Why We Left NCL?

[Lou33]

Mommy2 what confuses me is if smoking on balconies was a potential vacation disaster for me I would sail a line with no smoking on balconies. Seems pretty simple. I'd pick a line with the least chance of being disappointed and if someone smoking on the balcony next to me was that important I would book a line where that in not possible.

Just my 2 cents.

 

See post 236:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=35044895&postcount=236

[che5904]

Che5904,

 

 

My wife works in cancer research, so this is an issue that is very close to our family. I hope that one day, you too can free yourself from this addiction.

 

Thank you for your dearest concern Lou, however I know for a fact I am not addicted to nicotine, but just to the habit of smoking. I do not wish to quit because I actually enjoy smoking.

 

How? you ask can I be so sure of this (not addicted). Well you see I live in Canada, and in Canada electronic cigarettes are only legal if they contain NO nicotine. So at the end of 2010 I decided to quit smoking cigarettes and just use the electronic no nicotine vaporizers. I felt if I was addicted to the nicotine I could just subsidize with the patch (which I didnt' need). That way omitting most of what you have on the list above but still being able to enjoy my habit. Well I live very close to upper NY state and spend a lot of time hopping the border. Unfortunately I cannot take my electronic cigarette back and forth with me, because there is nothing written on it to say it does not containe nicotine and the Canadian customs confiscates them when I cross back into Canada. Not being discouraged, I continued to use them for a bit until I checked into the legalities of traveling with them, only to find out my cruise was to the MR and they are illegal in Mexico. Because no Government will step up to the plate to do a full testing on them because they are getting so much flack from the Pro-no-smokers that they have more bans and regulations on them than regular cigarettes.

 

So I have no intention of quitting. As for my health: The exhaust from your car, the scented products your wife wears or even the factories that make your synthetic stuff like rugs or tile in your house will probably kill me faster than my cigarettes. You see many people hurt the air I breath, because those are some of the things that affect me. But I look after my own issues and don't expect Governments or companies to do it for me. I avoid large cities as much as possible.

[Partyatsea]

See post 236:

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=35044895&postcount=236

 

Exactly why I am confused.

[DCT61]

You can preach till your blue in the face, but all your research and pleading doesn't mean a hill of beans to someone who's addicted or enjoys a cigarette. THey aren't going to quit until they are ready to or have some life changing epiphany. I can't recall hearing/reading one former smoker admit to quitting because they were preached to.

[Lou33]

You can preach till your blue in the face, but all your research and pleading doesn't mean a hill of beans to someone who's addicted or enjoys a cigarette. THey aren't going to quit until they are ready to or have some life changing epiphany. I can't recall hearing/reading one former smoker admit to quitting because they were preached to.

 

I agree with you. It's kind of like preaching to an alchoholic. It doesn't work. I wasn't really trying to preach, but I was just trying to share my thoughts. I think I had some good points and my hopes were that maybe it will at least make some people think.

[che5904]

Speaking of opinions, I'm amazed at the number of folks from the smoker side in this thread who choose the cruise line based on their smoking policy. I would think itinerary, quality of the ship and overall value would be at the top of this list. Not where I'm allowed to smoke on a ship. Just shows the power of nicotine.

 

I'm thinking that there would be a lot less whining on these threads if the non-smoking extremists or the pro-no-smokers chose a little more wisely based on the smoking policy.

 

If you think about it, there are people who choose their cruiseline based on whether the cruiseline encourages tuxes and long gowns, or whether they can sit with strangers for their dinners. hmmmm I wonder what their "addiction" is.

[mommyto2girls]

That post must have hit a sore spot with you, eh? Think about what you just said and then review all your 240 posts. I'm sure there have been a few opinions of yours in there somewhere. And, if we kept our opinions to ourselves, we wouldn't have forums like Cruise Critic!

 

Speaking of opinions, I'm amazed at the number of folks from the smoker side in this thread who choose a cruise line based on their smoking policy. I would think itinerary, quality of the ship and overall value would be at the top of this list. Not where I'm allowed to smoke on a ship. Just shows the power of nicotine.

 

I have chosen NCL for the Haven suites freestyle, suite life and itinerary, I like cruiusing 15 minutes from home in the dead of winter in a Haven Suite. I spend thousands of dollars to cruise the way I chose. You should all do the same with what accommodates you best. Just my opinion.

 

I also think this thread has beat itself to death already...

[IMWord]

I'm thinking that there would be a lot less whining on these threads if the non-smoking extremists or the pro-no-smokers chose a little more wisely based on the smoking policy.

 

If you think about it, there are people who choose their cruiseline based on whether the cruiseline encourages tuxes and long gowns, or whether they can sit with strangers for their dinners. hmmmm I wonder what their "addiction" is.

 

Oh. Still a bit new around here and wasn't aware people have actually posted they make their cruise decisions based on those two things. However, isn't it true that people don't have to wear formal attire or sit with strangers if they don't want to? Let's take Celebrity for example. If they have 1 or 2 formal nights, couldn't I just go the buffet instead without the tux or gown and sit all by myself if I wanted too?

 

And to answer your question, they really wouldn't have an "addiction", but perhaps a phobia of some sort ;).

[che5904]

Oh. Still a bit new around here and wasn't aware people have actually posted they make their cruise decisions based on those two things. However, isn't it true that people don't have to wear formal attire or sit with strangers if they don't want to? Let's take Celebrity for example. If they have 1 or 2 formal nights, couldn't I just go the buffet instead without the tux or gown and sit all by myself if I wanted too?

 

And to answer your question, they really wouldn't have an "addiction", but perhaps a phobia of some sort ;).

 

I'm talking about the other way around. People do not choose NCL because they have no official dress up night. People do not choose NCL because they can't be guaranteed sitting with strangers for dinner. Just do a search, easy information to verify.

 

My point is that people do no choose due to addictions or phobias, they choose what is important for them in a vacation. And if relaxing on a balcony to have a cigarette is important to them then that is part of the consideration given. Just as I am saying that if you think smoking beside you on a balcony will ruin your vacation, then take that into consideration when you book. Again it has nothing to do with addictions or phobias, just plain common sense.

[snoozycruisee]

As posted (Yes, by me) in another Smoking Thread about a month back:

 

(A) My Suggestion: Let Smokers smoke on their Balcony.

 

(B) My Request: Make sure your smoke stays on your Balcony.

I'm pretty sure that nearly every Non-Smoker would have absolutely no issue with someone smoking on their Balcony if smokers could figure out a way to make (B) a reality. As suggested on previous posts, Fans are a great start. Good smokeless ashtrays sometimes help out.

 

So, C'mon everyone, Smokers and Non- Smokers alike.........post your ideas and make it happen. Then maybe we can all Sail Happily into the sunset ;)

[triplett]

There has to be give and take on the part of smokers and non smokers. IMHO, smoking in an out of the way place on an upper deck is better for non smokers than allowing smoking on cabin balconies. Smokers will still be able to light up, just not on a balcony next to passengers who wish to use their balcony rather than just taking in the view from inside the cabin.

 

What about the smokers who have paid just as much for their cruise? They have to scurry off to some small corner of the ship in shame and huddle up in the Leper's corner?

[sadiecat]

I wonder if NCL went smoke free what the increase in cost per passenger rate would be if NCL had to compensate for the losses in the casino, bars, specialty restaurants, shore excursions, etc...

[karoo]

Unfortunately smoke travels-so one smoker can effect the 10 people around them. Less than 20% of people smoke in Australia and most of our ndoor areas are smokefree. In Australia our balconies, cabins and casinos are smoke free. (We are certainly the lucky country.) I do like doing NCL cruises, so I don't book a balcony. I learnt the hard way on my Mexican Riviera cruise (2009). It's no use paying for a balcony if I can't use it. I'd rather go and sit in a smoke free outdoor area. I also never visit the casino either on the ship or on land in the US. I guess it saves me a bucket load of money.

[che5904]

I do like doing NCL cruises, so I don't book a balcony.

 

It's really too bad you had not did your homework before your MR cruise to know that this was a possibility. But nice that you now know and that you have made a wise decision based on your own comfort levels and what is important to you.

[4774Papa]

Che said:

 

"So I have no intention of quitting. As for my health: The exhaust from your car, the scented products your wife wears or even the factories that make your synthetic stuff like rugs or tile in your house will probably kill me faster than my cigarettes. You see many people hurt the air I breath, because those are some of the things that affect me. But I look after my own issues and don't expect Governments or companies to do it for me. I avoid large cities as much as possible. "

 

You are truly in denial. Smoking is your choice, I won't try to take away your freedom, but I challenge you to find scientific documentation to support your statement.

 

Both my parents died from smoking related diseases. Just look at the percentage of persons that die of lung cancer (smokers and non-smokers).

 

In a 2006 European study, the risk of developing lung cancer was:

 

•0.2% for men who never smoked (0.4% for women)

•5.5% for male former smokers (2.6% in women)

•15.9% for current male smokers (9.5% for women)

•24.4% for male “heavy smokers” defined as smoking more than 5 cigarettes per day (18.5% for women)

http://lungcancer.about.com/od/Lung-Cancer-And-Smoking/f/Smokers-Lung-Cancer.htm

[che5904]

You are truly in denial. Smoking is your choice, I won't try to take away your freedom, but I challenge you to find scientific documentation to support your statement.

 

Papa I'm in denial about what? I know exactly what bothers my allergies. I really don't need scientific proof. I specifically said "because those are some of the things that affect me". I also have to close my windows, even in stifling heat (have no A/C), when my DH or neighbours mow their lawn.

 

Although without doing any research I'd be pretty sure that factory exhaust, car exhaust, airplanes, ships, and chemicals from scented products would be pretty easy to find negative studies on them and their harm. I just happen to be overly sensitive to them.

 

My point was that everyone should do what they feel is best for their own health instead of whining to other people about what other people should do. Or expecting some higher ups to "save" them from all the bad things in the world.

[Mississippian]

My wife and I lived for a few years in a tobacco town, where a lot of tobacco is raised. The first time we went to a little cafe to eat we sat down and noticed that 75 percent of the people in the restaurant were smoking at the tables and there was just this haze in the air. It was like we had been transported back in time 20, 30, or 40 years! So I guess there are a few pockets of die-hard smokers here and there!

 

Years ago I was on a Northwest Airlines flight to or from Frankfurt, and there were maybe a dozen Germans on board in a group who had been seated in the no smoking section but were assured by their travel agent that they could get up and walk to the back of the plane to smoke. WRONG! So there was this one empty seat in the smoking section and they all took turns sitting in it smoking, and the poor girl next to the empty seat almost got sick, even though she was a smoker. The constant smoke was just too much even for a smoker.

 

My point in sharing this story is that Princess and Celebrity now ban balcony smoking. My guess is that RCI and perhaps Holland America will join them. I don't see NCL wanting to tighten its smoking policies for the reasons that have been stated in this thread, namely that it gets more revenue from the casino and alcohol than a lot of cruise lines. But as everyone else tightens their policies, all the smokers will gravitate to NCL, and it's likely to become too smokey for even the smokers! We'll see.

 

And for what it's worth, there were people smoking on the balconies of my last Princess cruise. Since it's against the rules, Princess needs to work at identifying these people and ejecting them from the ship.

[che5904]

And for what it's worth, there were people smoking on the balconies of my last Princess cruise. Since it's against the rules, Princess needs to work at identifying these people and ejecting them from the ship.

 

Not disputing the offender should have been located and reprimanded. Never traveled on Princess so I know nothing about them.

 

But :D :D I'm betting there is a lot of policy breakers on NCL (diapers in pools, booze smuggling, chair hogging, kids in non-connecting rooms, shorts in more formal MDR....) that are really happy that if NCL (not famous for enforcing rules) were to enforce one of their policies that they don't "EJECT" most policy breakers from their ships. :eek:

[Lou33]

What about the smokers who have paid just as much for their cruise? They have to scurry off to some small corner of the ship in shame and huddle up in the Leper's corner?

 

If you don't want to annoy other cruisers with 2nd hand smoke, then that's a good way to do it. If you don't care if other cruisers (who pay just as much) are offended from the by-products of your habit/addiction, then just book a balcony on NCL and puff away.

[SissasMomE]

I understand your dislike of wishing to have your balcony door open, but you can't because you have smokers on one or both sides and their smoke drifts right into your cabin. Ick!

 

I have had this happen to me on more than one cruise, and it is very unpleasant.

[SissasMomE]

I wonder if NCL went smoke free what the increase in cost per passenger rate would be if NCL had to compensate for the losses in the casino, bars, specialty restaurants, shore excursions, etc...

 

Celebrity and Princess are both doing well. As an aside, I don't think they should ban smoking entirely. I would love to see it banned from balconies though. The last 5 cruises I took, I was able to leave my balcony door open at night on one of them. 1 out of 4 because of the smell. AND I smoke on occassion! The smell is nasty, and I don't want to sleep in it.

[snoozycruisee]

I wonder if NCL went smoke free what the increase in cost per passenger rate would be if NCL had to compensate for the losses in the casino, bars, specialty restaurants, shore excursions, etc...

 

Hmmmm - Good Question. On the flip side, I wonder about the overall cost to Insure a Ship (and) if the cost decreases as smoking areas are further restricted, i.e. No In-Room smoking, No Balcony smoking, etc.

[che5904]

Hmmmm - Good Question. On the flip side, I wonder about the overall cost to Insure a Ship (and) if the cost decreases as smoking areas are further restricted, i.e. No In-Room smoking, No Balcony smoking, etc.

 

Since insurance is usually thought of as an overhead cost and not a direct cost. Even if it did, do you honestly think this cost savings would be passed down to the customer level.

[SissasMomE]

Papa I'm in denial about what? I know exactly what bothers my allergies. I really don't need scientific proof. I specifically said "because those are some of the things that affect me". I also have to close my windows, even in stifling heat (have no A/C), when my DH or neighbours mow their lawn.

 

Although without doing any research I'd be pretty sure that factory exhaust, car exhaust, airplanes, ships, and chemicals from scented products would be pretty easy to find negative studies on them and their harm. I just happen to be overly sensitive to them.

 

My point was that everyone should do what they feel is best for their own health instead of whining to other people about what other people should do. Or expecting some higher ups to "save" them from all the bad things in the world.

 

I agree with you - "scents" and grass give me horrible migraines. I have to wash my clothes in unscented detergent as well.

[triplett]

If you don't want to annoy other cruisers with 2nd hand smoke, then that's a good way to do it. If you don't care if other cruisers (who pay just as much) are offended from the by-products of your habit/addiction, then just book a balcony on NCL and puff away.

 

I am actually a non-smoker, but I do see the hassle of having to stop what you are doing and go all the way up to the smoking section of the ship. I guess being around someone smoking occasionally just doesn't get my panties in a wad.