ducklite

I'm late to this topic, but for anyone else looking for this information...  We spoke to our PCP and she suggested being fully up-to-date on all the normal stuff (Covid, MMR, influenza, pneumonia, shingles depending on your age, DPT, etc.) and also wanted us to get Hep A and B. 

She also referred us to a travel medicine clinic who suggested Typhoid and rabies.  We will definitely do Typhoid before we leave, we're still thinking about rabies, but leaning towards it as our travel plans for the next few years include a number of high risk regions.

Our PCP also gave us prescriptions for Cipro which we will fill and take with us.  It's our understanding that in Egypt is' not if but when the "Pharoah's Revenge" will hit you, regardless of how careful you are.

This could all be avoided by a few steps.

1.  The CDC could require anyone cruising from a US Port show either proof of being fully vaccinated OR proof that they have had COVID and have sufficient antibodies.

2.  The CDC could require anyone cruising from a US port obtain travel insurance that covers a government ordered quarantine should the ship have COVID cases.

3.  Due to #1, the risk of anyone on board contracting COVID are very slim.

4.  Just like with airline passengers, the CDC can require a COVID test performed no more than 72 hours prior to returning to the US.  That testing could be performed on the ship 2-3 days prior to returning to port.  The CDC should waive that requirement for cruises lasting four days or less.
 

5.  If there was a positive case, the cruise line would then be responsible for setting up a "quarantine hotel" or space on a military base, etc. and the transportation of all passengers to the facility and then back to the port/airport at the end of the quarantine.  The cost of this to be borne by the passengers via their insurance.

While this might not work on the large ships, it is certainly viable on ships like Windstar and even the smaller Regent/Seabourn/Crystal/etc. ships.  I'll bet Disney could also easily do it on their classic ships.  They could do the PCR test on everyone the morning they arrive at their private island, fly the vials to a lab in Miami, and get results in 48 hours.

I don't believe shorts are allowed except at the beach BBQ.  Otherwise what you suggest is fine.  If you are talking about the evening event, you won't need a bathing suit.  The daytime event happens while everyone is on the beach, and then yes, you'll want your bathing suit.  

Good God I hope not.  I can't imagine any Windstar passenger being even remotely interested in ships that large.  Most are 600-800 or so passengers, and with what I understand they are quite long in the tooth.

I suspect that they will go to one of the Asian operators. They might be perfect for a Chinese line.

We would not cruise if we had to take cruise line shore excursions.  They are typically either drive by's or spend way too much time waiting for people who disrespect the time of others or at "special shopping locations."  We were planning on exactly one ship sponsored shore excursion on the Baltic Cruise this past summer, and it was to the missile silos in Lithuania.  Other options didn't make sense.

We had booked a cruise for fall of 2020 which was cancelled due to dry dock issues (irate that the ship wasn't in dry dock and was redeployed for a different itinerary the same time frame).  We rescheduled for a different cruise which was cancelled due to Covid.  I get that.  Rescheduled for a different cruise in the fall which was cancelled no reason given a week after we booked it and months before they cancelled the fall sailing season.  We wanted to rebook a different cruise over the summer of 2021, but the amount that they wanted for a deposit was far more than I was willing to let them hold onto for over a year, so we forfeited the whopping $300 in FCC's we had earned and got our deposit back.  I don't see the point of letting Windstar hold thousands of dollars for a cruise they may or may not cancel for any number of reasons, including chartering the ship.

9 minutes ago, twangster said:

 

Polls are easily manipulated by asking questions that lead to the answer the pollster is seeking.  

Well, as someone who lives within driving distance of KW who has in the past and would continue to spend long weekends there, I can say we've avoided it due to the level of cruise ships dropping off thousands of day trippers.  With the small ships we would never notice, so would be far more inclined to vist.

On 11/10/2020 at 1:02 PM, twangster said:

 

Great news.  Between Seabourne, Regent Seven Seas, Silver Sea and Azamara there appear to be twenty one cruises available to book that stop in Key West through the bookable window into 2022. 

 

2021 - 9 stops

2022 - 11 stops   

 

Granted only Azamara and Seven Seas have released 2022 bookings.  If Silver Sea repeats the 2021 calls on Key West add two more stops in 2022.  

 

Bargain rates on sale for as low as $7,300 for a couple up over $26k on some sailings but the service is really good at that rate.  

 

Four in the RCG family, two on Azamara, two on Silver Sea.  The rest are on Regent Seven Seas.  

 

If the charter amendment went into effect on Jan. 1. 2021 Silver Sea has one stop in January and one in April.  Azamara has a stop in November and one in December of 2021.  

 

Seven Seas will be the predominant cruise line in Key West now.  Some months they even stop twice.   Five calls in 2021, eleven in 2022.  One ship has 490 passengers, the other 750 passengers.  

 

KW will hardly know a ship is in town.  Just what the voters have demanded.  

Windstar also has itineraries from time to time that include a stop in Key West.  Max passenger load is 350-ish.

On 11/6/2020 at 4:54 PM, twangster said:

 

Not spending a dime except for an estimated $85m contributed to the economy annually and 1,250 direct or indirect jobs.

 

I get it.   If you own a hotel day tourists contribute very little to your bottom line.  When I stayed on Sugarloaf Key they felt the same way in Key West.  There is much cheaper accommodations 10-20 miles away and if you have a car it's an easy drive.   So they tried to reduce parking to encourage people to stay in Key West.   

 

Just like the hotel and shopping mall probably realized little revenue from cruise ship visitors the appliance stores and the hardware stores saw few day visitors buying a toaster.   Not all businesses benefit from day visitors in any tourist town.  That applies to beach or tourist towns all over America.

 

It is a complete exaggeration to say that cruise ships visitors don't spend a dime.  

They did a lot of polling of people who were prospective visitors to Key West.  A disproportionate number stated they wouldn't visit when it was cruise ship season.  They did the math, and decided they will lose the cruise ship business in favor of the people who visit and stay.  The amount of revenue that type of tourist generates is millions more than the cruise ships--with much lower impact on their quality of life.  

On 11/4/2020 at 9:45 AM, flamingos said:

 

I don't think they will.  There is a balance between being a tourist town and being a place to live; I hope this works for them.

I have several friends who live and work in Key West.  Two of them are native's.  While Key West welcomes tourism, they want the type that comes, spends the night in a hotel, has three meals a day, and then partakes of some of the local nightlife in the evening.  The large cruise ships were docking, people were getting off, walking around, not spending a dime in Key West, and leaving.  That is not the type of tourism they seek, and their vote said that loud and clear.

It could be already chartered.

On 8/6/2020 at 8:09 AM, 6rugrats said:

Yes, after that , I didn’t sail on Windstar again for quite some time.

We've decided to forgo the ~$200 in FCC and get our deposit back.  We're hoping to head to Europe next year, but not on a cruise.  We are going to give Windstar a few years to get their dry dock issues straightened out before we try to cruise with them again.   

On 7/21/2020 at 11:50 AM, Petoonya said:

@ducklite

Hard to have 3 cruises canceled. I'm guessing that one of them was COVID related but curious. Were the others also charters/changes of itinerary?

First was because of dry dock delays.  Second was because of COVID.  Third was who knows why?  I couldn't really get a straight answer about it.  I saw it probably the day they posted it, called and booked it, a week later tried to find it to send a link to a friend who was interested in it, and couldn't find it.  Called them and they said it was cancelled.  That was a couple months ago and I'm still waiting for an email informing me of this.  

I've had three cruises booked with them in the past 12 months and they've all been cancelled for one reason or another.  I'm really not even sure that I want to attempt to book another cruise.  I'm out what I paid for the travel insurance, as they won't move it for a 4th time, and the last time I spoke with them, they are looking for a significant amount above the $1200 or so of my cash they are already holding to book another cruise.  I'm pretty much thinking that I'm not really wanting to give them another penny until they get their act together.

We had rescheduled to a sailing next July that has gone dark.  There is a sailing mid June, then the next three or so weeks are missing (including the 10 day cruise we had booked) and then it resumes again.  I'm not going to be happy if they've chartered the ship, particularly because we opted to not wait for a cancellation with a FCC to jump on the great fare we had found.

Our first cruise was cancelled due to the delays in the shipyard, the replacement due to COVID and it looks like the next replacement might be cancelled due to a charter.  I'm not sure what we'll do if this is the case, but I'm leaning towards just accepting that the universe is whispering in my ear and outright cancelling.

On 5/23/2020 at 8:17 PM, TakingFlight said:

Let us know what you find out as I may want to do the same next year.  I tried to do this for a cruise in Europe and was told no. It might vary by country. Of course everything I thought I knew about travel from the last 30+ years has gone out the window this year. It’s a brave new world for travel going forward, that’s for sure. 

The difference is that most cruises in French Polynesia never leave that country, so there are no immigration issues.  

Just now, Aquahound said:

 

Ok.  That's emotion talking.  I'm not flaming your opinion as Floridian but speaking factually, a crime was not committed. 

If they can prove a causal link between anyone getting off that ship and someone being infected as a result, I believe it might be possible to charge someone.  It would definitely be enough to bring a cause of action for a tort.

5 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

I could see a civil suit under the DOHSA for improper care, but not a criminal case.

Criminal by whom?  Who was responsible for the Public Health regulations regarding a ship entry into port?  Who granted the ship clearance to enter port?  Who ensured that the Public Health regulations, at that time, were met or not met, as passengers disembarked?  I don't see HAL as the answer to any of those questions, but the answer to those questions could lead to who might be criminally responsible.

Accessories to the act.

1 minute ago, Aquahound said:

 

Criminal how?  I didn't like that scenario either, but what's the crime? 

Domestic terrorism.  Attempted assault.  It's no different than not disclosing HIV status to intimate partners.  The cruise line, Governor, and President were accessories.

I can't speak for Celebrity, but Windstar has changed final payment to 30 days prior from 90.  It's possible Celebrity has done the same.  I'd call to get a definite answer rather than relying on these boards.

17 hours ago, chipmaster said:

put your contaminated ID back in your carrier and touch some other part of your body/luggage and then even after washing your hands viola you are infected!

 

We've gotten into the habit of carrying a mini hand sanitizer on the key ring and after using a credit card or license, we pour out sanitizer, use it liberally on our hands, the card, and the sanitizer bottle before putting them away.  If we've touched anything, we also use sanitizer before retrieving the card to begin with.  We were never "hand sanitizer" people before this. We just believed in washing hands frequently.  But the new reality is that we use a lot of hand sanitizer when we're (rarely) out of the house.  I expect that to continue for quite some time. 

36 minutes ago, Aquahound said:

It's a bit of a stretch to say cruise line CEOs committed a crime, and I say that as a subject matter expert in the field.  What I have seen through this ordeal were a few cases where individual ships violated Captain of the Port (COTP) orders by failing to disclose the proper attestations before mooring.  That actually is a federal felony but even in those cases, it's not the top brass who wears the silver bracelets and who receive the privilege of visiting our lovely federal hotel.  It's the ship's master.  But even in normal times, COTP violations are not typically pursued unless especially egregious.  These aren't normal times.  Courthouses aren't open and grand juries are not convening.  The likelihood of anyone being arrested on a COTP order anytime soon is slim to none.  

 

Here's what could apply to the top brass but again, it's a stretch.  Let's look at the deaths that occurred on board, such as on Zaandam.  18USC1115 (Misconduct or Neglect of Ship Officers) could apply because the statute includes corporate executives.  However, US jurisdiction needs to be established.  These are foreign flagged ships on the high seas.   The only way it could be applied is if the deceased are US citizens and if prosecutors see a path to prosecution through the US's Special Maritime and Territorial Jurisdiction, which includes US citizens on the high seas.  I could easily argue that case but where it becomes a stretch is the fact Zaandam tried to port in numerous places but was denied.  

It was utter crap that it was allowed into Florida without all of them going into a full two week quarantine on either their or HAL's dime.  Instead sick and exposed people were allowed to walk off without a quarantine and to the public airport and get on commercial passenger airplane and spread the virus further.  That was criminal behavior.

3 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

A ridiculous notion.  Are you unaware of ANY cases where individual corporate managers have been held criminally responsible for actions taken by them in their capacity as managers?  

Enron off the top of my head.  I'm sure there are numerous others.

9 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

I never said that it is not an individual responsibility but I think to say that all the onus is on the individual is wrong. Travel insurance is optional and as long as countries are willing to take money from uninsured travellers they bear some responsibility for their care when things go wrong. 

 

 

I actually don't understand what you are referring to in this last statement. Is there any way you could clarify? 

I think they mean that people will flock to your country and then suddenly need medical care which they have no plans to pay for.

Just now, clo said:

Perhaps this has been mentioned here but what does "proof of insurance" look like?

The summary of benefits page that has the policy number, names of insureds, and limits of liability for coverage.