SailBreakaway

On 9/23/2019 at 6:13 AM, DCGuy64 said:

Does anyone know which bid MSC uses to decide whether to allow you to upgrade? Is it the first one you place or the highest? 

Be careful with this bidding stuff folks, with NCL I learned you need to really take some time and figure out some numbers.  Having said that, this company that does this uses pretty sophisticated algorithms that looks at several factors, some of which are internal to their pricing structures, etc.  

When you update a bid for a given category, it becomes the controlling bid, so it's always the last one for each category.  

All in all, you need to bid what you're comfortable spending, however always look at the full purchase prices before you do, and if you see you're coming close, use caution.

6 hours ago, kayteecat said:

Got it! We sailed away from NYC on a rainy day in December, so no pool deck party or if there was, it was sparsely attended. I honestly think I won't mind having those moved to the pool deck - if I want to feel like I'm in a night club, the Skyline Lounge fits the bill nicely. We'll of course see how it works out in practice. I think I will only miss Spice during the day, I loved going back there for a drink and some aft views.

Always enjoy a nice aft view.

Is the price to upgrade to unlimited wifi on the ship same as if I did it now? If so I'll just wait.

This just came across AIS, looks like things are happening (at least button pushing lol) and are starting to come together for a Conveyance this week. 

39 minutes ago, CazV said:

 

That notice has been on their website for months, so don't read anything into it. 

oh cool ok. just noticed it. 

3 hours ago, TheDougOut said:

 

This was posted this morning, but I didn’t know the source...

 

 

Sehr Gut!

Conveyance? Should be this week, right?. If not, for those of us on the TA, this would be concerning and a mean a delay in the plan. 

Interesting note on the MW site, esp the strong cease and desist part!?! I mean people are actually calling?

I bet the big stupid snake is holding it all up! 🤣🤣

On 9/20/2019 at 11:57 AM, TheDougOut said:

Back to blue lights on the Waterfront... so I guess they can alter the color.

 

 

(IG: nadine._.31.01.2k)

If they can change them to Red/Green that would be pretty darn effective for Nav lights in limited visibility operations, esp approaching and departing ports. 

As for Vibe, I’d rather pay 210/420$ more for this experience (no crowding, no kids, hot tubs, loungers, etc), than deal with the s**t show also known as the main pool and sun decks on the other ships. In the past we used to book Haven, now I save it $$$$ and replace it with all nights Specialty Dining, Thermal Suite passes, and Vibe. Thinking our Platinum status and some quick feet will help us get to the sales point to purchase. 

Booked second trip on Encore, now added another Bermuda in May. It will be our 5th or 6th trip on NCL to Bermuda. May will be my first Vibe purchase. 

This is the same bidding vendor that NCL uses. 🙄 Very simply OP, 90% of the time its not s deal. 

This is a vendor that NCL uses for upgrades. Same plugin and processing. For those that are familiar with Haven and pricing increases since 2015, and the bid program you probably cringed like I did when I opened my email link and found the guage and slider. I told DW that we should eat up as much YC as we can. The Haven product commanded ALOT of demand and that demand drove pricing way up and it has sustained those price increases, esp in NY kind of markets. Anyway Im in an inside for December and lowest bid is 340 each to deluxe. I’m just looking forward to a nicer Inside maybe opening up from this process, as our pricing for this was exceptional and is only reason we are taking it. 

43 minutes ago, prbffd28 said:

It's been a quiet week for new photos of a ship that is supposed to be on a conveyance at the end of this month, I believe that is the schedule anyway. Getting anxious to see some interior shots!!

We need intel! 

4 hours ago, capriccio said:

 

You are penalizing ship staff for a problem you have with headquarters?  It seems to me you are just trying to justify not paying the auto-gratuities. 

I don't think a lot of it is ignorance or incompetence, I really don't. Whenever a question is asked about taking advantage of something advertised, or online, or even by policy something that we as the consumer have coming to us or back to us, the answer is ALWAYS, oh no, that doesn't apply in this case.  Example, My sailing is in the 5+15% Voayager category.  My TA spoke to 3 reps who all said that doesn't apply to my cabin category, REALLY because I can go online and price it that way as we speak. Nope. I've asked about promos, and on and on and the answer is always nope.  Errors I've encountered always involve a math error to their advantage.

And here's the best one, they LOST my final payment money of 2000$ last month.  Yes you read this correctly.  I called my agent, she took my cc over the phone, called them, relayed it, came back on the phone and said ok all set.  I went on my merry way until I got no updated invoice next day, and when logged on it said  still owed 2000 something dollars!!! Called agent, and she came back on the phone for me and said, ok I don't want you to get excited but..... The agent filed a case with the accounting Dept at MSC.  I had to wait, 10 days until finally I got an email out of nowhere with my new invoice.  They had "found" my 2000$.  I was going to dispute with the CC company, but decided to give them a week or so to fix it, however man I spent that week pretty upset and irked,  MSC has a great onboard experience, but man the pre-cruise part is a nightmare.  Only way to not get tied up in all that, book online, don't change, don't ask for anything, hope your payments don't get lost and board. I just got an upgrade invitation to bid like NCL, HELL NO!!!! I can only imagine what that might look like, we charge your cc in the blind and you get an upgrade? Chances of that going off the tracks is really good (probably get downgraded!)

Anyway, just wanted to vent and share.  Just make sure your payments go through right away when you call them in.

If you can get past the reservations phase, and get to the ship, you're good.  I'm not sure how they corporately accept the status quo with reservations and all the issues.  It has to hurt their bottom line. Just last week I called to try and upgrade to a deluxe suite, as it was in the 5+15% voyager discount markdowns.  Went online, did a mock booking and figured it would be an additional 900$.  Well my friends, nope.  That is 1600$ sir, and I tried to explain about the 15% until I wanted to shove a knife through my eye as it would have been less painful than that interaction.  Key I think is to book once online or through a TA, don't change anything, don't try and get money back, and leave it alone until boarding day.  Crazy.

Just wanted too vent.  Nonetheless, I'm three cruises in with them and a three week grand voyage to go, so I guess I proved my own observation wrong, despite it all I still come back!

8 minutes ago, david_sobe said:

I hope its not true.  The theme nights always packed them in for prime rib and ribs.
But its very possible FDR is cutting back yet again.  I noticed that even the Haven menus don't have shrimp as an appetizer for lunch anymore.  

Sad.  You cant get prime rib anymore but you can get a hot dog. 

🤪

In 2015 we had Lobster, as much as you'd like in the Haven, imagine that! My how far we've come in just 4 years.

So sad.Oh well crying and spilled milk and all I guess right?...

I've got my popcorn and just waiting for the scene when this train derails and plummets off the trestle bridge...

😂

On 9/15/2019 at 3:39 PM, Son of a son of a ... said:

Man, that racetrack must print money as the reason for NCL allocating so much deck space

“Man that big virtual snake maze thing on the back of the ship must print money...” 

- DID NO ONE SAY EVER!!! 

🤣🤣

2 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

With the OP permission, please allow me to refute.

 

1) Is there a line building/holding a better fleet?  I'm going to define better in terms of qualitative variables (ie, specific things the ship offers). Short answer is YES! Absolutely. In fact, MOST new builds offer more tangible amenities than MSC. All lines hold some older/smaller vessels that could use a little tweaking; and personally I think this is a good thing. In terms of older, smaller cruise ships, I don't see much difference between MSC and others.  

 

However for the debate regarding which line is building/holding a 'better' cruise ship experience (remember, I'm defining better as offering more choices, more innovation, appealing to a larger consumer in tangibles), lets start with the most obvious  RCL/Celebrity as these ships are undoubtedly more innovative and offer many more experience choices than any ship in the MSC fleet. 

 

For example: New Seaside Class verses Older Freedom Class. Both are nearly the same size physically @ approximately 155 g/t and 4,500 passengers. However; RCL offers flowrider, ice skating rink (added night time entertainment also), skypad, laser tag, and a puzzle break room. The adults only indoor solarium that RCL and Celebrity offer on nearly all their ships is a huge tangible advantage IMO!! 

 

Then there is Oasis class; which offers more varied activities for adult/kid than any class afloat. Not an opinion, just pure fact. Whether or not you like 'big ships' (I'm not a huge fan personally), you can not argue that Oasis class ships appeal to the most diverse crowd.  Flowrider, zip line, 3 story adult solarium, 3 legal size volleyball/basketball/tennis courts, break out rooms, merry-go-round, a bar that glides up and down three stories, ice skating rink, a pool with sand, and wireless internet with speeds faster than my home. There are three main evening entertainment shows (broadway production, ice-escapade, and aqua park) which spread crowds out nicely and ensure that evening entertainment isn't repetitive.  (Qualitative alert: The aqua park show blew my mind and was undoubtedly the best cruise ship entertainment I've ever seen and while MSC night entertainment is great, it's 30 minutes vs 2 hours and one show that looks similar to every other show throughout the week with canned in music. Tangibles)

 

I believe MSC built the new meriviglia class to compete with Quantum class since both classes of ship are designed for cold weather sailing. The meriviglia at 171 gt with 5,700 passengers is considerably more crowded than Quantum class 168 gt and 4,900 passengers. I haven't sailed Meriviglia class, but have not read anything that places it ahead of quantum class in terms of activities/entertainment. Quantum class offers 3 story adult solarium, north star, flowrider, bumper cars, trapeze school, puzzle break, roller skating rink, 270 (IMO the most versatile venue at sea), Music hall, bionic bar, and Ifly (qualitative alert: this was the most awesome activity I've done on a cruise ship,, ever).

 

2) To the standards that MSC Produces: I'm not sure what you mean by standards, but I think amenities offered are 'standards' and I addressed those above. I think cruise ship space (ie, how crowded a ship feels) would be another 'standard", so let's take a peak there:

 

MSC is building their new World Class ship which has copied much of the design of Oasis, but this build has red flags flaring in the wind for me in terms of space ratio. At 205 gt and 7,000 passengers the space ratio is one of the smallest in the industry.

 

We all know that MSC new builds have low space ratios (ie, put more persons in each square foot); but I can't even begin to wrap my head around a space ratio of 29 on a 200+ g/t ship holding 7K people.

 

For more space ratio comparison here are a few of the new builds across the industry:

Celebrity Edge: 37

Oasis Class: 36 

NCL Joy: 36

Quantum class: 35

Nieuw Class: 34'

Sky Princess: 32

MSC Magnifica: 32

MSC Meriviglia: 31

MSC Bellisima: 31

MSC Seaside: 31

MSC World: 29

Carnival Panorama: 28

MSC Grandiosa: 28

 

I took the stats off this site which lists all cruise ships. There is some discrepancy between double occupancy and birth, but for the sake of this debate I think we can conclude that MSC standards include building the most crowded fleet in the industry.

https://www.cruisemapper.com/wiki/761-cruise-ship-passenger-capacity-ratings

 

3) With anything better than YC: There is a decent argument to be made here. If MSC continues to sell YC for less than comparable products, its going to be hard to beat. If the price is the same see my initial response in this thread.

 

However, I think it's worth noting at this point in the discussion that when we discuss space ratios (above), MSC ships likely feel much more crowded because a significant amount of their space is reserved for YC (which is anything but crowded). In other words, the space ratio of Grandiosa is likely much lower than 28 in areas outside of YC therefore 'feeling' much more crowded. 

 

________________________________

 

I'll conclude our friendly debate here. I truly hope the debate remains friendly, because while I don't agree with the msc 'cheerleaders' (for lack of better term) in that MSC is the best product sailing; I do agree that MSC is a great budget line and it is highly likely I will choose to sail with them again. I also think the MSC board has some of the most civil posters on social media or I'd never have engaged.

 

However; please note that I will sail MSC again knowing the limits of the fleet. Each line/ship has limits and I think having realistic expectations that match price paid with product are essential to having the best chance of a great vacation. 

 

I also understand that I've set myself up for some flaming on the MSC board (after all, most here are cheerleaders of a sort), but I do hope we can keep the discussion/debate/riot to quantifiable variables. Things like crystal staircases and gorgeous lounges are something MSC does extremely well, but those are qualitative in nature. 

 

Finally, I would go so far as to speculate that MSC is not attempting to build the "best fleet" in the industry. If so, they certainly could have chosen to add the amenity choices I've mentioned to make their ships appeal to a greater audience. I do believe they are trying to build a value based cruise experience ~ ships with less space so they can charge less admission and still make reasonable profit.  I like it! 

 

 

Rarely do I read a post on CC that really is an education and provides great value. This post is one of the most informative and has some outstanding well thought out points. Well said and thanks for the Ratio data, thats great info I wish we had at our fingertips. 

On 9/12/2019 at 7:01 PM, mafig said:

 Actually it is Haven Aft Penthouse vs. YC Deluxe.

🙂

Anyway my above thank you to everyone still stands.  I've learned a lot. Every one of you has contributed something to my decision making.  

Oh ok. Got it now... Aft Penthouse definitely. I really really love those staterooms. Best at sea. 

Courtyard, I choose YC for sure. 

Lifeboats loaded and she’s ready to sail, however back at the Ranch.....

Nov 21st huh?? we are sailing on the TA,  I’m just happy MW doesn’t build at the same pace as the Miami builder for the new Terminal!

YC all day long. They do it better. Im speaking of the experience. As for staterooms, NCL has much better choices, however with the caveat of same price, to be fair it has to be a Haven Courtyard vs YC Deluxe to make a fair comparison of the experience. 

FYI, FDR doesn't even come anywhere close to discussing TV content on ships.  FDR doesn't even come close to discussing exactly what's on the products in detail, or even in general in some cases.  He discusses revenue, and broad concepts that maximize revenue, and he looks at cost/revenue/growth/capacity/sales  data custom prepared for him to review,  Andy gets a little closer to detail about the different aspects of the product, but still nowhere near TV content.  VPs and Directors, absolutely.

Just some corporate insight there for ya.

Courtyard Haven and Deluxe YC, for all intent and purposes, SAME. Been in both.

Aft Penthouse on a BA or BA+ class, INCREDIBLE.

There is not an outdoor deck, like SS has forward of the Topsail.  Topsail on SS is 2 stories high windows, MG is one story.  Interesting, on Bell and Grand subsequently, they changed the design after Mera to go with the two story glass in the Topsail like on SS.  They realized after I think that was a big loss in the original design.  None the less, the Topsail looks beautiful as does the restaurant.  The restaurant has the windows as well (one story) however they put a table height counter or plant stand (don't know how else to say it) across the entire front, so the windows really are table high, if that makes sense. 

Youtube has plenty of good video reviews and Vlogs, I'd check them out.  

Mera has a lot in common with the Divina, Splendida, etc Yacht club spaces, more than SS I'd say.

Seaside is my first choice, however Mera has a lot to offer as well, if you enjoy a lot of indoor activity as we do.  There's more shade on the Mera YC Sundeck though, and that's a welcome feature for us.  On SS if you don't get those few loungers in the shad eon the side, no shade for you (other than a cabana or dining tables).

I'm not sure Mera is an 'anthill' though, her spaces are equally as beautiful inside and the Promenade is a nice feature.  At night, Seaside interior venues for dancing and activities (Haven Lounge) gets really really overcrowded, as they are small.  Looks like the design of Mera gives more interior space for these venues.  

Either way, can't go wrong in my opinion.

MSC is gonna shake the earth when they drop their capacity here. I can’t wait. 

Now if they can just get their IT i infrastructure and corporate support infrastructure scaled to the operation here that would be great! lol.