Itried4498

The Navigator visits Catalina Island every week, so it’s not an issue. The boats used to tender are the same ones that take people from Pedro/Long Beach/Dana Point in the morning, returning in the early evening (tendering in between). In the past, various cruise lines have secured tenders at the last minute, but perhaps the boats were being used or the cost was too high. When I was on one of the tenders last month, the owner of the company was on our boat and commented that he was losing money off his current contracts due to the spike in fuel. As you mentioned, it’s pretty much cold, windy and rocky year-round headed north… the exception being August/September/October but only if the weather cooperates. We were going to take the 5-day Cabo trip on RCL, but I’m glad we didn’t.

We'll be on the Navigator again for Labor Day; I'm sure Eric will be great, but we'll miss May and her awesome energy! Too bad she couldn't stick around for the voyages in which the ship actually goes somewhere, instead of floating off the coast (but I'm not surprised - she's been on the Navigator for 6 months and was clearly tired our last trip).

Circa April, the Family Harbor Lounge began closing at 9PM (previously, it was 24 hours, although in years' past it closed earlier). Soft serve ice cream, juices, milk, water, coffee and tea are served all day long. A light continental breakfast is served early, light snacks (chips and finger sandwiches, for example) are served in between lunch and dinner, and a couple variety of cookies are put out in the evening. They had video game systems, as well as a couple of secluded rooms in which a family could watch TV or hang out together. Probably very similar to the Mardi Gras, I'd imagine. It could get crowded for breakfast, but there was rarely more than 2-3 families in the lounge. Rarely did anybody use the video game system or hang out in the private rooms. Food goes really quickly... lots of people have no shame in literally taking every back back to their rooms. Probably similar to what you experienced.

The entertainment programs evolve, but rarely change. If you cruise a lot, the entertainment will become stale. But an excellent CD will put their own spin on it, injecting some life and making it worth your while to attend. Of course....if you couldn't careless about these events, then it's a non-factor no matter what. A couple of points... - On any given cruise this year, per JH, about half the passengers are first time cruisers. You may be a veteran cruiser who knows the entertainment program inside out, thus the announcements annoy you, but some people are actually listening to the announcements. - Part of the CD's job is to get attendance at various events. These events enhance most people's time on the ship, and make them more likely to return.

A lot of cases don't happen until passengers have embarked from the cruise. These aren't reported/attributed to that cruise, and in the era of self-testing, often aren't reported to the health department as well. We got off a 4-day cruise on RCL's Navigator of the Seas two weeks ago and we both tested positive for COVID. My illness wasn't bad-bad, but it was bad - it kept me out of work last week, and I've required two or three 10-minute naps every day this week to get through work (and I go to bed immediately when I get home). We were suppose to be on the Paradise over Labor Day weekend, but are going to cancel since I'm a tax accountant and can't afford to get sick that time of year (I'll lose clients if I don't get their returns out).

If you like to cruise, than cruise :). But any "good" AI is going to be more costly than a cruise, so if you have the time and money, it'd be a better option. One thing to remember - in late October/early November, it's generally on the cooler side along the California / Baja coast, so it will be chilly on embarkation + your first & last sea days, to the point that most people choose to stay indoors and it gets quite crowded. I live in the Los Angeles area and the lion's share of my cruises have been on the 7-day Mexican Rivera plus 3/4-day Ensenada, but the Panorama would not be my choice for three B2B cruises. That said, we've had some goofy weather lately (it reached 100 during that time period last year), so who knows? 🙂

Just an FYI: act quick! We had an upgrade offer for a November cruise, but wanted to think about it overnight, and it was no longer available.

...because I'm sure Virgin and its whopping ONE ship operating from the US is oh-so-influential. Maybe Carnival's keeping a careful eye on Margaritaville of the Seas as well!

I would expect these cruises to be at or near capacity. Carnival is aggressively pricing its fall cruises, but cruises over Thanksgiving are an exception - that's especially true for the few special itineraries timed for Thanksgiving. But Carnival did aggressively price its holiday (including Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's) cruises during wave season: we booked interior three rooms on the Miracle for about $550 each (two people per room). Given the pricing trends, I'd bet Carnival booked sufficient rooms over wave season and is seeing strong enough demand that it doesn't have to discount rooms further.

It was 11.99 on Navigator of the Seas last week. Multiple users claimed it was 7.99 earlier this year, likely when crowds were light, so yes they have been raising prices. Unless you really like JR, I’d skip. If you have a JR nearby your home, join their e club and you’ll receive perpetual coupons that will make make most burgers and fries $12 or less.

We don’t do upcharge restaurants, but Pigs and Anchor has dedicated outdoor seating and is open for lunch. Note that the coast surrounding California and Baja Mexico is known for its summer cloud coverage, and this year has been the strongest in quite some time. We were on the RCL’s Navigator of the Seas last week, and even though the ship moves very slowly (four day cruise from LA to Ensenada, which is only 150 miles away) it was way too cold to eat outside for my liking, and I generally prefer it on the cooler side. Maybe the weather will cooperate :). BTW, we got off the ship Friday morning and by Saturday night I felt like a train hit me. At at-home test confirmed I had Covid, and a follow up PCR affirmed the result. I’m feeling better today, so it seems like I’m over the hump. Covid is out there, be safe!!!

Data from websites that have tracked cruise fares for decades demonstrates that Carnival is the price leader. That’s not always going to be the case — our last three cruises were on RCL, as they were booked last minute and RCL had a better price — but if you plan your cruise in advance and follow fare, it’s almost certain that Carnival will have the best price. Big ships with lots of amenities are nice, but if you’re not interested in these amenities they have no value. Ultimately, everyone cruises for different reasons.

We got off the Navigator of the Seas on a Friday. Late yesterday I began feeling like crap, to the point that it kept me up all night. We each took two of our government-paid at-home tests and both came back positive. Covid is definitely here…

1) yes, pay in cruise workers’ home countries is totally relevant to this discussion *in regards to the points being made*. These aren’t Motel 6 positions in Oklahoma — these are historically coveted, competitive jobs that pay significantly more than the cruise workers would in their home countries. Using data from 2018/19 (the most recent years readily available), ship workers in menial positions earn similar wages to US workers in menial positions. Shop workers also get a ton of benefits that those US workers don’t. Alas, the perpetual argument that these workers are underpaid is FALSE. Markets dictate wages, not warm and fuzzy feelings. 2 and 3) RCL also makes it clear that the tips are optional and can be increased or removed at any time.

Los Angeles is a poor cruising market - Carnival had been the sole year-round operator for a decade. Norwegian, Princess, Disney, etc. served the market seasonally, generally when it becomes too cold to serve Alaska (from Seattle/Vancouver). In the winter, it’s cold and often rainy in SoCal. In the spring, it’s still chilly and there’s a strong current making it very windy. The summer is plagued by cloud coverage, which makes cruises chilly and cold. At best, you have a few weeks out of the year in which weather conditions are what people expect of a cruise. and as bad as LA is, SF is worse…

The point is that people follow US customs, not that of the country they’re visiting. In the 1990s and 2000s, restaurants in places like Cancun and Punta Canta added 10% service charges to meals and tipping wasn’t expected. But ignorant Americans decided to tip, anyway, and now tips are expected. As recently as the early 2010s, a meal in Cancun at a chain restaurant was about half that of the US. Now, those meals cost more, despite the fact that the double purchases DOUBLE the pesos…

Sometimes facts help. In 2019, RCL reported the median wage for ship staff at roughly $20K. That does not include gratuities. That same year, the BLS reported the median personal income in the USA - that includes tips - at 34K. Walmarts mean wage for a FT worker in the USA that year was just over $19K. Keep in mind that while Americans pay federal, state (with few exceptions) and payroll taxes, many (if not most) cruise employees pay no taxes on their income (the US is one of the few nations to tax worldwide income). And that’s not even getting into the benefits extended to cruise employees, including room and board. About half of Columbians and over 2/3s of people living in India live in poverty, with median wages per month in the hundreds.

Au contraire. I’d handily bet I’m one of the most generous persons on this forum, donating a large percentage of my time and income. In contrast, the extent of “charity” for most forum members is leaving generous tips to well compensated cruise employees, since it’s their happy place and makes them feel good.

I agree - after all, it's a narrative pushed by corporate America to justify low wages. But my point is that people become so emotionally invested in tipping when cruising, traveling to low-wage environments like Mexico, even at Disney World, etc., but could care less about the low-wage environment back at home. A good example: a few years ago we went to an AI in Punta Cana with my parents, and my parents showered the employees with hundreds of dollars in tips. We ended up arriving home in the middle of the night (flight was delayed) and the only place open was Denny's, where my parents decided a meager tip -- to somebody working their butt off at 3AM -- was sufficient, and that they should get a "real job." Reality is, the AI jobs are equivalent to domestic, union factory jobs of years past. If you want to make a true difference, instead of leaving generous tips on cruises or abroad, donate to a good chairty.

I agree, Guy's Burgers blows away Johnny Rockets. On my Navigator cruises, there was never a line at JR, and most of the business they did seemed to be milkshakes.

This illustrates the point I was making. The guaranteed wage your housekeeper is making is far more than he/she would make in their home country. There's a reason why so many of them have iPhones, Apple Watches, etc. For many waitresses back home, that 20% will go a lot further. People just aren't as emotionally invested - we're programmed to think the waitress at home should get a "real job," but we shower the waitresses on the ship with lavish tips.

Last Friday, we got a super deal on the Navigator of the Seas; since it would trigger an Amex offer (initiated by the above B2B trip), it cost less than staying home, so we went again! I may do a pictorial review, but I wanted to add the following: - 3800 people on this cruise (4JUL - 8JUL), the most on this ship since it re-entered service late last fall. - It's a period of heavy transition -- several employees told us they had just joined the ship, and when we were getting off today, there was a ton of crew luggage being inspected & loaded onto a truck (presumably going to LAX). - Several of the entertainment options that were present on our B2B cruises, were not present on this one. - The buffet was excellent, but on the B2B cruises it was superb -- on the sea day, it filled every single station, and included an elaborate dessert bar featuring a chocolate fountain. On port days, it featured a special dessert; for example, a huge apple pie with ice cream. This time, no special dessert and on the sea day, it was the same as non-sea days. Like the reduction in entertainment, I suspect this is a cost cutting move. - There was a special Fourth of July show -- a couple of line dancing songs, sandwiched between the Cupid Shuffle, ending with balloons dropping. It was interesting, but you could tell how disappointed the crowd was :). One thing I'd like to see -- now that the ship is ported out of Los Angeles instead of Miami, can we convert the Caribbean theming to Mexican? At the very least, replace Caribbean night in the buffet with Mexican. I struck up a conversation with one of the cast. I was told most of the cast are Royal Caribbean Dancers, which is inferior to full production staff. Currently, the dancers are joining the entertainment staff for sailaway plus performing Showgirls. The person told me that the ship is poised to do two, seven-day runs per month for the late fall/ winter/ early spring season, and that RCL may bring in a production staff but the ice show and dancers will go on hiatus (presumably their contracts are up anyway) for that time. We will see!

Valid points do not become "pointless" when you disagree.

No, it shows you completely didn’t understand my point.

Few people think twice about the low wages Walmart, McDonalds, etc. pay their employees (or that many of their FT employees are collecting government aid), yet they become emotionally invested in cruise employees earn. The base wages and benefits are highly competitive… have you ever researched wages in India, Columbia, etc.? These people aren’t working for tips, although I’m sure they appreciate them.