Rent tanks ans Enriched Air certification on RCI

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

Does anyone know if you can rent tanks on RCI?

 

Also, does anyone know if you can get enriched air certified on RCI?

 

I want to have larger tanks than what the dive charters offer while cruising on RCI's Oasis of the Seas next month.

[Capt_BJ]

based on my last RCI sailing in May of FOS I'd say, no they do not rent tanks at all. And I did not notice such a course on their 'things to do listings' but I was not looking for it and RCI on the larger ships anyway DOES have a heck of a diving program.

 

In my experience, the standard charter is not going to mix an enriched gas dive with a standard group.

 

You want larger tanks . . . ????

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

based on my last RCI sailing in May of FOS I'd say, no they do not rent tanks at all. And I did not notice such a course on their 'things to do listings' but I was not looking for it and RCI on the larger ships anyway DOES have a heck of a diving program.

 

In my experience, the standard charter is not going to mix an enriched gas dive with a standard group.

 

You want larger tanks . . . ????

Yes - larger than an 80 cu ft aluminum tank, which seems to be the norm at most dive shops. Looking for a 119 or 130 cu ft steel tanks: bigger tanks = more air = longer dives, right?

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

Just got a reply from RCI - they do not offer enriched air classes on board. No biggie - just feel better after diving with enriched air. :)

[BlueWaterPrincess]

Does anyone know if you can rent tanks on RCI?

 

Also, does anyone know if you can get enriched air certified on RCI?

 

I want to have larger tanks than what the dive charters offer while cruising on RCI's Oasis of the Seas next month.

 

You sure like to complicate things don't you? Why on EARTH would you want to hump tanks form the ship to a dive boat to begin with? That just doesn't even make sense. I know there are a few ops in Cozumel that offer larger tanks but you're going to pay more. Check with Aldora, Liquid Blue and LIving Underwater in Cozumel.

 

I have to ask, if you are not nitrox certified (as implied by your question of wanting to know if nitrox courses are offered on the ship) how do you know that you feel better after diving enriched air?

 

Who did you end up picking anyway after that long thread you started? You compared all of these dive shops and promised to let us know who you picked and we haven't heard back from you.

[BlueWaterPrincess]

Yes - larger than an 80 cu ft aluminum tank, which seems to be the norm at most dive shops. Looking for a 119 or 130 cu ft steel tanks: bigger tanks = more air = longer dives, right?

 

Only if you are not good with your air consumption do you need the crutch of a larger tank. I know plenty of divers that get 60 - 80 minutes dives on AL 80's including myself

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

You sure like to complicate things don't you? Why on EARTH would you want to hump tanks form the ship to a dive boat to begin with? That just doesn't even make sense. I know there are a few ops in Cozumel that offer larger tanks but you're going to pay more. Check with Aldora, Liquid Blue and LIving Underwater in Cozumel.

 

I have to ask, if you are not nitrox certified (as implied by your question of wanting to know if nitrox courses are offered on the ship) how do you know that you feel better after diving enriched air?

 

Who did you end up picking anyway after that long thread you started? You compared all of these dive shops and promised to let us know who you picked and we haven't heard back from you.

WOW - only 10 posts! You gotta get cruiing, girl, and get on some roll-call threads! :)

 

When taking the various PADI courses, you learn about this stuff - but you would know that right? Plus we're allowed to use enriched air during our certification dives, and on other dives too - so far 7 of my 16 dives to date have been on enriched air.

 

As far as the place I picked - I was going to post that after the cruise, along with a detailed review of the dives, and how they went. If I am correct, your name is Christi and your dive outfit was full for that day, so I had to choose another one - one that would do a 3-tank dive outing to my liking.

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

Only if you are not good with your air consumption do you need the crutch of a larger tank. I know plenty of divers that get 60 - 80 minutes dives on AL 80's including myself

 

Women get air consumption down pat soooo quickly - not fair! :D

I'm going with a total new diver, fresh out of the open water PADI course, so he will not have had time to figure this out for himself. I myself still use iar pretty quickly, but not as fast as I used to. I've never got 60-80 minutes out of any dive to date - in fact, none of my dives have lasted any longer than 49 minutes. However, I've been training in high-current areas of the St. Lawrence river, and often have to fight against the current which is a huge oxygen-sucker. Plus I don't have a good set of fins (yet), but I do plan on buying a good set prior to my trip. :) But the fact remains that my dive buddy will be excited and be using air at a "noobie" rate, and we dive together so I want our dive to last as long as possible.

 

Form what all the instructors that have been diving with me in the St. Lawrence tell me (if you can have a good drift dive here, you can have a great drift dive anywhere in the World), I'll be just fine.

[BlueWaterPrincess]

WOW - only 10 posts! You gotta get cruiing, girl, and get on some roll-call threads! :)

 

When taking the various PADI courses, you learn about this stuff - but you would know that right? Plus we're allowed to use enriched air during our certification dives, and on other dives too - so far 7 of my 16 dives to date have been on enriched air.

 

As far as the place I picked - I was going to post that after the cruise, along with a detailed review of the dives, and how they went. If I am correct, your name is Christi and your dive outfit was full for that day, so I had to choose another one - one that would do a 3-tank dive outing to my liking.

 

I'm going with a total new diver, fresh out of the open water PADI course, so he will not have had time to figure this out for himself. I myself still use iar pretty quickly, but not as fast as I used to. I've never got 60-80 minutes out of any dive to date - in fact, none of my dives have lasted any longer than 49 minutes. However, I've been training in high-current areas of the St. Lawrence river, and often have to fight against the current which is a huge oxygen-sucker. Plus I don't have a good set of fins (yet), but I do plan on buying a good set prior to my trip. But the fact remains that my dive buddy will be excited and be using air at a "noobie" rate, and we dive together so I want our dive to last as long as possible.

 

Form what all the instructors that have been diving with me in the St. Lawrence tell me (if you can have a good drift dive here, you can have a great drift dive anywhere in the World), I'll be just fine.

 

Nope, not Christi but I know who she is. I spend a lot of time on Cozumel and have a very close friend that owns a different dive shop who is a friend of Christi.

 

Correct that I am a PADI instructor and I lead groups to the island on a regular basis. I've been here for a majority of the summer in fact.

 

FYI - it is incorrect that you can dive enriched air during OW training dives, you can do them as an "Adventure Dive" during AOW if the instructor is a nitrox instructor and you must be accompanied by the instructor. No offense intended, but with only 16 dives you are still a very new diver too regardless of what c-card you hold.

 

Not only women have good air consumption, many of the divers I work with are men and can do well over 1 hour on AL 80's.

[Capt_BJ]

sorry you confused me when you coupled a request for enriched mix and larger tanks

 

there are many many factors that go into air consumption . . .

 

where you've been up to now the water is COLD is it not? I'd imagine that helps burn air fast too - but can only guess because I've only two cold water dives under my belt. My original checkout dive (yes I said DIVE) way back in the day in a Wisconson lake, and a VA quarry dive that I didn't burn half the tank b4 saying WHY?

 

If the water ain't about 85 degrees f I don't go in

 

ALSO depth is a MAJOR factor which I hope you understand. {in my day the amount of gas physics we had to be profficient in for a NAUI and YMCA certification would make most heads spin} In most of the islands deeper does not equal better. In Cayman if you want to dive 'the wall' you must go deep ... that's where the wall is ... Cozumel too in my experience. That is not the same as saying that's where the best diving is. At Bloody Bay wall on Little Cayman you can be over the wall at half that depth with longer bottom times and less air consumption. Do a good shore dive at Eden or Sunset House in Cayman and never get below 50 feet .... you'll have more bottom time.

 

On a Cayman trip we had a guy on several of our boat days who was from Norway and ALL of his previous diving was ICE diving. He'd come up from a wall dive and the boat crew would ask him if he'd actually breathed ... his needle had hardly moved. First day they checked for busted gear ... second day they checked again .. third day they let him do second dive on the same tank; ONLY time I saw a Cayman boat do that. On shore the guy used one tank for several days off Sunset House and he was ALWAYS underwater with his camera. How he didn't bend himself is a different issue ... I guess he had a really shallow spot where he sat and took pictures. But point it this cold water guy found warm water a very very relaxing environment.

 

Most dive shops/boats have different size tanks available. Question is will they let you know / have them. Spousal unit has very low air consumption rate and can easily get thru the average charter dive with a shorty tank. The places we frequent give her one no questions asked cuz they know her. But most places want all the divers they don't know to have a standard sized tank as they can rate diving skills and expected diving times from that 'standard' ....

[scubadiver888]

Ottawa_cruise_man,

 

As BlueWaterPrincess pointed out, lugging cylinders from the cruise ship to the dive shop doesn't make a lot of sense. Especially if you want to get steel 119 (50 pounds EACH when full) or 130 (52 pounds EACH when full) cylinders.

 

I, personally, would not want to carry all my gear PLUS another 100 pounds of scuba cylinders. It would make more sense to arrange for the dive operator to supply you with larger capacity cylinders at the shop/boat.

 

There are AL100 cylinders. An AL80 is really only 77.4 cu.ft. of air but an AL100 is actually 100 cu.ft. of air. Caribbean shops, because it is salt water, are more likely to rent an AL100 then steel cylinders. Aluminium cylinders are cheaper and easier to maintain. You might want to find out who the dive operators will be and see what the largest cylinder they can provide. If you ask for an HP119 or HP130 specifically, the answer might be NO and they won't even suggest an AL100.

 

There are PLENTY of shops in the Ottawa area who can get you EAN (Nitrox) certified. The standard course is all class room and usually one day. You can make it an Adventure Dive and do 2 dives on Nitrox as well but there is no real advantage to doing the 2 dives.

 

Which shop are you getting your training with?

[Middleager]

I'm in Toronto, and I don't dive in the cold water here. Ottawa St. Lawrence area, the water won't be warmer. And yes, one uses up air a lot quicker in cold water.

 

I enjoy diving in warm water better. Only did cool water in a PA spring, Catalina Island, and Ensenada, wearing 7mm and almost 20 lb of weight. So yes if you can dive fine in St. Lawrence water, it'll be easier in the warmer waters.

 

I had luck getting larger tanks in Cozumel the two times I was there. First time with Blue Angel, and second time with Chucho. Some others I inquired were also able to get larger tanks (Dive with Christina, and others).

 

Grand Cayman, couldn't get larger tanks. But the one dive I did at Eden Rock, shallow most of the time, I lasted just more than 1 hr, for my longest dive.

 

I enjoyed all the warm water dives much better than the cool dive at the PA spring. I bet you'll also enjoy the warm Caribbean dives much better than the cold water at the St. Lawrence currents.

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

Ottawa_cruise_man,

 

As BlueWaterPrincess pointed out, lugging cylinders from the cruise ship to the dive shop doesn't make a lot of sense. Especially if you want to get steel 119 (50 pounds EACH when full) or 130 (52 pounds EACH when full) cylinders.

 

I, personally, would not want to carry all my gear PLUS another 100 pounds of scuba cylinders. It would make more sense to arrange for the dive operator to supply you with larger capacity cylinders at the shop/boat.

 

There are AL100 cylinders. An AL80 is really only 77.4 cu.ft. of air but an AL100 is actually 100 cu.ft. of air. Caribbean shops, because it is salt water, are more likely to rent an AL100 then steel cylinders. Aluminium cylinders are cheaper and easier to maintain. You might want to find out who the dive operators will be and see what the largest cylinder they can provide. If you ask for an HP119 or HP130 specifically, the answer might be NO and they won't even suggest an AL100.

 

There are PLENTY of shops in the Ottawa area who can get you EAN (Nitrox) certified. The standard course is all class room and usually one day. You can make it an Adventure Dive and do 2 dives on Nitrox as well but there is no real advantage to doing the 2 dives.

 

Which shop are you getting your training with?

 

You're right about lugging the tanks around. The thing is, I'm only doing 2 dive trips during a 2 week cruise, so I want to make the most of it. Also, one of the dive will be with a new;y-certified diver, so his air consumption will be a bit on the high side.

 

Yes, there are plenty where I can get my En Air certification: it's just that I am quite busy these days, and I wanted to see if I cold get it done on board.

 

I got my training at Sharky's.

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

I'm in Toronto, and I don't dive in the cold water here. Ottawa St. Lawrence area, the water won't be warmer. And yes, one uses up air a lot quicker in cold water.

 

I enjoy diving in warm water better. Only did cool water in a PA spring, Catalina Island, and Ensenada, wearing 7mm and almost 20 lb of weight. So yes if you can dive fine in St. Lawrence water, it'll be easier in the warmer waters.

 

I had luck getting larger tanks in Cozumel the two times I was there. First time with Blue Angel, and second time with Chucho. Some others I inquired were also able to get larger tanks (Dive with Christina, and others).

 

Grand Cayman, couldn't get larger tanks. But the one dive I did at Eden Rock, shallow most of the time, I lasted just more than 1 hr, for my longest dive.

 

I enjoyed all the warm water dives much better than the cool dive at the PA spring. I bet you'll also enjoy the warm Caribbean dives much better than the cold water at the St. Lawrence currents.

 

Actually, I don't find swimming in the St. Lawrence to be cold at all with a 7mm full suit on. Once I get into the water, I acclimatize pretty quickly, I guess. But i have yet to dive in warm waters, so I'll be happy if my air supply lasts longer! :)

In. St. Thomas, it's AL 80, or AL70's - my choice... I wonder which one I'll pick...hehe!

 

In Cozumel - it's 100's - not sure if AL.

[scubadiver888]

I'm in Toronto, and I don't dive in the cold water here. Ottawa St. Lawrence area, the water won't be warmer. And yes, one uses up air a lot quicker in cold water.

 

I enjoy diving in warm water better. Only did cool water in a PA spring, Catalina Island, and Ensenada, wearing 7mm and almost 20 lb of weight. So yes if you can dive fine in St. Lawrence water, it'll be easier in the warmer waters.

 

I had luck getting larger tanks in Cozumel the two times I was there. First time with Blue Angel, and second time with Chucho. Some others I inquired were also able to get larger tanks (Dive with Christina, and others).

 

Grand Cayman, couldn't get larger tanks. But the one dive I did at Eden Rock, shallow most of the time, I lasted just more than 1 hr, for my longest dive.

 

I enjoyed all the warm water dives much better than the cool dive at the PA spring. I bet you'll also enjoy the warm Caribbean dives much better than the cold water at the St. Lawrence currents.

 

Middleager,

 

The St. Lawrence in the summer is a popular place to dive because the water is actually quite warm. I was there recently and the water temp was 79F at 100 feet. If you are in Lake Ontario (e.g. Kingston) you can expect thermoclines and temps as low as 45F. I have not been to Tobermory but I'm told it is a little colder than Lake Ontario.

 

So a warm day in the St. Lawrence is comparable to a cool day in the Caribbean.

[scubadiver888]

You're right about lugging the tanks around. The thing is, I'm only doing 2 dive trips during a 2 week cruise, so I want to make the most of it. Also, one of the dive will be with a new;y-certified diver, so his air consumption will be a bit on the high side.

 

Yes, there are plenty where I can get my En Air certification: it's just that I am quite busy these days, and I wanted to see if I cold get it done on board.

 

I got my training at Sharky's.

 

First, when I first started diving I ALWAYS ran out of air before most other people. I also never got cold. Why? I was trying to swim underwater. I was always kicking, wearing too much weight and using my hands. Now, I don't use my hands, I'm properly weighted and I always get cold. I can dive in the Caribbean in a full 3mm wetsuit and get cold. The reason is because I'm not using my hands. If you are warm you are active. If you are active you are burning through your air.

 

I'm surprised you are claiming Sharky's let you use nitrox for your open water dives. From page 192 of the Open Water manual:

 

So, to avoid oxygen toxicity problems, don't have (or try to have) your cylinder filled with enriched air, unless you're properly trained and certified. Don't use a cylinder that's marked as being an enriched air cylinder, (again, unless you're properly trained and certified).

 

Just above this paragraph:

 

reputable dive centers will not provide enriched air without proof of enriched air certification.

 

If Sharky's is letting Open Water students use nitrox then they are not a reputable dive centre.

[Middleager]

Middleager,

 

The St. Lawrence in the summer is a popular place to dive because the water is actually quite warm. I was there recently and the water temp was 79F at 100 feet. If you are in Lake Ontario (e.g. Kingston) you can expect thermoclines and temps as low as 45F. I have not been to Tobermory but I'm told it is a little colder than Lake Ontario.

 

So a warm day in the St. Lawrence is comparable to a cool day in the Caribbean.

Ah, I didn't know that. When talking to a dive op in Mississauga, they told me in the middle of summer when they go diving in Lake Ontario, people need to wear 6mm inside and 6mm outside (don't know why he said 6mm, because I thought it's 3mm, 5mm, or 7mm), and 30 lbs of weight. By the time you get to 50-60' it's cold, dark, muddy, and you might see sponges. Doesn't sound like much fun. I guess I'm spoiled from diving in the Caribbeans and Hawaii.

[BlueWaterPrincess]

First, when I first started diving I ALWAYS ran out of air before most other people. I also never got cold. Why? I was trying to swim underwater. I was always kicking, wearing too much weight and using my hands. Now, I don't use my hands, I'm properly weighted and I always get cold. I can dive in the Caribbean in a full 3mm wetsuit and get cold. The reason is because I'm not using my hands. If you are warm you are active. If you are active you are burning through your air.

 

I'm surprised you are claiming Sharky's let you use nitrox for your open water dives. From page 192 of the Open Water manual:

 

 

 

Just above this paragraph:

 

 

 

If Sharky's is letting Open Water students use nitrox then they are not a reputable dive centre.

 

Ditto to everything you said. Sharky's allowing you, an OW Diver/student to dive EAN without being certified for EAN is a standards violation if I ever saw one not to mention the irresponsibility on their part for giving it to you.

 

The nitrox dives to an OW student/diver are a standar

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

First, when I first started diving I ALWAYS ran out of air before most other people. I also never got cold. Why? I was trying to swim underwater. I was always kicking, wearing too much weight and using my hands. Now, I don't use my hands, I'm properly weighted and I always get cold. I can dive in the Caribbean in a full 3mm wetsuit and get cold. The reason is because I'm not using my hands. If you are warm you are active. If you are active you are burning through your air.

 

I'm surprised you are claiming Sharky's let you use nitrox for your open water dives. From page 192 of the Open Water manual:

 

 

 

Just above this paragraph:

 

 

 

If Sharky's is letting Open Water students use nitrox then they are not a reputable dive centre.

 

 

They did this during the certification dives. As far as I understand it is perfectly safe as long as you have a certified instructor with you. Nice of you to put in your 2 cents worth and make a statement like that, though. :rolleyes:

 

And in all reality, you can't convince me that there was safety violation: maybe a rules violation, but if you follow an air dive profile, then where is the harm? It's real nice to point fingers at others and make these statements, but in all reality you know for too well that there was never any risk whatsoever - especially with a dive pro attached to each student. Sheesh!

[BlueWaterPrincess]

They did this during the certification dives. As far as I understand it is perfectly safe as long as you have a certified instructor with you. Nice of you to put in your 2 cents worth and make a statement like that, though. :rolleyes:

 

And in all reality, you can't convince me that there was safety violation: maybe a rules violation, but if you follow an air dive profile, then where is the harm? It's real nice to point fingers at others and make these statements, but in all reality you know for too well that there was never any risk whatsoever - especially with a dive pro attached to each student. Sheesh!

 

PADI does not see it this way and no, it is not perfectly safe. But I guess the dive pros should defer to a newly certified open water diver with 16 dives to give us the scoop on this.

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

PADI does not see it this way and no, it is not perfectly safe. But I guess the dive pros should defer to a newly certified open water diver with 16 dives to give us the scoop on this.

Look: just tell me what the problem is then? What could possibly have happened to me then? Was I ever at any risk greater than breathing normal air? Don't tell me about certifications, etc... Just tell me about facts - nitrogen loading, etc... If you follow and air dive plan while breathing 32% enriched air, you are not at risk. In fact, you will have less nitrogen in your body, right?

[Middleager]

They did this during the certification dives. As far as I understand it is perfectly safe as long as you have a certified instructor with you.

 

And in all reality, you can't convince me that there was safety violation: maybe a rules violation, but if you follow an air dive profile, then where is the harm? It's real nice to point fingers at others and make these statements, but in all reality you know for too well that there was never any risk whatsoever - especially with a dive pro attached to each student. Sheesh!

 

Look: just tell me what the problem is then? What could possibly have happened to me then? Was I ever at any risk greater than breathing normal air? Don't tell me about certifications, etc... Just tell me about facts - nitrogen loading, etc... If you follow and air dive plan while breathing 32% enriched air, you are not at risk. In fact, you will have less nitrogen in your body, right?

These statements and attitude are worrisome.

 

You admit yourself the dive shop was in violation of the rules, then challenge others who are way more knowledgeable to prove to you its not a risk?!?

 

Diving is fun, but it should also be taken with prudence knowing there are also risks that can harm or kill. Attitudes like this is what get novice divers into trouble. I suggest you take some time yourself to learn more about EAN and other risks of diving. Only you can make sure you dive safely. Without an attitude change, not only you'll obvious put yourself in danger, you are telling others not to bother to help you.

[Middleager]

BTW, I'm also EAN certified. I enjoy diving and also know I have a lot more to learn about diving and am grateful to the many who are knowledgeable when they share/advise.

[Ottawa_cruise_man]

These statements and attitude are worrisome.

 

You admit yourself the dive shop was in violation of the rules, then challenge others who are way more knowledgeable to prove to you its not a risk?!?

 

Diving is fun, but it should also be taken with prudence knowing there are also risks that can harm or kill. Attitudes like this is what get novice divers into trouble. I suggest you take some time yourself to learn more about EAN and other risks of diving. Only you can make sure you dive safely. Without an attitude change, not only you'll obvious put yourself in danger, you are telling others not to bother to help you.

 

Look: we're talking about a dive with a certified EAN trainer. This isn't some attitude issue. DI think people are blowing this was out of proportion. Anyway, I'll be getting my certification this week or the week following depending on the schedule, and this will all be a moot point.

[scubadiver888]

Look: just tell me what the problem is then? What could possibly have happened to me then? Was I ever at any risk greater than breathing normal air? Don't tell me about certifications, etc... Just tell me about facts - nitrogen loading, etc... If you follow and air dive plan while breathing 32% enriched air, you are not at risk. In fact, you will have less nitrogen in your body, right?

 

When you take your EAN training it will be STRONGLY emphasized that you analyze your gas. YOU and ONLY YOU are responsible for the gas in your cylinder. Dive operators make mistakes.

 

For example, the first nitrox fill I got from a new shop, I wanted EAN32. I analyzed it and it was EAN46. My regulators weren't oxygen cleaned for anything above 40%. Not only was this more oxygen than I had planned for, it was in violation of recreational scuba diving standards. Mistakes like this happen ALL the time.

 

Another example, I went to one of the most well known dive shops on the St. Lawrence. It took them FIVE tries to get my nitrox mix correct. This is why is is STRONGLY emphasized that you analyze your gas.

 

It has not happened to me personally, but I have talked to people who accidentally got 100% oxygen. That can be toxic at 14 feet. You might be okay at 20 feet.

 

None of this talks about your oxygen clock. Another factor in using nitrox.

 

So, IF your instructor is monitoring everyone's oxygen clock and IF you got a 32% nitrox fill and IF no one goes below the MOD for EAN32 and IF, IF, IF.

 

There is a lot of IFs there. The idea is that accidents happen. The dive industry sets things up so that a number of things have to go wrong before someone gets injured. If one or two things go wrong you can usually recover from it with nothing more than a little scare. The more IFs you don't check for, the closer you are to a serious accident.

 

The fact that the staff at Sharky's don't seem to be thinking about this and realize the slippery slope they are stepping onto makes me question how good a dive shop they are.

 

By giving you nitrox without the proper training they are removing some of the safety factors. They are taking on responsibilities their insurance company assumes they are not. If something went wrong, the insurance company will use this loophole to cancel their policy. The injured diver will have to sue Sharky's. After a lawsuit and with no dive insurance, Sharky's will be out of business for good.

 

Additionally, the risk of DCS for an Open Water training dive on air versus on nitrox is so close as to be almost unmeasurable. The risk of a bad nitrox fill and oxygen toxicity is very high. Sharky's really is putting you in more danger by using nitrox.