DSmith91

7 hours ago, jland said:

I would like your email addresses please. Send to secajel882@ mail35.net

Thank you.

I'll forward  to you. 

@hostjazzbeau

37 minutes ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

I think this case is different than the others we have seen here, because eWaterways was not a travel agency but Ponant's (apparently) exclusive agent.  Because the UK number on Ponant's website connected to eWaterways, you can make the argument that Ponant clothed eWaterways in apparent authority to act in their name.  Under the doctrine of 'piercing the corporate veil' you could claim that Ponant has to accept the actions of eWaterways on their behalf as if they had done them directly.  Thus Ponant has 'constructively' received OP's deposit money even if they didn't actually receive it.  [This is an argument in US law.  I don't know if it applies in the UK, but we did get our legal system from the Mother country...]

I fully agree with what you have said and thank you for putting it so well.  Indeed, the UK number on Ponant's website directs you straight to eWaterways.

We have just received an update from Ponant saying that they are cancelling  our cruise even if it does go ahead, because of entry restrictions and quarantine measures, so at least we don't have  to pay the balance.  They have now offered 2000 euros off a next cruise along with $250 on board spend which still means we'd be still out of pocket by £1000.

The case continues...

Whichever option we take we will still be a deposit of over £3000 out of pocket because they are being quite canny in the way they have worded the options.  FCC plus 20% for the money we will have paid to Ponant.  No mention of the deposit amount as you say.  Anyway, we'll get onto it today.  Also if Ewaterways were due due pay Ponant 60 days before sailing date then that means Ponant have known about this for a month already and have only brought it to our attention yesterday!

@schnapperin 

I totally agree.

@parischris I understand what you are saying but the fact that Ponant took over the booking a year ago and said everything is in order...should that not mean that Ponant are responsible for the whole booking.  Ewaterways was the UK handling agent and we were directed to Ewaterways directly from Ponant website. Ewaterways were also in Australia and USA.

This has left me so angry that even if they came back and reinstated the deposit, I wouldn't want to cruise with them again.  I have already been researching other small cruise ship companies to do the cruise with in 2022 hopefully.

We shall get on to our credit card compant today.

Incidentally, we have a contact in Australia who has been doing a lot of research behind the scenes and has been in touch with a few high flyers in Ponant Australia.  I have email addresses should anyone need them.

When we rang the UK number on the Ponant site to book our cruise it took us through to Ewaterways who are(were) Ponant's agent in the UK.  it was the same contact we used for our Antarctica cruise 2 years earlier.  We didn't get any special deals, it was the UK agent for Ponant and we paid in GBP rather than Euros.

This is the first email I had about transferring to Ponant from Ewaterways, received on the 6th August 2019.

Due to recent structural changes within eWaterways Cruises Limited and an upcoming merger, we have agreed with Companie du Ponant that Your booking number BOOKING 1003684 - PONANT REF 253653 will from today be handled by our Ponant central reservation team. They will also be collecting your remaining balance of £7,102.20 for your booking Australia´s Iconic Kimberley which is due on 08^th of May 2020.

Prior to your cruise departure the central reservations team will be requesting your up to date Passport information and medical and insurance documents in case you haven’t yet submitted them.

You can reach the team on tel.: 0808 23 43 802 or via eMail to: mhuguet@ponant.com.

We thank you for booking with eWaterways Cruises Ltd  and  Ponant Yacht and Expedition Cruises and wish you a wonderful voyage.

Then on the 13th August 2019 I received this follow up from Ponant

You have recently received an email from Ewaterways Cruises Limited stating that from here on in Ponant will be directly handling your booking number # 1003684 - PONANT REF 253653 for your cruises (AUSTRALIA'S ICONIC KIMBERLEY -aboard Le Laperouse leaving on 06/08/2020). We just want to assure you that the booking is indeed confirmed in house and all is in order.  We will follow up with you directly when the balance is due.

So why are they only bringing this up now when the balance is due in 7 days.  As far as I'm concerned the dispute should be between Ponant and Ewaterways

11 minutes ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

We are finding out lots of new information about how cruise bookings work in the UK.  Passengers on other Cruise Critic boards report that their UK travel agents charge their credit card directly (to the travel agent) and then forward the funds to the cruise line (or don't).  When the cruise line cancels the cruise, they refuse to refund monies that they haven't received.  Doesn't ABTA cover your deposit with the defunct agent?

Unfortunately Ewaterways has gone bust unbeknownst to us until today. I can't for the  life of me find their ABTA number although the logo is on the emailed invoices sent to me.  We'll get the money back somehow, whether it's through insurance or credit card but on principle I don't want to do it.  The problem lies with Ponant and Ewaterways and if anyone has to take a hit it should be Ponant.

Ponant are really excelling!!

We booked our cruise through their UK call centre almost 2 years ago.  In August last year they said that they were going to be handling the booking from then on and that everything was in order.  The  final balance was to be paid direct to Ponant rather than their agent.  All good so far.  We are due to cruise in Australia which won't obviously happen but they have now dropped a bombshell saying that they never received our deposit from the agent and the agent has now gone bust.

This is their email which we received today basically saying that if the cruise doesn't go ahead we'll only get a FCC for the final balance paid and not the deposit.  Surely this can't be legally possible and that the problem (if there is one) is between the UK agent and Ponant.

What do you think of the email  I think it's appalling and I shall never cruise with them again.

FROM PONANT:

My colleague informed me of your call on Thursday, I was out of the office so I am coming bak to you only today.

In regards to the status of your cruise, we are still on stand-by.

As you know, we are in contact with the Australian authorities, and they have not yet given us a clear answer on if we can operate this cruise or not.

You booked this cruise initially with Ewaterways, which, as you know, no longer exists. As we had agreements with Ewaterways, they only paid Ponant 60 days prior to sailings.

Ponant made the decision to privilege it's direct customers, such as yourself, by maintaining the reservations, even without deposits paid, and even if it meant that we were loosing a part of the value of the booking.

I am explaining this to you as we do not have the payment of your deposit which you paid to Ewaterways directly.

Therefore, given the current circumstances, there are three solutions :

1/ You decide to wait and see if the cruise is maintained, and pay your balance 30 days prior to sailing.

If the cruise ends up being cancelled by Ponant ; we will offer a credit of 100% of the amount you will have paid to Ponant, and in addition, a 20% commercial gesture, to be applied on your next booking as a discount (20% calculated on the port/port basis of  the cruise only).

If the cruise is maintained by Ponant, but you cannot travel ; we will offer a credit of 100% of the amount you will have paid to Ponant, to be used for a replacement booking.

2/ The cruise is cancelled by Ponant before you pay the balance ; we will offer you a 20% commercial gesture, to be applied on your next booking as a discount (20% calculated on the port/port basis of  the cruise only).

3/ You cannot travel, or decide to cancel, but Ponant maintains the cruise, and you do not pay the balance of your booking ; as we do not have any payment on your booking, we will not be able to offer you a credit, nor a commercial gesture.

I keep my promise to contact you as soon as I have the updated informaton concerning your cruise.

Now Ponant have pulled the cruise cancellation page from their website.  Hopefully working on the updated version as the 7th May one was so out of date.

2 hours ago, Vesude said:

Do you have a link to this part of the T&C? I can’t find it...

Section 11.9 of T&C's.  We are in the UK.  I presume their T&C's are the same worldwide.

http://docs.ponant.com/CGV/CGV-en.pdf

Vesude.......

11.9 Where CDP is the Cruise Organiser, and no matter the reason for cancellation, no compensation is due to the Traveller, who will be able to choose between the following solutions:(i) A full refund of the Contract price; (ii) Another Service at the same price; (iii) A Service at a lower price and a refund for the price difference between the two Services based on the advertised prices. Travellers must inform CDP of their choice as soon as possible and in any event before the deadline mentioned in the cancellation document

16 minutes ago, Vesude said:

Does anyone have a copy of Ponant former T&A. So before they changed them?

If you're asking about your rights if Ponant cancels your cruise, the T&Cs on the website still states that you have the option of a full refund.

I'm hoping they will update in the next couple of days.  It's almost a month since they last updated and I'm waiting and hoping to see my cruise cancellation on there.

All cruise ships capable of carrying more than 100 passengers are banned from Australia until at least 17th September, but Ponant still says at the present time our cruise is on for the 6th August despite their ship being taken off the schedule  for Kimberley cruising. 

9 minutes ago, Seabiscuit68 said:

lil_stormi_pug is where my original post can be found.   2nd IG is Nedklo where I’m targeting cruise influencers and commenting on their Ponant/PG posts.  I’m going to do a similar post as my original on this account soon. 

Thanks Seabiscuit68.  I think I'll have to register for an Instagram account to keep track on what's gong on.

1 minute ago, luxury-lizard said:

I'm sure our situation was far from unique - when Ponant cancelled all cruises worldwide - it was effective immediately .... so many customers would have already travelled to the starting point of their cruise - maybe even been en-route.

 

OTOH - if ours would have proceeded we could have ended up floating around the Indian Ocean with no ports allowing the ship to dock .... a very real possibility.

I was hasty in my response.  After writing it I thought the halting of all sailing due to Covid-19 was the reason why it was cancelled at such short notice.  Bobbing about in the ocean wouldn't have been a better alternative.  I hope Ponant gives us more notice if they need to cancel.

19 minutes ago, luxury-lizard said:

Hum - very interesting regarding successful credit card refund - perhaps Ponant will take action before this becomes a 'landslide' - particularly when it reaches more widely read social media sites.

 

In my case - I can 'live' with a credit BUT felt the 20% extra did not sufficiently compensate me for the loss encountered - e.g. flights 'in vain' from Sydney-Cape Town - arrived in Cape Town to find the cruise was cancelled one day prior to sailing - cost $12,000. I've made a travel insurance claim for the return portion of the flights (still waiting for a response) as our original return flights (many weeks later) could not be used.

That's outrageous!  Letting you know within a day of due travel is well out of order.

What other social media sites are people using to highlight these issues?

14 minutes ago, jonikal said:

 

 

Excellent news indeed!

Excellent news.  Delighted to hear that.

29 minutes ago, Vesude said:

Thanks for this. For me it’s clear! 

You're welcome.

Rights of passengers where travel is cancelled.

I have found the following (and bookmarked for future reference) to be very useful and written in English.

https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=3c4d9f0f-57b5-4470-a0c9-6d298ad39f7b

34 minutes ago, Seabiscuit68 said:

I’m in.  I’ve set up another IG account and continue to make comments on Ponant and PG IG.  I noticed that some of my earlier PG comments have been deleted. Anything we can do on a coordinated basis will have more impact. 

Seabiscuit68.....Can you put your link up please? We don't need it yet as we aren't due to sail till August, but just in case...thanks.

1 hour ago, Vesude said:

We booked in 2018 also. Can you copy-paste that part of The T&C here?
I am going on with my fight! If anyone wants to join?

These T&C's were updated on 23rd January 2020 ans still available to read on Ponant's website.  We are in the UK so I don't know if ours may be different from other countries.  I doubt it though.

11.9 Where CDP is the Cruise Organiser, and no matter the reason for cancellation, no compensation is due to the Traveller, who will be able to choose between the following solutions:(i) A full refund of the Contract price; (ii) Another Service at the same price; (iii) A Service at a lower price and a refund for the price difference between the two Services based on the

advertised prices. Travellers must inform CDP of their choice as soon as possible and in any event before the deadline mentioned in the cancellation documents.

On 4/29/2020 at 2:13 PM, Vesude said:

Together with some other duped Ponant cruisers, we are about to send a out press release about the fact that Ponant has changed their general terms and conditions, after the Covid-19 outbreak. 

When we booked (in 2018 for a 2020 cruise) the following terms were valid.

Doesn't that refer to the 'worry-free policy for new bookings made after the 9th March this year?

We are in the UK and due to cruise in August this year,  We booked 2 years ago when the T&C's stated a full refund in case of cancellation by Ponant.  Their T&C's updated in January, and available on the website still state that a full refund is due if the cruise is cancelled.

I hadn't realised that Ponant could change their T&C's after purchase.  I thought the T&C's that were in place when we purchased our cruise would still stand.  Obviously not.

An update on final balance payment dates.  I sent Ponant a message yesterday through their website community page asking about a delay in paying our final balance.  We are scheduled to pay £7000,  90 days prior to departure but I had read they were relaxing this by 30 days.  They have come back to me and said that under the current circumstances the are delaying final payments till 30 days prior to cruising.  I'm happy with that as it was better than I was hoping for.