Troubles on Norwegian Sun

[HCTiger9704]

Ouch!!! that makes my back hurt just thinking about your accident.

 

Just remember that insurance companies (all types, not just ones that deals with travelling insurance), cruise lines, hospitals, restaurants, est. are businesses and they want to make as much money as they can. Just some of them are more greedy than others (I am not saying NCL is being greedy here, I am just saying some businesses are more greedy than others).

 

I want to thank you for sharing you story. If I ever think I should buy travel insurance, I am going to keep sure I do my research and keep sure I read the policy before buying it. So you may have save me some headache in the future.

[pieshops]

I know you say, you are not saying NCL is not being greedy. But let me ask you a question. If the policy states they won't cover you if you drink, and you drink and get hurt, why in the world would you think you would be covered, forget the fact he did not get a copy nor ask for a copy of the policy. Why is that being greedy, please explain that, I must be missing something here?

 

And isn't that the point of any business to make as much money as possible and support your family or stockholders, why is this a bad thing?

 

Ouch!!! that makes my back hurt just thinking about your accident.

 

Just remember that insurance companies (all types, not just ones that deals with travelling insurance), cruise lines, hospitals, restaurants, est. are businesses and they want to make as much money as they can. Just some of them are more greedy than others (I am not saying NCL is being greedy here, I am just saying some businesses are more greedy than others).

 

I want to thank you for sharing you story. If I ever think I should buy travel insurance, I am going to keep sure I do my research and keep sure I read the policy before buying it. So you may have save me some headache in the future.

[punkincc]

I am so sad you had this experience. I am glad to read that your mobility is improving.

 

So a question. If I book the NCL rum swizzle cruise and take a drink, and something happens I am not insured as "a drink" means that I consumed alcohol and therefore my insurance is void?

 

:confused:

 

I think it would work this way. If the rum swizzle boat crashes into the dock and you bash your head, it is in no way related to the alcohol you consumed, and you would therefore be covered, unless the insurance company lawyers want to argue that you would have kept your footing without the alcohol and they would have a hard time proving this.

 

Where you get into grey areas would be where you have wine at dinner and then trip on the stairs. Was it just a misstep, or were you woozy from the wine? IMO there are grey areas in the OP's situation also. We don't know his general health, maybe other health issues. He went out into the hot sun and became faint and fell. I know this is possible as I almost passed out at Tulum and I had zero to drink. We don't actually know how much he drank. Maybe just one shot?

 

The problem with defending your position against a large insurance corporation with lawyers on the payroll, is that it would cost more for you to take something like this to court than you would ever recover.

[punkincc]

I know you say, you are not saying NCL is not being greedy. But let me ask you a question. If the policy states they won't cover you if you drink, and you drink and get hurt, why in the world would you think you would be covered, forget the fact he did not get a copy nor ask for a copy of the policy. Why is that being greedy, please explain that, I must be missing something here?

 

And isn't that the point of any business to make as much money as possible and support your family or stockholders, why is this a bad thing?

 

But IF the insurance company writes clauses into the insurance which covers behaviors which 95% of cruisers are going to indulge in daily, and then uses that clause to deny coverage out of hand regardless of whether or not the accident or injury is clearly alcohol related is IMO being unethical.

 

I don't blame insurance companies at all for protecting themselves against passengers who really overindulge and cause their own misfortune, but I wouldn't like it if I fell on the stairs after wine at dinner and my claim was dismissed. You could never afford to fight this.

[NLH Arizona]

But IF the insurance company writes clauses into the insurance which covers behaviors which 95% of cruisers are going to indulge in daily, and then uses that clause to deny coverage out of hand regardless of whether or not the accident or injury is clearly alcohol related is IMO being unethical.

 

I don't blame insurance companies at all for protecting themselves against passengers who really overindulge and cause their own misfortune, but I wouldn't like it if I fell on the stairs after wine at dinner and my claim was dismissed. You could never afford to fight this.

Is it unethical or very smart business? I'm sure they know that many, if not the majority, cruisers will be drinking and it is a way to protect themselves.

[pieshops]

I agree with you and I also think there is more to this story than than the OP is saying. Having a glass of wine and falling down a flight of steps is a lot differant than doing 12 shots and jumping off a balcony.

 

With that being said the OPs statement was that they did not get the policy, nor ask for it, so by not having it and not knowing what was in it you can not claim ignorance after the fact, whether most people read it or not makes no differance .

 

But IF the insurance company writes clauses into the insurance which covers behaviors which 95% of cruisers are going to indulge in daily, and then uses that clause to deny coverage out of hand regardless of whether or not the accident or injury is clearly alcohol related is IMO being unethical.

 

I don't blame insurance companies at all for protecting themselves against passengers who really overindulge and cause their own misfortune, but I wouldn't like it if I fell on the stairs after wine at dinner and my claim was dismissed. You could never afford to fight this.

[punkincc]

Is it unethical or very smart business? I'm sure they know that many, if not the majority, cruisers will be drinking and it is a way to protect themselves.

 

Is it a way to protect themselves, or a way just to get out of paying any claims? Very few if any passengers are going to fight a denial. It reminds me of the case of a medical insurance carrier several years ago whose policy it was to deny all claims initially. Very few people appealed and subsequently got compensated. The insurance company was making lots of money. Maybe you would call that smart business? They eventually got into big trouble.

 

Not saying these travel insurance companies are doing this, but it does make me wonder.

[WildcatRock]

OP - my father-in-law was a quadriplegic for 16 years until he passed away a few years ago so I know what you went through and am very thankful you have regained mobility.

 

Thank you for sharing your experience with us. This has been an eye-opening thread for me as my DW and I purchase travel insurance for every cruise and I never even thought about an alcohol exclusion.

 

I have another issue with the cost of travel insurance now....thanks to the alcohol exclusion I pretty much only have coverage from 8 am to Noon.

 

 

Sent from my DROID4 using Forums mobile app

[NLH Arizona]

Is it a way to protect themselves, or a way just to get out of paying any claims? Very few if any passengers are going to fight a denial. It reminds me of the case of a medical insurance carrier several years ago whose policy it was to deny all claims initially. Very few people appealed and subsequently got compensated. The insurance company was making lots of money. Maybe you would call that smart business? They eventually got into big trouble.

 

Not saying these travel insurance companies are doing this, but it does make me wonder.

Well, the insurance company, if it was in their documents was not hiding this from anyone, if the customer just asked for the documents. They were not denying "all claims" or denying claims that were clearly covered by the plan, they are just denying those where alcohol is involved. Can't see how they would get into big trouble over this.

 

Clearly a way to protect themselves from paying for claims where the person insured abided in alcohol which might have been a contributing factor to the accident.

 

And no, I would not call an insurance company that denies all claims, if they are covered under the terms of the agreement, ethical or doing smart business and they should have gotten into big trouble and hopefully had to reimburse their customers.

[billie5]

OP, I feel so sorry for you. I can not even imagine what you have gone through the past 2 years.

 

I do not think it is that unreasonable that the average person does not read the policy. How many have really read the entire policy, and/or the entire cruise contract? (yea, some do, but not many).

 

To have a "drinking" clause in a policy pretty much makes it worthless for so many things. Even if this person tripped/fell with only one drink, they would not be covered.

 

Perhaps garycarla is correct about most people not reading the policy. While I generally self-insure (except for evacuation insurance), when I have purchased a policy, I always download it to my laptop.

 

However, where he gets the rest from I can not imagine. Even OP admits the drinking would have to influence the accident. How can one be sure only one drink would lead to no coverage? My guess -- it would be assumed one drink would not be enough for even a litigious insurance firm to assert the drink contributed to the fall. But I doubt anyone can claim to know this.

 

But IF the insurance company writes clauses into the insurance which covers behaviors which 95% of cruisers are going to indulge in daily, and then uses that clause to deny coverage out of hand regardless of whether or not the accident or injury is clearly alcohol related is IMO being unethical.

I must live in a different world. I don't drink daily before engaging in morning/afternoon activities, have never drunk before leaving for a daytime excursion, and know few who would. I must be surrounded by the 5%.

 

Incidentally, the OP admits the accident was very much alcohol related.

[wheatengirl]

I wonder how many people go on a cruise and don't have a drink. Under the conditions of the policy it seems as if they would never pay for an accident.

[NLH Arizona]

I wonder how many people go on a cruise and don't have a drink. Under the conditions of the policy it seems as if they would never pay for an accident.

You are assuming that all passengers are drinking 24/7 on a cruise ship. If someone were to fall down the stairs in the morning, they probably wouldn't be drinking. If someone is on a shore excursion, in most instances, the person would not be drinking. There are many, many examples where people are not drinking all the time on a cruise ship.

[Cruise_More_Often]

Don't forget that the OP claims the alcohol was offered on the excursion. The reason I bring this up is that even if I downloaded the carrier's policy, read it and thoroughly understood it, would I, being offered a drink while participating in a cooking excursion, remember the claim in the policy about alcohol voiding coverage? I'm pretty sure I wouldn't.

 

Thank you, OP, for opening my eyes about something I never would have considered.

[NLH Arizona]

Don't forget that the OP claims the alcohol was offered on the excursion. The reason I bring this up is that even if I downloaded the carrier's policy, read it and thoroughly understood it, would I, being offered a drink while participating in a cooking excursion, remember the claim in the policy about alcohol voiding coverage? I'm pretty sure I wouldn't.

 

Thank you, OP, for opening my eyes about something I never would have considered.

I'm sure the insurance company would say, that since you should have read the policy, you would have known alcohol incidents would not be covered and when you accepted the drink, you were fully aware that if you were in an accident it would not be covered. Thus you should have declined the invitation to take the drink.

[Nalagh]

I think it would work this way. If the rum swizzle boat crashes into the dock and you bash your head, it is in no way related to the alcohol you consumed, and you would therefore be covered, unless the insurance company lawyers want to argue that you would have kept your footing without the alcohol and they would have a hard time proving this.

 

Where you get into grey areas would be where you have wine at dinner and then trip on the stairs. Was it just a misstep, or were you woozy from the wine? IMO there are grey areas in the OP's situation also. We don't know his general health, maybe other health issues. He went out into the hot sun and became faint and fell. I know this is possible as I almost passed out at Tulum and I had zero to drink. We don't actually know how much he drank. Maybe just one shot?

 

The problem with defending your position against a large insurance corporation with lawyers on the payroll, is that it would cost more for you to take something like this to court than you would ever recover.

 

Thank you for taking the time to respond. I am questioning the rationality of purchasing this insurance and maybe seeking outside insurance. I still want to include medical, trip cancellation and trip interruption with out forgoing a swizzle on the catamaran. ;)

[Cruise_More_Often]

I'm sure the insurance company would say, that since you should have read the policy, you would have known alcohol incidents would not be covered and when you accepted the drink, you were fully aware that if you were in an accident it would not be covered. Thus you should have declined the invitation to take the drink.

Which is why I thanked the OP for informing me.

[Bruce CountyJay]

Sorry about your injury. I have been on the mexican cooking tour in Cozumel and really enjoyed it. I don't like anything alcoholic, so I simply said no to the drinks while I was cooking, and they gave me something else. They don't force you to have the alcohol if you don't want it or aren't used to it. Also I might be one of the rare people who don't drink on the ship. I don't need it or want it. I enjoy mostly water, diet pepsi, etc.

I buy travel insurance but now will download and read all my policy. I buy it from my TA who is also my daughter.

:o

[Jasalth]

The OP's situation sucks, and I am happy they are getting better now. As for the title of the thread I do also agree that it is misleading (I came here because my next trip is on the Sun) and this really doesn't have anything to do with the Sun or NCL. And while everyone is saying the OP isn't the blame, it is just how insurance works to be honest. Instead of a person having a medical accident, think of it as a car. Would you expect your car insurance to cover you running threw your own house instead of stopping because you were drinking? 99% of the time they will just flat out deny the claim. Now if you hit another person when you are DUI, they will pay for the damage you caused to someone else, but not yours and drop you like a hot potato or your rates will sky rocket.

 

I wonder how many people go on a cruise and don't have a drink. Under the conditions of the policy it seems as if they would never pay for an accident.

 

I am sure there are quite a few actually. While it isn't a lot of days, I can say in 30+ days of cruising, neither me nor my husband have had alcohol on the ship. One of our last excursions we took was to an all inclusive beach, I drank that day, but again my husband didn't!

 

Also have 2 kids under 21 and while they are covered, they also don't drink.

 

I was curious about it all, so I pulled up my Travel Guard Gold policy. It actually has the same exclusions in it. Actually mine says alcohol, narcotics or other drugs except on doctors orders. I take this to mean if I was on a pain medication and slipped and feel I would be covered. If I was on a pain med, took 5 shots THEN hurt myself, then I would not be covered.

 

In this case, the OP chose to drink even though they said they aren't used to drinking, the OP then chose to go out in the sun, the OP then had the accident because of the effects. Would the OP have had the same result if they hadn't drank? The insurance company came to the result that no they would not have. I think that is where the line is probably drawn.

[Umbarger]

I had no idea. I wonder if all insurance companies are like this.

 

I don't blame NCL. I do blame the insurance company that NCL uses. Insurance companies will do anything not to pay claims.

 

I think if this happened to any of us we would be pretty upset too.

 

So sorry this happened to you.

[Demonyte]

I have bought several NCL insurance policies and the OP brings up a good point. They never deliver the policy to you. You must print it out yourself or find it on the NCL site.

 

You also need to print the passenger contract yourself and it's still binding legal document which restricts passenger a lot more than the insurance policy.

 

I agree with somebody who said that this thread is very misleadingly titled. It's sad that these things happen but in this case the blame is not with NCL and definitely not with the ship. Drinking while on excursion is not mandatory so it's always passengers own choice to have the drink(s) - I've never been on excursion on which alcoholic beverages are being served but there are no non-alcoholic drinks like soda or water.

 

On the other hand it's great to see that several people had apparently not known about these kind of limitations so in that regard the discussion has been very beneficial regardless of how misleading or flawed the first post might have been. :)

[goose30]

Something does not smell right. The OP states that he is/was paralyzed from the waist down. That surely is a terrible thing. Then they are worried about getting cruise money back????

[MsTabbyKats]

OP never responded about "medical issues" being covered or transportation home being covered.

 

OP never responded about testing done to determine that he was "under the influence".

 

However, I don't think we will hear from him because of all the negativity here.

 

I'm also one the the rare people who never had a drink on a cruise. Even "freebies"....if it's not water, iced tea or diet coke, I don't drink it.

[vols_159]

Op

 

So sorry you got hurt but even workers comp insurance won't pay if you are hurt using drugs or alcohol.. Heck if you fail a drug test from pot you smoked a week ago they won't pay..

 

Speedy recovery

 

 

Sent using the Cruise Critic forums app

[kylenyc]

Going to the NCL site to get the terms... http://www.ncl.com/freestyle-cruise/booksafe ... Click on Term and Conditions... Click on Book Safe Travel Protection ... brings you to "Coming soon?" :confused:

[Seanote]

Just read Travelguard's policy. The general exclusions state (paraphrase here)--> the plan does not cover any loss caused by or resulting from: use of drugs, narcotics or alcohol.

 

Now, I know you dive into the world of insurance semantics here, but it does not say you cannot drink. But you cannot have a claim as a result of drinking. A fine line, I know.