Who gets the tips if I don't drink $109 in booze per day?

[New2cruise2022]

On 12/9/2022 at 8:17 AM, graphicguy said:

I see these types of threads and wonder if some are looking for ways to lower their fares.  If you really want to do that, don’t buy the drinks or the packages.  Don’t buy the Specialty Dining packages.  Don’t go to the casino.  Don’t go on the excursions.  There’s dozens of ways one can bring down their cost of their cruise that are way more effective and way more meaningful financially, than to succumb to the incessant whining about each little nickel they can’t explain.

 

It’s like the people who take the cheap/free airfare and then whine that the flights aren’t to their liking.  There’s one way for certain to fix that….book your own flights.

To your own point, how is a consumer removing the DSC any different than a consumer booking their own flight or removing the drink package? They have just chosen to remove one of the variable costs. 

[KeithJenner]

11 minutes ago, New2cruise2022 said:

To your own point, how is a consumer removing the DSC any different than a consumer booking their own flight or removing the drink package? They have just chosen to remove one of the variable costs. 

If someone books their own flights then they don't get flights from NCL. If they remove the drinks package then they don't get the drinks from NCL. If they remove the DSC then they still get exactly the same from NCL as they would have otherwise.

 

Seems a fairly obvious difference to me.

[graphicguy]

35 minutes ago, New2cruise2022 said:

To your own point, how is a consumer removing the DSC any different than a consumer booking their own flight or removing the drink package? They have just chosen to remove one of the variable costs. 

I think that’s a great idea. I always book my own flights.  You don’t pay for the drinks, you don’t get the drinks.

 

You remove the DSC, you don’t get fresh towels and linens.  Your cabin doesn’t get cleaned.  You don’t dine in the MDRs for sit down meal service.  

 

That means the rest of us will get better service.

 

I like it!!!!

[New2cruise2022]

19 minutes ago, graphicguy said:

I think that’s a great idea. I always book my own flights.  You don’t pay for the drinks, you don’t get the drinks.

 

You remove the DSC, you don’t get fresh towels and linens.  Your cabin doesn’t get cleaned.  You don’t dine in the MDRs for sit down meal service.  

 

That means the rest of us will get better service.

 

I like it!!!!

If the terms were written as such, I would be inclined to agree with you. But they aren’t. Nothing in the DSC says that towels and linens are linked to this fee. It is a removable and adjustable fee without any stipulation about removing services. But we can assume in your world that it works that way. 

[New2cruise2022]

47 minutes ago, KeithJenner said:

If someone books their own flights then they don't get flights from NCL. If they remove the drinks package then they don't get the drinks from NCL. If they remove the DSC then they still get exactly the same from NCL as they would have otherwise.

 

Seems a fairly obvious difference to me.

You made my point for me. There is no change in the service I receive if I remove the DSC. 

[KeithJenner]

7 minutes ago, New2cruise2022 said:

You made my point for me. There is no change in the service I receive if I remove the DSC. 

Just to be clear, I wasn't attempting to make (or not make) anyones point. I was just answering your question.

 

I'm just dipping into this thread for entertainment, and just skim reading posts, so still don't really know (or care) what your point is.

[New2cruise2022]

3 minutes ago, KeithJenner said:

Just to be clear, I wasn't attempting to make (or not make) anyones point. I was just answering your question.

 

I'm just dipping into this thread for entertainment, and just skim reading posts, so still don't really know (or care) what your point is.

@KeithJenner is not making any points. I think we are all here for entertainment. I don’t think there is agenda driving here with any expected outcome other than entertainment. 

[KeithJenner]

3 minutes ago, New2cruise2022 said:

@KeithJenner is not making any points. I think we are all here for entertainment. I don’t think there is agenda driving here with any expected outcome other than entertainment. 

But tipping threads on here are particularly entertaining. There are regular participants on them who I don't think realise how entertaining we find them.

 

It isn't the arguments that entertain me, it's the way they are presented. Some of it is comedy gold.

[New2cruise2022]

1 minute ago, KeithJenner said:

But tipping threads on here are particularly entertaining. There are regular participants on them who I don't think realise how entertaining we find them.

 

It isn't the arguments that entertain me, it's the way they are presented. Some of it is comedy gold.

I agree that it is entertaining. And the sheer volume of comments is nod to the comedic value. When people are onboard without the CC community watching, they will tip or they won’t. They will pay DSC or they won’t. I imagine some are very true to the representation you read in the threads and others deviate when their partner or spouse nudges them to leave a tip or pay tue DSC. That’s the true comedy we will never know as a fly on the wall. 

[New2cruise2022]

3 minutes ago, KeithJenner said:

But tipping threads on here are particularly entertaining. There are regular participants on them who I don't think realise how entertaining we find them.

 

It isn't the arguments that entertain me, it's the way they are presented. Some of it is comedy gold.

[MoCruiseFan]

2 hours ago, DaCruiseBug said:

 

It literally states that on the NCL website.

 

It literally says "by a combination of salary AND INCENTIVE PROGRAMS THAT YOUR SERVICE CHARGE SUPPORTS."  (Caps aded for clarity)

That means they get a salary AND they get a an incentive program that is supported by the DSC.  EXACTLY what you underlined.

 

[IronRobi]

On 12/10/2022 at 12:17 PM, bortman23 said:

 

But that's not exactly what's happening (if we're to believe some people on here).

It's not about believing some people on here or not. It's in black and white in your cruise contract as well as on the NCL website. It funds their salary, an incentive program, and a company-wide wellness program. What percentage goes where, and what exactly the incentive program entails is all that's left for speculation. 

 

6 hours ago, MoCruiseFan said:

 

Please provide us with anything that supports your OPINION that NCL does this.  I have yet to see it.  

This is not an opinion. See the link below, or the image pasted above.

 

IMPORTANT NOTICE: Guests are advised to carefully read the terms and conditions of the Guest Ticket Contract set forth below which affect your legal rights and are binding (ncl.com)

Section 3(C) of your cruise contract.

 

(c) Service Charges: Certain members of Carrier’s crew are compensated by a combination of salary and incentive programs that are funded in part by the service charge paid by each Guest. The charge , which is automatically added to your onboard account and subject to adjustment at your discretion, is intended to reward service provided in all departments and job categories and is distributed to employees 07/2011 according to Carrier's evaluation of job performance. A portion of the service charge collected by Carrier is also used for fleet-wide crew welfare programs.

[New2cruise2022]

1 minute ago, IronRobi said:

which is automatically added to your onboard account and subject to adjustment at your discretion

This is the language that fuels these discussions. “at your discretion” implies a reason is not needed to adjust. 

[IronRobi]

4 hours ago, MoCruiseFan said:

It literally says "by a combination of salary AND INCENTIVE PROGRAMS THAT YOUR SERVICE CHARGE SUPPORTS."  (Caps aded for clarity)

That means they get a salary AND they get a an incentive program that is supported by the DSC.  EXACTLY what you underlined.

 

Are you seriously choosing to ignore the fact that it also says SALARY and incentive programs THAT YOUR SERVICE CHARGE SUPPORTS.

 

This is exactly what I've been saying is wrong with this situation. If the DSC is a tip, why the hell is it supporting paying their salary?

[IronRobi]

1 minute ago, New2cruise2022 said:

This is the language that fuels these discussions. “at your discretion” implies a reason is not needed to adjust. 

It's really not needed. You can just request they be removed and no need to even tell them why. They won't shame you, make you feel bad, or even question it any further. Your fellow cruisecritic members though..... prepare to be made to feel like you just committed mass murder.

[New2cruise2022]

Just now, IronRobi said:

It's really not needed. You can just request they be removed and no need to even tell them why. They won't shame you, make you feel bad, or even question it any further. Your fellow cruisecritic members though..... prepare to be made to feel like you just committed mass murder.

The community shaming is interesting, though unsurprising. Could you imagine if there was a clause like this in your contract when you bought a car and dealer fees could be adjusted at the buyer’s discretion? Would anyone choose to keep them? Would they be shamed for removing them? I’m guessing not. 

[bortman23]

1 hour ago, IronRobi said:

Are you seriously choosing to ignore the fact that it also says SALARY and incentive programs THAT YOUR SERVICE CHARGE SUPPORTS

 

Its actually not clear if they DSC funds the incentive program AND the salary or the incentive program in addition to their salary.

 

"...compensated by a combination of salary and incentive programs that are funded in part by the service charge"

 

That sentence could mean the DSC funds the incentive program on top of salary, or both the incentive program and the salary. 

 

1 hour ago, IronRobi said:

It's not about believing some people on here or no

 

That was in reference to the individual's server/tip example, not the DSC verbiage.

[IronRobi]

11 hours ago, bortman23 said:

 

Its actually not clear if they DSC funds the incentive program AND the salary or the incentive program in addition to their salary.

The use of "are" suggests both salary and incentive programs.

[graphicguy]

Every once in a while, someone comes along here at CC and states..."I'm removing the DSC....I'll just tip in cash as I see fit (they usually don't)....The DSC is bogus.....I don't drink (sarcasm)...I don't eat (more sarcasm)...crew doesn't deserve my tips/DSC....cruise line is hiding my tips/DSC...."  It goes on and on.

 

it's not only on NCL I see this.  I see it on all the cruise lines' threads.  They always pop up every once in a while in all threads.

 

I'm one who looks at the total out of pocket for the total cost of my cruise.  It's not just the fare, it's the DSC...it's the tips...it's the transport to and from the pier...it's the excursions...etc.  If that total number is not to my liking, I don't book that cruise.

 

If my total out of pocket was listed as $1,000 DSC but the cruise was free.  That's what I'm spending, regardless of what you want to call it.

 

Some just look at the fare, and think..."well, that's all I have to pay".  Not sure if it's their first cruise, or they just don't cruise a lot.  But, they always seem surprised.

 

If you're going to remove the DSC, be sure to tell the steward who takes care of your cabin, the bartenders getting your drinks, the waitstaff in the restaurants, etc that you're removing it from your bill because you don't like the cruise line's nomenclature or how they describe the DSC.  See what they think of you for letting them know no matter how good they treat you, or how good their service is, you're not going to pay the DSC.  Don't just whine here.  We can't help you with your decision. Tell those who will be most affected.

 

 

 

 

 

[RocketMan275]

On 12/7/2022 at 3:29 AM, zzdoug said:

The Free-at-Sea liquor package charges me gratuities on estimated $109 value per day, or about $21. Suppose I only drink $30 worth of drinks per day.  Does the full $21 go to the bar staff anyway? Or does the bar staff collect 20% x $30 = $6 and the rest goes to management?

It makes as much sense to ask 'what happens to the other $79 worth of drinks you didn't drink.  Does the captain get those drinks?  Do they pour those drinks over the side?  Ask why don't you get a refund?

[DaCruiseBug]

1 hour ago, graphicguy said:

Every once in a while, someone comes along here at CC and states..."I'm removing the DSC....I'll just tip in cash as I see fit (they usually don't)...

 

If you're going to remove the DSC, be sure to tell the steward who takes care of your cabin, the bartenders getting your drinks, the waitstaff in the restaurants, etc that you're removing it from your bill because you don't like the cruise line's nomenclature or how they describe the DSC.  See what they think of you for letting them know no matter how good they treat you, or how good their service is, you're not going to pay the DSC.  Don't just whine here.  We can't help you with your decision. Tell those who will be most affected.

 

 

 

 

 

 

1. How do you know that someone who says they're removing the DSC in order to tip cash doesn't actually do that? Do you follow people around 24/7 while on the ship? Seems to me like you're making a lot of assumptions.

 

2. Way to try and guilt other cruisers into doing what you do. If the DSC isn't mandatory and can be removed then why should you have to go and tell each crew member that you're not paying DSC? I thought it's your choice to do as you please and cruise how you please? Oh wait...that doesn't apply when someone does differently does it?

[MoCruiseFan]

3 hours ago, IronRobi said:

The use of "are" suggests both salary and incentive programs.

Not at all, it says incentive "PROGRAMS" which is plural ergo are is exactly correct and my post is 100% correct.

[RocketMan275]

2 minutes ago, DaCruiseBug said:

 

1. How do you know that someone who says they're removing the DSC in order to tip cash doesn't actually do that? Do you follow people around 24/7 while on the ship? Seems to me like you're making a lot of assumptions.

 

2. Way to try and guilt other cruisers into doing what you do. If the DSC isn't mandatory and can be removed then why should you have to go and tell each crew member that you're not paying DSC? I thought it's your choice to do as you please and cruise how you please? Oh wait...that doesn't apply when someone does differently does it?

There have been multiple reports of people removing the DSC in order to save themselves that amount of cash.  Besides, I've yet to see many passengers providing cash tips to waiters in the buffet, those working in the laundry, etc., etc.

If you remove the DSC, then you should be proud enough to ensure those affected by that action are aware that you're making a principled statement to improve the way the cruise line treats employees.

[MoCruiseFan]

14 hours ago, bortman23 said:

 

"...compensated by a combination of salary and incentive programs that are funded in part by the service charge"

 

That sentence could mean the DSC funds the incentive program on top of salary, or both the incentive program and the salary. 

 

Not the way it is written and punctuated.

[MoCruiseFan]

15 hours ago, IronRobi said:

Are you seriously choosing to ignore the fact that it also says SALARY and incentive programs THAT YOUR SERVICE CHARGE SUPPORTS.

 

This is exactly what I've been saying is wrong with this situation. If the DSC is a tip, why the hell is it supporting paying their salary?

You are ignoring the way the sentence is written and punctuated.  It states the the employees are "compensated by a combination of salary AND incentive programs that are funded in part by the service charge", two separate means of compensation "salary" AND "incentive programs that are funded in part by the DSC".  Ergo the sentence in no way says that the DSC pays salaries.