wine in the box

[dakrewser]

[quote name='Ekaj']Why laugh? It's entirely possible that these wines AREN'T available in the U.S. [/QUOTE]

Possible, yes. True, no. They're simply re-labled (or privately labeled) mas-produced California wines. Think two-buck chuck's big brother.

[dedlaw]

Well, I sort of doubt that -- they claim to be from foreign countries, and it is hard to imagine X (or any other line) knowingly helping these folks violate multiple laws.

[dakrewser]

[quote name='dedlaw']Well, I sort of doubt that -- they claim to be from foreign countries, and it is hard to imagine X (or any other line) knowingly helping these folks violate multiple laws.[/QUOTE]
Hmm, the only one's I've heard about have been California labelings - what else has been offered?

[dedlaw]

Nothing from USA, period. There were "super Tuscans," "Bordeaux" and such -- but again, you've never heard of any of them (that was the selling point). The labels looked really nice -- somebody has done their homework.

[dakrewser]

[quote name='dedlaw']Nothing from USA, period. There were "super Tuscans," "Bordeaux" and such -- but again, you've never heard of any of them (that was the selling point). The labels looked really nice -- somebody has done their homework.[/QUOTE]

Labels are cheap to print, but usually the source can be ascertained, and I spent 15 years importing European wines, so it's hard to find things that I've "never" heard of...

[Ekaj]

Oh, never mind...

[dakrewser]

[quote name='Ekaj']Oh, never mind...[/QUOTE]

I never said "mis-labeled" wine, but rather "re-labeled" wine. It's a standard industry practice all over the world and is not meant to aid fraud, but to give vendors an "exclusive" label to sell.

Oh, and Celebrity isn't auctioning the wines any more than they auction the "art" - it's all done by concessionaires with X taking a cut off the top.

And, no, I'm not familiar with every producer everywhere. Still, the "language of the label" can tell you much both by what's on the label and by what's left off.

[dedlaw]

Wow -- you DID certainly mean mislabeled -- if it says its from Italy and it's really from Fresno, that's mislabled. Relabeling (i.e., "rebranding") doesn't imply "changing" the place of origin. And with lots of small wineries popping up, it is VERY easy for anybody to have not heard of something. Especially with custom labels -- I can go to Windsor Vineyards and have them bottle under the dedlaw label, even if it is the same stuff as in all their other bottles.

While X may not be conducting the auctions, that certainly lend the air of credibility by allowing it to take place on their ships. Concessions cover auctions, spa services and the like, but if everyone was unhappy with their spa treatments, I don't think X would make the issue go away by saying, "it's only a concession." By saying this, I mean that X must have a reasonable level of confidence in the wine auction firm before allowing them to conduct onboard auctions, because X knows the image will rub off on X (and vice versa).

[dakrewser]

[quote name='dedlaw']Wow -- you DID certainly mean mislabeled -- if it says its from Italy and it's really from Fresno, that's mislabled. [/QUOTE]

Please don't put words in my mouth, especially when the words are available for everyone to read and discver that you are wrong.

As I said, the only wines from the auctions I'd seen discussed were California wines. Re-labeling, as you noted, is neither illegal or unethical. Still, the wines you can buy from Windsor with your name on them will carry an indication that they were bottled by Windsor - unless you're willing to incorporate yourself as a winery...

[Ekaj]

Dave, I agree with dedlaw - it certainly seemed as if you were saying that California wines were being labeled with the intent to mislead consumers. And yes, your words are here for everyone to see. I said to someone, in regard to the EUROPEAN wines that might be available at auction on the ship:

"It's entirely possible that these wines AREN'T available in the U.S."

To which you replied:

"Possible, yes. True, no. They're simply re-labled (or privately labeled) mas-produced California wines. Think two-buck chuck's big brother."

And later you said something else about wine labels being cheap to print. Now, I don't know about anyone else reading these threads, but it certainly seemed to me that you were implying that these auctions were taking California wines and putting European labels on them. Why else would you say to me, "True, no" in regard to my statement that these European wines really might not be available in the U.S., and then call them "mass-produced California wines"?

The interesting thing was that on another board, there was a discussion of "weak" drinks being served, and you seemed to be quite upset that the poster would accuse the line of "fraud" as you called it. But yet above, it certainly seems as if you are accusing the wine auction vendors of fraud, by taking "mass-produced California wines" and re-labeling them - and if these wine auctions are supposed to be all about European wines that aren't available in the U.S., as dedlaw said, then wouldn't our conclusion about your statements be correct? If they are not, then perhaps you could enlighten us as to what you REALLY meant.

In addition, I erased my post from ealier before I knew that you had responded. The reason that I had said, "Oh, never mind..." in my post is because I had decided that it's just wasn't worth my time to attempt to reason with you on this subject. (I am posting this morning simply to stand up for dedlaw in her comments to you, b/c I agree.) I honestly think that you really do just love to argue and try to prove your point, whether it's a good one or an off the wall one, and maybe that's the sole reason you come to these message boards. I've often seen you take just one sentence out of someone's post, misconstrue it, take it in a completely different direction than the conversation had been going, and then argue it. Seriously, do you ever just agree with anyone? And yes, I fully expect you to misconstrue this post, ignore the point, and go off in a different direction. (I'll admit, though, it's sometimes interesting and amusing to see WHICH direction...)

[dedlaw]

Ekaj, thanks, and there is no point in continuing. This board should be a pleasant diversion, not a debate society. I am guilty of turning this thread all around (folks, they are NOT auctioning boxed wines) and I usually grumble about that when done by others -- sorry about that.

BTW, I'm a "him," not a "her."

[Ekaj]

[quote name='dedlaw']Ekaj, thanks, and there is no point in continuing. This board should be a pleasant diversion, not a debate society.[/QUOTE]

And I agree with you completely... I love to chat about all kinds of subjects, and I'll post my opinions if I feel strongly about something, but I really DON'T like it when it becomes an all-out argument or debate.

[quote name='dedlaw']BTW, I'm a "him," not a "her."[/QUOTE]

I'm so sorry! For some reason, I saw your screen name and thought of the name "Dee", as in the female "Deedee". (I have a friend with that name.) Oops, my apologies. :o

[dedlaw]

Well, if it makes you feel any better, my wife wears the pants in the family.

[dakrewser]

[quote name='Ekaj']Dave, I agree with dedlaw - it certainly seemed as if you were saying that California wines were being labeled with the intent to mislead consumers. And yes, your words are here for everyone to see. I said to someone, in regard to the EUROPEAN wines that might be available at auction on the ship:
[/QUOTE]

Actually, neither you or the person you were responding to used the word "european". If I mistakenly thought you were referring to American wines, I apologize.

But no where do I imply an intent to commit fraud. No where. That's something you & dedlaw seem to have conjured up on your own...

[CruzinSuz]

I love Black Box Wine, it's very tasty and packs well for the cabin. I've served it at parties with a few of my wine snob friends, and they liked it too. It is not Franzia or Almaden, it's award winning wine. I also pack bottles of wine for the dining room. I really enjoy having a glass or two while getting ready for dinner. We've only ever paid a corkage fee once on all our cruises. Usually give the waiter a nice cash tip instead.

Suz

[VibeGuy]

Trinchero makes the Target box wines, and I have to say the Pinot Grigio is both rasty and exceedingly cheap. I really love having a glass or two on hand that I don't end up having to use half the bottle to deglaze a pan because it's gone a little off after three days in the fridge. They also sell a *very* smart-looking carrier that will hold their 3L square "casks".

Eric

[dakrewser]

[quote name='VibeGuy']Trinchero makes the Target box wines, and I have to say the Pinot Grigio is both rasty and exceedingly cheap. [/QUOTE]

I almost hate to ask, but was that "r" typo supposed to be a "t" - or an "n"? :rolleyes:

[dedlaw]

Suz:

I live in "wine country." EVERY wine is "award winning," because there are too many awards. What is okay for a nip before dinner may not have its place at the table -- just as you suggest.

As far as "nice cash tip," on Celebrity they have you sign a bar-tab type slip each evening -- the cash tip would in effect be a bribe to not hand me the slip which was already run at the register. A few years back I found that they would skip a night, maybe every other night, but no more -- the price we pay for keeping cruise prices low.