Villa Vie Residences

[walkingsoon]

"A woman named Jenny- posted today on youtubes sites- including the one labeled "Scam Life At Sea Villa Vie" about her experience. "

Don't disbelieve, but can't find. Can you post a link? All I see on You tube are the usual puff pieces fed to the press, the few upbeat vloggers and only one critical older video by a Saudi lawyer expressing doubts. They do seem to get nice treatment from the press.

[Travel_Around_The_World]

1 hour ago, rebeccalouiseagain said:

A woman named Jenny- posted today on youtubes sites- including the one labeled "Scam Life At Sea Villa Vie" about her experience.  

"Villa Vie terminated my 3 1/2 year contract claiming I was creating a negative environment for the residence, they've provided no proof of this and a large number of the residents claimed otherwise. It was abrupt and unexpected and I now have nowhere to live as I was expecting to live on the ship for a minimum of three and a half years, this is also happened after I have been waiting in Belfast since May for this Voyage to begin. I am looking for legal representation"

 

Clearly they made an example out of her- so the other passengers are going to be fearful of speaking out.  Jenny has waited six weeks now for her cruise refund and even though passengers were given a Per Diem- apparently Jenny and others have NOT been reimbursed for those per diems. So if a passenger has been paying out of pocket for these 100 plus days- figure the passengers have spent a minimum of 10K on out of pocket living expenses (all of which was promised by VVR but will never be refunded IMO)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Pretty sure there are a lot of disgruntled passengers. Considering they have "hundreds of residents" and you only hear or read from the same 5 or 6 which is more than just suspicious. 

But knowing the couple in charge I can see them strong arming disgruntled passengers. 

 

[MacMadame]

3 hours ago, walkingsoon said:

Are the bloggers and vloggers really getting better treatment than the more reserved folk? A

The ones I follow aren't even waiting for the ship. They were only going on for a segment and just postponed their cruise until later on in the year.

[VL1]

This is a scam.  I am more convinced every day that they were simply under capitalized.  Canceling a contract because of "negative" atmosphere.  Time for a lawyer.

[couldbeswell]

12 hours ago, rebeccalouiseagain said:

A woman named Jenny- posted today on youtubes sites- including the one labeled "Scam Life At Sea Villa Vie" about her experience.  

"Villa Vie terminated my 3 1/2 year contract claiming I was creating a negative environment for the residence, they've provided no proof of this and a large number of the residents claimed otherwise. It was abrupt and unexpected and I now have nowhere to live as I was expecting to live on the ship for a minimum of three and a half years, this is also happened after I have been waiting in Belfast since May for this Voyage to begin. I am looking for legal representation"

 

Clearly they made an example out of her- so the other passengers are going to be fearful of speaking out.  Jenny has waited six weeks now for her cruise refund and even though passengers were given a Per Diem- apparently Jenny and others have NOT been reimbursed for those per diems. So if a passenger has been paying out of pocket for these 100 plus days- figure the passengers have spent a minimum of 10K on out of pocket living expenses (all of which was promised by VVR but will never be refunded IMO)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is a bit misleading -- @JennyatSea left the above as a comment on this YT video. She has not posted any content since joining YT last year.

 

[rebeccalouiseagain]

Another link from GMA (about 3 year cruise passengers stranded in Belfast)

Jenny says

"I was one of the stupid paid customers who intended to live on this ship for 3 and 1/2 years if not indefinitely. I flew to Europe to be ready to embark on May 15th when it was supposed to start. After waiting through numerous delays week after week, being shuffled to many different hotels and even having to stay in student dorms as a senior citizen, eating fast food for months at severely affected my health, this company abruptly and without notice terminated my 3 1/2 year contract to live on the ship based on the fact that they said I was creating a negative environment for the residents. I have never expressed any negativity and a public environment or media outlet, but was having personal private chats with residents only. I had most definitely expressed my unhappiness with three months worth of delays and waiting overseas, with drastic changes to the original itinerary sold on the website, and with changes to the all-inclusive package I was sold. These complaints were used as the basis for terminating my contract, I am unable to comment on the legality of that at this point. I was left in Belfast to find my own way home at my own expense and to this date , 6 weeks after termination my money has not been refunded."

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[Travel_Around_The_World]

So, sea trials are over? When is the launch date? 😆

 

[rebeccalouiseagain]

They are making an announcement tomorrow.  

[Travel_Around_The_World]

46 minutes ago, rebeccalouiseagain said:

They are making an announcement tomorrow.  

Well, we'll see. 

[sandiego1]

Only Founders signed NDAs, not all cruisers.

[Travel_Around_The_World]

6 hours ago, sandiego1 said:

Only Founders signed NDAs, not all cruisers.

Like the original residents? Or management?

[rebeccalouiseagain]

1 hour ago, Travel_Around_The_World said:

Like the original residents? Or management?

In the Terms and Condition section (bottom of VVR website)- it discusses "Residents".  The people who purchased cabins, versus buying the 3.5 world cruise or segments.  These people - about 100 of them are owners.  They call themselves "founders".  Really this is a very cult like mentality that they and their grand master, Mike Pettersen, are all in this "first ever" enterprise together.  Mike has convinced them that all these false starts and repairs are typical of a "start up".  The founders have a lot to lose if this fails to launch.  Most have paid in full for their cabins- anywhere from $100k-900K.  So it's in their best interest to stay positive and promote the ship- otherwise no one will book passage.  Mike needs to fill the ship with segment passengers for this to be viable.  Even then- my math says it's not sustainable.  It's a ponzi IMO.

[Travel_Around_The_World]

1 hour ago, rebeccalouiseagain said:

In the Terms and Condition section (bottom of VVR website)- it discusses "Residents".  The people who purchased cabins, versus buying the 3.5 world cruise or segments.  These people - about 100 of them are owners.  They call themselves "founders".  Really this is a very cult like mentality that they and their grand master, Mike Pettersen, are all in this "first ever" enterprise together.  Mike has convinced them that all these false starts and repairs are typical of a "start up".  The founders have a lot to lose if this fails to launch.  Most have paid in full for their cabins- anywhere from $100k-900K.  So it's in their best interest to stay positive and promote the ship- otherwise no one will book passage.  Mike needs to fill the ship with segment passengers for this to be viable.  Even then- my math says it's not sustainable.  It's a ponzi IMO.

Now it all makes sense.

 

Have I missed the big launch date announcement today? 😝

[rebeccalouiseagain]

There is a wonderful Sea Trial promotional video produced by VVR.  Gotta say- being out on the beautiful water is exactly why people book cruises in the first place- so it was definitely well done and exciting.  Having said that- they don't say that it "passed" but that's being bandied about.  Hopefully the ship is in good shape at this point.  I like these people and want them to have their cruise. So I am glad that they are feeling confident.  Still- until they have been told that they can sleep onboard- I'd be wondering what is left to do before setting sail.  I know they have to have things signed off on but what that entails- I'm not clear on.

[chengkp75]

They will have to provision the ship, take on fresh water, and bunker fuel.  As noted, there is a lot to "sign off on".  From the DNV class database, there were 25 "conditions of class" (items that had to be repaired before certificates are issued), outside of any that were found while in Harland and Wolff.  While it is not uncommon for all the reports to be filed at once, and for the online database to not be updated in timely manner, the fact that these conditions of class are not cleared may indicate some delay while things are finalized.

 

Actually, the video I saw states that the sea trials were completed successfully (but that does not mean everything is fixed).  But, dolphins and standing on a balcony have nothing to do with whether the ship meets class standards.

[rebeccalouiseagain]

That's true

[Travel_Around_The_World]

According to this article they hope for a certification by Monday or Tuesday. 

CNN Article: They were due to leave for their dream cruise in May. Three months on they’re still stuck at the departure port

The article is a mix between earlier info and latest info and a full fledged blame game by M Petterson. That was to be expected. Again, if they would have done their due dilligence all of it could have been avoided. 

 

A spokesperson for DNV said that it does not comment on individual clients’ cases. Samantha Stimpson, CEO of Fred. Olsen Cruise Lines, told CNN:

“We enjoyed many happy years of sailing with this ship, and completed thorough and regular maintenance throughout her operational time. She was in lay up during the pandemic.

“Prior to the sale, the ship was subject to a full and independent survey and technical inspections by the team at Villa Vie.

“We wish Villa Vie every success in their upcoming venture with this wonderful ship.”

Maybe that inspection team from Villa Vie was utterly clueless. You always hiree a third party who has the experince in ship inspections. 

And what I have said earlier there is probably some benefit to become the marketing voice for Villa View:

The couple have also been upgraded from an interior room to an ocean view, which has likely helped their mood. They’ve started a YouTube page to document their journey, as have Canen and Bodin.

 

Edited September 7 by Travel_Around_The_World
changed link description

[chengkp75]

Most of what the CEO is saying is pure bollocks.  The ship is not being held to the standards of a new ship, no ship is held to standards past after the ship was built.  The ship is being held to the standard of a ship new to DNV registry.  As for Fred Olsen not providing maintenance history documentation, that was up to Villa Vie to require, and obtain, at sale.  They obviously didn't know about this, and now the ship is no longer of any concern to Fred Olsen, so they have no obligation to retain, let alone provide the maintenance records.  When the ship went into long term layup, of course Fred Olsen let the certificates expire, otherwise they would have had to continue maintenance (most is time based, not running hour based) and pay for continued surveys by DNV.  What Villa Vie should have required, as a condition of sale, was for Fred Olsen to provide up to date DNV certification.  This is pretty standard, and in many cases a buyer will require a dry docking prior to sale, if one has been postponed by the seller, or one is due within months of sale, at the seller's cost.  It appears that Villa Vie was so desperate for any ship to buy that they agreed to whatever Fred Olsen wanted.

 

"Boy, have I learned a lot", is not something a CEO of a startup shipping company should be saying when it comes to the maintenance, condition, or survey status of their one and only ship.

[Travel_Around_The_World]

20 hours ago, rebeccalouiseagain said:

There is a wonderful Sea Trial promotional video produced by VVR.  Gotta say- being out on the beautiful water is exactly why people book cruises in the first place- so it was definitely well done and exciting.  Having said that- they don't say that it "passed" but that's being bandied about.  Hopefully the ship is in good shape at this point.  I like these people and want them to have their cruise. So I am glad that they are feeling confident.  Still- until they have been told that they can sleep onboard- I'd be wondering what is left to do before setting sail.  I know they have to have things signed off on but what that entails- I'm not clear on.

The comments are hillarious but of course controlling opinion is a big factor.
From the commeent section before it disappears....
 

@Lori-q7d

15 hours ago

Funny, I read a negative comment and then it magically disappears! Only the “everything is fine, nothing to see here” comments seem to survive the cut!

@Teacher659

15 hours ago

I just had two deleted, that concerned a party getting out of this and getting his money back. Censorship is only used to hide something bad.

@Lori-q7d

15 hours ago

I had one deleted as well! This ship is going no where. Bankruptcy by the end of the year is my opinion. The math just doesn’t work. Besides that, who in the world would get on a small, ancient, 31+ year old ship to face the wrath of Mother Nature for months on end? What happens if you have a medical emergency? How does that work and who pays? Seems like a total illusion!

@Teacher659

14 hours ago

 @Lori-q7d  we live within 45 minutes of a Florida Cruise port, we go on weekends to have lunch, a cocktail and wave them off. We go on Royal, Disney. This ship, looks like a bottom tier ship. They want no neg comments…censorship only benefits bad things

@justcreeky5483

11 hours ago

That's how it's been with Church of Mike since Life at Sea.1 - he or the cult will cut out any dissenting questions/ people.

The question I have goes to @chengkp75 who seems to know something about sea trials.
In the past most sea trials I have seen included tight turns, zick zack patterns and some kind of high speed/cruising speed runs. All I have seen (which I posted earlier) is a leisure spiral test pattern with a comfty speed of 6-10 knots and a casual return at 6-10knots to port. If they are considering this ship as a "new certification" after a 4-year lay up shouldn't they be a little tougher than a casual, cruising-like test. 

 

[chengkp75]

6 minutes ago, Travel_Around_The_World said:

The question I have goes to @chengkp75 who seems to know something about sea trials.
In the past most sea trials I have seen included tight turns, zick zack patterns and some kind of high speed/cruising speed runs. All I have seen (which I posted earlier) is a leisure spiral test pattern with a comfty speed of 6-10 knots and a casual return at 6-10knots to port. If they are considering this ship as a "new certification" after a 4-year lay up shouldn't they be a little tougher than a casual, cruising-like test.

Those types of sea trials are typically for newbuild ships, where the handling characteristics are not known.  This ship has a known handling characteristic, of speed, stopping, turning radius, etc, that is recorded on the "bridge card" of every ship so that the harbor pilot can know how the ship handles.  Unless there are major modifications or changes to the ship's propulsion or steering, there is no need for the speed, crash stop, or steering tests.  These were done for the Odyssey when she was lengthened, as this is a major modification, while not to propulsion or steering, to how those systems react to a new hull form.

 

What has been done to Odyssey are major repairs, and as such while requiring testing to confirm that the repairs are correct, and the equipment functions correctly, it does not require maximum effort testing.  With two engines on each propeller shaft, they could test the one engine that was repaired by operating it alone on that shaft, loading the engine to full load (so a maximum power test), but which would only have produced about 40% of the speed on that shaft.  To keep the vessel tracking well, they would reduce power on the other shaft, so I would not expect more than 40% speed if they were to test the engine this way.

 

Spent 46 years as a ship's engineer, mostly as Chief Engineer, so I know about shipyard repairs, class society surveys, and sea trials. 

[Travel_Around_The_World]

20 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Those types of sea trials are typically for newbuild ships, where the handling characteristics are not known.  This ship has a known handling characteristic, of speed, stopping, turning radius, etc, that is recorded on the "bridge card" of every ship so that the harbor pilot can know how the ship handles.  Unless there are major modifications or changes to the ship's propulsion or steering, there is no need for the speed, crash stop, or steering tests.  These were done for the Odyssey when she was lengthened, as this is a major modification, while not to propulsion or steering, to how those systems react to a new hull form.

 

What has been done to Odyssey are major repairs, and as such while requiring testing to confirm that the repairs are correct, and the equipment functions correctly, it does not require maximum effort testing.  With two engines on each propeller shaft, they could test the one engine that was repaired by operating it alone on that shaft, loading the engine to full load (so a maximum power test), but which would only have produced about 40% of the speed on that shaft.  To keep the vessel tracking well, they would reduce power on the other shaft, so I would not expect more than 40% speed if they were to test the engine this way.

 

Spent 46 years as a ship's engineer, mostly as Chief Engineer, so I know about shipyard repairs, class society surveys, and sea trials. 

Thanks so much. That was some great info.

[rebeccalouiseagain]

The sea trials were performed and the results are yet to be announced.  The DNV and VVR are not required to say whether they passed the sea trials but it's interesting that they nor passengers have stated that the ship passed the sea trials.  They just state the sea trials were successful.   That isn't saying "we passed with flying colors".  And VVR would brag about that if it was true. 

Edited September 7 by rebeccalouiseagain

[chengkp75]

26 minutes ago, rebeccalouiseagain said:

They just state the sea trials were successful.   That isn't saying "we passed with flying colors".  And VVR would brag about that if it was true. 

Saying that the trials were "successful" is the same as saying the ship "passed".  There is no "passing with flying colors", there is just pass/fail.  The CEO did note that there were a "couple" of what he calls "items" (which means they are "conditions of class") that still need to be finalized, I believe he mentioned crew training, so this may be things like fire drills or abandon ship drills, which need to be redone, to the surveyor's satisfaction, prior to the ship sailing.

[rebeccalouiseagain]

I stand corrected.  Mike lacks credibility.  So anything out of his mouth means nothing.  In fact, the opposite of what he says usually happens.  He said that the ship will have a "pet spa", " a golf simulator", "a golf pro shop" "a lap pool, combining the two smaller pools" "a culinary arts classroom" "luxury" "opulence" "refurbished villas"- that were advertised as much larger- all with new interiors and sofas.  None of those updates occurred and instead the cabins are small, circa 1993.  Even the hallways on the ship have 20 year old stained carpet.  Hideous.  He announced that the ship would be ready in "10 days" two months ago.  Every date he said the ship would sail was false.  

 

Edited September 7 by rebeccalouiseagain

[walkingsoon]

This from the CNN article:

 

"And anyone voicing doubts might have concerns about repercussions. Petterson says that as well as seven people canceling their trips, two have been booted off the cruise for making “negative statements” about Villa Vie to their fellow residents. The two passengers involved dispute this. One, Bonny Kelter, told CNN: “We had long-standing contracts and they were unilaterally canceled by Villa Vie Residences without warning.” Kelter, 66 – who says she was hoping to live on the ship “for the rest of my life” – has not yet been refunded, Petterson admitted."

 

I'm disgusted by this. The concept seemed attractive for a minute. Having slept for years on a bunk in a crowded berthing area, I was not put off by the apparent modesty of the staterooms or overall facility,  but I was probably going to reject it just on a risk vs reward basis. This idea that he's booting passengers off for "negative statements" along with censoring social media makes it a hard "no".

 

Good for CNN (haven't thought that for about twenty years) for actually reporting a bit of counterpoint. The bloggers and vloggers likewise seem to have only positive remarks to their posts, making me guess that they too are censoring, choosing sycophancy perhaps out of financial necessity.

 

Walkingsoon

 

edit: Thinking about it some more, I realize that it's not just Petterson. Are their fellow passengers not tattling on each other? As in:  "Mike, Mike... so and so just made negative comments!" Holy crap.

Edited September 7 by walkingsoon