Epic Disappointment

[insidecabin]

I am beginning to get the feeling from what I am reading here and elsewhere, that folks who love Las Vegas are going to love the Epic, and those who like ocean breezes and fresh air, not so much.

 

 

For another board I did the cruise numbers if I got it right there are about 110million cruise berth days a year across the major cruise lines with around 14million US and 20+million EU PAx.

 

 

from here http://govegas.about.com/cs/faqs/l/blfunfacts.htm

 

Annual visitors to Las Vegas, in millions 36.7

Number of hotel rooms 124,270 (*2*365 = 90million bed days)

 

So Vegas is about as big as all the cruise industry put together.

 

Not a bad target market for one ship.

[sjbdtz]

First off, it is terrible netiquette to "change" ;) someone's quote.

 

Third, everything smartcruiser123 said is 100% correct. How do I know? Unlike you, I was there.

 

I was there too, and I disagree. Our bathroom light functioned exactly as it was explained to us....it was a motion sensor, designed to be environmentally friendly. There's no such thing as 100% right....only 100% for their opinion, and their context. SmartCruiser provided neither of these indices.

 

 

--------

 

She sailed; she failed on many counts. Again, I disagree. I think the ship performed exactly as intended...she stayed on top of the water, reached NYC ahead of schedule, fit under the bridge, fed everyone, and had entertainment in every corner. This isn't conjecture. I WAS THERE. Only reason we lined-up early was to get "CHOICE" of seats (I like aisles), our seating was otherwise secure.

 

 

 

*(I wasn't aware I was being sold a fake voyage...could I have paid with Monopoly money?) You could have tried....did you? If you didn't even try, why complain about it post-fact? ;)

 

 

On a message board, you have some people with either

 

a) an axe to grind

 

b) a desire for compensation

 

c) they work for a competitor

 

 

and then you have people who

 

a) prefer the provider for whatever reason (your baby is ugly syndrome)

 

b) have invested thousands of dollars in a vacation choice which is being denigrated (buyers remorse syndrome)

 

c) have actually experienced things and are not fazed by it (tourist vs. traveller syndrome)

 

 

The clash of these motivations is what makes some discussions more heated than others. Many people speak in absolutes....which is misleading to NEW cruisers, when a different person may have had a different experience.

 

For example....instead of saying "The Toilets didn't work", try saying "Neither MY toilet, nor the public one on deck 7 aft, port side...worked".

 

That is something which most people would accept....and offer suggestions as to how to get it fixed. Many might inquire as to whether the matter was corrected.....but very few would try to refute it as it is

 

a) a measurable issue

b) localized

c) personal to the writer

 

 

That's MY 0.02

Stephen

[Black Pearl Sailor]

on a message board, you have some people with either

 

a) an axe to grind

 

b) a desire for compensation

 

c) they work for a competitor

 

 

and then you have people who

 

a) prefer the provider for whatever reason (your baby is ugly syndrome)

 

b) have invested thousands of dollars in a vacation choice which is being denigrated (buyers remorse syndrome)

 

c) have actually experienced things and are not fazed by it (tourist vs. Traveller syndrome)

 

 

the clash of these motivations is what makes some discussions more heated than others. Many people speak in absolutes....which is misleading to new cruisers, when a different person may have had a different experience.

 

For example....instead of saying "the toilets didn't work", try saying "neither my toilet, nor the public one on deck 7 aft, port side...worked".

 

That is something which most people would accept....and offer suggestions as to how to get it fixed. Many might inquire as to whether the matter was corrected.....but very few would try to refute it as it is

 

a) a measurable issue

b) localized

c) personal to the writer

 

 

that's my 0.02

stephen

 

hear hear !!!

[SueSea]

And a business plan morphs...Bottom Line...

 

Of course a business plan morphs. That was what a number of people here were stating, which you thought was an unfounded rumor.

 

In response to the post: NCL is already taking a 50% loss of revenue on any studio cabin; since these cabins were actually to be double occupancy/price, you posted: This is not a loss of revenue. This space was never designed to hold more than one person so all revenue from these cabins were based on single pricing...

 

A number of people posted a correction to your assertion; they posted that this space was originally designed for two occupants. Your response was: I know it is hard to believe but not everything posted here or written here is golden. While on board the Epic they explained that they hired a seperate designer specifically for this space and it's main purpose was to accomodate the single traveler....

 

Since you called into question the veracity of the info about the original capacity for studio cabins, I posted the quote directly from NCL's website to identify the source. It was not an unfounded rumor started on these boards. The source was NCL themselves. So your response to that was: And a business plan morphs. As if your previous point was that NCL has the right to change their business plan at anytime (which they certainly do); however, your previous point actually was that NCL did not change their business plan.

[Mr. Luckytoo]

On a message board, you have some people with either

 

a) an axe to grind

 

b) a desire for compensation

 

c) they work for a competitor

 

That's it? Really? Maybe you also have some people who just give their opinion. Maybe there are some people, like myself, who are tired of reading where posters get "jumped" and/or ridiculed if they post something other than perfect. Maybe some posters take things a little too personal at times.

 

and then you have people who

 

a) prefer the provider for whatever reason (your baby is ugly syndrome)

 

b) have invested thousands of dollars in a vacation choice which is being denigrated (buyers remorse syndrome)

 

c) have actually experienced things and are not fazed by it (tourist vs. traveller syndrome)

 

Stephen I don't understand options a-c (seriously - guess it went over my limited understanding :o)

 

The clash of these motivations is what makes some discussions more heated than others. Many people speak in absolutes....which is misleading to NEW cruisers, when a different person may have had a different experience.

 

For example....instead of saying "The Toilets didn't work", try saying "Neither MY toilet, nor the public one on deck 7 aft, port side...worked".

 

That is something which most people would accept....and offer suggestions as to how to get it fixed. Many might inquire as to whether the matter was corrected.....but very few would try to refute it as it is

 

a) a measurable issue

b) localized

c) personal to the writer

 

 

That's MY 0.02

Stephen

 

I agree with you on this last point. However, for most people posting a review or observation on their cruise they don't pay this much attention to detail. Most of us write on a BB they way we speak. Unfortunately it loses something in the translation at time...

[rachelandfamily]

I'm new to the NCL forum, have experienced and booked for 2011 on Epic, a convert from RCCL [Diamond member] but find the postings really scary...this is a holiday...lets be excited, not argue....I would say I am apprehensive to join in here...

[sdmike]

I'm new to the NCL forum, have experienced and booked for 2011 on Epic, a convert from RCCL [Diamond member] but find the postings really scary...this is a holiday...lets be excited, not argue....I would say I am apprehensive to join in here...

 

Hi Rachel - Welcome. There's just a lot of opinions, unknowns and excitement due to the ship being brand new, very different, and the maiden voyage not going as well as some had hoped. There are a few people here that are overly negative, a bunch that are overly positive, and a WHOLE lot of people just discussing the ship in general. With the passion around this you'll get some disagreements but don't let that scare you away. There's a ton of information on these epic threads. Read away and draw your own conclusions. :)

[rachelandfamily]

thankyou for your welcome, she is such a ground breaking ship, there will be greatly differing opinions. My initial feeling are probably biased by having a truly unique experience on an inaugral. But have booked for jy 40th next year, as opposed to my regular RCCL.

[sjbdtz]

That's it? Really? Maybe you also have some people who just give their opinion. Maybe there are some people, like myself, who are tired of reading where posters get "jumped" and/or ridiculed if they post something other than perfect. Maybe some posters take things a little too personal at times.

 

 

 

Stephen I don't understand options a-c (seriously - guess it went over my limited understanding :o)

 

 

MrLucky: I didn't say my lists were exhaustive. I said "some do this", "some do that"....I didn't say this+that = all.

 

Tourists expect everything to go according to the schedule, move in, photograph, move out. Travellers tend to take things in stride, enjoying the 'adventure' (no, GKBIII I'm not talking about you, here) as much as the voyage or the destination.

 

These are the people who revel in missed connections, and having to think on their feet....think John Candy in "Planes, Trains & Automobiles".... each new dilemma simply requires a new solution.

 

I'm not saying either is better than the other, but I consider myself closer to a traveller than a tourist......

 

Try having the airline lose your luggage between New Zealand & Sydney, causing you to miss your connection to Seoul, having to re-route through Hong Kong. Arrive in Seoul at 1:30 a.m. in what they would consider 'fall' (cold, rainy, near-winter) in shorts & sandals because NZ was hot....not speaking the language, no luggage (thanks Air New Zealand), and a 7a.m. appointment to see the de-militarized zone, which has a dress code including no shorts and no sandals.

 

That's travelling!!!! :eek: (yes, that's my actual experience)....I made the 7a.m. appt, borrowed a fleece & some socks, and had one of the best experiences...setting foot in North Korea, driving alongside active minefields, etc.

 

Granted this wasn't vacation...I was there for work, but still.... it makes worrying about not having television for 3 days, on a ship with entertainment in every corner....seem like a trivial issue.

[maja]

I grew up in Vegas; lived there for 22 years.

 

And you are right on the money.

 

Wow! I just love how all of us can sail on the same ship & come off with so many different impressions. Goes to show we each have our own ideas of what makes a cruise good or bad.

 

I didn't feel "Vegas" at all on the Epic. In my opinion, the Epic was a step up from the other NCL ships. Everything I enjoyed in the past was here but better. Each night felt like a night out in NYC with great food & entertainment. I didn't find it to be "glitzy" at all if this is what you mean. I found it to be "finer" than I had expected.

[sjbdtz]

Wow! I just love how all of us can sail on the same ship & come off with so many different impressions. Goes to show we each have our own ideas of what makes a cruise good or bad.

 

I didn't feel "Vegas" at all on the Epic. In my opinion, the Epic was a step up from the other NCL ships. Everything I enjoyed in the past was here but better. Each night felt like a night out in NYC with great food & entertainment. I didn't find it to be "glitzy" at all if this is what you mean. I found it to be "finer" than I had expected.

 

Maybe we have different perceptions not of the ship, but of Vegas. Vegas to me is loads of top-talent entertainment, top-notch restaurants, 5 star hotels, and style. Look at Wynn (casino)....nothing 'glitzy' about it...it's a stylish, fancy, hotel.

[Leyndon]

Maybe we have different perceptions not of the ship, but of Vegas. Vegas to me is loads of top-talent entertainment, top-notch restaurants, 5 star hotels, and style. Look at Wynn (casino)....nothing 'glitzy' about it...it's a stylish, fancy, hotel.

 

 

I agree with this.

 

Also crusing is very Vegas in itself...everything is kind of manufactured and pre designed (Or like they say in Vegas - "Master planned community".) Of course being on a ship, it has to be planned- but compared to other modes of travel, there is less variation in what you can do/eat/go etc. There is a finite list.

 

I now am a New Yorker, which gives me a good way to compare...

[Mr. Luckytoo]

Maybe we have different perceptions not of the ship, but of Vegas. Vegas to me is loads of top-talent entertainment, top-notch restaurants, 5 star hotels, and style. Look at Wynn (casino)....nothing 'glitzy' about it...it's a stylish, fancy, hotel.

 

Sjbdtz, While we may disagree about things on the TA I agree with you on this point.

 

I felt like I was in "Vegas" while on the Epic. The style of the cabins was something like the Venetian. BMG plays in Vegas. Legends I saw in Vegas and the shipboard performace lived up to that quality. Cirque Dinner show reminded me of the Cirque shows at Treasure Island and the MGM. The casino reminded me of Harrah's in AC as well.

 

When people mention Vegas many think of the neon lights of the old Sands and Flamingo. It's still there but there are many upscale, top talent and great eating establishments as well.

[hat776]

I'm sure the fires and other trouble EPIC had before being handed over to NCl knocked NCL's plans for the TA.

We were on the Gem's inaugural Med cruise a few months after being launched. Most of the crew were new.

We were also on Splendida's maiden cruise, and Eclipse's Naming Ceremony.

In all cases everything worked perfectly and the crew were all confident.

I can't imagine any line trusting the French ship yard after all the problems NCL had