foreign ports. So I have been there, done that. When I sail on my next Caribbean cruise, it will be the 14th time, so once again, been there, done that. Ports really make no difference to me. It is the ship, the sea, and the ambience I experience while cruising that brings me back. I know there are many, many more cruisers out there that feel as I do.

 

Finally, you wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>If you booked a cruise to Alaska and they sent you to Mexico instead I am sure you would be very upset.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Of course I would be upset, but having said all the above, I would either collect my insurance money for the change or I would enjoy what I was being offered.

 

A good thing about this board is that we can agree to disagree

 

 

 

Until we sail on SUMMIT for 10 nights

 

 

Roll Call Summit 11/05/2004 click here

 

 

 

Until MOAGC's on Explorer of the Seas

 

 

 

Seven Cruises last Century, then:

 

Norwegian Sky 2000 GGC2000

Volendam 2001 GGC2001

Paradise 2001

Sensation 2002 GGC2002

Millenium 2003 (Nov 16)

Mariner OTS 2004 (Feb 29)

Summit 2004 (Nov 05)

Explorer OTS 2005 (Jan 09)

 

[This message was edited by DocJohnB on 05-06-04 at 04:17 PM.]

[lunyma]

All well said, John... BTW.. How is Kathy doing??? email me!

 

Pam : )

Emerald Seas 6/20/83

Nordic Empress 6/93

Imagination 3/30/00

Ecstasy 9/4/00

Majesty of the Seas 10/27/00

Triumph 12/16/00

Radiance of the Seas

3/26/01 & 3/29/01

Crown Odyssey 6/24/01

Golden Princess 10/11/01

Spirit 11/11/01

Sensation GGC 1/13/02

Sovereign of the Seas 3/24/02

Imagination 5/18/02

Pride 11/2/02

Explorer of the Seas 3/29/03

Enchantment of the Seas 9/1/03

Serenade of the Seas 10/28/03

Grand Princess 11/16/03

 

check out my pics at http://community.webshots.com/user/lunyma

[creempuff0530]

I was reading this and just had to add a little to it. YES the cruise line has the right to change the itinerary for whatever the reason and YES they can change it to whatever they decide. Having said that, I think what some people are trying to say is that when you are expecting to go on a warm and tropical cruise and get rerouted to somewhere that is well, not tropical, people might be mad about it.

[DUBIDUB2]

Firstly I agree with RCI response.

 

Secondly, it's part of the contract. PERIOD. What other contracts do you dispute when you don't get your own way ?

 

Third. They cannot give in to people who do not buy insurance otherwise NO one will buy insurance, would they.

 

fourth, RCI has no choice really. All of there ships are mostly full or already had a schedule. Lets say, if this person is complaining is a fair person then she would agree, all the other 3000 passengers should be compensated. But RCL can't pull another ship out of the hat like you could an Airplane say if you were Delta and had a spare lying around....

 

She sounds like a person who throws her toys out of her prame when she doesn't get her own way

 

 

 

<applet codebase="http://*************/java-sys" height="25" width="203" code="countdown.class">

<PARAM NAME="font" VALUE="lcdb0"><PARAM NAME="month" VALUE="4"><PARAM NAME="hour" VALUE="17"><PARAM NAME="year" VALUE="2005"><PARAM NAME="day" VALUE="03">

 

 

 

</applet>

RCCL - Mariner (April 3rd 2005) - Click here for April 3rd 2005 Mariner Roll Call

Princess - Golden (April 3rd 2004)

RCCL - Navigator (June 2003)

RCCL - Explorer (April 2002)

RCCL - Voyager (June 2001)

Carnival - Paradise (Dec/Jan 1999/2000 Millenium Cruise)

Big Red Boat (1997)

[DocJohnB]

Pam,

 

I don't have your email (comp crash). Quick send me one at usnretdocb@yahoo.com This is my backup and I will get back to you immediately.

 

J.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lunyma:

All well said, John... BTW.. How is Kathy doing??? email me!

 

Pam : )

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

 

 

Until we sail on SUMMIT for 10 nights

 

 

Roll Call Summit 11/05/2004 click here

 

 

 

Until MOAGC's on Explorer of the Seas

 

 

 

Seven Cruises last Century, then:

 

Norwegian Sky 2000 GGC2000

Volendam 2001 GGC2001

Paradise 2001

Sensation 2002 GGC2002

Millenium 2003 (Nov 16)

Mariner OTS 2004 (Feb 29)

Summit 2004 (Nov 05)

Explorer OTS 2005 (Jan 09)