Carnival Legend 4K French Doors no longer open - Sealed shut!

[Krazyhardrocker]

I am curious. What did you settle on? Did you cancel? Did you take the $25 OBC? Did they sweeten the deal and offer something else? I don't mean to pry. I am just curious how far they were willing to move.

They threw in a bottle of wine along with the $25 obc and it looks like that's as far as they are willing to go. If you are booked in one of these rooms, I encourage you to get a hold of them. If enough people contact Carnival, they might realize that this might be something they want to address.

[ljslight]

WOW!! I have 2 friends who book a 4k on a 16 Hawaii cruise (9/2019) thinking the doors would open! I am up on deck 6 for the same cruise. I will have to let them know. They will be angry to find this out!!!!

[Krazyhardrocker]

WOW!! I have 2 friends who book a 4k on a 16 Hawaii cruise (9/2019) thinking the doors would open! I am up on deck 6 for the same cruise. I will have to let them know. They will be angry to find this out!!!!

 

Tell them to contact Carnival. Things won't change unless people take the time to voice their concerns. Since that cruise is so far out, they may be willing to change them into a different room. Unfortunately for us, our cruise is only a few months away and almost full. They did offer to cancel without penalty, but we didn't want to do that either.

[PrincessArlena'sDad]

AC could be more of an issue with the 4K than the balcony.

 

On a balcony, people go in and out, but are less likely to just leave the door open (and there is a sticker on the door asking you not to do that). If you want fresh air, you go out on your balcony. No need to hold the door to get the fresh air.

 

With the 4K, if you want fresh air, you have to keep the door open one way or another. If you are not able to keep the door open, there is hardly any benefit to having a door there, instead of a window. Yes, you could open it for a second and smell the air, but you are not supposed to keep it open. I'm sure people were propping the door open for hours while sitting in their room. There is less incentive to disobey the sign in the balcony rooms, as you can go out on the balcony for fresh air.

 

As for the safety issue:

People aren't going to climb over the balcony railing to go exploring. Were people doing this on the 4k? It's very possible people were, or Carnival just got afraid dumb people could, and then sue Carnival when they got hurt.

[Krazyhardrocker]

AC could be more of an issue with the 4K than the balcony.

 

On a balcony' date=' people go in and out, but are less likely to just leave the door open (and there is a sticker on the door asking you not to do that). If you want fresh air, you go out on your balcony. No need to hold the door to get the fresh air.

 

With the 4K, if you want fresh air, you have to keep the door open one way or another. If you are not able to keep the door open, there is hardly any benefit to having a door there, instead of a window. Yes, you could open it for a second and smell the air, but you are not supposed to keep it open. I'm sure people were propping the door open for hours while sitting in their room. There is less incentive to disobey the sign in the balcony rooms, as you can go out on the balcony for fresh air.

 

As for the safety issue:

People aren't going to climb over the balcony railing to go exploring. Were people doing this on the 4k? It's very possible people were, or Carnival just got afraid dumb people could, and then sue Carnival when they got hurt.[/quote']

 

I am sure the door vs AC was/is being abused by both 4K and balcony cabin cruisers. Personally, when we had a 4K on our Alaska cruise we would open the doors and stand at the Juliette balcony for a few minutes and then close the doors.

 

As for the safety issue, dumb people are going to do dumb things regardless of what cabin they are in. I am sure that someone at some point climbed out of their 4K cabin into an area they were not supposed to be in, but it did not seem to be a rampant issue (or it seems like it would have been a big topic on these boards).

[Krazyhardrocker]

The Carnival Spirit goes into dry dock tomorrow in Singapore. I have a friend that is doing the cruise back to Australia in a 4K right after the dry dock. She checked and says the website description for her cabin has change too. When she called to complain, she said they were very abrupt and rude with her. They did not offer an explanation, apology or compensation for the situation. The bad customer service continues to amaze me. Well, that's 2 Spirit class ships down, 2 to go. The Carnival Pride is due for dry dock in Feb 2019 and the final ship, the Carnival Miracle is due in 2020.:eek:

[HeidiHo]

As for the safety issue:

People aren't going to climb over the balcony railing to go exploring. Were people doing this on the 4k? It's very possible people were' date=' or Carnival just got afraid dumb people could, and then sue Carnival when they got hurt.[/quote']

 

I know someone who was traveling with some teen girls on a Spirit class ship in the French door rooms several years ago. One of the parents with them told me that the girls had climbed over the railing to go from room to room rather than going through the hallway.

 

I can understand why Carnival wants to replace those doors with windows but I do agree that anyone who had booked those cabins before they decided to change them should be notified. They are not getting what they booked.

[mgdehoyos]

I found a picture of the change ... ugh! Looks like all the Spirit class will have this coming in their scheduled dry-docks.

 

 

 

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[john91498]

That's a bummer. Was on the Miracle in 2016 and loved our 4k. We were in between the life boats and had a great view.

[Krazyhardrocker]

I found a picture of the change ... ugh! Looks like all the Spirit class will have this coming in their scheduled dry-docks.

 

 

 

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Yeah, that would be nice if you actually had a view. The way the picture shows it, not so much. I'll experience it for myself in September and then decide if that will be my last 4K.

[mtn_couple]

I’ve booked a 4K in November (for the price and the fresh air), if I’m no longer getting the fresh air, it becomes an expensive “inside” category room. I will contact Carnival when time permits in the next few days and will follow this with interest.

[patcruise1]

A friend is booked on the Pride in February/2020. There is no description change of the 4K when booking. Did Carnival send out a letter to individuals regarding the change and the $25.00 OBC?

 

Thank you for your help.

[Krazyhardrocker]

I’ve booked a 4K in November (for the price and the fresh air), if I’m no longer getting the fresh air, it becomes an expensive “inside” category room. I will contact Carnival when time permits in the next few days and will follow this with interest.

 

I would contact them sooner rather than later. Best of luck and please post the results.

[Krazyhardrocker]

A friend is booked on the Pride in February/2020. There is no description change of the 4K when booking. Did Carnival send out a letter to individuals regarding the change and the $25.00 OBC?

 

Thank you for your help.

 

This is my main issue with the situation. Carnival is doing NOTHING to inform people that have booked one of these 4K cabins before the changes were made. I actually just pulled up the Carnival site and did a mock booking for the Pride in 2020. The 4K cabins are still listed as having French doors even though they are fully aware that those will be removed in Feb 2019. It is horrible and intentional false advertising. They are not offering anything unless you call them to complain. Even that is hit or miss, depending on who you get on the phone. Your friend's sailing is to far out, so it seems like they would be willing to let them make a change if they want to do so.

 

Best of luck. Please let us know what happens.

[patcruise1]

This is my main issue with the situation. Carnival is doing NOTHING to inform people that have booked one of these 4K cabins before the changes were made. I actually just pulled up the Carnival site and did a mock booking for the Pride in 2020. The 4K cabins are still listed as having French doors even though they are fully aware that those will be removed in Feb 2019. It is horrible and intentional false advertising. They are not offering anything unless you call them to complain. Even that is hit or miss, depending on who you get on the phone. Your friend's sailing is to far out, so it seems like they would be willing to let them make a change if they want to do so.

 

Best of luck. Please let us know what happens.

 

Thank you. I think she is going to stay where she is. I don't think an Ocean View is as good as the 4K and they are on Deck 1, where all the traffic is when leaving for excursions. I am in a 8K in the bowling alley room, so we will have plenty room and fresh air in my cabin. We will keep an eye on this and see where it goes. I feel for everyone that has this happening to them now. I agree, that Carnival should be notifying people of the change and the change coming on the Pride and Miracle. They can put a disclaimer on the cruises that they are selling for future cruise after the dry docks, so guest will know before they book. It is really a shame that they can't be forthcoming on things like this.

[patcruise1]

Thank you. I think she is going to stay where she is. I don't think an Ocean View is as good as the 4K and they are on Deck 1, where all the traffic is when leaving for excursions. I am in a 8K in the bowling alley room, so we will have plenty room and fresh air in my cabin. We will keep an eye on this and see where it goes. I feel for everyone that has this happening to them now. I agree, that Carnival should be notifying people of the change and the change coming on the Pride and Miracle. They can put a disclaimer on the cruises that they are selling for future cruise after the dry docks, so guest will know before they book. It is really a shame that they can't be forthcoming on things like this.

 

I also have a cruise for the Legend - May 6, 2019 and they have changed it to:

 

 

INTERIOR WITH WINDOW (OBSTRUCTED VIEW)

When is an Interior stateroom more than an Interior stateroom? When one comes with a floor-to-ceiling window, letting sunlight stream into your stateroom. Your room will also feature even more space, a sky view through that window of yours, plus a seating area to enjoy it from. (Note that the view will be obstructed.)

I will keep an eye out on the Pride for February 9, 2020 to see when it changes.

 

 

[Krazyhardrocker]

I also have a cruise for the Legend - May 6, 2019 and they have changed it to:

 

 

 

INTERIOR WITH WINDOW (OBSTRUCTED VIEW)

When is an Interior stateroom more than an Interior stateroom? When one comes with a floor-to-ceiling window, letting sunlight stream into your stateroom. Your room will also feature even more space, a sky view through that window of yours, plus a seating area to enjoy it from. (Note that the view will be obstructed.)

I will keep an eye out on the Pride for February 9, 2020 to see when it changes.

 

 

 

Yeah, that is what Carnival is doing. They are not changing anything on the description until after the dry dock has happened. It is very deceptive since they are fully aware that the change to the cabin is coming. The fact that they don't feel the need to inform anyone about the change is what really has me upset. In my case in particular (cruising on the Legend in September of this year - booked way back in July of 2016), Carnival seems to think that just changing the room description on the website is all that they need to do to inform me about the change. It is not reasonable to believe everyone is going to find this information on their own. I just stumbled across it when I was looking at booking a different cruise on the Carnival site and noticed the change in the 4K description. That led me to do some more research and make some calls to find out what is going on. I should not have needed to do that as Carnival should have informed me about the change, which they have known about for quite some time. My cruise is pretty much full as it is a very popular Journey's cruise and I only got the information less than 4 months before the sailing, so my choices were pretty much to accept the change or cancel my cruise. Changing my cabin is not an option. We are going to go and we will have a great time (as long as Hawaii doesn't blow up). However, I am more than happy to try to get the information out to my fellow cruisers if Carnival is not willing to do so.

[patcruise1]

Yeah, that is what Carnival is doing. They are not changing anything on the description until after the dry dock has happened. It is very deceptive since they are fully aware that the change to the cabin is coming. The fact that they don't feel the need to inform anyone about the change is what really has me upset. In my case in particular (cruising on the Legend in September of this year - booked way back in July of 2016), Carnival seems to think that just changing the room description on the website is all that they need to do to inform me about the change. It is not reasonable to believe everyone is going to find this information on their own. I just stumbled across it when I was looking at booking a different cruise on the Carnival site and noticed the change in the 4K description. That led me to do some more research and make some calls to find out what is going on. I should not have needed to do that as Carnival should have informed me about the change, which they have known about for quite some time. My cruise is pretty much full as it is a very popular Journey's cruise and I only got the information less than 4 months before the sailing, so my choices were pretty much to accept the change or cancel my cruise. Changing my cabin is not an option. We are going to go and we will have a great time (as long as Hawaii doesn't blow up). However, I am more than happy to try to get the information out to my fellow cruisers if Carnival is not willing to do so.

 

Very thankful for you to take the time to let us cruisers know. I am on a Journey Cruise on the Pride, November 4, 2018. No one is booked in a 4K, so I haven't even been checking prices or descriptions. This is so frustrating. I have always wanted to book a 4K because of the French Doors, but I certainly won't be now. I like my Balcony. I sure hope that Hawaii doesn't blow up and that you have a wonderful time.

[Krazyhardrocker]

Very thankful for you to take the time to let us cruisers know. I am on a Journey Cruise on the Pride, November 4, 2018. No one is booked in a 4K, so I haven't even been checking prices or descriptions. This is so frustrating. I have always wanted to book a 4K because of the French Doors, but I certainly won't be now. I like my Balcony. I sure hope that Hawaii doesn't blow up and that you have a wonderful time.

 

Thanks Pat

 

Anyone in a 4K for your Journey cruise should be fine since it is 3 months before the Pride dry dock. I have only been in a 4K once before and that was about 6 years ago in Alaska. We were lucky enough to book between life boats and enjoyed our little view and the fresh air. We really liked it and were looking forward to it for our Vancouver to Hawaii cruise in September. Unfortunately, we were not lucky enough to get a room between the life boats this time, so I will have a beautiful floor to ceiling view of orange.

[pratzert]

We are booked in a 4K on the Nov. 4th Journeys cruise on the Pride too. We did a Journeys cruise on the Pride in Jan. 2017 and were in a 4K cabin as well. It was nice to have the Full glass so you could see daylight and a little bit of a view.

 

But we never did open the door for fresh air. There WAS an upcharge for the 4K cabin.

 

On the Nov.4th cruise, we recvd an email offering an "upgrade" to a balcony for $400. Initially, we decided not to spend the extra money, but a day later we were considering it a little more seriously, but the offer had already been withdrawn.

 

I think we'll still have a great time on the cruise, with or without a functional door or balcony.

 

I wonder how John Heald feels about the change? What did he say about it?

[patcruise1]

We are booked in a 4K on the Nov. 4th Journeys cruise on the Pride too. We did a Journeys cruise on the Pride in Jan. 2017 and were in a 4K cabin as well. It was nice to have the Full glass so you could see daylight and a little bit of a view.

 

But we never did open the door for fresh air. There WAS an upcharge for the 4K cabin.

 

On the Nov.4th cruise, we recvd an email offering an "upgrade" to a balcony for $400. Initially, we decided not to spend the extra money, but a day later we were considering it a little more seriously, but the offer had already been withdrawn.

 

I think we'll still have a great time on the cruise, with or without a functional door or balcony.

 

I wonder how John Heald feels about the change? What did he say about it?

 

You should be okay since the Pride doesn't go into dry dock until Feb/2019. They should still be French Doors. All the 4K are sold out at this time, so there is no description. For some reason they are trying to get this sailing sold out long before we even get to final payment. The OBC were crazy and the prices were falling everyday.

 

I haven't seen anything from John Heald, but I am sure others have.

[Krazyhardrocker]

You should be okay since the Pride doesn't go into dry dock until Feb/2019. They should still be French Doors. All the 4K are sold out at this time, so there is no description. For some reason they are trying to get this sailing sold out long before we even get to final payment. The OBC were crazy and the prices were falling everyday.

 

I haven't seen anything from John Heald, but I am sure others have.

 

I had some contact with John over the weekend. You can see the response below. Essentially, he says that the Carnival website has been changed. He pretty much refused to address the issue of people that booked before the change was made on the website.

 

[chengkp75]

 

I wish this site's resident expert on all things maritime would weigh in here. I was told that in an emergency event if the degree of list was severe enough that the boats could not be loaded with passengers from the promenade deck the boat station crew would direct passengers to the 4k cabins on main deck to evacuate the ship from there. I do not know this for fact but it does make me question why the " french " doors are there in the first place.

 

 

I saw your request on the other thread, and looked at this and wasn't going to post, as mostly it seems like a customer service issue. Then I found your post here. What you were told is not correct. With a ship listing, the boats on the low side would want to swing away from the ship at the promenade level, but are prevented from doing so by the "gripes" (no, not what passengers do at Guest Services) that are wires designed to hold the boat against the side of the ship if the ship is rolling (don't want the boat swinging out and back and smashing into the ship). Once loaded, the gripes are released, the boat swings a couple of feet away from the side of the ship and is lowered. If it is the "low" side, it merely gets to the water farther from the ship's hull than normal. The boats on the "high" side will naturally hang against the side of the ship at the promenade deck, without needing the gripes to hold it in. People can board normally. The problem with a ship listing is that the "high side" boats now have to slide down against the inclined side of the ship, with the boat tilting towards the ship, and could cause injury to people in the boat, or even tip the boat over, and if the ship is listing enough, they won't be able to go "around the corner" at the bilge (corner of ship side to bottom). The problem with lowering lifeboats when listing is not with the low side boats, it is with the high side boats, and trying to load the boat in the stowed position (up by the french door cabins) would have no effect on this. It is also very dangerous to lower a gravity davit like these with a fully loaded boat, as when that davit runs down to the corner of its track, the boat wants to swing away hard, and if there are people in there, they could be thrown out of the boat or injured. Besides, boats are designed to launch at listing angles up to 20*.

 

You will note that in the Concordia incident, the only boats not launched were on the high side (and 23 of 26 boats were successfully launched).

 

I have no idea why they put those doors there in the first place.

[sanmarcosman]

Thanks as always for weighing in here.

[jwjax]

I saw your request on the other thread, and looked at this and wasn't going to post, as mostly it seems like a customer service issue. Then I found your post here. What you were told is not correct. With a ship listing, the boats on the low side would want to swing away from the ship at the promenade level, but are prevented from doing so by the "gripes" (no, not what passengers do at Guest Services) that are wires designed to hold the boat against the side of the ship if the ship is rolling (don't want the boat swinging out and back and smashing into the ship). Once loaded, the gripes are released, the boat swings a couple of feet away from the side of the ship and is lowered. If it is the "low" side, it merely gets to the water farther from the ship's hull than normal. The boats on the "high" side will naturally hang against the side of the ship at the promenade deck, without needing the gripes to hold it in. People can board normally. The problem with a ship listing is that the "high side" boats now have to slide down against the inclined side of the ship, with the boat tilting towards the ship, and could cause injury to people in the boat, or even tip the boat over, and if the ship is listing enough, they won't be able to go "around the corner" at the bilge (corner of ship side to bottom). The problem with lowering lifeboats when listing is not with the low side boats, it is with the high side boats, and trying to load the boat in the stowed position (up by the french door cabins) would have no effect on this. It is also very dangerous to lower a gravity davit like these with a fully loaded boat, as when that davit runs down to the corner of its track, the boat wants to swing away hard, and if there are people in there, they could be thrown out of the boat or injured. Besides, boats are designed to launch at listing angles up to 20*.

 

You will note that in the Concordia incident, the only boats not launched were on the high side (and 23 of 26 boats were successfully launched).

 

I have no idea why they put those doors there in the first place.

 

Where did you get all this "experience".....??:confused::confused: