Child's Last Name Doesnt Match Moms

[Joseph2017China]

18 minutes ago, Grenouille21 said:

 

You are missing my point completely.  Having a different last name than my children does not necessarily mean I am divorced from their father.  Having to bring divorce papers to prove that I can take my children on vacation is like saying you need to bring your marriage certificate to share a room with your spouse.  It is antiquated and misogynistic.  If people really believe that different last name = divorce in this day and age, then you just aren't going to understand my argument.  

 

And my bad, I thought my maiden name was on their passports but I was mistaken.  

It sounds like you might have some issues with people.....this is not about your name, or your kid's name.  It is about the security of your kid, and a simple act of proving you are the parent, and not a kidnapper.  Some countries that the cruise line goes to, might require you being married to do certain things together......but that is a different topic altogether.

 

For the poster, generally speaking it is a simple question.  Your do not always need extra documents, but when you go through security, you possible might need it.  So just to be safe, bring it.  It's that simple.  Just make a copy of it, tuck it away in your carryon.  Motto is always prepare for the worse, and enjoy your trip.

[Kerry's Girls]

12 hours ago, Grenouille21 said:

 

  Having to bring divorce papers to prove that I can take my children on vacation is like saying you need to bring your marriage certificate to share a room with your spouse.  It is antiquated and misogynistic. 

Non-custodial kidnapping is a horrific possibility for a lot of families.  I have been asked many, many times to prove I'm the parent and I'm allowed to travel with my own children, and I never mind.   Having a "chain of title" to prove the children are mine and that I am the sole or custodial parent (or have notarized permission from the shared parent) is common when crossing borders.  If there are two parents on the birth certificate and only one is travelling, proof of permission is necessary whether it's the father or mother.   It doesn't happen most of the time, but it should.  I don't find it offensive that immigration needs to see marriage/divorce/custodial paperwork to make sure who is travelling and that a non-custodial parent isn't taking off with the kids - there's no way they can know if they don't check. What would be antiquated would be assuming that because the mother is on the birth certificate, she is allowed to leave the country with her kids.  

   

[cruisinsince2000]

In my cruise documents from October it stated if the child has a different last name you needed a passport and birth certificate for the child. This rule was also listed on their website. Since then it has been deleted from the cruise documents. I noticed it is not in our documents for a cruise we go on in 2 weeks and the question no longer pops up on Royals FAQ page either. So it seems you would just need to bring the same documents if you did share the same last name, just a birth certificate.  I have my daughters passport but when we board I am going to see if I can just use her birth certificate. 

Edited May 2, 2019 by cruisinsince2000

[cruisinsince2000]

My husband and I both have children from previous relationships. His daughter shares his last name but my daughter does not. It wouldn’t be fair that he wouldn’t need to get additional documents but I do. Birth certificate shows I’m her mother. 

[cakerbaker]

3 hours ago, Kerry's Girls said:

Non-custodial kidnapping is a horrific possibility for a lot of families.  I have been asked many, many times to prove I'm the parent and I'm allowed to travel with my own children, and I never mind.   Having a "chain of title" to prove the children are mine and that I am the sole or custodial parent (or have notarized permission from the shared parent) is common when crossing borders.  If there are two parents on the birth certificate and only one is travelling, proof of permission is necessary whether it's the father or mother.   It doesn't happen most of the time, but it should.  I don't find it offensive that immigration needs to see marriage/divorce/custodial paperwork to make sure who is travelling and that a non-custodial parent isn't taking off with the kids - there's no way they can know if they don't check. What would be antiquated would be assuming that because the mother is on the birth certificate, she is allowed to leave the country with her kids.  

   

 

It's interesting though isn't it?  The assumption that a mother with a different surname to her child is seen as a possible risk? Does a father, with the same name as his children, who is travelling alone with them need to provide some kind of permission from the mother? Are they a risk for parental kidnapping? Does a mother, with the same name as her children also need to provide this? What is the difference between different surnames or whether it's the mother or father?  Different rules for all? Why?

 

What about situations where there is actual risk to safety - where one parent is at physical/psychological risk from the other parent, do they need to get permission to take their child on holiday? Clearly this is not ok or possible.  The cruise line has no authority to know about these situations. 

 

So long as the cruise line is checking passport/birth certificate (for both parents, not just mums!) that's all they can do.  Surely, it's outside their jurisdiction to actually police this.  All they can do is the surface-level checking.  They have no business finding out about various individual situations.  Some situations mean that 'parent permission slips' from the other parent simply are not possible, and people in these situations are already vulnerable, why make them even more so?

 

 

Edited May 2, 2019 by cakerbaker
typo

[brillohead]

I think that the passport is the biggest issue here. 

Both parents have to agree to a child getting a passport, unless the court says otherwise (like a parent who is not in the picture at all, or who has lost parental rights to the child).  A child who has a passport either has the permission of both parents to travel out of the country, or the permission of the court to travel out of the country.  

I've traveled out of the country with my son's teenaged GF a few different times now.  We have totally different names and look NOTHING alike.  While I've always had a notarized letter from her mother giving me permission to leave the country with the child, I've never been asked for anything -- not by Royal's agents at check-in, and not by Border Patrol when leaving/entering a country.  I believe that this is due to the fact that she has a passport.  

Even if they falsely assume I'm her mom but divorced / remarried / whatever and so have a different name, the situation doesn't raise any suspicions because 1) she's not fighting and screaming that I'm not her mother, and 2) she has a passport, which means both parents signed off on her ability to leave the country.

[brillohead]

I've also cruised multiple times with my son without his father (same last name).  I always had a notarized letter from his father, but never was asked to present it.  Again, he had a passport, which his father had to be present for in order for him to apply for one.

[waterbug123]

On 5/1/2019 at 7:49 AM, Grenouille21 said:

 

You are missing my point completely.  Having a different last name than my children does not necessarily mean I am divorced from their father.  Having to bring divorce papers to prove that I can take my children on vacation is like saying you need to bring your marriage certificate to share a room with your spouse.  It is antiquated and misogynistic.

 

Correct, having a different last name from your children doesn't mean you are divorced from their father.  But it makes it less certain that they are your children.  Think it antiquated and misogynistic if you like, but the cruiseline has a responsibility to ensure that someone boarding with a child has the legal right to board with that child.  And unfortunately, they can't just accept someone's word that "yes, this is my child and yes I have permission from the child's other parent to take him/her out of the country."

[MNelson486]

I have a different last name from my children - just because I never changed mine.  My husband and I have travelled out of the country (cruises, land crossing to Canada, and flights to Europe).  We have never been asked to prove that we had the permission of the other parent, but we always made sure we were prepared in case someone asked.

 

Since we are actually married, we created a notarized form (which can be found on the internet) that gave each other permission to take the child out of the country.  We went to the bank and had it notarized.  It is much better to have that form and not need it, then stress out about missing the adventure of a lifetime!

 

Good luck!

 

[Kerry's Girls]

13 hours ago, cakerbaker said:

 

It's interesting though isn't it?  The assumption that a mother with a different surname to her child is seen as a possible risk? Does a father, with the same name as his children, who is travelling alone with them need to provide some kind of permission from the mother?

 

Yes.  Any parent, no matter the gender, crossing a border alone must be prepared to show that either they are the sole parent or they are allowed/have permission to leave the country with the child.   Unless the child only has one parent on the birth certificate.   And yes, mothers with the same surname need to show proof as well.  I have the same name as my children, but  since we do not travel with their father, I must show why I'm allowed - which is fine with me if it saves another parent from losing their child to a non-custodial parent.

13 hours ago, cakerbaker said:

 

 They have no business finding out about various individual situations.  Some situations mean that 'parent permission slips' from the other parent simply are not possible, and people in these situations are already vulnerable, why make them even more so?

 

13 hours ago, cakerbaker said:

 

 

 

 You're right, some situations make this really difficult, having to get legal paperwork showing sole custody or allowance to travel, but it's still required.   None of the their business doesn't really fly - and they don't care about the circumstances - they just want to see legal permission.  How else can they stop non-custodial kidnapping?   You're right, it is sad there's an extra legal cost for some parents.  

[kittykitty576]

I have traveled with my child, who has a different last name.  My last name is also different from my husband's.  I take documents, as other people suggest, to avoid potential problems.

 

The other thing that I do is TAKE A PICTURE OF ALL 3 PASSPORTS TOGETHER and make sure that photo is on all of our phones.  In the case we are separated in another country, it demonstrates that we are all traveling together.

[YamahaRyoko]

We raise our nephew as legal guardians.

His mother is disabled and has full legal custody.

We do not need dad's permission.

 

We take his birth cert (in lieu of a passport since he's 15 and dad won't sign)

The custody papers

A notarized permission form from his mother (generic templates available online)

My wife's power of attorney 

 

On Freedom they checked the notarized form, the power of attorney and the custody papers.

On Allure they only checked the permission form.

Both checked his birth cert of course in lieu of a passport.

 

He turns 16 this year and a passport will replace his birth cert.

 

It seems fair to say that each sailing you're going to get a different clerk who will look for different things.  There's no one real answer except to cover yourself.  The website says one thing,  phone support says another, and then requirements in person vary.  We never received a bullet proof answer.

 

>>Both answers said she would not need a consent form from the ex.

 

Here's the thing.  If they have shared or joint custody then the permission form for a minor is dictated by US and state laws, barring any agreements in the custody order.  Its not an Royal Caribbean rule;  its a legal / custody / border rule.  For this reason,  Royal Caribbean doesn't always give consistent answers and shouldn't be the advisory on such matters.  You're traveling out of the country with children from another parent so its the laws that matter.  If you have full custody then you generally do not need permission from the other parent.

 

Edited May 2, 2019 by YamahaRyoko

[brillohead]

1 hour ago, YamahaRyoko said:

We raise our nephew as legal guardians.

His mother is disabled and has full legal custody.

We do not need dad's permission.

 

We take his birth cert (in lieu of a passport since he's 15 and dad won't sign)

I know you said you're getting the passport this year, but just pointing out that the dad doesn't have to sign if the mom has full legal custody.   

Details are listed on the State Department Website.

 

 

[waterbug123]

13 hours ago, YamahaRyoko said:

We raise our nephew as legal guardians.

His mother is disabled and has full legal custody.

We do not need dad's permission.

 

We take his birth cert (in lieu of a passport since he's 15 and dad won't sign)

 

 

If mom has full legal custody, dad does not need to give permission to get him a passport.  There's also an allowance for a parent to get a kid a passport if the other parent who technically still has shared/joint custody simply can't be found or contacted to sign, and/or is willing to sign but can't be present as required.

[kimteeth]

This exact situation happened to us several years ago. Traveling with my  then 17 yo daughter with a different last name. The first document they asked for was the birth certificate, which we did not have with us, we only had a passport. The birth certificate would not have matched either because my last name was different then than it is now. So we were able to call her father and he had to immediately fax a letter and a copy of his drivers license to RC. As soon as they received those documents they let us board. Thank god we go to the cruise port early because that took an hour with a lot of anxiety and tears. So get a certified letter ahead of time with your child’s passport to be safe.