Warning Credit/ Debit cards Cloning

[Jimsgirl]

A poster says that in order to track a fraudulent charge, it is only necessary to check the statement, which will list the retailer, the amount , the date and possibly the location.

 

This may be, but that does not help with tracking the actual perp. who stole the details or made the fraudulent transaction. A card details "stolen" in for instance in the UK, could be used in the USA, Pakistan, and S. Africa all with 30 mins of each other. only about an hour after being "stolen"

 

Two weeks ago, I made a phone call purchase via a company I have used for years, with an excellent reputation. An hour later I received a phone call frm a female stating she was "xxx with the Accouns Dept at yyy (the company" that my card had been denied, and she needed more details "in case it was our error"

 

Sounds reasonable does it not? As certain posters have implied on here I am "difficult to deal with" (hmmmm) anyway I replied that if she would leave her phone number and extension number I would contact the Credit card company, find out why the denial, and call her back. The phone call was disconnected. Sadly it could not be traced.

On calling the credit card company, I learned that the transaction had taken place without any problem only mins after I had placed the order.

 

The phone call from the "accounts dept" was a total scam. It did mean that someone at the company was in touch with "crooks" though, and the company are investigating who handled my financial dealings.

 

Crooks are very technically minded, and very inventive . Sadly many ordinary people are too trusting, and alas also "do not want to get involved", how many times on here do we read of posters who "look the other way" rather than confront an issue.

 

On an earlier posting re Post cruise billing, a poster actually suggested that a wrongful charge of $80 should be paid rather than confront Cunard and get into a hassle with them

 

How bad is that advice.?

[newjoisey]

A poster says that in order to track a fraudulent charge, it is only necessary to check the statement, which will list the retailer, the amount , the date and possibly the location.

 

This may be, but that does not help with tracking the actual perp. who stole the details or made the fraudulent transaction. A card details "stolen" in for instance in the UK, could be used in the USA, Pakistan, and S. Africa all with 30 mins of each other. only about an hour after being "stolen"

 

Two weeks ago, I made a phone call purchase via a company I have used for years, with an excellent reputation. An hour later I received a phone call frm a female stating she was "xxx with the Accouns Dept at yyy (the company" that my card had been denied, and she needed more details "in case it was our error"

 

Sounds reasonable does it not? As certain posters have implied on here I am "difficult to deal with" (hmmmm) anyway I replied that if she would leave her phone number and extension number I would contact the Credit card company, find out why the denial, and call her back. The phone call was disconnected. Sadly it could not be traced.

On calling the credit card company, I learned that the transaction had taken place without any problem only mins after I had placed the order.

 

The phone call from the "accounts dept" was a total scam. It did mean that someone at the company was in touch with "crooks" though, and the company are investigating who handled my financial dealings.

 

Crooks are very technically minded, and very inventive . Sadly many ordinary people are too trusting, and alas also "do not want to get involved", how many times on here do we read of posters who "look the other way" rather than confront an issue.

 

On an earlier posting re Post cruise billing, a poster actually suggested that a wrongful charge of $80 should be paid rather than confront Cunard and get into a hassle with them

 

How bad is that advice.?

and you KNOW it is a wrongful charge how ?

[edgeoftheworld]

Well, I know it's not Cunard, but Celebrity certainly does; when we were on Eclipse a couple of months ago, we received a letter in the cabin advising us that our card had been rejected, and requesting we contact our bank. As it was obvious (to us, if not to Celebrity) that the Purser's Desk had made an error in processing the card, I wandered down and asked them to put the card through again - they advised that there would be a fairly long wait while they did this; it actually took about fifteen minutes.

 

From this, it appears to be normal practice for all cruiselines to check at some point during the cruise that the funds are available for the final bill?

 

Mary

 

did you have to give them your card to be processed?

 

 

they most likely operate the same way as hotels do, they process a pre-authorisation on the card, whereby they 'hold' a set amount on that card, which you are then unable to spend. they dont actually process the payment up-front, but know that they will be able to process a payment of the amount on hold.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_hold

 

 

 

"As it was obvious (to us, if not to Celebrity) that the Purser's Desk had made an error in processing the card, I wandered down and asked them to put the card through again - they advised that there would be a fairly long wait while they did this; it actually took about fifteen minutes."

 

had you previously given the pursers desk your card details? or had you done it on land?

that they said there would be a wait, & that it actually took 15mins to do anyway, suggests that they contacted shoreside to re-process the card.

 

 

even if the pursers desk on a ship can directly process credit/debit cards, its a very small number of staff that would be able to do this, & only against transactions already on your ship account.

[Norfolk Brit]

did you have to give them your card to be processed? Yes, had to give them my credit card.

had you previously given the pursers desk your card details? or had you done it on land? On land.

that they said there would be a wait, & that it actually took 15mins to do anyway, suggests that they contacted shoreside to re-process the card. The impression they gave was that they were contacting the card provider to check the funds were available.

 

See replies in red above.

[edgeoftheworld]

A poster says that in order to track a fraudulent charge, it is only necessary to check the statement, which will list the retailer, the amount , the date and possibly the location.

 

This may be, but that does not help with tracking the actual perp. who stole the details or made the fraudulent transaction. A card details "stolen" in for instance in the UK, could be used in the USA, Pakistan, and S. Africa all with 30 mins of each other. only about an hour after being "stolen"

 

my reply was in the context of what has been specifically stated so far in this thread;

 

 

I have quoted the relevant section of the post from the other forum below. The original post on this forum could certainly be interpreted in the way you describe, as could the first part of what "Marianne Coventry" said. However the second part of the quote is entirely unambiguous.

 

 

"All the transactions were done whilst we were aboard the ship and they were all done by signiture not pin number. The bank said it must be someone on the ship that had access to my bank details."

 

 

I have a sneaky feeling that another confounding factor in all of this may have been a communication failure between MC and her bank.

 

J

 

 

I am sorry that has taken me a while to reply but my I.S.P has been down all day, How do i know of this happening! It is Through personal emails not a web site!. The person involved is adamant that the card was not used anywhere apart from at check in at Southampton & no where else & that purchases where made on the card whilst they where on the ship & that the card companies fraud department are now investigating the case.

 

 

 

 

to know where the fraudulent transactions have come from, simply look at the purchases on a statement.

it will list the retailer name, the amount, date, & sometimes the actual location

 

presumably the person concerned has done so?

 

 

 

what has been stated is;

 

the transactions occurred whilst the person was on the ship

> this gives us an exact date range

 

the transactions occurred on the ship

> this gives us an exact location of use, & a limited number of people that could have used the card details to make purchases (ie only people on the ship, & even which till was used)

> we also know what was bought, as the card transactions will relate to transactions on the ships accounting system

 

 

even if the card was left lying around in the cabin, & the card details written down, there is a very limited number of people that would have access to the cabin, & all access is recorded (keycards)

then, how are they going to use that information?

where on the ship can they use it?

would the shop staff really find it perfectly normal for a room steward (as an example) to pay for something from one of the shops using card details on a piece of paper?

would they even be able to process a card payment on their till?

[Leucothea]

I had a problem when I hired a private car from Southampton to London. The car never materialized, but my card was charged the full price. When I called him he claimed that it was I who did not show up. I was standing at the waiting area for 2 hours waiting and watching for every car that arrived. It's not that big an area. I made very sure we were in sync with the time and location.

 

This man was very insulting and rude to me, accusing me of being a "no show', but the minute I suggested I was going to speak to an attorney about it, he immediately returned my money. It was amazing how fast he returned it. I think he imagined I was some ditzy female who would be too intimidated to challenge him.

[gentlemancruiser]

my reply was in the context of what has been specifically stated so far in this thread;

 

 

 

 

 

what has been stated is;

 

the transactions occurred whilst the person was on the ship

> this gives us an exact date range

 

the transactions occurred on the ship

> this gives us an exact location of use, & a limited number of people that could have used the card details to make purchases (ie only people on the ship, & even which till was used)

> we also know what was bought, as the card transactions will relate to transactions on the ships accounting system

 

 

even if the card was left lying around in the cabin, & the card details written down, there is a very limited number of people that would have access to the cabin, & all access is recorded (keycards)

then, how are they going to use that information?

where on the ship can they use it?

would the shop staff really find it perfectly normal for a room steward (as an example) to pay for something from one of the shops using card details on a piece of paper?

would they even be able to process a card payment on their till?

 

Cunard like every other cruise lines operates as a cashless society. Guests must signs for purcahses and they are applied to an onboard account which gets settled at the of the guests stay.

 

How is it possible for one of the shops or shop clerks to process a purchase on a credit card into thier 'till' when the 'till' doesn't even exsist. I'm not aware of any services that passengers can purchase with cash or credit cards on board.

 

It would be very difficult to process a credit card transaction and to get an approval code from Visa/MC/Amex while the ship is in the middle of the Atlantic!

 

Do the onboard shops now have credit card terminals?????

[Salacia]

Cunard like every other cruise lines operates as a cashless society. Guests must signs for purcahses and they are applied to an onboard account which gets settled at the of the guests stay.

 

How is it possible for one of the shops or shop clerks to process a purchase on a credit card into thier 'till' when the 'till' doesn't even exsist. I'm not aware of any services that passengers can purchase with cash or credit cards on board.

 

It would be very difficult to process a credit card transaction and to get an approval code from Visa/MC/Amex while the ship is in the middle of the Atlantic!

 

Do the onboard shops now have credit card terminals?????

 

Both deposits for future bookings and future cruise credits are purchased on board with a credit card as those charges can not be put on passengers in-stateroom folio account.

[edgeoftheworld]

Both deposits for future bookings and future cruise credits are purchased on board with a credit card as those charges can not be put on passengers in-stateroom folio account.

 

these payments may be sent to shoreside to be processed

 

even if the sales office can directly process card payments on the ship, & the pursers office can, they arnt really purchases, like the type being discussed.

also, would a crew member be booking a cruise this way? using some written down card details?

 

 

 

 

what is this 'other place' thats been mentioned a few times?

[Salacia]

these payments may be sent to shoreside to be processed

 

even if the sales office can directly process card payments on the ship, & the pursers office can, they arnt really purchases, like the type being discussed.

also, would a crew member be booking a cruise this way? using some written down card details?

 

 

 

 

what is this 'other place' thats been mentioned a few times?

 

Hi edgeoftheworld. I'm not disagreeing with you - just that I was responding to your writing that you weren't aware of any purchases that could be made onboard using a credit card.

 

Oddly enough, I just got off the phone with my credit card company. Apparently, my card had been used fraudulently. I haven't used that particular card in over a year (and never used it for any Cunard charges); the card hasn't been out of my possession. Stuff happens, as the saying goes.

 

S.

[edgeoftheworld]

Hi edgeoftheworld. I'm not disagreeing with you - just that I was responding to your writing that you weren't aware of any purchases that could be made onboard using a credit card.

 

Oddly enough, I just got off the phone with my credit card company. Apparently, my card had been used fraudulently. I haven't used that particular card in over a year (and never used it for any Cunard charges); the card hasn't been out of my possession. Stuff happens, as the saying goes.

 

S.

 

yep, stuff happens

 

 

however, i just cant see how what has been described as having happened could have happened

[fg_hb]

I for myself could report the following:

My credit card company provides information about reserved and booked amounts online and send text messages to my cellphone for every amouint which is reserved or billed by someone. With this I always I can see what is done with my card.

 

While checkin in Southampton an amount of $300 was reserved for onboard credit. After usinig this amount another $300 reservation was done and so on.

I don't know if this was done from ship or from land office.

 

A week after disembarkation in New York the amount of my onboard bill was billed to my card and the reservation was released. On my printed card statement the reserved amount was not shown.

 

Frank

[capnpugwash]

I for myself could report the following:

My credit card company provides information about reserved and booked amounts online and send text messages to my cellphone for every amouint which is reserved or billed by someone. With this I always I can see what is done with my card.

 

While checkin in Southampton an amount of $300 was reserved for onboard credit. After usinig this amount another $300 reservation was done and so on.

I don't know if this was done from ship or from land office.

 

A week after disembarkation in New York the amount of my onboard bill was billed to my card and the reservation was released. On my printed card statement the reserved amount was not shown.

 

Frank

 

The legendary German efficiency.:)

[Louise D]

I just log in to my on-line charge card statement every day to check every purchase. I only ever have had one problem, and it was a genuine mistake by a seller and not fraud.

[northernsailor]

Cunard DO process your card daily whilst aboard as I have seen my credit card 'available spend' change on a number of trips whilst we're still at sea. They do use satellite connections to process it - why wouldnt they, they provide internet connectivity anyway?

 

The ship can't trust 2000+ passengers based on a credit card each unfortunately and hope to charge them all on the last day, therefore they process them every night it seems (or perhaps after X dollars has built up on your bill)

[Underwatr]

They must trust me just fine, because my card is only charged once per cruise. Perhaps they would adjust the hold on the card as the initial hold is consumed, but I don't get these daily charges you speak of.

[edgeoftheworld]

Cunard DO process your card daily whilst aboard as I have seen my credit card 'available spend' change on a number of trips whilst we're still at sea. They do use satellite connections to process it - why wouldnt they, they provide internet connectivity anyway?

 

The ship can't trust 2000+ passengers based on a credit card each unfortunately and hope to charge them all on the last day, therefore they process them every night it seems (or perhaps after X dollars has built up on your bill)

 

They must trust me just fine, because my card is only charged once per cruise. Perhaps they would adjust the hold on the card as the initial hold is consumed, but I don't get these daily charges you speak of.

 

 

'available spend' =/= transactions

 

what has changed when you look at your account online is the pre-authorisation amount.

im sure that if you look at your statement for the period, youll find one charge after the trip, which is the total notified to you on your obc statement.

[Jimsgirl]

and you KNOW it is a wrongful charge how ?

 

If you read the posting you will see that the charge was in fact incorrect, and was brought to the notice of the Pursers office whilst the poster was on boar.

 

A corrected bill was issued by the pursers office at that time, then post cruise the credit card was charged, was disputed, was investigated and found to be "incorrect" by the card company.

 

However at a later date passengers received notification from collection agency that that they still owed Cunard the $80, and would be sued if they did not pay.

 

The advice on this board was "Pay the $80 it is not worth having being sued for sucha small amount.

 

Face it , Cunard is a company, and any company can have

 

a/ Staff that are less than honest

b/ Staff that do a poor job

c/ Supervisors who are not fit to fill that post.

 

It happens, and when it does it is up to Cunard HQ to correct the situation WITHOUT DELAY, and as for passengers , like you and I,-we should use our brains and realise that NO COMPANY (even if their name is Cunard) is infallible.