Harmony Size question

[amscene1]

I read that the harmony is 7 feet longer and 18 feet wider than her sisters, yet just 2000 tons heavier. Do you think they did some weight reduction to the vessel to achieve this?

 

I can't even imaging an extra 18 feet added to the promenades with, that will be even more insane!

 

 

 

 

Oasis wiki source: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oasis-class_cruise_ship

 

Harmony Source: http://www.shipcruise.org/rccl-harmony-of-the-seas-itinerary/

[Clarea]

The difference of 2000 tons is not a measure of weight, it is a measure of enclosed volume.

[racerxspeedy]

The width at the waterline won't be increasing by 18ft. The max width is likely measured across the bridge. The promenade width will match the other ships.2

[whitshel]

The width at the waterline won't be increasing by 18ft. The max width is likely measured across the bridge. The promenade width will match the other ships.2

 

 

So the bridge is 18ft wider? Or is this just rccl math, like voyager and freedom widths?

[racerxspeedy]

So the bridge is 18ft wider? Or is this just rccl math, like voyager and freedom widths?

 

I have no factual information. My best SWAG is that there is some minor change (solarium, water slides, pool deck, lifeboats...etc) that will add a few feet per side. Bridge would only get wider if required for visibility of the aft.

 

This would not impact the main hull waterline width, but it may get everyone excited enough to talk about the "worlds largest cruise ship" .

[racerxspeedy]

When I was looking for top view pics I ran across these from J.Milstein - Fun, but a lot of work to get these.

 

 

http://www.slate.com/blogs/behold/2015/05/19/jeffrey_milstein_photographs_cruise_ships_in_his_series_cruise_ships.html

 

[3dog]

When I was looking for top view pics I ran across these from J.Milstein - Fun, but a lot of work to get these.

 

 

http://www.slate.com/blogs/behold/2015/05/19/jeffrey_milstein_photographs_cruise_ships_in_his_series_cruise_ships.html

 

Cool, but this is Freedom of the Seas.

[racerxspeedy]

Cool, but this is Freedom of the Seas.

 

Correct - there was no picture of Oasis class, but this view gives a great view of the bridge width and cantilevered tubs. The overall width of Freedom and Oasis class ships is greatly impacted by these appendages.

[3dog]

Correct - there was no picture of Oasis class, but this view gives a great view of the bridge width and cantilevered tubs. The overall width of Freedom and Oasis class ships is greatly impacted by these appendages.

 

Not sure "impacted" is the correct word, but the beam (width) of most (if not all) ships is usually defined by the width at the bridge; Freedom class and Oasis class included.

 

 

That said, it is my opinion that the extra 5-1/2 meters of width on Harmony will be translated into the core structure, and not just have the bridge 5-1/2 meters wider. Will it also be the case at the water line or will it just be the superstructure? I don't know as I don't have those dimensions. But since this is a new build at a new shipyard, either or both is possible.

[amscene1]

Not sure "impacted" is the correct word, but the beam (width) of most (if not all) ships is usually defined by the width at the bridge; Freedom class and Oasis class included.

 

 

 

 

 

That said, it is my opinion that the extra 5-1/2 meters of width on Harmony will be translated into the core structure, and not just have the bridge 5-1/2 meters wider. Will it also be the case at the water line or will it just be the superstructure? I don't know as I don't have those dimensions. But since this is a new build at a new shipyard, either or both is possible.

 

 

An extra 5 - 1/2 meters would be pretty noticeable (and awesome) if it is on the passenger decks. Hopefully this is for more public spaces then it is staterooms, but I doubt it. [emoji6]

[oneputt18]

The difference of 2000 tons is not a measure of weight, it is a measure of enclosed volume.

 

 

Explained here:http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gross_tonnage

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[3dog]

An extra 5 - 1/2 meters would be pretty noticeable (and awesome) if it is on the passenger decks. Hopefully this is for more public spaces then it is staterooms, but I doubt it. [emoji6]

 

For something that is already 65m wide, it might not be as noticeable as you might think (O-class are really wide ships, not particularly really long).

 

Again it is a guess (based on reports and no "official data"), but my guess is that the superstructure widens by 5-1/2 meters and not translated much, if at all, to the rooms (keep in mind the majority of rooms are along the length of the superstructure, so doesn't benefit from added width). So Central Park, The Boardwalk, The Royal Promenade, and even the Crown Loft space will get wider, but not any of the staterooms. But due to the added width, there can be more CL staterooms as well as interior staterooms (current reports suggest only 44 more cabins will be added to Harmony, not much as a percentage on a ship with 2700 already).

[Ourusualbeach]

For something that is already 65m wide, it might not be as noticeable as you might think (O-class are really wide ships, not particularly really long).

 

Again it is a guess (based on reports and no "official data"), but my guess is that the superstructure widens by 5-1/2 meters and not translated much, if at all, to the rooms (keep in mind the majority of rooms are along the length of the superstructure, so doesn't benefit from added width). So Central Park, The Boardwalk, The Royal Promenade, and even the Crown Loft space will get wider, but not any of the staterooms. But due to the added width, there can be more CL staterooms as well as interior staterooms (current reports suggest only 44 more cabins will be added to Harmony, not much as a percentage on a ship with 2700 already).

 

The deck plans from Harmony are posted. If you compare deck to deck there does not appear to be any extra width added as the deck plans look identical. Is that 18' wider an actual know fact from a credible source?

[amscene1]

If the ship has 2700 cabins how come we never see it sail with over 10,000 passengers on board. Is it because the crew can't handle it or is it regulated somehow?

 

I noticed that a lot of the sailings will only allow you to do a maximum of two people in the stateroom. I assume that a lot of people on the ship try to book with four or five passengers to a room early and closer to the booking they limit rooms to two people.

 

Maybe they are widening the ship to accommodate more crew cabins and more passenger capacity so it can sail with 9,000 passengers and 3000 crew.

[Clarea]

If the ship has 2700 cabins how come we never see it sail with over 10,000 passengers on board. Is it because the crew can't handle it or is it regulated somehow?

 

I noticed that a lot of the sailings will only allow you to do a maximum of two people in the stateroom. I assume that a lot of people on the ship try to book with four or five passengers to a room early and closer to the booking they limit rooms to two people.

 

Maybe they are widening the ship to accommodate more crew cabins and more passenger capacity so it can sail with 9,000 passengers and 3000 crew.

They cannot go beyond the capacity of the lifeboats.

[amscene1]

Maybe the life boats are 8 feet wider each sticking out of the sides lol

[Ourusualbeach]

I read that the harmony is 7 feet longer and 18 feet wider than her sisters, yet just 2000 tons heavier. Do you think they did some weight reduction to the vessel to achieve this?

 

I can't even imaging an extra 18 feet added to the promenades with, that will be even more insane!

 

 

 

 

Oasis wiki source: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oasis-class_cruise_ship

 

Harmony Source: http://www.shipcruise.org/rccl-harmony-of-the-seas-itinerary/

 

 

If you look at the information provided by Royal, they list the max beam of. Oasis as 213 ft and not the 198 ft listed by Wiki.

 

http://www.royalcaribbean.com/findacruise/ships/class/ship/home.do?shipClassCode=OA&shipCode=OA&br=R

 

I have doubts that the Harmony is actually 18 ft wider. With only an increase of 2000 tons (volume) (less than 1% of the Oasis's current volume) you are only talking small changes in the overall dimensions of the ship.

 

From the fact sheet,

 

 

Oasis of the Seas

FAST FACTS

Registry: Bahamas • Built at STX Europe, Turku, Finland

Maiden Voyage: December 5, 2009

Godmother: Daisy Fuentes, Dara Torres, Gloria Estefan, Jane Seymour, Keisha Knight Pulliam, Michelle Kwan, Shawn Johnson

 

225,282 GRT • 1,187 feet (362 meters) long • 215 feet (65 meters) wide

213 feet (65 meters) high from the water line • 30 feet (9.1 meters) draft • 22 knots cruising speed

16 guest decks • 18 total decks • 24 passenger elevators • 4 bow thrusters with 7,500 horse power each

5,400 guests (double occupancy) • 6,360 guests total • 2,394 crew (From over 71 countries)

Edited May 21, 2015 by Ourusualbeach

[3dog]

The deck plans from Harmony are posted. If you compare deck to deck there does not appear to be any extra width added as the deck plans look identical. Is that 18' wider an actual know fact from a credible source?

 

The builder:

http://stxfrance.fr//UK/stxfrance-reference-41-HARMONY%20OF%20THE%20SEAS%20%20OASIS%204.awp

 

States a width of 66m vs. Oasis 60.5 (as specified on DNV):

https://exchange.dnv.com/Exchange/main.aspx?extool=vessel&subview=dimensions&vesselid=27091

 

However, I did make an error in the number of added staterooms. I forgot that Oasis added 38 on their last dry dock making the total 2738, and the builder's site suggests Harmony has 2747 (not the 44 I gleaned elsewhere), meaning there are only 9 more.

[Ourusualbeach]

The builder:

http://stxfrance.fr//UK/stxfrance-reference-41-HARMONY%20OF%20THE%20SEAS%20%20OASIS%204.awp

 

States a width of 66m vs. Oasis 60.5 (as specified on DNV):

https://exchange.dnv.com/Exchange/main.aspx?extool=vessel&subview=dimensions&vesselid=27091

 

However, I did make an error in the number of added staterooms. I forgot that Oasis added 38 on their last dry dock making the total 2738, and the builder's site suggests Harmony has 2747 (not the 44 I gleaned elsewhere), meaning there are only 9 more.

 

 

This is the spec sheet as posted by Royal, I still think that all this confusion is that the shipyard is measuring one width, Royal another width and the two different widths are being incorrectly compared.

 

Oasis of the Seas

FAST FACTS

Registry: Bahamas • Built at STX Europe, Turku, Finland

Maiden Voyage: December 5, 2009

Godmother: Daisy Fuentes, Dara Torres, Gloria Estefan, Jane Seymour, Keisha Knight Pulliam, Michelle Kwan, Shawn Johnson

 

225,282 GRT • 1,187 feet (362 meters) long • 215 feet (65 meters) wide

213 feet (65 meters) high from the water line • 30 feet (9.1 meters) draft • 22 knots cruising speed

16 guest decks • 18 total decks • 24 passenger elevators • 4 bow thrusters with 7,500 horse power each

5,400 guests (double occupancy) • 6,360 guests total • 2,394 crew (From over 71 countries)

Edited May 21, 2015 by Ourusualbeach

[sseuorosal]

The max width is likely measured across the bridge.

[3dog]

This is the spec sheet as posted by Royal, I still think that all this confusion is that the shipyard is measuring one width, Royal another width and the two different widths are being incorrectly compared.

 

Oasis of the Seas

FAST FACTS

Registry: Bahamas • Built at STX Europe, Turku, Finland

Maiden Voyage: December 5, 2009

Godmother: Daisy Fuentes, Dara Torres, Gloria Estefan, Jane Seymour, Keisha Knight Pulliam, Michelle Kwan, Shawn Johnson

 

225,282 GRT • 1,187 feet (362 meters) long • 215 feet (65 meters) wide

213 feet (65 meters) high from the water line • 30 feet (9.1 meters) draft • 22 knots cruising speed

16 guest decks • 18 total decks • 24 passenger elevators • 4 bow thrusters with 7,500 horse power each

5,400 guests (double occupancy) • 6,360 guests total • 2,394 crew (From over 71 countries)

 

Yea, there does seem to be a difference in measurement. I do have a tendency to trust the DNV registry just a little more.

 

 

I have doubts that the Harmony is actually 18 ft wider. With only an increase of 2000 tons (volume) (less than 1% of the Oasis's current volume) you are only talking small changes in the overall dimensions of the ship.

 

Something to keep in mind is that Central Park and the Boardwalk don't contribute to the GRT, as they are not contained space. So a ship can get wider in those spaces without changing the GRT for those spaces. So potentially not unrealistic to become 5.5 m wider and only add 2000GRT.

[racerxspeedy]

The deck plans from Harmony are posted. If you compare deck to deck there does not appear to be any extra width added as the deck plans look identical. Is that 18' wider an actual know fact from a credible source?

 

Exactly -

 

There are no facts pointing to Harmony being wider at the waterline than Oasis. This would be huge news.

 

1) No significant gross tonnage or displacement increase.

Oasis is roughly 30 ft wider than Freedom Class. An 18 ft width increase would add roughly 50,000 tons. Look at the wiki data below 3dog

 

2) 18 feet is the size of a stateroom. It would be very noticeable on every level on the deck plans - it does not.

 

In summary this would impact the design so much (hydrodynamics, power, mechanical systems, costs, logistics ..etc) that you would create a new class of ship.

 

Again I go back to the width measurement location - there is no consistency. 213ft - across the widest point, not the entire hull width. Hull will remain at 154 ft

 

 

Per Wikipedia

 

Freedom

 

Tonnage: 154,407 gross tonnage (GT)

Length: 1,111 ft 6 in (338.8 m)

Beam: 126 ft 8 in (38.6 m) at waterline

183 ft 8 in (56.0 m) bridge wing

 

Oasis

Tonnage: 225,282 GT[1]–227,700 GT[2]

Length: 360 m (1,181 ft) overall[3]

Beam: 47 m (154 ft) waterline

60.5 m (198 ft) extreme

[Ourusualbeach]

Yea, there does seem to be a difference in measurement. I do have a tendency to trust the DNV registry just a little more.

 

 

 

 

Something to keep in mind is that Central Park and the Boardwalk don't contribute to the GRT, as they are not contained space. So a ship can get wider in those spaces without changing the GRT for those spaces. So potentially not unrealistic to become 5.5 m wider and only add 2000GRT.

 

But compare the deck plans of O ASIs and. Harmony and there is no difference (certainly not 18') in the width of Central Park or on the pool deck.

 

If Central Park was 18' wider then the decks above and below would have to be that much wider as well and they clearly are not.

[rusty nut]

If they built Harmony 18 feet wider than Oasis/Allure that would be an astronomical difference, so much so, it would put the ship into an entirely new class. I believe Harmony's hull and superstructure will be a flat out carbon copy of Oasis/Allure. That's why RCI calls it an "Oasis class" ship.