Lighting Set Up

[FinelyCruising]

I am thinking I would like to get some new equipment. My focus is on flash photography for stills using a seamless paper background. My daughter has a new business that she needs so photos of her products so I'd like to use this opportunity to help her and improve my skills in this "studio" area at the same time.

 

What lighting systems would you recommend? I have a Canon Rebel and am not sure if I want to set up all speed lites via wireless exclusively as I think there must be other options.

 

I am trying to be cost effective but still want to be open minded enough to consider all possibilities for suitable equipment to help me do a good job even if it means a stretch.

 

Thanks in advance for your insight.:)

[pierces]

I have had a great time working with a pair of Alien Bees B800 monolights. Dedicated flash units are great for portability but cost an arm and a leg ($400-$500 for a good, powerful dedicated unit). I was able to pick up a pair of B800 flash units, heavy-duty stands to match, umbrellas, a large softbox and a radio-controlled trigger setup for about $1000. Monolights produce tremendous power compared to shoe-mount units and even with 1/160s sync, the flash duration is only about 1/2000s and freezes motion completely.

 

Here're a couple of my attempts:

 

 

 

More at: http://galleries.pptphoto.com/p456757777#h6b2c2e1

 

Take a look at http://www.alienbees.com

 

Reasonably-priced, good build and their customer service is incredible!

 

Dave

[FinelyCruising]

Dave the photos are great and the Family is Beautiful!!!

 

Thanks so much sharing these.

 

I am going to love the site you sent me to. Just love it! That is exactly what I was looking for. So now a bit more research on the bees site before I hit the buy button.

 

Your photos are representative of just two lights? No on board flash?

[pierces]

Dave the photos are great and the Family is Beautiful!!!

 

Thanks so much sharing these.

 

I am going to love the site you sent me to. Just love it! That is exactly what I was looking for. So now a bit more research on the bees site before I hit the buy button.

 

Your photos are representative of just two lights? No on board flash?

 

I have the radio trigger mounted on my flash shoe so there is no light on the flash at all. The two flash setup is easy to arrange and fiddling with the flash levels until you get the effect you want is pretty easy.

 

One light works well too if you use a reflector for fill:

 

 

If you have any questions about the Bees, post them. I've been using mine for over a year now and just finished some heavy-duty research regarding my nest step in expanding my lighting setup.

 

Dave

 

Dave

[FinelyCruising]

Dave - how about you just give me a shopping list so I know what to get. :D I see a bunch of radio devices and its all Greek to me.

[pierces]

Dave - how about you just give me a shopping list so I know what to get. :D I see a bunch of radio devices and its all Greek to me.

 

Budget?

 

The radio triggers are simple and complicated at the same time.

 

The CST CyberSync radio trigger slips into your hot shoe and synchronizes your camera with the flash units connected to either the CyberSync CSR (AC powered) or CyberSync CSRB (AA battery powered). They both work the same with the only difference being the power source. I chose battery since they can be used to trigger my old Minolta flashes with an adapter if I ever want to.

 

The CSR+ and CSRB+ receivers work the same as the non-"+" units with the CST trigger but have additional circuitry to control the flashes via the new Cyber Commander trigger unit. The Cyber Commander allows you to adjust the flash levels on each unit from the camera without running around and moving the sliders on the flash units themselves (a big bonus if you have one 8 feet off the floor or 20 feet on either side of you shooting a group!). I spoke to their tech people and it seems that a lot of people start with a CST trigger and CSR+ or CSRB+ receivers. That allows them to move up to a Cyber Commander when they're ready without replacing the receivers. (They allowed me to send in my old CSRB units and trade up to the + units for the $20 difference in price!)

 

I plan on getting a Cyber Commander to control the flash levels (using it hand-held like a remote control), but will still use the CST trigger to fire the flashes since it is very light and compact.

 

There's my take on Remote Triggering 101. How did I do? :D

 

Dave

[FinelyCruising]

Dave I am really excited to get home tonight and re-read your message with the Bees site open for a side by side match up...I did see that commander too and though it was pretty cool!

 

Thanks again for taking the time to detail the items, I appreciate it.

 

Oh...and yes, you done good!:D

[FinelyCruising]

I have had a day and a half snow day here in snowy NJ and I have used that time to do a lot of research.

 

I found some YouTube videos on the Bees that was pretty helpful, and I have done a bunch of looking at umbrellas and soft boxes too.

 

Oh and light meters, don't let me forget. :)

 

I am sure that I really want two lights.

 

I am sure I really like the Bees.

 

Despite that I really want two, I have very limited space to do any work, so any advise in this subject might be helpful in assisting me. Should I start with just one ( I like the extra discount if I buy two ;))

 

I have a finished basement with a low ceiling. That poses limitations but how bad will I be limited and to what? Will I then need to have larger distances?

 

I have standard height in the living room (no open ceilings) if I move a few things, and its not a bother to me to put something up to only take it down when I am done. I do have to worry about about loading up some receptacle circuits; I have to finish research about power requirements/amps. Not so in the basement.

 

So for now, with these space limits, any thoughts on what will work best for the lighting modifications, an umbrella, a shoot though umbrella, soft box to big? Umbrella going to need to be too high? Should I be thinking differently? maybe I should ask what is the smallest/minimum area that I can utilize assuming one or two people at most for some clothing product on a human person.

 

I can't tell since I have never done this before, just the old on board flash or my flash accessory, and the old EZ for my Canon film EOS does not seem to fire on-board this Xti camera. I have to find out more about that too.

 

So for now I have made so selection progress but might be off on some other elements.

 

Any feedback will be very appreciated.

 

I found this one link that I book marked that I thought was pretty cool. I attach it in case it helps anyone see the effects of different items for flash use. I used the drop downs to get a comparison idea for the shoot through umbrella. (If that is what umbrella transparent is). I though it looked like a nice effect.

 

 

http://www.bron.ch/vt_pd_lg_sc_en/index.php

[pierces]

Oh and light meters, don't let me forget. :)

 

Skip the light meter for now. Use the extra $400-$500 that a good meter costs for flash stuff. They can be helpful for critical work and advanced, multi-light setups but digital makes trial and error settings quick and manageable where in film-shooting, a meter was a necessity.

 

I am sure that I really want two lights.

 

Two are better. For fashion shots on a model you can get away with one and a large reflector but if the clothing is the target, full lighting might be preferable.

 

I am sure I really like the Bees.

 

I do too! Worked with others and can attest to the bang-for-the-buck!

 

Despite that I really want two, I have very limited space to do any work, so any advise in this subject might be helpful in assisting me. Should I start with just one ( I like the extra discount if I buy two ;))

 

I shot the above in one end of our living room (normal ceiling) against a 8ft wide backdrop with a normal ceiling light. I used two lights with large shoot-through umbrellas for the ones of the girls and one light with a Beauty Dish and reflector for the family portrait. I think both came out well, but they have a different look.

 

I have a finished basement with a low ceiling. That poses limitations but how bad will I be limited and to what? Will I then need to have larger distances?

 

With large umbrellas, the light can be diffused enough to make short working distances "workable".

 

I have standard height in the living room (no open ceilings) if I move a few things, and its not a bother to me to put something up to only take it down when I am done. I do have to worry about about loading up some receptacle circuits; I have to finish research about power requirements/amps. Not so in the basement.

 

The modeling lights are the big draw. Even they are only 100w each (150W bulbs ar optional if you need more light). I have thought about dimmable fluorescents but haven't tried them. The power needed to cycle the charge on the flash units is less than the draw of the modeling lamp. The vagabond portable power pack will give 575 full-power flashes from two B800 units, so I would say that if your circuits can handle a 100W bulb or two, you be fine.

 

So for now, with these space limits, any thoughts on what will work best for the lighting modifications, an umbrella, a shoot though umbrella, soft box to big? Umbrella going to need to be too high? Should I be thinking differently? maybe I should ask what is the smallest/minimum area that I can utilize assuming one or two people at most for some clothing product on a human person.

 

I started with a pair of shoot-through umbrellas with the removable black cover. If I was starting now, I would order the PLM units instead. Potential for much better light control. (http://www.alienbees.com/plm.html) I just ordered one of the 64" silver units with the diffuser panel for a big softbox look. You may want to look at the white shoot-through with the black spill-kill cover (PLM64U-W + PLM64-BFSPKF) for diffused-light product shots. (BTW, the spill-kill blocks the lights from illuminating things behind you that may reflect color or bright spots onto the subject.)

 

Dave

[510picker]

I use Alien Bees as well, but I have the AB400's instead of the 800's. The 400's have plenty of power for my needs. Something to be aware of, you mention you have the Canon Rebel. I don't believe the Rebel has sync port, so you will need to buy the Alien Bee's wireless transmitter and receiver to trigger the flashes. If you do much photography with your strobes you will want these anyway, trust me.

[pierces]

I use Alien Bees as well, but I have the AB400's instead of the 800's. The 400's have plenty of power for my needs. Something to be aware of, you mention you have the Canon Rebel. I don't believe the Rebel has sync port, so you will need to buy the Alien Bee's wireless transmitter and receiver to trigger the flashes. If you do much photography with your strobes you will want these anyway, trust me.

 

The wireless is the only way to go. My A700 has a sync port, but the idea of dragging a cord around as I'm shooting with a digital camera seemed very "'70s"! :D

 

I ordered the trigger and remotes with my Bees and always recommed them when asked.

 

I agree that the 400s have as much power as one might need for the purposes FinelyCruising stated. I have used my 800s for group shots and felt the extra $100 for the pair was well spent, but that was a personal decision.

 

I really like PCB's equipment and as I said, their customer service is the best!

 

Dave

[510picker]

The wireless is the only way to go. My A700 has a sync port, but the idea of dragging a cord around as I'm shooting with a digital camera seemed very "'70s"! :D

 

I ordered the trigger and remotes with my Bees and always recommed them when asked.

 

I agree that the 400s have as much power as one might need for the purposes FinelyCruising stated. I have used my 800s for group shots and felt the extra $100 for the pair was well spent, but that was a personal decision.

 

I really like PCB's equipment and as I said, their customer service is the best!

 

Dave

 

My intention was to let the original poster know that the wireless equipment is not optional for them if they are going to shoot with the Rebel. I agree about shooting wired. I did it for a while and must say the money spent on the wireless equipment was some of the best I've spent of all my photography equipment.

[pierces]

My intention was to let the original poster know that the wireless equipment is not optional for them if they are going to shoot with the Rebel. I agree about shooting wired. I did it for a while and must say the money spent on the wireless equipment was some of the best I've spent of all my photography equipment.

 

Actually, the Rebel's on-board flash will trigger the built-in optical slave on the bees if used in manual mode, so they could be used with no additional sync connection. The radio slave is just more reliable, especially if ambient light is bright.

 

I totally agree that the money for the radio trigger is very well-spent.

 

Dave

[FinelyCruising]

Good Morning!

 

I have been busy researching:D

 

I found some great YouTube videos on the PLM's and some test shots with them too. Maybe I just need a bigger house to accommodate the 86"! From what I have learned I can see what the excitement is about.

 

I am starting to whittle down my list, and with the options that the PLM's provide, I almost think I can start with just one light and accessories and see how I do. Dave I like your shot with the single light, and I won't mind starting there since I like that effect and I like what I saw with the single light in the videos.

 

Yes, to the trigger flash and receivers!!! I should have clarified that was part of the list, but the positive recommendations support that is the way to go. I will get the plus for future building, not sure yet about battery or no battery.

 

I have read a few comments about my old flash and its not really going to make life simple. I will defer what I decide to do about a flash until after the Bee things. An alternative to the Canon may be a Sigma.

 

So that is where I am at right now. Of course I still have no idea what color Bee to get.

[pierces]

Good Morning!

 

I have been busy researching:D

 

I found some great YouTube videos on the PLM's and some test shots with them too. Maybe I just need a bigger house to accommodate the 86"! From what I have learned I can see what the excitement is about.

 

I am starting to whittle down my list, and with the options that the PLM's provide, I almost think I can start with just one light and accessories and see how I do. Dave I like your shot with the single light, and I won't mind starting there since I like that effect and I like what I saw with the single light in the videos.

 

Yes, to the trigger flash and receivers!!! I should have clarified that was part of the list, but the positive recommendations support that is the way to go. I will get the plus for future building, not sure yet about battery or no battery.

 

I have read a few comments about my old flash and its not really going to make life simple. I will defer what I decide to do about a flash until after the Bee things. An alternative to the Canon may be a Sigma.

 

So that is where I am at right now. Of course I still have no idea what color Bee to get.

 

Sounds like you have a plan!

 

If you are going with a single light, this is what I used to bounce the fill light:

 

Extra light stand - Your choice.

 

I had a little one left over from some small hot lights but you may just want to buy an extra Bee stand to support your next light. The Bee stands are very sturdy and well made. I got the 13' non-pneumatic stands. Very stable.

 

Reflector holder and reflectors - http://www.alienbees.com/crk42.html

 

I used the 42" silver surface to fill the shadow side (almost like having a half-power light!)

 

DON'T FORGET A BACKDROP STAND!

 

I got this one from Adorama. Nice carry case included: http://www.amazon.com/JTL-B-909-Background-Support-System/dp/B0000AM6T5/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1267373035&sr=8-2

 

Good luck and feel free to post if you have any questions!

 

Dave