Cruise Lines Targeted..Again

[5waldos]

And that is just oil tankers. Wonder how many cargo ships there are? There are about 280 Cruise ships. Getting on close to 3% looks like.

 

Although if we are talking about human effects on the oceans these figures are way off since a cruise ship often has nearly 4,000 people. An oil tanker way way fewer. The ones the pirates keep taking have about 40 people on them. On the other hand, just to further complicate things, the potential for harm to the environment is probably far greater with the oil. Ah this is a complex problem.

[annierie]

You may want to read this.

 

Royal Caribbean deliberately dumped waste in coastal US waters, covered it up, and put hazardous waste in garbage in US cities. Those of you living in those areas were the victims of their lawbreaking.

 

Norovirus is originally contracted by consumption of shellfish that have been contaminated with waste, such as the waste that cruise ships could dump in coastal waters.

 

Royal Caribbean was then banned from Glacier Bay since convicted felons couldn't sign contracts with the Federal government. Now Princess and HAL have the lock on the slots every summer.

 

http://yosemite.epa.gov/opa/admpress.nsf/34cef4854b892b8b8525645a004de9a4/d4cf84427956628e852567b50070ccaf!OpenDocument

 

http://www.nytimes.com/1999/11/17/us/cruise-ship-officer-faces-charges-in-dumping-case.html

 

Are you OK with cruise lines dumping hazardous waste in your coastal waters, or do you want people to be watchful and make sure this never happens again? Yeah, some of them are over the top vigilantes but I hope we never have this type of arrogance again, like Royal Caribbean did before convicted.

 

I mean, really, "bypass pipes", in order to go straight into the sea so as not to incur the expense of treatment, or of removal in port.

[5waldos]

Awful yes but that was eleven years ago- not just yesterday. i suspect they learned their lesson.

[DHADEN]

Sorry but what I find interesting in this discussion is that you are all accusing the website and article of lies and half truths yet none of you seem to have any hard facts either. You guess, you have a gut feeling, you imagine, you think. It would make a significantly better argument if you could back your feelings up with knowledge. For example- what percentage of ships floating about are cruise ships? That figure must be known. And is human waste more damaging to the oceans than the fish's waste? (On this one I suspect that the answer is yes since the ocean evolved with the fish, not with human waste).

Knowledge is golden.

 

What you yourself are saying is dribble - - don't you see that you are contradicting yourself? Or maybe call it "Hypocrocy" at it's purest.

First you condem our arguments of being "guess/feeling/imagine" then you

"Suspect" your argument.

Once again, someone arguing FOR the whacos has turned on herself. :p

 

Although if we are talking about human effects on the oceans these figures are way off since a cruise ship often has nearly 4,000 people. An oil tanker way way fewer. The ones the pirates keep taking have about 40 people on them. On the other hand, just to further complicate things, the potential for harm to the environment is probably far greater with the oil. Ah this is a complex problem.

 

First of all, there are probably closer to a THOUSAND cruise ships on the ocean at any given time. And there are TENS OF THOUSANDS (maybe even hundreds of thousands) of other ships out there. Even with all that, you are talking about the EARTH - - you know.... that HUGE, GIAGANTIC, BALL with a surface area of about 200 MILLION SQ. MILES.... and 2/3 of that is ocean.

Point being that all those ships put together in one spot would not even cover 200 sq. miles - let alone 200 million. Can you grasp the tiny tiny tiny-ness of these ships' affect on what the planet is actually capable of handling????

 

Oh, and by the way, feces is feces, no matter who it is from. Biological waste is just that - - biological and perfectly natural, and food for other marine life. So actually you could argue that the cruise ships are HELPING feed the marine life. ;)

[5waldos]

First of all, there are probably closer to a THOUSAND cruise ships on the ocean at any given time. And there are TENS OF THOUSANDS (maybe even hundreds of thousands) of other ships out there. Even with all that, you are talking about the EARTH - - you know.... that HUGE, GIAGANTIC, BALL with a surface area of about 200 MILLION SQ. MILES.... and 2/3 of that is ocean.

 

Sorry but internet sources say that there are 280 cruise ships and 4200 oil tankers- couldn't find a number for freightors

 

Oh, and by the way, feces is feces, no matter who it is from. Biological waste is just that - - biological and perfectly natural, and food for other marine life. So actually you could argue that the cruise ships are HELPING feed the marine life. ;)

 

If you say so I guess it must be right. but gee- I sure do remember beaches being closed when there were human sewage leaks. don't ever remember them being closed for fish sewage.

[lgonquin]

What you yourself are saying is dribble - - don't you see that you are contradicting yourself? Or maybe call it "Hypocrocy" at it's purest.

First you condem our arguments of being "guess/feeling/imagine" then you

"Suspect" your argument.

Once again, someone arguing FOR the whacos has turned on herself. :p

 

 

 

First of all, there are probably closer to a THOUSAND cruise ships on the ocean at any given time. And there are TENS OF THOUSANDS (maybe even hundreds of thousands) of other ships out there. Even with all that, you are talking about the EARTH - - you know.... that HUGE, GIAGANTIC, BALL with a surface area of about 200 MILLION SQ. MILES.... and 2/3 of that is ocean.

Point being that all those ships put together in one spot would not even cover 200 sq. miles - let alone 200 million. Can you grasp the tiny tiny tiny-ness of these ships' affect on what the planet is actually capable of handling????

 

Oh, and by the way, feces is feces, no matter who it is from. Biological waste is just that - - biological and perfectly natural, and food for other marine life. So actually you could argue that the cruise ships are HELPING feed the marine life. ;)

Amen to that!

 

I am happy to see people are paying attention to environmental issues. This is the only planet we have, so everyone should be mindful. But.......just wait until they start imposing "carbon taxes" on the cruise industry. You think the fuel surcharge is a joke. Those big nasty ships spitting carbon based gases into the atmosphere -- pay-pay-pay until you can'y pay anymore. That's the governments answer to everything.

[5waldos]

The beautiful blue Pacific- or 1000 square miles of it

 

http://seacat.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/plastic1.jpg

[John Henry on CC]

You may want to read this.

 

Royal Caribbean deliberately dumped waste in coastal US waters, covered it up, and put hazardous waste in garbage in US cities. Those of you living in those areas were the victims of their lawbreaking.

 

Norovirus is originally contracted by consumption of shellfish that have been contaminated with waste, such as the waste that cruise ships could dump in coastal waters.

 

Royal Caribbean was then banned from Glacier Bay since convicted felons couldn't sign contracts with the Federal government. Now Princess and HAL have the lock on the slots every summer.

 

http://yosemite.epa.gov/opa/admpress.nsf/34cef4854b892b8b8525645a004de9a4/d4cf84427956628e852567b50070ccaf!OpenDocument

 

http://www.nytimes.com/1999/11/17/us/cruise-ship-officer-faces-charges-in-dumping-case.html

 

Are you OK with cruise lines dumping hazardous waste in your coastal waters, or do you want people to be watchful and make sure this never happens again? Yeah, some of them are over the top vigilantes but I hope we never have this type of arrogance again, like Royal Caribbean did before convicted.

 

I mean, really, "bypass pipes", in order to go straight into the sea so as not to incur the expense of treatment, or of removal in port.

 

Awful yes but that was eleven years ago- not just yesterday. i suspect they learned their lesson.

 

The press release was ELEVEN years ago, the fine was levied TWELVE years ago, on infractions committed FIFTEEN AND SIXTEEN years ago.

 

Ships, and Royal Caribbean ships in particular, have come a long way, baby, since then.

[lgonquin]

The beautiful blue Pacific- or 1000 square miles of it

 

http://seacat.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/plastic1.jpg

Nice -- LOL.

And what port of call might that have been?

[5waldos]

The press release was ELEVEN years ago, the fine was levied TWELVE years ago, on infractions committed FIFTEEN AND SIXTEEN years ago.

 

Ships, and Royal Caribbean ships in particular, have come a long way, baby, since then.

 

But it looks like they still aren't allowed into Glacier Bay, best I can tell.

[lgonquin]

Not allowed or choose not to stop there? They have several ships doing Alaskan itineraries with stops all along that area (Juneau & Skagway). Why would they be "shunned" from only parts of that waterway and not the entire thing? Are some areas considered more expendable than others? I think not.

[5waldos]

Not allowed or choose not to stop there? They have several ships doing Alaskan itineraries with stops all along that area (Juneau & Skagway). Why would they be "shunned" from only parts of that waterway and not the entire thing? Are some areas considered more expendable than others? I think not.

 

Glacier Bay is a National Park so yes, some parts are considered more expendable than other.

[The_Big_M]

Cruiselines want to protect the environment.

 

I wouldn't say that given their obstinacy towards and arguments against new laws to protect the environment.

 

Some certainly have displayed a consideration towards it, but you can't generalise and say that they want to protect it either.

[5waldos]

Nice -- LOL.

And what port of call might that have been?

 

Sadly that is someplace in the middle of the Pacific- far west of Hawaii- don't know the exact place but many many miles from land.

[NordicPrince]

http://www.marisec.org/shippingfacts/worldtrade/number-of-ships.php

 

Here are some estimates of the number of commercial ships and breakdown.

 

While we're at it 10% of the world's air pollution comes from (you guessed it) cows who pass methane gas as part of the digestion process.

Guess we should stop eating meat and drinking milk as well.

 

I think we have to be responsible users of our natural resources. Nuff said.

[DHADEN]

The beautiful blue Pacific- or 1000 square miles of it

 

http://seacat.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/plastic1.jpg

 

Sadly that is someplace in the middle of the Pacific- far west of Hawaii- don't know the exact place but many many miles from land.

 

It looks like maybe ONE square mile or less...... and what's this guy doing 1,000 miles out in the ocean in a ROWBOAT!? :eek:

 

You're doing it again, Waldo. Don't believe everything you see on the internet.

Actually, don't believe ANYTHING you see on the internet.:cool:

[5waldos]

It looks like maybe ONE square mile or less...... and what's this guy doing 1,000 miles out in the ocean in a ROWBOAT!? :eek:

 

You're doing it again, Waldo. Don't believe everything you see on the internet.

Actually, don't believe ANYTHING you see on the internet.:cool:

 

You might want to look up this. It is real, and it is huge. And he is in a rowboat because he is part of an expedition to study it.

[hotrod1954]

Best dvice to all these whack jobs genesis 8 verse 22 . Who you gonna belive God or people like Al Gore

[5waldos]

"As long as the earth endures, seedtime and harvest, cold and heat, summer and winter, day and night will never cease."

 

Isn't that the issue here? And don't I also remember that God helps him who helps himself?

[CruisinGerman]

Dear friends:

 

Many of you posting here seem to think that the cruiselines are honest, holier-than-thou companies, and that the governments are picking on them.

 

Obviously, many of you haven't cruised in the 70's, 80's and 90's. I remember standing on deck late evening and watching crew members dumping garbage bags full of all of the day's garbage right into the ocean.

 

And back in those days the cruiselines dumped the ship's bathroom waste right into the ocean as well.

 

The only reason they stopped was because of the many lawsuits eventually filed against them, and the many fines they received from various authorities and governments.

 

I think a system of checks and balances is good in any industry and, in the long run, even though you feel the cruiselines are being "picked on" right now, this will eventually bring better practices in the future.

 

Kind regards,

 

Gunther and Uta

[hotrod1954]

"As long as the earth endures, seedtime and harvest, cold and heat, summer and winter, day and night will never cease."

 

Isn't that the issue here? And don't I also remember that God helps him who helps himself?

Well what i was saying God is in Control. Yes we have to take care of it but when you listen to some of these nut jobs it seems like they know whats best for everybody. I pile all these people in the same boat. The world is going to endure God said it. Case closed for me.

[5waldos]

Well what i was saying God is in Control. Yes we have to take care of it but when you listen to some of these nut jobs it seems like they know whats best for everybody. I pile all these people in the same boat. The world is going to endure God said it. Case closed for me.

 

And I believe that God wants us to help ourselves and our neighbors. Lots of lessons here.

[yellowsnow]

I feel like bible quotes are completely irrelevant as arguments for anything not related to RELIGION.

 

Back to the topic, I've always wished cruise companies made some nuclear powered ships. The only reason to not make them that I have heard of is that some countries don't allow for them to enter their waters (which may be something that also needs revision. As I understand it, nuclear power is very very safe now.) but cruise companies could use the ships to go only to ports where they were allowed and skip the others.

 

I bet you that once countries notice how much more traffic other ports get because they allow for nuclear ships, they may revise their restrictions quick.

[Aquahound]

Obviously, many of you haven't cruised in the 70's, 80's and 90's. I remember standing on deck late evening and watching crew members dumping garbage bags full of all of the day's garbage right into the ocean.

 

It was from several incidents just like that RCCL was forced to start a proactive campaign called "Save the Waves." Save the Waves is actually somewhat of a probation sentence from the U.S. District Court.

[5waldos]

I cannot think of any other business which inspires such huge support from its customers.