Selbourne

Cruise ships and buffets are inextricably linked, so I can’t see them going. Whatever people choose to call them, buffets are not for me. It’s not about the food, as that’s fine. When dining on a holiday, I want to be shown to a table and have waiter service. I don’t want to stand in a queue, witnessing some less than hygienic habits of some fellow guests, and then have to search for a table. As my wife is in a wheelchair I have to do that for two, which is doubly unpleasant. The ambiance doesn’t fit with my idea of a relaxing meal either. For all these reasons, I wouldn’t book a hotel that relied solely on buffets for lunch or dinner either.

Well done. That’s a brilliant result. It’s very encouraging to hear that even those of us needing an accessible cabin might have a chance with a last minute booking. We are on a wait list for an accessible balcony cabin for the 16 night Aurora cruise in May. I fear that our chances are nil.

Butlers were always way down at the bottom of the reasons that we booked suites. First reason was the extra space and location (e.g. aft corner wrap balconies) and the second reason was being able to have breakfast in Epicurean. Priority boarding was also great, as this was in the days before we qualified as a matter of course due to loyalty status. We must have been very unlucky with the Butlers we’ve had. Only 2 out of 6 were good. 3 did the bare minimum, turning up ‘faffing about’ trying to look useful (always with an eye on an end of cruise tip), when the real work was always done by the excellent cabin stewards. One was so bad we asked for him to be changed, as he did nothing but complain about how overworked he was and anything we asked about was batted straight back to us. Frankly, we would have opted out of having them, but the two good ones enhanced the cruise with things like in cabin (or balcony) dining and telling our (then) teenage daughters in the adjacent balcony cabin to make any room service requests through them to avoid charges. As for the daily ‘canapés’ the less said the better 😂 We don’t book suites any more, primarily because we have re-evaluated what we are prepared to pay for the ‘new’ P&O and we don’t believe that the product is worth over £500 a night any more. We get priority boarding now anyway and our last Epicurean breakfast experience was spoiled by a very noisy family and a screaming baby (different family) each morning. We ended up going to the MDR! The one advantage of needing an accessible cabin these days is that the cabins and balconies are 50% bigger than standard balcony cabins, so even the space benefit of a suite is no longer such a big factor. Am I correct in thinking that a concierge service would effectively replace the Butlers with a dedicated phone line which you could use for making bookings, requesting room service etc? If so, that would have been OK for us when we were suite passengers, as long as you can still have in-suite (or balcony) dining.

Yes, it can be anywhere of their choosing Andy. I agree that this system may be of use to those on Savers, but is far less attractive to those booking Select, for the reasons you mention.

Thanks. I completely understand why inside cabins appeal for those who cruise in the way that you do. I wish we felt the same as it would save me a small fortune 😂 I would hope that you don’t feel attacked, but a little more understanding of the fact that what works for one doesn’t always work for another is all that is asked for 😉

With all due respect, I do feel that you need to consider that not everyone wants to cruise in the same way as you do, even those of similar ages. There are clearly a number of problems at present. Even the most blinkered P&O fan can surely see that and it’s telling that even our forum P&O insider admits it. Just because they don’t affect you personally doesn’t mean that they don’t need fixing. We are only a few years older than you, so in the same age group. However, we differ in how we cruise in almost every respect. To explain; Price - You often cite how low cruise prices are and the comparison with other holidays. However, you happily book inside cabins, possibly on Savers and can always cruise off season if you wish. In our case, we would absolutely detest an inside cabin, so much so that we would rather not cruise than have one. A balcony cabin is a minimum for us. A cabin is not just a place to sleep or change. We spend a lot of time in it, reading, watching the views (from the sofa or balcony) etc. especially on sea days when the ship is busy. Location is important to us, so we want our first choice location, not what is left over. On ships where there is a dining choice, we always want Freedom dining. All these factors rule out Savers. Because we need an accessible cabin, last minute (bargain) bookings aren’t possible. All of these factors combined mean that we pay significantly more per cruise than you do. It is therefore not unreasonable that our expectations may be different. Dining - You tend to use the buffet or speciality restaurants. We also like the speciality restaurants, but we avoid the buffet like the plague. We don’t pay to go on holiday to eat in a self service cafeteria. The majority of evenings we will use the MDR. I don’t expect to be forced to use the speciality restaurants more than we would chose to, just because the MDR is poorly organised or inadequately provisioned. Whilst we can cruise off peak, we are going on Iona in August. Not our choice, but one daughters partner is a teacher. As megabear rightly points out, Iona and Arvia are designed as family ships. They should still be able to comfortably cope with 6,000 passengers in school holidays. It’s simply not acceptable that on Arvia at present people are being forced to use the buffet as they cannot get into the MDR. I’ve read a few excuses for that, but excuses are all they are. Whilst Iona doesn’t seem to be as badly affected as Arvia, I have still decided that we will probably be best to avoid the MDR other than perhaps one formal evening. I’m paying for the holiday for all 6 passengers, so the decision to use speciality restaurants most evenings is going to add to my cruise cost considerably. That’s wrong. Shows - We dine much later than you so if we go to a show it’s always the 10.30pm one. Whilst we have to get there early to secure a wheelchair space and companion seat, there is never a problem with people being able to walk in right up until the show starts. Now we will have to book and if we decide not to go remember to cancel. Meanwhile, those who decide on the spur of the moment to go (who would previously have just walked in) will now have to queue and wait for no shows. This is solving a problem that never existed and even our P&O insider agrees it should stop. The joy of cruising for many is spontaneity and doing things on a whim. That’s all gone. There are other ways in which our cruise expectations differ, but hopefully this gives you a flavour of the fact that we are all different (even if similar ages) and just because P&O are ticking all your boxes at present you can appreciate that for others they are going backwards. We have only ever cruised with P&O and have been loyal to them since 1996. However, we have started looking elsewhere now, something that we wouldn’t have done had all these things not occurred. We have booked our first Cunard cruise and are registered with Saga. Yes, P&O cruises are a lot cheaper in real terms than they used to be, and we will still use them as ‘filler’ holidays. But we are at a stage where we rate quality over quantity and we would happily pay more for a better experience.

You will probably notice a drop in quality from your last P&O cruise if it was 10 years ago, but the prices have also fallen in real terms to reflect it. Superior Deluxe cabins (if that’s the ones you mean are a bit bigger and have a seating area, although it’s a rather uncomfortable sofa or sofa bed. Balconies are a decent size but an important difference is that the vast majority of Superior Deluxe balconies are uncovered. Overlooking isn’t a major issue but lack of shade can be. There are a few other very minor benefits such as a half bottle of fizz, some flowers and fruit and, from memory, canapés on formal nights. You will be able to book Epicurean and Sindhu before your cruise (2 weeks before?) but cannot use OBC for this purpose. You cannot pre book the Glasshouse. Sample menus are online. Don’t know about current prices. I think that they still have wine packages but there are no wine waiters any more, so it may be more of a challenge. One of the many things stopped “because of Covid” was the ability to ask the restaurant to hold part used bottles for your next visit. That may have been re-introduced though.

Yet they don’t seem to have this problem on Iona, and the only difference is the number of MDRs 🤔

What a let down! Makes you wonder why they even bother. I would only consider an upgrade to be a move to a different type of cabin, for instance, as you say, outside to balcony.

Whilst I don’t have a problem with the big ships, I’ve read enough consistent reviews of Arvia now to know that she is best avoided during peak periods, especially if you want to dine in an MDR. The removal of the two additional smaller MDRs that Iona has in favour of extra speciality restaurants has caused a major capacity problem on Arvia, which is further compounded by the reservation system which is leaving tables empty for periods of time. I know that many like the ‘app’ system, but I can’t help but feel that we didn’t get all these reports when Freedom Dining operated as it should (ie first come, first served). Yes, you had to take a pager at peak times, but people weren't giving up and using the buffet in desperation. I am also at a complete loss as to why P&O are persisting with a booking system for the theatre. Once again, trying to solve a problem that never existed!

Gosh. This raises so many issues. Firstly it appears that these cabin changes are indeed as a result of quarantine and nothing else. Given that we are living with Covid now in the U.K., I wonder how those who work coped with having to take an extra week off? I should imagine that only a tiny proportion of those who might have felt that they had a symptom or two would have said anything as, by doing so, you voluntarily subject yourself to imprisonment (or quarantine, to use the official term). So if it felt as though a lot of people were in quarantine, the actual numbers infected would almost certainly have been many times higher, but those folk would have just carried on with their cruise (and maybe just rested in their cabin for any days they felt rough). Yes, the noise and vibration when docking would have indeed have been the aft thrusters.

Yes, that’s my worry (we are on Iona in August 😱). I’m looking forward to our first ‘post Covid’ cruise and our adult daughters (who we are taking) are particularly looking forward to it. We are also on a waiting list for a May cruise, but I’m not holding out any hope as we need an accessible balcony cabin (which look great on Iona and Arvia). Whilst the August school holiday experience may be a ‘challenge’, if we like the ship we will be looking to book some out of season cheapies just for ourselves.

I had rather assumed that you were on commission anyway 😂

Great news about your claim. Well done! Sounds as though my theory may have some legs then. I probably have a ‘P’ against my name also but, in my case, it probably stands for “Pain in the a**e” 😂

Please correct me if I’m wrong, but didn’t you have quite a bit of preferential treatment from P&O on a previous cruise due to correspondence that you had been entering into with them (insurance?)? If so, I wonder if your upgrade is a continuation of that? A lot of companies will ‘look after’ people deemed to be ‘influencers’ (once they have identified them) in order to curry favour and hopefully generate positive reviews. For this reason, I always take with a great pinch of salt the often gushing reviews of those who promote their own cruise review sites or blogs as they aren’t always reporting on the ‘normal’ experience. Of course, I might be barking up completely the wrong tree, as I know that this latter point certainly doesn’t apply in your case.

Interesting points. I’ve just ploughed through the detailed T’s and Cs for the upgrade scheme and there is no mention that it only applies to Select bookings only. On that basis, I’m inclined to agree that some people who often book lower grade cabins on a Select basis may now start booking them as a Saver and then submitting multiple upgrade bids for several grades above. As you say, it’s worth keeping a note of all the various pricing options for different grades at the time of booking, as the T’s and Cs make it clear that any OBC will remain at the level of the ‘booked’ cabin, rather than the ‘upgraded’ cabin. As it’s safe to assume that 99% of people won’t do that, some of those who are successful in securing an upgrade won’t be getting as good a deal as they think!

Thank you. Am I safe to assume that Norway is not one of those countries and therefore we are not at risk of a last minute problem with our August cruise on Iona? As mentioned previously, I have booked a block of 3 adjacent Deluxe Balcony cabins and subsequently found out that these were in the previous quarantine zone. As ours is an accessible cabin, our cruise would have to be cancelled, as there is only one other accessible cabin that is of an equal or higher grade, and that’s the sole accessible suite which will be booked (and we didn’t want anyway).

Absolutely appalling. As I have said many times, when taking bookings the P&O shoreside staff are lovely, but when you have a compliant or a problem they are beyond useless and as well as lacking empathy they don’t have the first clue about customer service or problem resolution. Like others, I am now very anxious about our next P&O cruise and the fact that @molecrochip has not provided any clarity regarding what this is all about is making me very suspicious.

Good point, although you presumably keep all the other Select fare benefits (additional OBC / Parking / Dining choice / shuttle buses etc) which you wouldn’t have if you’d booked a Saver at the outset?

Blimey. That’s £135 per person per night. That was an incredible bargain even back then and many cruises are that sort of price or more now just for a standard balcony cabin. I think you’d be looking at more than double that price nowadays. We used Suites between 2015 and 2018 and never got one for less than £250 per person per night (admittedly most were in school holidays). Given that suites are usually around double the price of a balcony cabin, I don’t think that the minimum bid price is too bad. I agree, however, that the Penthouse premium isn’t worth it. We used one on Ventura once for a short cruise to try it out and all you gain over a regular suite is a large dining area and table that we never used!

Per cruise so, yes, very good value, as long as you don’t get a naff location. Also most of the Superior Deluxe balconies are unshaded, which doesn’t suit everyone.

Ah yes, you had said. Apologies 😂 Personally I don’t think the minimum prices are too bad, but I understand your reasons. Poor location can spoil a cruise.

Interesting. Assuming that you are in a balcony cabin, the minimum upgrade bid for a suite would be around 50% of the normal price premium that you’d expect to pay. That’s taking an assumed price of £250 per night for a balcony and £500 per night for a suite (per couple). Normal price difference £250 a night, minimum upgrade bid £120 a night. Obviously my back of a fag packet calculation is based upon approximate average prices and not the actual prices for your cruise.

I would agree that, from the examples shared so far, they don’t appear to be ‘bargains’. I guess that there’s a fine line that will take P&O some time to find. If they set the prices too high, very few people will use the scheme. Conversely, if they set them too low, people may start booking a lower grade than they might have usually booked, hoping that they can secure an upgrade for less overall cost than booking their desired cabin type from the outset! I should imagine that the minimum upgrade bids will start high for the initial cruises and may start to soften over time.

As this system is only available to those who have booked direct, I can see a lot of people who normally use a TA cutting out the middle man with the next release later this month. Discounts these days are relatively small and some may choose to forsake that in order to be able to chance their arm with this upgrade system. In our case, however, the decision whether to book direct or via a TA may vary depending on which ship we are booking. To explain; We aren’t eligible for our two booked P&O cruises as we booked with a TA although, in both cases, that won’t be an issue. The only upgrade options on Iona would have been a Conservatory Mini-Suite (which we wouldn’t want even if it was a free upgrade) or a full suite, and there’s only one accessible suite and it’s at the aft, which we usually like but wouldn’t on Iona or Arvia due to the design and the outdoor bar etc underneath. On Ventura our only upgrade option would be a full suite and that would be midships underneath public decks, which can result in overhead noise that we won’t get in our booked Superior Deluxe Balcony cabin.