wizard-of-roz

Cari: Thank you! It feels so good to have the support of my fellow SD travelers. You really did what probably is the best thing to do.....How effective is a Citizen's Arrest? What does it entail? Is there a statute of limitations?

My DH wants me to bring it up at the meeting at CCI to get their opinion on what is really the most effective thing to do and the very best way to handle these situations.....I know it's case by case....and very personal but why do these organizations train these remarkable dogs if the public is going to abuse the rights of the person walking or wheeling with an SD and most importantly why does the public feel so empowered to act this way?

I know, it's all about educating them......but, it can get pretty tiring!!!!

Honestly, life's challenges are difficult enough without these moron's getting in our way!!!!! :(

PLEASE READ THIS......You've got to hear what happened to us at a restaurant. I must apologize about the length of the story....but, it's worth reading..................

I'll re-introduce myself for those of you, who are not familiar with me:

I've had a Service Dog, (Brenda) for 6 years. She was trained by Canine Companions for Independence. She's 8 1/2 years old. She's traveled all over the world and will even be on her 10th cruise on November 15th. Neither one of us are "newbies" to the Service Dog world or to world traveling. But, what happend is not to be believed and has NEVER happened, anywhere in our travels...........

On September 29th my DH, Brenda and I entered the Souplantation restaurant, in Northridge, CA.

It's a "buffet style" restaurant; Brenda is attached to my left wrist and walking by my side (in a very respectful, as usual, manner.) I'm walking down the aisle getting my food and DH is behind me, he pays for our food; I'm walking towards a table, with Brenda in tow and my tray in my hand (not an easy task, as you with SD's can attest to!) A man approaches me, puts his face in my face and says; "get out of this restaurant with your dog!"

I'm stunned....I say, (as I continue to walk towards the table, holding my tray); "what did you say?" He has now placed himself right in my path and continues, in an angry tone; "you have to leave with that dog!" I say; "this is a Service Dog, please observe the vest that she's wearing!" I'm now at the table I put down the tray and he keeps standing right in front of me, not allowing me to sit down. (Brenda always wears the CCI Service Dog Vest, although, as most of you know...a Service Dog doesn't have to wear a vest.)

He starts walking towards the front door of the restaurant and I follow him, all the while explaining about Service Dogs and their rights!

I said to him,"you can NOT ask me to leave and who are you?" He said that he was the General Manager and he can ask anyone to leave, if he wanted to! I reiterated to him; "you can NOT ask me to leave just because I have a service dog!" I pointed out to him the decal that is on the front door, which reads, "Guide Dogs Welcome!" He said; "you're not blind and the next time you want to come in here, you have to call me first. I have children and adults in here who do not like or are allergic to dogs!"

Again, I can't begin to tell you how "surprised" and "shocked" I was at his behavior and insistence that I leave! I proceeded to sit down on a bench in the front of the restaurant and said to him; "I am NOT leaving, I have a right to be here!"

I continued to tell him that I had just gotten off of a airplane and the TSA welcomed my SD, I said; "do you have more authority than the TSA?" He ignored me! I needed to gather my thoughts of what to do, it was so frustrating! I searched through my wallet to find the paper from IAADP which states the "law" handed down from the ADA in regard to refusing admittance and asked him to please read it! He simply walked away!

I couldn't think of anything else to do, short of dialing 911.....So, I did; I called them and I told the operator that I needed the police to come and help me because my Service Dog and I were being denied entrance to a restaurant. (I really had no idea that this would work or not.....I have NEVER been put in this position in the entire time that I've had Brenda!) And, who knew if the police would follow through or not!!! I just wasn't leaving without obtaining my rights!!!!!

Two hours later, the police came. I greeted them outside the restaurant, I explained the whole situation; they observed Brenda, with her vest on and acting in her best behavior. They walked back in with me, asked a server to speak with the manager. The manager came....they walked him outside....pointed out the decal on the window and told him that disabled people are NOT just blind! They said he had no choice and must let me & my Service Dog into the restaurant. The manager walked back in, right past me, never said a word! The two officers came in and said; "enjoy your meal, here is our card, if this happens again, call us!"

I stood and walked VERY TALL with Brenda by my side and went over to the manager, who was now at the register and asked for a refund!

We left.....I was so upset and still a bit angry. We went back to this restaurant 3 days later....the manager was not there and he had removed the decal from the front window! What a jerk!!!!!!

The following day I contacted their corporate offices and told them the whole story. They profoundly apologized and promised to inform this manager and all their other locations of the ADA laws. I called the IAADP office and was told that police are not always so responsive, I got lucky! I also called CCI, they reassured me that I did the right thing and also couldn't believe the managers behavior......I am going to a workshop in Santa Rosa on October 25th, I will definitely bring this up, again.

Should we call 911? Should we just walk out? Do we stand our ground, do we insist? After we hand them all the info. from the ADA (mine has several different languages on it) and, even states that there could be fines assest and damages sought, if they still don't let you in, what would you do? And, who's going to seek the damages? Who's going to pay for the attorney? Who's going to back us up?

Have you faced a similar "hard head?" What did you do to resolve your issue?

Please let us all know if you've faced such a situation and how you resolved it. I will bring all my good information back with me after the 25th.

Please speak with your Travel Agent [he/she will contact your cruiseline and get the exact information you will need.]

What we have needed for most of our journeys (Caribbean, Mexico, Hawaii, South America and Europe (Europe=Tick & Tapeworm treatment done 48 hours before travel, blood draw for rabies serology, they asked that she be chipped but accepted her Tattoo as I.D.) and for other countries:

1. Immunization Record (this will have all current vaccinations i.e. Rabies (Rabies Titer, this is required for Europe and Hawaii) and all others.

2. Some Countries/Islands require that testing is done 10 days prior, some 30 days and some 48 hours. Your TA will find this out for you. Or, your Vet will know.

3. The Vet will stipulate on the form that Heartquard and Advantix (or similar tick/flea deterrent were given or are used regularly).

4. Most recent Vet check and dogs condition. Date and Signature (with address/phone/license number of Vet.)

5. Vets statement that this, in fact, is a Service Dog. He doesn't have to distinquish what the dog does. [i like my Vet to make this statement on the Vet Check form....It certainly has helped me in a few instances.]

It seems like a lot but it's stuff that we normally do for our SD's anyway. The foreign countries, as well as our own, just want to make sure that your dog is in prime health and is well cared for! As well they should. Afterall, you are bringing it onboard a floating hotel and entering another country with an animal. Most foreign countries do not acknowledge the ADA....so be on your best behavior, make sure your dog stay calm and use your good sense.

Hawaii has NEVER had a case of Rabies documentented....and, they don't want anyone bringing it onto their Islands. I don't blame them!

Everyone should take such good care of their animals as we do our Service Dogs! :)

Cindy: You could never bore us.....we love stories of Service Dogs and the furbabies who keep them company, at home! :)

If you booked through a Travel Agent, they will assess you of all that is needed for Joe to go with you; they will contact the cruiseline and get the douments and the timing for you for debarkation and for entering the various Ports. If you booked on your own....You may call: HAL's Access & Compliance line at 1-800-577-1731.

Each cruiseline does it a bit different. Each one has their own special form to fill out; sign and fax or mail back.

Your visit to your Vet, for the Agricultural Inspection Form and for updates on all vaccinations should be within 30 days of your cruising.

Brenda does NOT have a Chip but does have a Tattoo, in one ear [from CCI], I don't know if that's why we've always been able to enter the Ports and foreign countries ,without any further requests or not but we have! I think the Chips are a great idea and will probably do it on our next Vet visit. :rolleyes:

I carry the Certification Card that CCI gives us upon graduation [at all times], I show it; her Vet record; city License, ect., all to the Immigration authorities upon re-entrance to the ship and upon disembarkation and we're done!

If we don't plan on leaving the ship at the Ports, all the ship will need is your documentation (make them a complete set of what you have, you can give it to them to keep or you may pick it up at the end of your cruise).....they need all the paperwork for the Immigration Officers. The ship will not get "clearance" for the other guests to enter their country, until your dog has been cleared! The same goes for re-entering the USA.

ALWAYS have Joe's papers ready to show while on land or when re-entering the USA.....it makes life so much simpler! I have a special zippered pouch that I carry in my purse, just for Brenda. I keep copies of everything in a suitcase; at the Purser's Desk; and, in the zippered pouch.

HAL's Potty Box is smaller than the other cruiselines. They ALWAYS provided "turf" [a strip of real grass]...they placed it on our veranda. If you have an "inside" cabin, they will place it on a deck [usually, in the forward part of the ship, outside their Theatre.] It makes for a bit more planning when going potty but was never too difficult to work around! ;)

You know your dogs routine......it's really very simple to keep your schedule while crusing, as well!

It was so easy to teach Brenda to use a 4x4 box. I put her leash on...I knew it was time for her to go potty.....I used her "command', while I circled her over and over again until she relieved herself. I gave her a "treat." I repeated it [at her next potty time], again and again until I could remove her leash and on command she did it.

Brenda likes to "bury" her droppings by "back kicking"...it took some time for her to realize that she couldn't do it in the box. It was funny to watch but I NEVER let her see me laugh!!!! :o

Also, if you and Cari would share your wonderful suggestions and information with ALL of us, that would be great! We can NEVER know too much, when it comes to traveling with a Service Dog!

Bailee sounds like a wonderful girl and I'm sure that she misses Rangeley as much as you do. Dogs just know how to "move-on" so much better than we do! I know that Joe will bring you much joy and comfort as you remember your lives with Rangeley and what he gave you both! He can NEVER replace him!!!! He'll be very special in his own way!!!!

Please let us know how all your plans are going and if there's something new we should all know about.

Brenda always gets a lot of attention and I've had people call her and try to divert her away from her work....[some people can be so ignorant to the focus that these dogs must keep]..but, the vast majority just want to touch and love our dogs because they're missing their own babies! And, quite frankly, the "working dog" is an enigma that the "public" still is in the dark about and they're so, so curious!!!!!!

rangeley: I am so sorry about the loss of your beloved service dog. He/she was very handsome! How old was he/she?

Congratulations on getting your new SD.....There is no time like the present to introduce your dogs to cruising. It's wonderful! Unless you're a parasailer, horseback rider, underwater diver or you do the "zip lines", there's no reason your dog can not enjoy your adventures on land.

If you've read these boards you know that our dogs are included in most that we do onboard a cruise and when we're on land.

You could leave him in your cabin (Service Dogs) are used to being left alone. (Although, we've NEVER left Brenda). If she can't do what we're doing, we don't do it!!!! She's truly part of my life....I can't imagine doing anything without her, now!!!!

You are truly lucky to not have to wait too long to get a "successor dog", some people have to wait a long time!

Contact Guest Services of the cruise that you're taking or ask your TA and you will be given all the necessary paperwork to fax back to them. It's simple; what is required by you is all layed out....once you've completed the forms; the Vet visit, etc., etc. You will enjoy everyday, just like you're at home with your trusted companion by your side!!!

Take the dogs (are they both SD's?)......they'll love it....you'll love it! And, they'll have each other in the cabin, if you choose a land excursion that is not so "dog friendly!"

What ever you choose to do....have a wonderful time and remember that you have a new Angel looking down on you! ;)

Nancy: Good luck on your new job!!!!

I don't know which cruiseline is using "kitty litter", now...but, we have ALWAYS had wood shavings on Princess. A 4 x 5 box filled with wood shavings....the box was placed in either a stairwell near our cabin or in a walkway, near our cabin (used only by the crew!)

I could have gone to the potty box in my pajamas (it was very close and I didn't have to go outside!)

Very convenient!!!!!

If you don't like the placement of the box or the contents ask to speak with the Hotel Manager.....he/she will resolve it and make you happy!!!!

Happy sailing to everyone who leaves before me on November 15th.

Quam: Thanks for the information about the chip. I hope all is well with you. Have you traveled much, this summer?

CJ: Thank you for sharing the great picture of Ollie and his new found friend....it's the one thing that is the hardest for Brenda to pass-up in toy stores....the dreaded "stuffed animals!" Ollie's in love!!!!!

It sounds like you had a wonderful time in Alaska....next, to enjoy it from a cruise ship!

It's good to know about the Anchorage Airport.

Thanks so much for sharing! :)

Nancy: Thank you for your persistence...You may send the form to: Canine Companions for Independence, P.O Box 446, Santa Rosa, CA 95402-0446 - Attention: Program Manager.

The cart sounds great....just make sure that the wheels in the front are not stationary but they move 360 degrees. Makes for much better mobility. You're a good shopper and thanks again for all your efforts for CCI.

denver: I have yet to have a cruiseline put kitty litter in the box. What line was it? When I send in my paperwork, prior to cruising, I always specify what type of litter works best.

When we were first using a 4x4 box to train Brenda, we did try kitty litter (JohnnyCat) to be precise! What a mess! She used it but it would always stick in between the pads on her feet; she would track it into the house; and, it was such a mess around the box....because; dog will be dogs....they still "circle" the box and each time she would "circle" out would come some more litter!:(

We stopped the litter and went to grass sod! It's cheap; it lasts a long time; it's at our local nursery and it's very low maintenance. And, best of all; Brenda thinks it's the "north forty" in a 4x4 box! :p

I'm going to CCI, in mid October, to help Brenda to add some more skills to her repertoire! She'll be able to do everything except the dishes and make beds......I'll cut her some slack on those!!!!

While I'm there I will get more information about the training and just how in depth the process will be for our returning service people and the dogs that will assist them.

If any of you know anyone who might be interested in this program please have them contact CCI at: 1-800-572-BARK (2275).

Or, anyone who would like to have more information on acquiring/Volunteering or becoming a Puppy Raiser please call the same number.

:) Remember CCI trains: Service; Hearing; Facility and Skilled Companions. :)

CCI is now training Service Dogs to work with the men and women who are returning from Iraq and Afganistan. Not only to assist the ones in wheel chairs but help those with PTS (Post Traumatic Stress.)

These brave men and women do not have to face each day afraid; they will have a Service Dog to help see them through each and every day!

CCI used to take the "released dogs" and give them to families or to their puppy raisers.....they are now finding that they can re-direct/train these dogs to be with a service person who is having a difficult time assimilating back into society.

cj: Good to hear from you, again. Have you done much traveling this summer?

sunshine: Good idea....it would be wonderful to have trainers and puppy raisers come onboard and share some of their stories.

Also, the wonderful SD's that served us on 911 had some very severe paw and leg injuries. Not to speak of the depression that was so rampant amongst the service handlers and dogs alike!

It is so rewarding when not only the handler but the SD can locate someone (hopefully) alive but scenting even just a body can be uplifting for the dogs. Can you imagine the confusion that wnet on on the grounds of the towers. There was scent everywhere! Enough of those thoughts.

These amazing SD's can not be repaid enough for their work ethic, in all that they do!!!!!

Orson: You traveling canine, you!!!! How lucky....Have fun and tell us all about your journey to Mickey's world!

We have not done Disney with Brenny! But, I can't wait!!!!

It's amazing what becomes "cool", once it starts hitting the pocket book; riding the train seemed like the best thing to do! For many families life will never be the same. My thoughts and prayers go out to them!

We owned a home in Chatsworth and still have a business there! We love to take the Metrolink into downtown L.A. (there's so many wonderful, old restaurants to go to) or, the Amtrak to Santa Barbara or San Diego. So convenient, not expensive and fun. And, Brenda loves it!

We're not going to take the train for a while! Of course, driving to all our favorite places doesn't hold much glory either!!!

Yesterday, Metrolink was "up" and running, like nothing happened. Of course, when it passed by the area where the trains collided it was very, very sad.

There's a private school, that is located right near the tracks, where they set-up their triage, right after the accident and to watch the children playing right next to where the accident happend, is eerie!!!!!

It's a miracle how we can clean-up and move on!!!!!!

Tis the reality of "life!"

One of my friends has a dog that has been trained to physically place his body on top of hers to keep her from "thrashing", she has a seizure disorder and has been known to hurt herself, severly!

To watch her dog lean against her (forcing her against a wall) and then holding her there until she "slithers" to the floor; then placing his body on hers,(with his head facing her face and his eyes staring into hers) until she's strong enough to command him to "release"; he then gets off of her and lies beside her.......it's such a sight. She's on medication, now and doesn't seize as much as she used to but in the beginning it was at least 3 times a day.

Her dog watches her like a hawk and lies beside her, while she sleeps. When she wakes, he wakes! Such devotion!

The training process took three people and 3 days and the dog had the training down pat!

He's a cross between a Lab and a Retreiver....he's huge and looks like a Great Dane with a giant head!!!!! Such a hero!

I thought "Werin" was a boy too! I should know better...CCI does name their puppies, in each litter, with the alphabet......One of Brenda's sister was Beulah!!!!! How funny!!! I get enough "giggles" from people when they ask her name and I tell them "Brenda", especially the girls who are named Brenda!!!! I rarely call her by her name, anyway!!!! She's used to it and it works for us!!!!!

CCI gave us a patch for Brenda's vest that says, very boldly: "PLEASE DO NOT-PET I'M WORKING!" I can't tell you how many people say; "I'm sorry, I just now read the patch!" That's after they've already reached for her and started petting!!!!!

I understand their AWE of these dogs. And, I too, would have a very hard time not touching them!

We live near the train accident that happened, last week. There were several "Search Dogs" that were called to action. And, watching them was, again, an awe inspiring event.

I just ADORE the working dog and, of course, the "fur babies" that stay at home and take care of their "people", with their devotion and love!!!!! :)

CCI - Canine Companions for Independence offers Hearing Dogs....they are $100....(the cost of raising/training/housing is about $35,000 to $40,000). I think it's a great deal!

Service dogs are a lot of work and responsibilty....but, what they give back is well worth it! And they're a wonderful reminder to; "get out", "walk", "exercise" and "socialize!"

For children, they're especially wonderful....they assist the child in making friends and can literally open-up their world!!!!

Brenda will be on her 10th cruise in November....I can't even imagine how we cruised without her and we did!!!

The cruiselines are making it so much easier for the Service Dog....it's a pleasure to go with her......I can't say that about the first couple of cruises that we did.....I consider us the pioneers in this...and, hopefully, we've made it easier for all of those who followed!!!!

It sounds like you've got a good plan for your family....but, just know, that if you ever consider a "Hearing Dog", they can make a significant difference in how you or someone that you love goes through life! :)

Good shopper! I love my cart and wouldn't be without it for going to all means of transportation. We even use it when boarding planes. The TSA lets my DH push it through and I put all of our stuff and Brenda's stuff in it to walk to the door of the plane....then, they put a "tag" on it and we don't see it again until we deplane!

It really holds a lot and my DH will use it, while he won't use a walker!!!!! (It looks more like a shopping cart but serves the purpose of helping with balance, etc.)

Reno, I'm coming over right now to pick you up....it's so cool in L.A. today, it feels like winter is already here. I'm sure that will change....it's the "give it 10 minutes, it's bound to change, thing", I swear we're getting more like Texas every year! Our humidity gets worse every year!

Have a wonderful weekend, everyone! Talk to you next week! :)

Awwww! I feel the same way about those parks..:o ....I'm sure with your gentle and loving guidance he'll start feeling safer and safer!

Let us know how it goes!

Brenda is very fearful of the passageways between buildings that are open.....and stairs that don't have closesures.

On Princess, and on the Celebrity Summit; the stairs in the main foyer are all open and she has a difficult time going up and down them......we do it over and over again but I can tell she doesn't like it!!!! She won't refuse walking on the passageway but she insists on walking against the wall (if there is one) and will not walk against openings or glass windows that are above the first floor! She move to the other side of me....I move her back and just keep walking!!!!

They're just like people....somethings make them fearful and some don't......it doesn't really hamper her work....I just insist that she go with the flow!!! ;)

Peter, Susan, Cameron and Werin: WOW! WOW! WOW! What a fabulous journey you took us all on!!!! I loved it! And, the visual aids were superb!!!!!!

I want to do Quebec so badly but am very tentative because of the access problems......Also, CCI is now training the new pups to use escalators....It will make shopping and traveling so much easier!!!! I want to teach Brenny (we're going to a work-shop at CCI, in October, I think I'll bring up the escalator thing) and get some insights!

Why didn't you have HAL put Werin's Potty Box on your veranda? Just curious!

I so dislike when other passengers use the potty box as a giant ash tray or a trash disposal! I finally made signs that say....."DOGS POTTY BOX- PLEASE DO NOT DISGARD REFUGE" and I bring them with me when I cruise-just in case the box is placed in a public area!!! I must say 98% of the public are so, so wonderful about Service Dogs and their being in public places.....the other 2% can be troublesome, to say the least! I have had problems with taxi cabs and some touring buses.....Traveling with an SD is becoming easier and easier.....it takes time!!! And, education of the masses!

Peter, thanks so much for sharing your adventures with Werin......I love reading them!

You know best.....and, you certainly don't want to traumatize your kitties! :o

uppitycats: Thank you! FYI: Some CCI facilities train their Service Dogs while in the same room with cats/rabbits and birds. This is to desensitize the dogs to all sorts of animals and sounds in their environment.

Brenda can see a bird/squirrel/cat/rabbit and not even move an inch....but, the second she sees another dog, she immediately goes into that "gotta meet ya", "gotta meet ya" mode! :p She literally turns into a different dog.....It's one of her "quirks!" I don't think she'll ever change about this....I just have to remain on guard, when I think there might be another dog in sight. She needs a little extra "correction!" :rolleyes:

There is a Chicago CCI Satellite Office (not too far from Wisconsin.) It's in Woodstock, Illinois - (847) 816.7360. Just in case you might be interested in opening up your world and inviting an amazing "partner" into it!

In the meantime, enjoy your "fur babies" and write-in when you can!

Reno, you're "13"! How wonderful....Nancy is a really good caretaker!

Kim, Orson and Family....I, too, hope that we get to meet one day...who knows...Maybe on a cruise ship!!!! ;)

And, Orson, you are a handsome boy!!!!!!

Dear Orson and Family,

Congratulations on graduating the most amazing, difficult and phenomenal process of your life!

You must be a very special dog. The program that you and your "humans" have just gone through was so grueling and intense, but you did it with an organization that will be behind all of you, the rest of your lives!

Your "humans" are so lucky to have you....they must be very smart and patient. It takes a lot of both to graduate from CCI!!!!!

I'm a graduate, myself. I've been with Roz for 6 years and we really love and respect each other. I also love her "man"; Morey and her children. We're a "family!" When I'm not working....we all play and, I get the best massages from Morey!

They take me on cruises, airplanes, buses, traines and on really long car trips.....Oh! I've also been to Las Vegas....boy, you should see the looks when I walk through a casino......amazing!!!!! The bigger the crowd the more I hold my head up, really high!!!!!

I'm going to a work-shop, at CCI in Santa Rosa, with my "humans" in October. I love going there! That's where I graduated from. I get to see a lot of other really smart dogs, just like me. They also wear clothes! My "humans" call my clothes a "working vest", (very different than those civilian dogs) that I see walking and running around the streets. Some of them do the silliest things!

Orson, you'll love your new life! You'll get to go to the movies and into the malls; you'll get to see a lot of legs and human's who stare a lot. It's because you're so, so special! Watch and listen to your humans.....even though they don't have fur.....they love you and wouldn't ask you to do something that you couldn't do!!!!!!

Take your time......don't worry, you'll work through the "rough spots" together. Sometimes you'll feel like you can't get anything right. Take a deep breath....step back, sit....look at what's going on....and, try it again!!!!!

Oh! And, I'm sorry you're not black.....but yellow is also a nice color!

Again, congratulations to all of you! May your future together be filled with lots of good health and lots and lots of fun and laughter.....

Love and Licks,

Brenda & Her "Humans" :)

Reno would have made the most amazing service dog.....he has all the attributes it takes to be successful!!!!!

Enjoy him! He's a gift! ;)