Cruise Lines Targeted..Again

[hotrod1954]

I feel like bible quotes are completely irrelevant as arguments for anything not related to RELIGION.

 

Back to the topic, I've always wished cruise companies made some nuclear powered ships. The only reason to not make them that I have heard of is that some countries don't allow for them to enter their waters (which may be something that also needs revision. As I understand it, nuclear power is very very safe now.) but cruise companies could use the ships to go only to ports where they were allowed and skip the others.

 

I bet you that once countries notice how much more traffic other ports get because they allow for nuclear ships, they may revise their restrictions quick.

I am sorry that I brought in Religon but the few verses before, Noah was on the Ark for forty days. Do you think all those animals were constipated for all that time? So what did he do with all the waste. I was just making the point that if you listen to some of these idiots you would go hide from humanity

[TEXASMUNK]

What was, was. What is, is.

 

I have been cruising since the early 70's and yes the polluting was horrible.

 

But your attempt to equate yesterday's evil with blind support by customers or any particular cruise line does not work.

 

Heck, using your logic, we should still all hate Germany because of what happened 70 years ago....

 

Being Irish, I should hate the English because of the mistreatment of Ireland...

 

Just doesn't work.

[yellowsnow]

I am sorry that I brought in Religon but the few verses before, Noah was on the Ark for forty days. Do you think all those animals were constipated for all that time? So what did he do with all the waste. I was just making the point that if you listen to some of these idiots you would go hide from humanity

 

I see, I read the quote out of context but now that I know the context it is kinda funny.

[Jolimont]

:confused: But all the cruise ships in the world do not burn more than all of the other ships and boats plying the waters...what's your point. The rational is don't use any vehicle using oil as its energy source? I'd like to see less dependency on it, but not gonna happen in the near future. And you're not gonna give up your gas guzzler just as I am not...not until I can afford something that is really efficient other than gasoline. The best I can do is my Toyota Yaris-41 mpg on the highway...yes that is correct!

I could stay home and ride my bicycle everywhere I need to go (which I do weather permitting) instead of going on a cruise. Or drive a Yaris just like hundreds of thousands of Frenchies. I gave up on the gas guzzler when I moved to France, it was too expensive here, and honestly, it's totally unecessary. Now cruises, those are necessary to me.

[futaba951]

I could stay home and ride my bicycle everywhere I need to go (which I do weather permitting) instead of going on a cruise. Or drive a Yaris just like hundreds of thousands of Frenchies. I gave up on the gas guzzler when I moved to France, it was too expensive here, and honestly, it's totally unecessary. Now cruises, those are necessary to me.

 

It would probably be more environmentally friendly to drive the gas guzzler for 25 years than it is to keep throwing away that POS Yaris every couple of years. :p

[DHADEN]

This requires a "Step-By-Step" response:

 

Dear friends:

Many of you posting here seem to think that the cruiselines are honest, holier-than-thou companies, and that the governments are picking on them.

 

I resent the "holier-than-thou" reference when all we are talking about is a company LEGALLY providing a service to so many lovers of that service. And then there are Whacos who want to end that, and the only way is with lies and hyperbole!!

 

Obviously, many of you haven't cruised in the 70's, 80's and 90's. I remember standing on deck late evening and watching crew members dumping garbage bags full of all of the day's garbage right into the ocean.

And back in those days the cruiselines dumped the ship's bathroom waste right into the ocean as well.

 

AND THE EARTH MADE IT AAAALLLL THE WAY THROUGH that horible abuse.

 

The only reason they stopped was because of the many lawsuits eventually filed against them, and the many fines they received from various authorities and governments.

 

First of all - who do you think PAYS those fines; or those outrageous frivolous lawsuite payouts??? All this increases the cost and therefore the price we have to pay. That's why there are so many of us upset every time we hear these ridiculous claims.

 

And, by the way, the reason things changed was because RCI recognized the need and VOLUNTARILY started the "Save the Waves" program to keep people happy.

 

I think a system of checks and balances is good in any industry and, in the long run, even though you feel the cruiselines are being "picked on" right now, this will eventually bring better practices in the future.

 

Checks and Balances can be a good thing, but that is NOT what we are talking about in this thread. Go back and look at those websites. They want to END the cruise industry.

 

Well what i was saying God is in Control. Yes we have to take care of it but when you listen to some of these nut jobs it seems like they know whats best for everybody. I pile all these people in the same boat. The world is going to endure God said it. Case closed for me.

 

Thank you, Hotrod. Very well said.

[jackdiamond]

We would not need to drill offshore if we were permitted to drill onshore....but that is a totally different story, and does not fit here...

 

The way I see it, these groups have it all figured out. Bambi is good, all of mankind is evil...Simple. If you follow their logic, if we all killed ourselves, the earth would be better off...

 

When did we turn the asylum over to the inmates?

Sadly, some time ago; and, it will get worse unless right thinking folks stand up.

[rubrrick]

Sadly, some time ago; and, it will get worse unless right thinking folks stand up.

 

 

Right on!!

 

Rick

[Adri204]

I feel like bible quotes are completely irrelevant as arguments for anything not related to RELIGION.

 

Back to the topic, I've always wished cruise companies made some nuclear powered ships. The only reason to not make them that I have heard of is that some countries don't allow for them to enter their waters (which may be something that also needs revision. As I understand it, nuclear power is very very safe now.) but cruise companies could use the ships to go only to ports where they were allowed and skip the others.

 

I bet you that once countries notice how much more traffic other ports get because they allow for nuclear ships, they may revise their restrictions quick.

 

 

Since when is the bible just relevent only to one part of our lives? This is a cruise board so I am not going to start spouting religious topics. However I found the posters talking about it relevent. If thats what they want to use why should it not be talked about? The one poster made a good point where did all the animal waste from Noah's ark go? I pondered that and concluded the waste went in the ocean. I also have pondered how neat it was that the animals did not attack and eat each other lol.

 

Adri :)

[Mark_K]

Sorry but what I find interesting in this discussion is that you are all accusing the website and article of lies and half truths yet none of you seem to have any hard facts either. You guess, you have a gut feeling, you imagine, you think. It would make a significantly better argument if you could back your feelings up with knowledge. For example- what percentage of ships floating about are cruise ships? That figure must be known. And is human waste more damaging to the oceans than the fish's waste? (On this one I suspect that the answer is yes since the ocean evolved with the fish, not with human waste).

 

Knowledge is golden.

This might give you a clue to your first question.

 

Cruise ships: http://www.sailwx.info/shiptrack/cruiseships.phtml

 

Cargo ships and cruise ships: http://www.sailwx.info/shiptrack/shiplocations.phtml

 

As far as your second question, humans are not that special. All animal waste is biodegradable.

[5waldos]

The cruise lines have cleaned up their act a great deal not because they are good guys who are concerned about the environment but because the governments of the world decided that they were going to begin regulating them. A few very stiff fines and bad publicity works wonders in stopping the dumping of bilge water and garbage bags. Would you continue to cruise on a line which discharged human waste into the Inner Passage of Alaska, for example? Or into your favorite fishing bay, where ever that was? Have you ever spent much time in an area where there are no such regulations? It can get pretty nasty and dangerous. And no it is not just human waste- but there are a lot of us cruising around on the seas.

[Mark_K]

The cruise lines have cleaned up their act a great deal not because they are good guys who are concerned about the environment but because the governments of the world decided that they were going to begin regulating them. A few very stiff fines and bad publicity works wonders in stopping the dumping of bilge water and garbage bags. Would you continue to cruise on a line which discharged human waste into the Inner Passage of Alaska, for example? Or into your favorite fishing bay, where ever that was? Have you ever spent much time in an area where there are no such regulations? It can get pretty nasty and dangerous. And no it is not just human waste- but there are a lot of us cruising around on the seas.

Unless the inner passage of Alaska is more than 12 nautical miles from the shore, they wouldn't do it. As far as what they might have done in the past, times change, rules change, standard practice changes. I'm more concerned with what they do now.

[TahoeBob]

Not sure about the rules on this, so not posting the story....over on the Welcome, news side of AOL there is another story about the evil cruise industry.....

Friends of the Earth are talking about how the cruise industry is destroying the oceans with pollution. Never mind that the cruise industry has taken steps to offer environmentally protective steps when it comes to waste.

 

Someone may now if the article can be posted here, otherwise, you can stop by AOL click on welcome and flip through the current news stories to read it...

 

I have no idea but I get the funny feeling that all the cruise ships in the world probably total around 1% of the ships on the sea and that every modern day ship is somewhere around 99.9% more environmentally friendly than any other ship.

I take all these type of stories with a pound of salt.

Friends of the Earth is a liberal group that bashes things that are not to there liking. The same thing can be said on teh other side of the coin.

 

Big oil wants less environmental laws, friends of the earth want more.

 

This is what different groups do, say things to get there point across, it happens on both side of the political spectrum.

[RonnieD]

In 103 days I intend to hug a ship and not a tree. No guilt here.

[5waldos]

Unless the inner passage of Alaska is more than 12 nautical miles from the shore, they wouldn't do it. As far as what they might have done in the past, times change, rules change, standard practice changes. I'm more concerned with what they do now.

 

They shouldn't do it. But that is one of the problems. And there continue to be things that happen now. Far less common, and the immediate consequences are much greater. The standard practices often follow on being regulated- it costs more to process the waste than it does to dump it. More to keep garbage including all that plastic until it can be disposed of in a reasonable fashion than simply dumping it overboard. And big business is about profit.

[Mark_K]

They shouldn't do it. But that is one of the problems. And there continue to be things that happen now. Far less common, and the immediate consequences are much greater. The standard practices often follow on being regulated- it costs more to process the waste than it does to dump it. More to keep garbage including all that plastic until it can be disposed of in a reasonable fashion than simply dumping it overboard. And big business is about profit.

To paraphrase your previous post - talk is cheap, show me the hard evidence that RCI is currently doing this. It goes both ways, you can't ask others to back up their posts and then just make posts with no evidence.

[5waldos]

To paraphrase your previous post - talk is cheap, show me the hard evidence that RCI is currently doing this.

 

http://www.cruisejunkie.com/envirofines.html

 

A list of fines. Not just RCL- I'm not in any way saying that one cruise line or another is more or less doing this. I have nothing against RCL at all and no way of knowing whether in times past they were better or worse or just the same as any other line. I just said that some of it does continue. Some on purpose, some by accident. I know- Cruise Junkie delights in these things. But these are actual lists of fines. And a few pictures to back some of the stuff up.

 

I do believe that things have improved a huge amount- and will stay improved as long as there continues to be oversight. Let the oversight go away and things will slip. A bit here, a bit there. And yes, some in this list of fines are complete accidents.

[Mark_K]

http://www.cruisejunkie.com/envirofines.html

 

A list of fines. Not just RCL- I'm not in any way saying that one cruise line or another is more or less doing this. I have nothing against RCL at all and no way of knowing whether in times past they were better or worse or just the same as any other line. I just said that some of it does continue. Some on purpose, some by accident. I know- Cruise Junkie delights in these things. But these are actual lists of fines. And a few pictures to back some of the stuff up.

 

I do believe that things have improved a huge amount- and will stay improved as long as there continues to be oversight. Let the oversight go away and things will slip. A bit here, a bit there. And yes, some in this list of fines are complete accidents.

I'm not seeing much other than "pending" that relates to dumping human waste where it shouldn't be dumped.