SD I March 20-27 review

[Martita B.]

Jim~~~please come and join us on a Seabourn voyage! I've been sailing the Yachts for 6 years and have only sailed ONCE with ONE little girl about 10 yrs. of age. I've heard that a few are on board during the summer months in the Med., but I've not experienced children on the Pride or the Legend. Yes, I love my triple Grandsons, but not on a exclusive 6* cruise ship! Children should enjoy other lines~~~~Carnival, Disney, etc., etc. Many lines to choose from.....

I treated the Boys and their parents, to a Carnival Caribbean cruise (from Galveston) a few years ago.......they were ALL in heaven!

So sorry to hear that the beautiful Sea Dream's are allowing SO many children aboard an ADULT line. I had thought of booking a Sea Dream cruise, but now, am reconsidering!

(yes, I'm aware that the Sea Dream owners are former Seabourn owners)

We would loveee to "welcome you" to Seabourn!

'lest we forget, "The best Islands in the world are those that float and move.......their names are: The Legend, The Pride and The Spirit!"

Martita West Texas

[Jim Avery]

Martita:

Thanks for your kind words and good info on Seabourn. We are very seriously considering Seabourn or Silversea. SeaDream is a wonderful product if they only would stick to what they originally advertise, "55 privileged couples" and get away from allowing anyone under 18 on board. The beautiful little ships are too small to avoid other peoples brats and so the experience degrades. So far I have seen no complaints on either Silversea or Seabourn. Our only concern on Seabourn is that it is a part of the Carnival Group and, as long time Cunarders, are sickened by the disaster they have made of Cunard. Have you noticed any cheapening of the product under the Carnival Group? They really are good looking ships and we have the video from last year which always makes it look great. Maybe we will see you aboard soon.

Happy sailing.

Jim.

[its_my_dime]

We've been on both.

 

As I've posted, a year ago Christmas was our second trip on Seadream. We liked the ship which is why we came back. Great service and food. Very comfortable. However, after the Christmas - New Year's experience (25 kids the first week; 32 members of an extended, ethnocentric family the second week) and given that posts on this board suggest that nothing has changed, we have written off Seadream.

 

We did 2 weeks on Seabourn this spring. No problem with kids or groups. Its larger size allows more facilities and entertainment. And the tux for dinner wasn't as much of a problem as I had thought (although we did need a third suitcase between us for all the dressy clothes).

 

But Seabourn is an all smoking ship. In every public room indoors except for no smoking sections, and everywhere outdoors including the entire veranda dining area. If there are a bunch of dedicated smokers on board, it is almost impossible to get away from cigarette smoke. Every time you walk into an area, you need to look around to see where the smokers are so that you can sit away or upwind from them. And management likes it that way.

 

So we are not going to risk the Seabourn again unless or until we hear that the smoking policy has changed. (Sorry, Martita, but smoking is a non negotiable deal breaker for us).

 

We may try the Silversea in the next year or two, but meanwhile, there are many travel alternatives and we have several trips planned over the next year that do not include Seadream or Seabourn.

[Martita B.]

Jim~~~come join us on Seabourn! The Yachts are going to have "their face lifts" this fall and winter. The Pride 1st, in the Bahamas, the end of Oct. Then the Spirit, in Asia, and last the Legend, again in the Bahamas, in Dec. All will be refitted. Brand new vessels~~~haha well, not "brand new" but we Guests will feel they're new. The service is 6*, the food and wines are also 6*, as well as the passengers! We have alot of fun! Grrreat warmth and sociability! We're actually a big family!

 

it's-my-dime, Yes, you're right as to it is a "smoking allowed" ship. But, I have found that the Guests are very courteous and respectful of the non-smokers.

You would be happier, on perhaps, Oceania Lines.

 

Happy Trails and Sails!

Martita B.

[its_my_dime]

Jim~~~

it's-my-dime, Yes, you're right as to it is a "smoking allowed" ship. But, I have found that the Guests are very courteous and respectful of the non-smokers.

You would be happier, on perhaps, Oceania Lines.

 

Martita B.

 

Except when they aren't. Like the couple who sat next to us on the already overcroweded veranda, lit up and said that they had a right to smoke where other people were eating; they were going to smoke; and if we didn't like it, we could leave. We did. And, after talking to the hotel manager who said that he could do nothing about head office policy, we gave ship a final a very low final rating and suggested to our travel agent that Seabourn was not the place to book her non smoking clients.

 

And please don't talk down to us by saying that the only way we can avoid smokers is to go on Oceania (we've been there...on something called the MS nickel-and-dime). Please accept the fact that your precious Seabourn has a major (and for some people, deal-breaking) flaw because of its anachronistic smoking policy and we can part as friends and move on.

[sbflat]

We have been on SDII twice with our son - now 13. His behaviour was far better than the majority of the adults on the ship. Many adults arrived in the dining room in short and t-shirts while our son arrived in a dress shirt and slacks. He ordered a more sophisticated dinner than most (the chef had to work to please him!), behaved better than those who were drinking to excess, and retired long before the cigar smoking (that KILLS YOU!!!!!) idiots at the bar. SeaDream makes us feel very welcome because our money clears the bank just like anyone else's. For those who object to younger humans on these ships, get a life! You are biased and such attitudes reflect poorly on your intellect - if you have any. Family vacations at a luxury level are the future. If you can't accept that - go to Carnival where your attitudes are irrelevant.

[Jim Avery]

SBFLAT:

Two things about your post concern me. First, it appears you have not read, or didnt comprehend, the meaning expressed by the many posts in this thread and the other one concerning children aboard SD. Second, you have taken these posts as a personal affront and have reacted harshly and immaturely with your comments about intellect. Also, who cares about your money clearing the bank. We take at least 4 nice vacations per year and I assure you our money clears the bank equally well.

If your son is as perfect as you claim, you are to be congratulated-he is a rarity and I wish he had been aboard in place of the ones we experienced.

You do, however, miss the point of these posts and, with apologies to the other posters, I am going to repeat myself.

As I and many other posters stated, we have all had children, raised children, taken family vacations with our children. We are all now looking for an adult time with our spouses or partners. Being in a confined space with other peoples children is as offensive to us as is second hand smoke to a reformed smoker. It doesnt matter that your child is perfect (and I assure you only you and your child think this so), everyone I spoke with, passenger or crew, does not like children aboard such a small, intimate, quality ship. This is not "bias" as you claim, simply wanting the product we were sold. SD markets themself as the ultimate experience for "55 privileged couples". No where in the brochure do they mention any children, childrens facilities, or childrens rates.

It truly comes down to a simple choice. If SD wants you and yours on board, we and many like us will no longer sail SD. If, however, they return to their original business model and provide all the best for adult travelers then we will continue. Simple as that. Probably never meet you but then that is the best thing about a SD cruise, meeting accomplished, intelligent, well traveled adults. Parents who travel with their children miss that to some extent because they spend every day doing what they do at home, catering to the whims of their precious. I really hope you will stop taking other peoples opinions and wants as a personal affront. Do so and you will probably live longer. The other way must stress you out.

All the best.

Jim.

[paradise55]

Jim - I have to take issue with what you just wrote......You beat me to the punch. I too, was taken aback by the previous poster's comments and observations. Your words though, were exactly my thoughts and reaction. All my wife and I want is what SeaDream markets itself as, a place for "55 privileged couples" to enjoy an upscale experience. We are approaching and looking forward to our impending Med cruise with nothing less in mind. My wife and I are your typical "dinks" in our forties who work hard and enjoy adult company. We are mindful that there may be the odd child or 'slob' aboard, but should they be a real "presence", then our future vacation plans will not include SeaDream. Which would be a shame because we are truly excited about the concept. Just my nickel's worth because sometimes a dime's too much.

 

P.S. You would never catch us on a Carnival (good choice for a 13yr old though)

[DisneyJen]

Well said Jim and Paradise ... DH and I have a 12-year-old daughter who has traveled the world with us. However, what attracted us to SD in the first place was the idea of "adult" time. We too work hard and play hard ... and are advocates of 1 week away from our DD. She enjoys that week with her grandparents.

 

When we do take her on a cruise ... we take her on Disney or RCCL.

 

Again, it comes down to how SD is marketing the product ... and if they deliver that product.

[frequent traveler]

I can only second Jim, paradise 55, and DisneyJen-- we have two kids, 16 and 20, and we take a number of great family vacations -- however they are marketed as family vacations - -nothing, and I mean absolute nothing in the Sea Dream's brochures indicate that up to 1/3 of the ship will be occupied by children when there are no facilities - no camps, no pools, nothing. In fact the marketing brochures promise the exact opposite - 55 couples. So when I spend money, I expect to get what I was promised -- 55 couples - not 30 children under the age of 18 with most being 12 and under.

 

yes, sbflat - some of the adults can be obnoxious -- but I assumed that risk -- out of 55 couples, there will always be a few jerks - with enough alcohol, we all probably crossed a line at one point or another on the voyage.

 

yes, Jim, I do find it curious that no one has responded to us -- maybe my response on the end of cruise survey was too polite. Keep in touch and as you plan your next vacation -- let us know where you're going. Our next one is Beaches - Turks & Caicos with the kids this time.

[mason525]

Jim-

I think you're missing the point as well. The ship mate who is unpleasant to be on board with is as likely to be adult(smokers, overdrinkers,constant complainers) as a child. If you really want to control who is on board, you need to charter. Meg

[Jim Avery]

Hi Meg:

Nope, you missed the point. I am not trying to control who is on board. I am only asking SeaDream to provide exactly what they are marketing. the only control I have is on me. I plan to use the advise Ernesto provided and cancel if our Med cruise turns into the kiddie corps again.

Thanks for posting,

Jim.

[frequent traveler]

Hi Jim -

I agree, its not a "control on board" issue -- we all knew our ports could be changed, bad weather could interfere, and of the 55 privileged couples, some could be unpleasant personalities with whom we wouldn't want to socialize with if they were our next door neighbors. We assumed that risk when we signed up for the cruise -- but we didn't assume the risk of kids hogging the bar stools, interfering with waiters at night at dinner, . . . How will you handle your airline tickets for your next Sea Dream trip? we tend to use frequent flyer miles or book in advance to get the best deals so there are penalties for changes

FT

[flamboyant 1]

Which champagne did they serve on the SeaDream cruise ?

[Jim Avery]

Hi:

Had enough so I dont remember but I do remember it being good. Maybe Frequent Traveler will come in with the answer. She was the champagne queen of this trip.

Jim.

[U24Erin]

Jim

 

Thanks for your thoughtful and well stated posting re: kids on Seadream. When I had younger kids, I would have loved to take them on a cruise - but would have never considered taking them on SD - or any of the high-end smaller ships or luxury lines, it would have been just outright rude to the other passengers. Unfortunately, as we all know, our simple request will find deaf ears among those who most should pay attention. Cruise line management and their agents are our only hope.

 

But, some of the replies in this thread hint at another problem - groups on these very same small luxury ships. Sounds like the kids came in tow with such a group and the adults probably figured they owned the boat.

 

Now, I have not yet cruised on SD - I will - I did sail on them when they were the Sea Goddess 1 & 2 maybe a half dozen times - although I hear that the boats are now even better - and I thought they were fabulous before. About half the time, I was onboard with corporate groups - I even had responsiblility for leasing the whole boat on 2 occassions for such groups (winners of a sales incentive). When we owned the whole ship, it was fine. When the group was there along with other paying passengers - I felt embarassed about our behavior and painfully sorry for the others - we did pick up some or all of the other passengers' bills as an apology for basically ruining their vacations. My point is this, because of their size, these ships often attract groups and incentive sailings - if they lease the whole ship, then fine - if not, the management should have the thoughtfullness to advise booked patrons that a group will be onboard and give them the opportunity to shift their booking to another date. Everything that is soooo wonderful about ships like the SDI and SDII is absolutely destroyed by a group doing bow to stern tequilla shooters (even if they try to pull you into their 24X7 party) or by someone else's little darlings that the parents refuse to control and you aren't allowed to.

 

As a corporate groupster - I promise to never do it again. As a cruising vacationer, I request of all smaller ships the courtesy of giving me the option to bow out prior to getting on my flight. As a meetings and events professional, my apologies to anyone who has ever had their vacation spoiled by someone like me descending on Maui or Rome with 50 to 3,000 drunken sales reps in tow (I didn't like it either - that's why I'm outta that business).

[frequent traveler]

From the "champagne queen" -- it was a very good French champagne -- Red Label, I think Perrier or Jouet -- can't remember (killed a number of brain cells - only a few remaining) but the glass was never empty.

 

Loved it - the crew stocked the mini-bar for me -- had two bottles left when we debarked.

 

Frequent Traveler

[Jim Avery]

Have received an email from Bob Lepisto of SeaDream informing me of a change in pricing for 3rd person in a stateroom (often children). The old pricing was $100/day for ages 1 to 11 and $200/day for over 11, plus applicable fees. The new rate is 50% of the regular rate but never less than $200/day plus applicable fees, possibly reducing the number of young children aboard. I hope this helps. Comments anyone?

Jim.

[DisneyJen]

Hmmm ... that is interesting Jim. Thanks for sharing that info with us.

 

I suspect it MIGHT have an impact on that 1 to 11 age group and not so much on the teens. Does the "regular" rate mean the published rate or the discounted rate?

[frequent traveler]

Hi Jim -

Glad to see that Dennis hasn't kept you off line. Hope you and Lois are doing well.

 

As I remember our nightmare cruise, the terrible toddlers were accompanied not only by parents, but by a nanny which would have necesitated a separate cabin. So unfortunately, I tend to agree with Disney Jen. The change also wouldn't have prevented the feuding family of 4 who bought their package at a charity auction. I think the only way to minimize the risk is to avoid the SD on the US school holidays (Christmas, New Year's and Easters) -- though it sounds like a couple of the European cruises have also been impacted by extended family groups with children.

 

The cross-Atlantic sailing sounds pretty good - low risk of children I'd think - of course - no islands to visit either!.

 

FT

[Jim Avery]

Hi FT:

Yes, we got lucky this time. Was offline for a few days but no damage to speak of. Much better than Ivan when we lost roof, had flooding in house, 2 cars flooded and a third with a bird house on the roof, fences, trees, etc.etc. Its such fun living "in paradise".

I agree with you, at this price level, seems like parents pay any price for the kiddies. I hope it helps or at least signals a trend that SD is trying. Many comments other than ours indicate problems with the same issues.

As far as transatlantic, we have considered that too. Great value for money and we love the sea days. Have done 16 transats on Cunard dating back to the age of sail. Very enjoyable for persons that dont require 24 hour entertainment and who like their spouse/partner. I also like your idea of getting 55 "Privileged couples" together and chartering.

Have a great Summer.

Jim & Lois.

[frequent traveler]

Thanks Disney Jen -- have got the e-mail address - so you can take it down now if you'd like.

 

My hubbie is also not in favor of an ocean crossing in a small ship so for my current mid life crisis, I'm thinking about going on my own!!!.

 

FT

[DisneyJen]

FT ... I would take it down if I could figure out how to edit it at this point:rolleyes: I hear you on the midlife crisis.

 

Actually DH told me I was too young to be having it now ... I told him women can have it anywhere between 40 and 55:p I even shared the Time article a few weeks back on women and midlife crisis.

[frequent traveler]

DisneyJen -

I went to the FAQ's - supposedly there is an "edit" symbol next to each posting allowing an author to edit his/her postings -- but I can't find it next to mine - maybe you will have better luck.

 

Its nice DH thinks you are too young --- but I agree - anytime between 40 and 55 sounds good to me.

 

I'll be in touch - on the road again. Somehow - 12 days at sea on SD surrounded by strangers and a crew waiting on you - with no one contacting you by phone, e-mail or Crackberry (oops, I mean Blackberry) is sounding better and better.

 

FT

 

When I posted this - all of a sudden there was the "edit" symbol - I guess it only works with brand new postings. :confused:

[DisneyJen]

Well isn't that interesting ... the post with the email info went POOF with out me doing anything:confused: Oh well ... mission accomplished:p

 

I laughed so hard about the Crackberry ... I actually can't decide if the Blackberry is a blessing or a curse (although I have been known to curse it more than once a day).

 

I wonder if there is email access on the transatlantic cruise?