pcakes122

I never even discussed math here. And as far as whether or not I created this email myself (😂) I am not the only NCL player who received this email today. As they say, if you know you know. 😉 And it looks like you don't. (Sorry! 🤷‍♀️)

If you don't gamble, why are you so invested in this? Just forget about it and move on. I have no idea what you like to do on cruises for entertainment, but whatever it is - enjoy! If we (players) didn’t feel we were coming out on the plus side, we wouldn't do it. And if you think I'm about to turn down free cruises because of a moral objection to perceived gaming industry conspiracies, that's not gonna happen. In fact, look what came in today's email from the NCL Conspiracy Department:

Reading is fundamental. Lol. Nowhere in what you quoted says that you had to LOSE $600 an hour. It says you have to PLAY $600 an hour. From that, the casino projects your "long-term ESTIMATED loss" and gives you 30% of THAT (note - it doesn't say you EVER have to actually lose even ONE CENT of that "estimated loss!") But you still got the comp offer equal to 30% of the ESTIMATE! Are you starting to get it now?? PS The estimated loss is the "theo" (or theoretical loss) we keep talking about!)

Actually you'd be surprised how many people are interested in casino comps. We have an NCL casino FB group devoted to just this topic. Some people have been playing in the ships' casinos for years and had no idea that they would be eligible for free cruises and are appreciative to learn how it works! (There's also CC group on the topic, but not limited to NCL.)

Please go to the link and test the calculator. It never asks for ANY information about wins OR losses. 🤯 Or just Google comps and how they work. This is exhausting and I don't think you really want to understand how it works or you would have caught on by now.

I just said that based on my own personal comp experience WITH NCL that the calculations from that calculator are right on target. I use it ALL THE TIME to calculate my comps when I plan my future cruises. It hasn't failed me yet. And AGAIN, it has NOTHING to do with wins or losses. I've continued to respond because I'm hoping that there are folks out there that really want to understand how to gauge comps. You clearly are not a player so none of this has anything to do with you.

I actually linked you a calculator upthread so that you could see how it works. That calculator is a great gauge for NCL casino comps. You keep referring to "gambling losses" in conversations about comps and we've explained multiple times that one thing has nothing to do with the other. If you need me to walk you through the calculator and explain how that relates to an NCL cruise comp I'd be happy to do so.

Same with cigarette companies, liquor companies, even soda and candy companies, etc. (Not to mention unmentionable companies lol) Casinos aren't the only ones using these tactics, but somehow they are getting a bad rap here lol However, those tactics don't work on people who don't have addictive personalities. So yes, if you are predisposed to lose your self-control you should beware. As I've said before, if you're engaging in ANY activities you can't easily walk away from, you probably shouldn't be partaking at all.

Same to the drinkers! 🥂🍻👏 Keep that NCL revenue tap flowing! PS Comps are 30-40% of theo (industry standard - no big secret!) In fact, here's an online calculator to help you figure it out https://urcomped.com/vip/calculator. Just another example of non-players not really knowing how it works. It's not all a big, mysterious secret conspiracy. 😂

It all depends on what type of entertainment is exciting for you. Lots of people love to drink a lot on a cruise. Drinking does nothing for me and doesn't appeal to me IN THE LEAST. A day of bar-hopping on a cruise would be a torturous bore for me, but I could spend that time in the casino and have a blast. I plan/budget (within my means) for gambling in the casino as part of the cost of my vacation. Win or lose, it's all a part of the experience. (If you have to think twice about what you lost in the casino, you are betting above your head.) Everybody has a different hobby and many hobbies are very expensive. I have a friend who pays $47K a year for a membership to play GOLF! I think he's crazy and he probably thinks I'm crazy for what I spend gambling. 😂 But, all kidding aside, as long as you have the money, do what makes you happy. Our point (the gambling crew) is that there seems to be a prevailing opinion that all gambling is a losing proposition and there's no way to stay ahead because of "the math." And we're telling you that between 1) the entertainment factor and 2) the comps and perks, we are doing OK 👍🏻😁 If we weren't, we'd find another hobby (not golf lol)

I know it's hard to wrap your head around, but you are completely wrong about comps. A casino looks COMPLETELY differently at a player who loses $2,000 by betting $1 a spin on slot machines over 5 days vs. player who loses $2,000 in one hour betting $50 a pull. The loss is EXACTLY the same. The comp offer would be COMPLETELY different. I don't think free cruises are in your future anyway, so believe what you want. I just responded to clarify your misinformation for others.

That's not how it works. I know you're trying to be funny, but you are spreading misinformation and there may be people here who really want to learn about casino comps from people who actually know how it works (I previously worked in the gaming industry.) Casino comps are NOT driven by losses AT ALL. It has been shared here and on other threads that comps are driven by your "theo" (THEORETICAL loss - NOT actual loss.) There are a couple of factors in the calculation of your theo, but a key factor is your average bet - which equates to your risk. Your actual wins or losses do not factor into your theo AT ALL. No one should actually play "for comps", but higher bets lead to greater comps. (Not an occasional high bet here and there when you are "up", but average high wagers for a sustained period of time.) From an odds perspective, the more $$$ you risk the more the casino can potentially gain (the odds are in their favor) so the greater offers they will make in order to get those high bettors back. That's how it actually works.

When did I ever say I play just for comps? You must be confusing me for someone else. NCL doesn't have a casino offer website (you have to call to book), but here's an example of my current offers with Royal Caribbean. I have no intention of redeeming any of them. So yes, I turn a lot of them down.

I don't think you really understand how it works if you think you need to pay yourself for the time you spent playing on your vacation LOL. People who gamble on vacation do it because it's entertainment for them. Some people like watching shows, some people like scuba diving, some people like gambling. It's fun for us, and we would do it whether we were getting comps or not. As far as how to be assured that you don't lose more than your comps worth? Just don't. (And if you can't stop yourself, that's a whole other problem and you probably shouldn't be gambling at all.) People who don't gamble always want to to generalize and say that gamblers always lose (overall.) What we're trying to tell you -- FROM EXPERIENCE -- is that it's not always the case. I can only really speak for myself, so others who have different gambling habits may have a different story. Personally, I don't gamble at all on land (I don't even buy lottery tickets.) My entire gambling budget for the year is dedicated to cruising. I know exactly how much $$$ I'm willing to risk and I know exactly the value of my comps (including cruise fares, OBC and other onboard perks.) I'm ahead. 👍🏻 And I turn down tons of free cruise offers (from more lines than just NCL) to stay that way! (If I went on every free cruise I was offered, I would probably be in a deep hole lol That said, I do see alot of people get pulled in that way.) PS If you want a non-smoking casino, try Celebrity! (Or any of the NCL ships that have separate smoking rooms.)

That would be entry level for cruise comps. Haven comps you are looking at a minimum $10K per week in play. But as I've said before, you have to consider it in perspective with the overall vacation cost. Remember, I don't pay the Haven cruise fare! For example, most people here who are cruising NCL in a balcony cabin are paying at least a couple of thousand a week for their cruise. Well imagine instead of paying that cruise fare they just gambled that same couple of thousand in the casino and NCL gave them the cruise for free. Same difference. 🤷‍♀️

If hubby is playing significant $$$ in the casino, make sure he is calling NCL's Casinos at Sea department to see if they can make an offer on your cruise fares! I've been surprised at the number of people who are not aware of this perk of gaming. Granted, you do have to be playing relatively higher stakes to be offered a full Haven comp, but NCL casino perks start at a % off, then Inside, Oceanview all the way up to Haven & the DOS. If the casino offers a free Oceanview for two - but you only cruise Haven - you would just pay the difference between the Oceanview & Haven fare. Not a free cruise, but a pretty good discount! Make that gaming $$$ pay off - even if it's not at the tables or slot machine! 😉 (For anyone wondering what level of play would qualify for a discount - there's no real # - but if your gaming budget is even in the $1K-$2K range for a week, I'm sure you could get SOMETHING from the casino! Also, the casino loyalty program offers additional perks. Plus, depending upon your actual play on the cruise, you would also qualify for ONBOARD perks.)

I don't know that winning bids is that rare, but if most people are paying the (crazy) full prices even me - a die-hard Haven devotee - would be the 1st one to say that there are specialty cruise lines that do luxury WAAY better than NCL if people want to drop crazy money on a cruise. And those ships are usually smaller and can visit many exotic and unique ports of call that NCL ships cannot. My particular issue is that I get comps and those smaller, luxury cruise lines don't have the big casinos (or casino programs) that NCL does (or I'd be there in a heartbeat.)

QM2 is definitely still my dream! ❤️ I am not giving up! I have RA and am always hopeful for a remission (it's happened a few times over the years! 🤞) I've cruised just twice since the pandemic. I was gun shy going back because I had Covid on the Bliss in March 2020 (none of my 3 travelling companions got it, so I guess I'm just lucky like that lol.) I'm back at sea in October, but to Bermuda where vaccinations are still required. I'm not sure how I'm gonna feel about cruising if vaccination requirements are lifted.

That may be, but I think this is a very valid question. People who plan ahead are preventing themselves from having to be in "crisis management" mode if something unexpected happens. Cruising without a care or a "Plan B" and just not cruising at all are not the only two options. Some people like to think things through so that at least they are mentally prepared for what could happen. (I mean they could wind up being one of the "very, very, very small number" of people who are affected.) Maybe it's my perspective as a disabled person, but even in "normal" times I have to anticipate every possible scenario so that I am fully prepared for all scenarios (or maybe even realize that a particular trip is not for me.) For example, one of my bucket list cruises was always the QM2 Transatlantic. I was fully ready to book until I started asking what people may have thought were unnecessary, doomsday questions. However, that led to me finding out that there are several days in the middle of a transatlantic when medical airlift is impossible. Unfortunately, with my condition, I cannot take that chance. Even though it is a very, very, very slim chance that I would need to need to be airlifted, it's a chance I cannot take. I'm glad I asked!

So, I'm going to throw this out there as food for thought. I don't really think there are very many people at all paying $5K a week to cruise in the Haven. NCL may be pricing the Haven in the stratosphere, but it would be interesting to see just how many people are ACTUALLY paying those prices. During this discussion alone there were at least 3 or 4 of us who jumped in and acknowledged that we either don't pay for the Haven at all or we getting it at a deeply discounted fare. Then factor in all the people who are bidding to upgrade, which is also a deep discount. NCL has created an illusion of this super-expensive can't-touch-this exclusivity, but I honestly can't imagine who is paying full price. Right before the pandemic I cruised in the Deluxe Owner's Suite on the Bliss. I was comped for two passengers by the casino, but I had to pay for guests 3 & 4. My total cost for all four people (including port taxes) was $5,500. The online price for for that cruise & suite for the week for 4 was $36K. First, was it worth $5,500 to me? Yes. (Plus, as an aside, I won all that back in the casino that week so yay me lol.) But second, would I EVER in my life have paid $36K for that cabin for a week? No way! And most importantly, is ANYONE paying $36K for a week in the DOS on the Bliss?? Not only do I highly doubt it, but if they are I think someone needs to ask them if they're OK. The pricing and exclusivity thing is just a marketing ploy, IMO. I don't believe anyone is paying those prices. That's said, the Haven is still super nice and I wouldn't want to cruise any other way on NCL. PS This also may explain why people are disappointed when they expect class and decorum in the Haven. Most of us are just a bunch of degenerate gamblers who got in for free LOL 😉

You just have to think of it as the cost of vacation! For example the current price of a Haven Penthouse (for two) for a 5-day Bermuda cruise on the Prima in the spring is $10.5K. If NCL comps me that cruise, I would pay $200 in admin fees and about $500 in port taxes for two people. As long as I don't lose more than $9.8K (and I'll make sure I don't), I'm ahead in terms of my overall vacation cost.👍🏻

You are right, this is exactly how it works. And the key to his great comps is that he is betting high (that's what drives his theoretical loss - or "theo" - up which is what comps for based on.) I haven't paid for the Haven in years (other than port taxes/admin fees) regardless of what I have won or lost. I used to get "Club Balcony" comps when I played slots at $2-$4 a spin. When I started playing $10-$20 a spin I started getting offered the Haven. It's not how much you win or lose, it's how much you RISK (because remember the odds are ALWAYS in the casino's favor, so the more you risk the more they have a chance to make on you.) Ultimately, I never lose more money than the Haven cabin would have cost me to book, so it's a win-win for me. I cruise in luxury and I have fun playing all week (which I would do anyway!)

Unfortunately, the descriptions of the lesser packages do specifically state "No VPN" so they probably have some way to block it (not that I would have a clue as to how the do that lol.)

I have even used my corporate VPN in the past but that has not been recently. In order to use a vpn you must upgrade to the Premium "streaming" package.

I agree with this, but another reason I don't tip upfront is because of the message I think it sends. Not everyone will agree (I'm sure lol), but I think it implies "OK, right up front, let's establish who has the power here. I have the money, you need the money. I am the boss, you are the servant. This is your reminder that I hold the cards and you can either have a good week or a bad week depending upon if you please me." That's the part I find offensive. I'd rather establish the relationship as equals (e.g., I'm a paying guest, you're working professional who is expert at your job) and then express my appreciation for great service at the end with a thank you note and a tip.