Do you think RCCL will ever build bigger than OasislAllure?

[loubetti]

Unless there is some economic crash, they WILL build larger. They are just not going to announce it to the competition right now. My guess: 250,000 tons or better. William Wright even said it, but gave no details except for "larger".

 

Of course, things can change, but I suspect they will build larger and sell / transfer some of the older / smaller ships. It's all about economy of scale and building floating resorts for those who have yet to cruise, or do not want to think they are on a ship. They won't add to the Oasis class, but will build a new, larger class.

 

We'll see if I am right! :cool:

[littlesteelo]

I think the Oasis class was built not as a general purpose 'go anywhere it is needed' cruise ship, but as something that is so big and so impressive that anybody, specifically young people and families considering cruising for the first time would want to sail on it. That is why they made the design so incredible. So that everything else would seem inferior for years to come. The amount of features and amenities are years ahead of any ship currently in service or on order. It is something which is designed purely to sail the same itineraries each week, and as much as I hate saying it, they are designed as huge revenue machines, and it works.

I personally will probably never sail them, as I would only sail on a 12 night cruise minimum, preferably 14, and B2B on Oasis/Allure w/flights is out of my budget.

 

Sunshine will likely be, as I said, more of a 'general purpose' cruise ship. It will have features brought down from Oasis, but it will be treated by RCI the same as they treat their Freedom Class, and will likely have much more variety in its itineraries.

 

In answer to the question, I think someday there will be ships of similar and greater size to Oasis, but not for a long time. The ports simply cannot handle them, and there is no point in having another Oasis class out of Port Everglades.

 

What I think would be interesting is what RCI do with the Voyager/Freedom/Oasis Classes when they decide to retire them. Those ships are so unique, and there are are so many staple Royal features on them, like FlowRiders, the Royal Promenade, Viking Crown lounge, and it is even more so on Oasis. I couldn't imagine a ship like Oasis ever sailing for Pullmantur or any other line for that matter. That will be at least 20 years away, and things will likely have changed by then. Voyager of the Seas probably only has another 7 or 8 years with RCI, though.

[ktbr11crs]

There is one on the drawing board that will be based out of Miami. You'll board at the bow of the ship, walk to the stern and get off in Grand Bahama.

 

Should be reasonably priced as the only fuel costs will be to run the generators to provide electricty for the ship. Halfway out there will be a 500 yard stretch of international water where the casinos and shops can stay open 24 hours a day.

 

LOL! Great comment; thanks!!

[Langley Cruisers]

I have never found it "hard" to find a quiet place watching the ocean...

 

 

I see you haven't sailed Oasis yet. This is an issue, trust me. You'll probably find so too. We always book a balcony and I can't say I want to always be there just to sit and watch the ocean. :o

 

Book a balcony cabin.

 

See my above reply. You don't always want to be on your own balcony.

[KG1924]

I see you haven't sailed Oasis yet. This is an issue, trust me. You'll probably find so too. We always book a balcony and I can't say I want to always be there just to sit and watch the ocean. :o

 

 

 

See my above reply. You don't always want to be on your own balcony.

 

 

I have sailed the Oasis and I disagree-first there's the promenade deck w/ the running track. In the aft they have great Adirondack chairs w/ amazing views of the wake. Then there is the shuffle board area behind the aqua theater, again w/ Adirondack chairs as well as stools against a small bar-like table. The solarium and the pool deck have the same views, if not more then other classes. Then there's still the viking crown lounge-while different then other ships, it still offers great views. Again, I haven't sailed the radiance class, but other then the glass elevators and the outdoor seating for the Windjammer, what is the difference? I'm honestly asking because I don't know myself.

 

We were with a large group, but still never had trouble finding spots to be quiet or avoid loud crowds. We often left the solarium because it was too quiet! I think the bars even did a great job of offering plenty of space, especially Dazzles. If you went upstairs you had a great view of Central Park with the band playing in front of the huge wall of windows.

[KG1924]

I think the Oasis class was built not as a general purpose 'go anywhere it is needed' cruise ship, but as something that is so big and so impressive that anybody, specifically young people and families considering cruising for the first time would want to sail on it. That is why they made the design so incredible. So that everything else would seem inferior for years to come. The amount of features and amenities are years ahead of any ship currently in service or on order. It is something which is designed purely to sail the same itineraries each week, and as much as I hate saying it, they are designed as huge revenue machines, and it works.

I personally will probably never sail them, as I would only sail on a 12 night cruise minimum, preferably 14, and B2B on Oasis/Allure w/flights is out of my budget.

 

Sunshine will likely be, as I said, more of a 'general purpose' cruise ship. It will have features brought down from Oasis, but it will be treated by RCI the same as they treat their Freedom Class, and will likely have much more variety in its itineraries.

 

In answer to the question, I think someday there will be ships of similar and greater size to Oasis, but not for a long time. The ports simply cannot handle them, and there is no point in having another Oasis class out of Port Everglades.

 

What I think would be interesting is what RCI do with the Voyager/Freedom/Oasis Classes when they decide to retire them. Those ships are so unique, and there are are so many staple Royal features on them, like FlowRiders, the Royal Promenade, Viking Crown lounge, and it is even more so on Oasis. I couldn't imagine a ship like Oasis ever sailing for Pullmantur or any other line for that matter. That will be at least 20 years away, and things will likely have changed by then. Voyager of the Seas probably only has another 7 or 8 years with RCI, though.

 

I do agree with you-they are appealing to a different crowd, so to speak. That doesn't mean the veteran cruisers won't like it either, but they're capturing new cruisers and families w/ these builds. We had a few new cruisers with us on the Oasis and one woman will only sail on ships that have "the middle open" (i.e. Central Park and Boardwalk) We gently explained that she has only 2 options then, Allure and Oasis-and she's perfectly fine with that. To her that's what cruising is and she would most likely be disappointed to an extent to go on a smaller, older ship since she has never experienced what cruising "used to be"

[time4u2go]

I don't think RCI will, but I would bet another cruise line would.

[smoosh21]

 

 

What I think would be interesting is what RCI do with the Voyager/Freedom/Oasis Classes when they decide to retire them. Those ships are so unique, and there are are so many staple Royal features on them, like FlowRiders, the Royal Promenade, Viking Crown lounge, and it is even more so on Oasis. I couldn't imagine a ship like Oasis ever sailing for Pullmantur or any other line for that matter. That will be at least 20 years away, and things will likely have changed by then. Voyager of the Seas probably only has another 7 or 8 years with RCI, though.

 

 

I think they will keep Voyager longer than that. I think they would get rid of the Vision Class ships before they started getting rid of the Voyager. Most of them don't have the Specialty restaurants and the Concierge. It will be hard to command a premium on rooms for them.

 

Royal has been talking about putting Flow-riders on Voyager Class which says to me they see keeping them much longer.

[north29]

I am not a big fan of cruising, but am a coin operated traveler. I cruise to just get away for a while, easy living in Florida, and the price for seeing much of the world, not in depth, but a good peek at many places, I could never afford to visit in depth.

This ship would not be for me.

In the future, I see grand/gigantic cruise ships that will be a at sea all inclusive vacation, much like Sandles, only bigger and better, they will have every thing, from beaches to broadway plays. They may go no where, or maybe just a port that will handle a ship that size. The ships could be like a at sea hotel, with daily shuttles/flights bringing in new passengers and possible celebrities (areas designed for then) The ports would be for the traditional boarding etc. not necessarily a port of call,as we know it today.

In today's world, there may already be a market for such a ship/floating sea going city. I doubt that it will happen soon, but IMHO it will be built, maybe in a series of ships, it may have already started with the Alure, but the ships will have to supply more space to each passenger to feel well, for lack of a better word, confortable. Did I say big ship.

[SamFritz]

I'm frustrated by the lack of options for cruising in the Caribbean during the summer. I feel as though the presence of, and need to fill, Allure and Oasis, has them sending a variety of smaller ships around the world and leaving us with very limited itinerarries for summer cruises in North America.

 

Also, the size of Oasis and Allure limits the ports they at which they can stop.

[teddie]

Why not?;)

 

I say I hope not, but that's just for me. I have sailed on the Enchantment (pre-stretch), once on the Voyager and five times on the Explorer. As a pre-teen, I have sailed from NYC to Australia, and back by ocean liner -- Greek Line, Italian Line, and Chandris. I do not need or want Broadway shows, water extravaganzas, or (shudder) an outdoor TV screen on my cruise, and if you build it any bigger, they'll have to fill it up with more of the things that don't interest me.

 

Like some previous posters, I cruise because I love to be on the ocean, and enjoy a (mostly) relaxing vacation. Being at sea in a balcony cabin, with good service, and good food makes me happy enough.

 

Teddie

[Langley Cruisers]

I have sailed the Oasis and I disagree-first there's the promenade deck w/ the running track....

 

That's OK to disagree with me, and I disagree with you on this. I couldn't sit on the running track deck at all - that's not my idea of rest and relaxation. Couldn't see - railings too obstructed, lifeboats in the way.

 

Anyway, nevermind. I didn't like Oasis and I realize thousands of others did and do. My opinion is still as valid as anyone else's. :)

.

[roe2ship]

I see you haven't sailed Oasis yet. This is an issue, trust me. You'll probably find so too. We always book a balcony and I can't say I want to always be there just to sit and watch the ocean. :o

 

 

The person I was quoting was talking about Freedom class ships and under. Yes I have not sailed Oasis yet… I’ll find out in 104 days.:D With that said, even though I love views of the ocean, I’m somewhat confident I won’t feel as if I’m “enclosed” or “disconnected” from the sea. Perhaps those that go on the Oasis class with a preconceived mindset about the “inward” feel are going to have that issue. When I board the Oasis, or any ship for that matter, my mind is what reminds me that I’m at sea every second while I’m on board, I really don’t need the visual at all times.

[JAMESCC]

Well I have created quite a discussion here, I did not think this thread would get this big[no pun intended]. I am impressed with all the comments, no one is getting upset, just stating their opinions and preferences.

Now someone has to explain to me the economics of "large ships pay for themselves faster". Isn't the same no matter what size? I mean if a ship like Oasis/Allure cost over a billion but fits so many passengers and a ship like Radiance cost MUCH less and fits so many people, isn't it the same thing? Please explain why this isn't the case if you can?

I just love technology, I love GIANT projects, I love when things move forward, which is why I love new and bigger cruise ships. They are beautiful, and strong and buck the harsh seas keeping its passengers and crew safe. Something about that, that I just love. I'm also an Electronics technician so I just love new technology. Its what wakes me up every day, new technology.

Thanks again guys for all the comments and for being civilized. And i have to say this in all my posts, please RCCL put a Sunshine ship here in NJ?

[Jman1118]

Goldstein on adding ships larger than Allure: In the near term, no. We don't have any current plans to go beyond Oasis class. In fact, we've said that we're not currently thinking of adding to Oasis class.

 

That makes sense, why build something that huge if it can only be docked in a couple of ports in the Caribbean. We liked the size of Mariner and when we went on the Liberty, it was only just a stretched version of the Mariner. I think Royal Caribbean should stick to something around the size of those ships as they can dock in most ports in the world, hold 4,000 people, and can have the same amount of bells and whistles as the Oasis class.

[littlesteelo]

Now someone has to explain to me the economics of "large ships pay for themselves faster". Isn't the same no matter what size? I mean if a ship like Oasis/Allure cost over a billion but fits so many passengers and a ship like Radiance cost MUCH less and fits so many people, isn't it the same thing? Please explain why this isn't the case if you can?

 

Let's say on each cruise a passenger spends an average amount of money. On Radiance, you have that amount X 2500. On Oasis you have that amount X 5400. Per cruise, you have way more money coming in from Oasis than Radiance. What would be a better thing to say is the rate at which the ship pays for itself is higher on larger ships than on smaller ships, due to more passengers spending more money, and more fares from cabins.

[Cuizer2]

See my above reply. You don't always want to be on your own balcony.

 

No, I don't always want to be on my balcony. However, I also don't always want to sit and watch the ocean go by. However, when I do want to sit an watch the ocean go by I have found that my balcony is a great place to be.

[Cuizer2]

Now someone has to explain to me the economics of "large ships pay for themselves faster". Isn't the same no matter what size? I mean if a ship like Oasis/Allure cost over a billion but fits so many passengers and a ship like Radiance cost MUCH less and fits so many people, isn't it the same thing? Please explain why this isn't the case if you can?

 

If you are only looking at income, there is no economy of scale. However, if you are looking at expenses there are. Take for example the ship's officers. It takes two Radiance class ships and thus two sets of officers to equal the number of passengers on the Oasis/Allure. Thus you are moving twice as many people with just one set of officers (saving the expense of the other set).

 

The Oasis class is more than twice the size of the Radiance class, but does not use twice the amount of fuel, more savings based on economy of scale.

 

You only have to keep track of one Oasis class ship vs. two Radiance class ships - more savings.

 

With the Oasis class you only have to dry dock on ship vs. dry docking two Radiance class ships.

 

It may cost more in dock fees for the Oasis/Allure vs. the Radiance class ships, but not twice as much - more savings.

 

Economy of scale comes from expenses, not from income.

[Langley Cruisers]

No, I don't always want to be on my balcony. However, I also don't always want to sit and watch the ocean go by. However, when I do want to sit an watch the ocean go by I have found that my balcony is a great place to be.

 

Indeed. That's why we all love cruising, I think.... something for absolutely everyone. :)

.

[JAMESCC]

If you are only looking at income, there is no economy of scale. However, if you are looking at expenses there are. Take for example the ship's officers. It takes two Radiance class ships and thus two sets of officers to equal the number of passengers on the Oasis/Allure. Thus you are moving twice as many people with just one set of officers (saving the expense of the other set).

 

The Oasis class is more than twice the size of the Radiance class, but does not use twice the amount of fuel, more savings based on economy of scale.

 

You only have to keep track of one Oasis class ship vs. two Radiance class ships - more savings.

 

 

 

It may cost more in dock fees for the Oasis/Allure vs. the Radiance class ships, but not twice as much - more savings.

 

Economy of scale comes from expenses, not from income.

 

Interesting information and brings up another question I have now. What in general do captains and the crew as far as the crew that works the bridge earn? How many officers are there per cruise ship? Obviously one captain, but how many officers does he then have? Is it 10, is it more, is it less, or does it go by the size of the ship? Just curious questions I have always had. Thanks again.

[A2Mich]

Another issue may be finding a shipyard that can build anything bigger than the Oasis class ships. Fincantieri (which RCI does not contract with) cannot build a cruise ship that size. Meyer-Werft, if I'm not mistaken does not have a drydock large enough. STX Europe Chantiers does not have a large enough drydock. STX Europe Turku or Helsinki do have drydocks large enough for these ships, however, the Oasis and Allure BARELY cleared the Great Belt Bridge (cleared with I believe about a foot of clearance, even after retracting the funnels) - had to sail at full speed, low tide, and with the funnels retracted to barely make it under. Basically, there is no way for STX Turku to build a ship taller, unless it was not fully completed on-site, meaning having to have the funnels/masts/radars, etc installed at another shipyard - with all of the issues of building the Oasis-class ships, I would be surprised if anything larger were built there. The other possibility would be to have one of the Asian shipyards build them in the commercial shipyards, such as where they build supertankers, though they may not be equipped to build passenger ships.

[Gilgo Surfer]

I think the answer is yes, but the question is when?

[Cuizer2]

Interesting information and brings up another question I have now. What in general do captains and the crew as far as the crew that works the bridge earn? How many officers are there per cruise ship? Obviously one captain, but how many officers does he then have? Is it 10, is it more, is it less, or does it go by the size of the ship? Just curious questions I have always had. Thanks again.

 

A ship has a captain (actually the master), a staff captain, a first officer, a second officer, a third officer and I don't know how many quartermasters.

 

The captain makes over $100,000/year and works half the year.

[NewShips]

Another issue may be finding a shipyard that can build anything bigger than the Oasis class ships. Fincantieri (which RCI does not contract with) cannot build a cruise ship that size. Meyer-Werft, if I'm not mistaken does not have a drydock large enough. STX Europe Chantiers does not have a large enough drydock. STX Europe Turku or Helsinki do have drydocks large enough for these ships, however, the Oasis and Allure BARELY cleared the Great Belt Bridge (cleared with I believe about a foot of clearance, even after retracting the funnels) - had to sail at full speed, low tide, and with the funnels retracted to barely make it under. Basically, there is no way for STX Turku to build a ship taller, unless it was not fully completed on-site, meaning having to have the funnels/masts/radars, etc installed at another shipyard - with all of the issues of building the Oasis-class ships, I would be surprised if anything larger were built there. The other possibility would be to have one of the Asian shipyards build them in the commercial shipyards, such as where they build supertankers, though they may not be equipped to build passenger ships.

 

There is a tunnel which has a 10m underwater clearance to under öresund.. so they could actually build larger. & the docks can easilly be extended, im surprise they havent put roof over the turku yard anyway so they must love showeling that snow. :eek: i've also heard of the issues with working with the finish yard but after working together for 10+ years, i guess some grudges are to be expected...

 

Meyer werft would also have that same bridge in the way...

[littlesteelo]

There is a tunnel which has a 10m underwater clearance to under öresund.. so they could actually build larger. & the docks can easilly be extended, im surprise they havent put roof over the turku yard anyway so they must love showeling that snow. :eek: i've also heard of the issues with working with the finish yard but after working together for 10+ years, i guess some grudges are to be expected...

 

Meyer werft would also have that same bridge in the way...

 

Meyer Werft are at the very limit of what they can build now, unless they do something about that bridge, plus the river would have to be significantly altered to fit something like Oasis down it. That's one of the reasons why they have to go down the river backwards, as it is easier to line up the stern with the narrow opening in the bridge than the bow.

 

If there was going to be another candidate for such a ship, it would probably be Fincantieri. They would have to build a bigger drydock, but they wouldn't have any issues with bridges. Besides, they must be sick of building the same Carnival clone ships each year, they could do with something interesting to build.

 

A2Mich made a good point about the Asian yards. Sapphire Princess and Diamond Princess were built by Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, so they are perfectly capable of building passenger ships. Something tells me RCI would want to stick with shipyards with more passenger shipbuilding experience though.