Tips or Gratuities

[TedC]

Heyabbott,

 

Cruise directors on our last two HAL cruises told us that the $10pp per day is distributed thus: $3 each to waiter and cabin steward, the remaining $4 to "back of the scenes" folks.

 

We always leave the autotip in place and give extra to steward, waiter, asst. waiter, wine steward and anyone else who we thought deserved it. They DO NOT have to pool what they get if you leave the autotip in place. The DO have to pool what they get if you remove the autotip.

[heyabbott]

At $70 pp for the week for 1800 passengers, the support staff divides up $126,000. How many are in the pool? How many rooms does the steward have? Should people with larger rooms, the suite people tip more? More space to clean.

 

Is $20 on the first meeting with the steward sufficient to interest him in exemplary service with the implicit understanding that there's more at the end. Or is it better to leave something everyday?

[sail7seas]

heyabbot....

 

 

It has never been our habit to pre-tip a cabin or dining steward in order for him to provide us with good service. It is expected that we will have good service and if we do not, we would speak with him about it. If it still did not improve, we would speak to his superiors. Pre-tipping may be done by a few folks but not by very many IMO

 

We always tip the steward who brings our room service breakfast. It often is the same steward everyday but you cannot be sure you will see him again, so we tip at the time of service.

 

We tip the cabin steward/dining stewards over and above the amount automatically charged to our account with cash placed in an envelope on the last day/evening of the cruise. I don't know of anyone who tips their cabin/dining stewards daily.

[maddie404]

I worked as a waitress in FL. Starting pay was just $2.15 per hour. Some made less than that - they were considered "private contractors" and a gratutity (12%) was automatically included on the patron's bill. They were paid ONLY the 12% and what was left on the table (if anything) Most restaurant service employees do not make minimum hourly wage of $5.35/hr paid by their employer. They rely on their tips. And they have to declare a percentage of tip money to the IRS. Not sure how it works on ships.

[ryansmemom]

At $70 pp for the week for 1800 passengers, the support staff divides up $126,000. How many are in the pool? How many rooms does the steward have? Should people with larger rooms, the suite people tip more? More space to clean.

 

Is $20 on the first meeting with the steward sufficient to interest him in exemplary service with the implicit understanding that there's more at the end. Or is it better to leave something everyday?

 

 

heyabbot,

 

We have never pretipped anyone on any of our many cruises. We have always received excellent service. Both my husband and I feel that to pretip people would substantially alter the relationship we have with the stewards which has always been one of mutual respect.

 

I fear that a pretip may be misinterpreted as a bribe, especially by a people like the Indoneasan crew on HAL who have a strong work and pride in service ethic. This misintepretation may cause your good intention to backfire on you. Therefore I would advise against it.

 

In my experience, mutual respect and genuine friendliness go a lot further in insuring good service.

 

Linda

[RuthC]

Another approach to additional tipping is to pack thank you notecards.

At the end of the cruise a personal note of gratitude, with cash enclosed, is a nice gesture.

Also, I have seen lounge stewards get positively thrilled to know you mentioned them by name in the survey. Seems an honorable mention helps them get another contract and good assignments on the current one.

[ryansmemom]

 

I spend a lot of time in countries in which you really wouldn't even think of tipping anyone, other than in very exceptional circumstances.

 

Also, I live in a country where great big HEAVY HINTS (often in block capitals) are given when you need to tip because you wouldn't really think of doing so otherwise - eg in the type of restaurant where a tip is expected. In addition, there are certain sorts of tipping (eg bar staff) which are common in the US, but would be regarded as downright insulting if you tried it here.

 

If a cruise line says "tipping not required" and (wrongly) gives the impression that tipping is not expected, either, I don't think that you can necessarily fault passengers who act on that impression.

 

 

Please excuse my myopia regarding tipping practices in other countries. However, since, in my experience, the majority of passengers on HAL ships are US citizens I was basing my observations on US tipping customs. I also used the fact that HAL is a company based in the US to determine the appropriatness of this choice.

 

If I were to comment on tipping practices on board a non-US based company, I would of course need to use the practices of that country/culture as a guide.

 

Linda

[ryansmemom]

Another approach to additional tipping is to pack thank you notecards.

At the end of the cruise a personal note of gratitude, with cash enclosed, is a nice gesture.

Also, I have seen lounge stewards get positively thrilled to know you mentioned them by name in the survey. Seems an honorable mention helps them get another contract and good assignments on the current one.

 

 

Ruth

 

You hit the nail right on the head!! Perfect!! I agree wholeheartedly!!!

 

Linda :)

[Emmie]

Hello, all! What I would like to know is: if you are tipping a bit extra, what is considered reasonable? Would $10 to the steward on top of the autotip be insultingly low, or would it be appreciated?

 

I'm asking because my DH and I are on a budget, and we liked the idea of the tips being included. However, I wouldn't mind leaving something extra if possible, especially if the service is exceptional. I know we have to decide what we can afford, but it would be nice to hear what others do and kind of get a sense of what is "average."

 

By the way, the personalized thank you cards are a WONDERFUL idea! I'm planning to do that whatever happens!

 

Emmie

[Ritanita]

On our first HAL cruise years ago, tipping was expected (and amounts set in a memo to passengers)

 

Our last trip.. a 21 day cruise charged us a fee for services rendered, aka: tips.

I don't remember exactly how much per day was charged to our account... but I do remember that a service charge of $17 dollars was added to my "Coke Card" for tips.

 

Technically, the gratuity charge per day per passenger was to be spread out among all the people who served us in one way or another. This was to include not only those who served us directly, but also those who one would not ordinarily tip.

 

However, I found out through my conversations with the bartenders who waited on me, that they found no changes in their income due to this process!

 

Well, they may have been mistaken; but at the end of the cruise, I gave all the people who had served me well an envelope with an extra gratuity.

 

I had to thank them in some tangible way for their special service. The sports bar server who regularly brought me TWO Diet Cokes before I even asked, the waiter/server in the Ocean Bar who would bring me extra appetizers, the room steward who made up our room every time we left it!

 

I understand why a fixed gratuity might be fairer to the staff in general, but I regret that the old system of rewarding excellent service has been undermined by this new policy.

[RuthC]

On our first HAL cruise years ago, tipping was expected (and amounts set in a memo to passengers)

I'm very curious as to how long ago that was?

 

 

I first cruised HAL way back in '78, and the method then was "tipping not required". There was no suggested amount.

I did not sail HAL again until '92 when that was also the rule of thumb. Could HAL have changed---then changed back---during that period?

Or was your first cruise before '78?

[SANDY BEACH]

Emmie, You're not going to get too many exact $$ amounts on this thread. Most are quite private about the amount they tip over and above; however, I think anything you leave over and above would be much appreciated by the staff. Do what you can and your budget allows. I think it is very kind of you to consider extra for those that have served you well. Enjoy your cruise!!

[Pudgesmom]

I've been away from this thread for a few days, and I must respond to Sail's comment on the disembarkation talk. First of all, I have never attended any "talks" on any cruise I have taken. I hate meetings, and the last thing I'm interested in is silly songs or maudalin (sp) expressions of supposed sad good byes on my vacation. I cannot name any cruise director on any ship on which I have ever sailed.

 

Also, I am an avid reader. I read all the fine print in every cruise catalog. My travel brochures are totally dog-eared by the time I travel. I am positive about never reading any information other that the "tipping not required' phrase in the HAL literature.

 

How in the world would I guess that the cruise line was going to deliver heretofore unknown information about tipping at the "disembarkation" talk? In fact, I'm glad I never went, as I would have been very upset to find out on the last day of my cruise that my family of four owed another couple of hundred dollars to make good on the "tipping not required" cruise I was on.

 

Remember, I believe in tipping for good service.

Beth

[heyabbott]

If HAL didn't charge my account $140.00 for us for the week, I would have tipped that amount for cabin steward and dining room waiter. 10 a day for the steward and waiter respectively.

Obviously additonal tips for baggage porters and room service attendant.

 

I'm now assuming that additional tips for the steward and waiter are based upon service above and beyond the genrally acknowledged wonderful service usually given. Am I correct?

[jhannah]

That's the way I see it. HAL has defined what they think is proper for us to give for "excellent" service. We're then invited to go beyond for "exemplary" service.

 

From the HAL website:

Exceptional service is part of the Holland America cruise experience. Because you are our guest, it is our goal to make sure you receive the finest service possible. And we have made it easy for you to reward excellent service onboard.

 

A gratuity of $10 per guest per day for dining and stateroom services will be automatically added to your shipboard account on a daily basis. We are confident that you will find the service onboard exemplary and, should you wish to make adjustments, you may do so at the end of the cruise by contacting the front desk.

[sail7seas]

I've been away from this thread for a few days, and I must respond to Sail's comment on the disembarkation talk. First of all, I have never attended any "talks" on any cruise I have taken. I hate meetings, and the last thing I'm interested in is silly songs or maudalin (sp) expressions of supposed sad good byes on my vacation. I cannot name any cruise director on any ship on which I have ever sailed.

 

Also, I am an avid reader. I read all the fine print in every cruise catalog. My travel brochures are totally dog-eared by the time I travel. I am positive about never reading any information other that the "tipping not required' phrase in the HAL literature.

 

How in the world would I guess that the cruise line was going to deliver heretofore unknown information about tipping at the "disembarkation" talk? In fact, I'm glad I never went, as I would have been very upset to find out on the last day of my cruise that my family of four owed another couple of hundred dollars to make good on the "tipping not required" cruise I was on.

 

Remember, I believe in tipping for good service.

Beth

 

 

 

Do as you wish. If you do not choose to avail yourself of information which , by the way, is replayed repeatedly on the cabin televisions, that is your perogative. There is always a notice in the daily program of when the disembarkation talk is going to be held; there is always an announcement they request one person from each 'party' attend; there is always notice that the talk will be replayed on the televisions.

 

The information has always been available and the vast majority of people who have cruised HAL have heard it (some literally dozens of times). It matters not to me in the least if it does not interest you. Go/don't go. Listen/don't listen. Tip/don't tip. Whatever. Suit yourself.

[Pudgesmom]

No....I think not.

 

 

The Cruise Director always explained the policy in very clear langauge. It was not confusing in the least.... Unless one wished to use it as an 'excuse' to salve their conscience for 'stiffing the crew'.

JMHO, of course.

 

 

I am sure I am dumb but what is MSC? Thank you.

 

Sail, I do think you care whether people tip or not, my point that you fail to see is that HAL had a very ambiguous policy concerning it. Yes, I did watch the disembarcation talk on TV, and no, I don't remember anything about tipping. Besides, why wasn't it called the "disembarcation and secret tipping policy talk?" I feel embarrassed that I cruised HAL and did not tip appropriately. I do not like the new policy either, but I heartily disagree that HAL provided ANY information to new or newish cruisers on the old policy

 

Beth

Sorry if the quote didn't work, I'm still trying!

[flamingogal]

It never ceases to amaze me how bent out of shape intelligent people can get when their judgement/actions are questioned by total strangers.

 

Whether you tip or not, how much or how little is no one's business but your own. Advice is freely given on these boards, (and welcomed) but sometimes it comes with opinions that are not needed.

 

I leave the auto tip on, I also tip the cabin steward the second day of the cruise if I really like him. I may tip him throughout the cruise. I also tip the hamburger man, the omlet man, the good bartenders and the waiters/asst waiters. Heck, we've tipped the security guys! Tipping isn't rocket surgery, have a good time, leave a tip if you are inclined, if not, don't. :D

[Pudgesmom]

Flamingo,

 

My point was that HAL never explained that although tipping was not required, it was still expected.

 

Beth

[anngie]

That was my whole point in starting this thread to begin with. MSC had a cruise for travel agents and explained their tipping policy to them so that they could pass it along to their clients. They emphasized that their crew makes a very good wage so it is not necessary to tip them but if you still feel they go beyond the expected feel free to tip and they will give you envelopes to put it in.

I don't think all travel agents completely understood the policy that gratuities not required meant that it is still expected. We always use the same travel agent and she told us the first time that we ever sailed on HAL that tips were included. I have a feeling that lots of other people were told the same thing.

[sungoddess]

Gratuities have never been included on HAL, and are not included now. You have the option of removing the auto-tip if you wish. I agree, HAL's Tipping not Required policy was confusing, which is why they changed it.

[flamingogal]

Pudgesmom - I agree exactly! I had the same questions about tipping the first time I cruised HAL. Luckily I had good friends travelling with me who explained how the system worked. Since then, I have figured out my own way of tipping and I think my system was working pretty well until HAL decided to implement the standard tipping /service charge. I'm OK with the new system - less hassle, no bother, etc.

 

p.s. I've never been to a disembarkation talk yet and I don't plan on going in the future. There has to be something more interesting to do on a cruise ship than that!!!! :p

[dakrewser]

Tipping on a cruise ship is not the same as in a restaurant, although it is perhaps closer to the practice in a hotel - at least for the cabin steward.

 

For the dining room, it's more like the situation in a guest house, or perhaps a B&B (a large one).

 

As to the last night dining choice, I've never even considered what others might think of my choice.

 

I also never attend the debarkation talk, port & shopping talk or any other sermon from the crew. I will glance at the debark lecture on TV, but only to see if any procedure has changed. It rarely does.

 

As to bribing (what some euphemistically call "pre-tipping") there are two implications: 1) unless I pay up front, I won't get the best service; or 2) if I pay up front I'll get better service than the next guy. Both are repugnant thoughts.

 

The service on board the Oosterdam last week was, in fact, better than that which we experienced on the Volendam in the fall of '03 (our previous HAL cruise) - delightfully so. So much so that we went out of our way to ensure that there was both cash and envelopes available for a "bit extra" for our cabin & dining room attendants as well as those not included in the auto-tip (Pinnacle staff, Neptune concierges).

 

I've got to agree that HAL's previous policy ("No tipping required") was hopelessly ambivalent. On the one hand, you were told that there was no need to tip additional amounts. On the other hand, experienced cruisers would tell you that a gratuity was considered de riguer. But the cruise line wouldn't deign to recommend a typical amount. So you, poor passenger, were pulled both ways on this question. I also found the ritual of "the passing of the envelopes" on the last night in the DR to be both embarassing and stilted. At a restaurant ashore, would you wait for your waiter to return to your empty table so you could personnally slip him a few bucks and shake his hand? I think not - especially as the table had already been cleared and the asst. steward was chomping at the bit to lay the table for breakfast! We solved the problem on this cruise by not going to the DR on the last night. Or the night before, either. We tipped the DR staff on the third-to-last night (our last in the DR) much to their surprise and enjoyment.

 

-dave

[Santa Fe Jim]

Several people in this thread (and on previous tipping threads) have said that they would prefer HAL acknowledge the current tipping program as a "service charge". My question: if it becomes a mandatory service charge (as is coming on NCL I think), then HAL has to declare it as income, whereas if they call it a tip, it would not be corporate income? If so, seems they have a vested interest in keeping the "tipping" system (which I do not mind).

 

SFJ

[jhannah]

You are correct. I'm not a tax attorney, but payroll taxes (the employer's share of FICA and Workers' Comp and unemployment insurance) are based an a percentage of payroll. So to put that amount into payroll per se would cost the cruise line more in taxes.