Has This Happened to You in Dining Room?

[cruiseknots]

What's wrong Gator? Still haven't answered my question? I think your inablility to answer is answer enough.

[wraithe]

All I'm gonna say is that this goes along with the whole, "I don't care what you think, I'm gonna do what I want to" attititude that many folks show. It fits in with the jeans/t-shirts/shorts in the dining room issue, and the other "you can't tell me what to do" threads. It basically boils down to "you don't matter enough to me to do what's considered right". I dress up more, use my best manners, and watch my language (I am a retired US Navy Chief Petty Officer, use your imagination) when I'm on a cruise because I care enough about my fellow passengers and the great people who work on the ship to show, by example, that I do care about the people around me. The fact that a DVD is out of place, even for a 7 yo, in an upscale dining establishment, whether on a cruise ship or not, is the issue. If I didn't have enough of a handle on my kids (and I raised two) for them to make it through dinner without showing their behinds, then I wouldn't take them to the dining room. It's about more than "ME", if I couldn't figure out how to make the child behave through dinner without a prop, or make arrangements for him to be somewhere else during dinner, then I wouldn't go to the dining room. If your opinion differs, fine, this one is mine. I would let my kids color at Shoney's, but wouldn't have asked for crayons at Ruth's Chris, much less carry in a DVD player, with any movie.

 

To sum it up, when I'm cruising, I care enough about the rest of the people in the dining room to dress up, use my best manners, and my inside voice, and I would expect no less from my children.

 

Thanks for listening. Happy cruising!

[jerseygirl3]

It's really ashame that your grandmother had to use corporal punishment to teach her children to behave.

 

My sister and BIL just brought their 5-year-old twins on a cruise with us. They sat through dinner in the dining room every single night. They were mindful of manners, and weren't the least bit disruptive. The only night we didn't take them to dinner with us was when we went to the Supper Club. We felt that asking them to sit still for 3 hours AND pay $30 per child for a dinner that they couldn't really appreciate was asking too much.

 

When I was raising my children, we took them out to dinner frequently...not anything fancy when they were very young, but just enough to give them a taste of what was expected of them. I didn't need to pinch or hit my children in order to teach them manners.

 

It's a lot harder to discipline children but believe me, it pays off in the end. The lazy parents who don't pay the price later.

[texancruzer]

Last time I checked a 7 year old is in school....which means they must sit and behave themselves for longer than 2 hours at a time.....of course they are busy doing schoolwork etc... but then, are they not busy eating dinner ? Two hours would be long for a 3-4 yr old but 7 should be old enough to actually be part of the dinner conversation - at least we always tried to encourage our two kids to.

[SuzieQ123]

I agree its inappropriate, I haven't seen this on a ship yet but I did see it at my local TGI Fridays one night. You teach your kids how to behave in public and in restaurants, letting them watch a movie does not teach the reality of the situation. I too was taught at a very young age--you will behave in a setting like this--no questions asked. We were raised without the DVD player in the car, the plane, the ship. If your kids cannot behave for 1-2 hours for dinner, you have a bigger problem.

 

 

And yes I do have a Stepson whom I've raised since he was 8 years old and will be 17 next month and has cruised 6 times with us. Never had a problem with his table manners

[dougp26364]

While I agree that it's important to teach children manners, I have to say that when I was younger, I was never taken on a vacation such as a cruise. Those types of vacations were reserved as "parents only." Instead we'd go on a family vacation that was for the family and geared more towards my attention span (or lack there of).

 

Instead of taking me on the "adult" vacations, I was left with my grandparents. Something that could be done back then because grandma had been a stay at home wife, as was my mother. However, today it takes two parents working (or grandparents) to support the lifestyles we've become accustomed to. Things like central air, multiple cell phones, multiple cars (no one had two cars when I was a kid), big screen plasma TV's with home entertainment centers et.....

 

So I believe what you're seeing is more and more younger children traveling with parents. It's not that it's wrong but it is different than "back in the good old days" when children were to be seen and not heard.

 

Before we get to crazy with thinking people with young kids are rude let's not forget that it's not an age related item. Every day I've been tempted to ask someone how they got to be so old by being so stupid (wakling in the middle of the street, unable to park their car without scratching someone else's, standing in middle of the isle blocking everyone's passage so they can catch up on old times with their neighbor et....) Heck, each day I see at least a dozen adults that think their car is a phone booth. Far more than I see of people thinking their car is a restaurant of a makeup mirror.

 

Talking about how rude someone is reminds me of when the pot called the kettle to tell the kettle it was black. IMO, if you want to escape the kiddies in today's world, you'll have to go to an all inclusive, all adult vacation resort. Otherwise we'll have to put up with things such as electronic babysitters just so the parents can take a much needed vacation.

 

BTW, our kids are 26 and 23. Fortunately we don't have these issues with ours anymore. Our issues tend to be more dramatic and more expensive these days. I only WISH the only thing I had to worry about was keeping a 7 year old occupied during dinner on a cruise ship. ;)

[MIcruiser99]

No I do not have kids BUT was a kid myself so and remember being young. I was expected to act a certain way and was taught so at a very young age. Nothing has changed with raising kids but parents who put other things first over parenting. .

 

My thinking changed completely once I had children. I thought my SIL was terrible at keeping her children under control until I had two of my own. You really have to live it to understand it.

 

I do expect my children to behave in public. But this takes alot of work and I think some parents find it is easier to let technology take over and be the babysitter. It is sad but that is their choice of parenting.

[surfklutz]

I see this generation as having trouble down the road. Kids need to be entertained with multi-media ALL the time now - and what happens if they are in a situation where they actually have to entertain themselves. What happened to driving in a car and looking out the window - now kids are always glued to movies and TV. It will be interesting to see how these kids cope as adults.

 

That being said, I am not sure if it would have bothered me to have her next to me if I could not hear it.

[boaterette]

"My thinking changed completely once I had children. I thought my SIL was terrible at keeping her children under control until I had two of my own. You really have to live it to understand it.

 

I do expect my children to behave in public. But this takes alot of work and I think some parents find it is easier to let technology take over and be the babysitter. It is sad but that is their choice of parenting."

 

Unfortunately it is our society that must live with the consequesnces of their choice of parenting.

[Cruising89143]

My thinking changed completely once I had children. I thought my SIL was terrible at keeping her children under control until I had two of my own. You really have to live it to understand it.

 

I do expect my children to behave in public. But this takes alot of work and I think some parents find it is easier to let technology take over and be the babysitter. It is sad but that is their choice of parenting.

 

I have family members that have young kids and they know how to behave regardless of the setting. My niece has two boys that are around six to eight years of age and they are very well mannered. It still stand by the fact that it all goes into being taught at a very young age right from wrong. No one is going to win debate as we all have our own opinions.

[TKinAZ]

We're taking our 7 year old DGD on a cruise with us in June. I fully expect her to get through dinner just fine and enjoy the conversation, despite being scheduled for the late seating. However, if we are proven wrong and the dinners are too long for her, there are other options. First, we would gladly sacrifice the formal dining room experience to enjoy dinner with her in a more low-key area. If there was some reason we felt we must eat in the dining room, and she absolutely could not handle it, there's always Adventure Ocean for the children. Under no circumstances would we allow her to bring a DVD, Gameboy, or other electronic entertainment to the dining table--even at home.

 

With that said, however, you can't control other people's actions--only your own responses. I would absolutely not let it ruin my cruise. If the sound had been on all week, I think there would have been a valid complaint. Most likely, a polite explanation to the parents would have taken care of it.

 

It reminds me of any Disney vacation. How often have you been in one of the parks and seen some kid having a total melt-down, with the parent screaming something supportive like, "Shut up so we can have some fun?" :eek: A ship is a relatively small village; you just have to let the village idiots roll along on their own and make your own good time. :)

[maurick]

Why are you all so short and assume people have no children, if they do, they are lazy parents etc etc. Shame on all of you. This board is to help with cruising and sharing information. Parent skills belong on a family board

 

If the DVD was such a problem for you to view. Then you should have moved your seat or table.

 

It would not be my choice to bring a DVD for a child in a formal dining room. But, the child is quiet and not bothering you. That does not mean the child is wearing the pants in the famil or the parents are lazy. Its none of anyone's business why. Maybe you should have had dinner in the buffet area.

[wraithe]

I thought my SIL was terrible at keeping her children under control until I had two of my own. You really have to live it to understand it.

 

That's one of the reasons that this sort of thing bothers me, my SIL's three yo runs their house. She's never been told no, and had anyone besides my wife or myself mean it, and her manners show it. I won't go to a restaurant with her kids, after a few minutes, it's nothing for her to be playing musical chairs between parents, grandparents, and a great-aunt. Round and round the table. This will be our last year of a "family" vacation because of the way this child acted last year. It's a shame, but my 17 yo and 20 yo never acted the way this one does, because when necessary, there would be punishment, and they knew it. It doesn't have to be corporal, although that is quite effective.

[Casshew]

Why is everyone equating this little girl quietly watching a DVD as bad manners? Bad manners would be if it was loud with no headphones.

 

She could have eaten early and was just sitting with the adults while they had their meal, so she would not be alone in the cabin, or maybe didn't want to go to the kids club.

 

I don't think the family should be put down because their daughter was watching a movie, it's her vacation too, she should be able to enjoy herself.

 

It would not bother me at all to see a child enjoying themselves quietly while I have my dinner. We don't know that family and can't comment on their parenting skills over this :rolleyes:

[cruisin granny]

Well said Doug! As a teacher of "troubled teens", I have to add that hopefully parents are raising their kids differently than they were raised or I raised my kids in the 70's-80's. I did not have to worry about chat rooms, an internet that teaches good and bad, the "new" past time of choking and using cold medications to get high. Yes, I had my challenges as they were growing up but today's parents have to be very alert. i may get flamed for this but had to say it because I work with kids that have grown up much too soon and have dealt with a lot.

[Disneycruisers]

We took our son on his first cruise when he turned 7 and it never occurred to us that we should take him to the casual dining area. We ate in the dining room every evening and we all enjoyed it from beginning to end. Our little boy was taught at a very early age how to behave in a dining situation; if he misbehaved, or became restless, one of us would leave with him and sit in the car. End of problem. Over the years we have received many compliments on our son's behavior in public settings, and we hope it is something he will pass along to his children.

 

[/font]

 

Smooth Sailing! :) :) :)

 

Then again you have one child, and while your techniques certainly have much to do with it, I think the rest is the child himself (or herself.) My DB and DSIL's first child was just as such. They had a 'book' and practiced every method to a 't,' and received many compliments as well. Then their second child arrived. Not a chance! LOL! The techniques didn't work quite the same with him, and they still continued to receive comments about the older child.

 

DH and myself, have only one child, too. I do think each child is different though, while much, but not all, behavior is reflective of the parents.

[imsulin2]

Weeeelll! Call me old-fashioned, but when our five were young (5 within 10 years), I actually had the gall and audacity to insist that we eat dinner together AND refused to answer the phone during dinner time! Now, mind you, this was in the days of transformers, GI Joe/Barbie/Ken, Strawberry Shortcake, and Star Wars action figures. Very tempting playthings at the time, but banned from the dinner table. Also banned when we all went out for dinner. I guess we concentrated more on trying to teach them appropriate behavior while dining and a few manners....like not picking their noses, thonking mashed potatoes into sister's/brother's milk, flinging sweet peas on spoons, and putting corn kernels on teeth. Trust me...it took awhile!! But, in the long run, it pretty much worked. When we began cruising with them in their teens (and not all at once), the subject of Walkmans at dinner never came up, because they weren't necessary. Now, I realize that a 7-year old is just that. Had five of them. However, I've never seen a 7-year old or 17-year old sit through a 2-hour church service with a DVD player or wearing earphones. That's just plain rude. No, I'm not comparing the two, but I really believe that a 7-year old can actually be taught to participate in a 2-hour dinner! I feel badly for those kids that their parents opted for techno-babysitters instead of including them in these dinners. Could they not have chosen to engage those kids in actual..um...er...ah...conversation about activities of the day and plans for tomorrow? Numbers 3 and 5 (and a Son-in-Law) asnd I are going on the Jewel next month. Right now, they're all about formal dresses, sports coats and ties, and proper dining attire. I'll guarantee you there will be no Palm Pilots, Blackberrys, DVD players, or cell phones at the dinner table. We'll just kind of talk about how much fun we're having!

 

BTW - both their Dad and I worked full-time. It was just as "fast-paced" then as it is now.

[BobbyK]

I have raised three sons and I have taught six, seven and eight year olds (first, second and third grades) for twenty three years. I'm old but not old fashioned. First of all, I find this situation very, very sad. Instead of sharing with their daughter the day's events, cruising, dinner plans, even what the silverware was used for she was allowed or encouraged to watch her DVD. I realize that this is not easy for little ones but they need to be taught this in a positive way. Think about your conversations with the people around you and how much you share and learn about everything from just cruising to locations around the world. I raised three boys and I remember the mischief they can and did cause sometimes when we went out. Of course, you have to give them the look, the trip to the bathroom, etc. Children with special problems still need the opportunity to socialize, learn how to behave, and the chance to experience the dining room experience. By the way, I was on a short cruise recently that had hundreds of little kids (as they had a large band competion). They were all well behaved. There were no problems and no kids were watching DVD's in the dining room.

Robin :cool:

[JWMom]

Why are you all so short and assume people have no children, if they do, they are lazy parents etc etc. Shame on all of you. This board is to help with cruising and sharing information. Parent skills belong on a family board

 

If the DVD was such a problem for you to view. Then you should have moved your seat or table.

 

It would not be my choice to bring a DVD for a child in a formal dining room. But, the child is quiet and not bothering you. That does not mean the child is wearing the pants in the famil or the parents are lazy. Its none of anyone's business why. Maybe you should have had dinner in the buffet area.

 

Why should I have to have dinner in the buffet area? I just made a simple comment that I thought it was a little tacky and not really appropriate for a more formal setting that they have a semi-dress code for (but apparently no codes for electronic devices!!). I didn't want to move my table because I liked my waiters and wanted to stay with them. We were at a table for 10 and had the 4 seats along the wall so my front eyesight was basically at her and the screen. I guess I could have looked off to the right wall the whole time....And I never said as one melodramatic poster said that it ruined my cruise. I was making a simple observation and wondered if this happened often. Yes, the girl obviously is not hurting anyone but as one poster pointed out, if you went to a nice upscale restaurant would you want to be watching Scooby Doo the whole meal? I wonder if this child does this at home. Yes, it's also better than having her misbehave the whole meal-but if that happened I would hope the parents would remove her from the dining room-but as we all know, that doesn't always happen. I did appreciate them bringing in the headphones the 2nd night. Maybe they felt they wanted to have the whole family "dine" together and that's why they didn't take her to the kids activities-but obviously, she's not interacting with them if she's watching a movie the whole time!!

[caribbean dreams]

We had 5 & 7 year old kids sitting at the table next to us, if i was not a polite person i would have said something.

They would crawl up on top of the table and lay down during the middle of dinner, the partents would just reach around then to get what they needed, then they would wonder the dining room & find empty chairs, drag them to their table and drape all the napkins they could find over them to make chair tents, crawl on their hands and knees under everyones table, all the while their parents totally ignored the way they were acting. This went on every night, if it was not for the good dining room food, I would have eaten in the buffet.

If parents do not want to control the kids, take them to the play room during dinner.

I take my kids in the dining room and they always behave well, if they didn't, i would not take them.

My point is, even though it is very bad manors, I would rather have a child watching cartoons in the dining room than running wild.

 

 

[JWMom]

Thank you LeeAnne. I agree with the ""look how much better a parent I am" thread." It's usually people that don't have children" that are the experts on raising children. I can't figure that one out.

 

I don't think I ever said that I'm a better parent-but I do have two children (only mentioning that because of your quote) ages 9 and 12 who have always behaved at dinner and in public. I never said I was a better parent but have always had expectations of my children.

[johnjen]

Drat! Does thiis mean I shouldn't bring my banjo to dinner? I was planning on entertaining some people!

 

The nerve of that little girl! I'd have preferred a Groovie Ghoulies DVD!!

 

Just being faecetious here! Sorry, I have pre-cruise fever!

[Casshew]

Just because this little girl was watching a video doesn't mean she can't behave without one. Maybe the DVD was a reward because she had been so good sitting though dinner. Maybe everyone is reading too much into all this.

[JWMom]

Just because this little girl was watching a video doesn't mean she can't behave without one. Maybe the DVD was a reward because she had been so good sitting though dinner. Maybe everyone is reading too much into all this.

 

Well of course she was good sitting through dinner-she was watching a DVD the whole time!!:)

[LLSullie]

After all my questions regarding attire in Dining Room, I had an interesting thing happen. We just returned from our first cruise on the Jewel and it was fabulous. However, at dinner at the table next to us, there was a pretty large group together with a daughter maybe 7 yo and she brought a portable DVD to dinner every night. (this was the 8:30 seating too).

 

JWMom ... hope you had a wonderful cruise.

 

I must say this is surprising to hear. I can remember taking books and even crayons, when the kids were little, to a restaurant. But it would never occur to me to do something like this. My other concern would be, and this is just me, why is a 7 YO having dinner at 8:30 at night? I understand it's a vacation, however the ship does have the "kids center" and sitters available, and younger children do tend to get a bit squirmey after a certain point. I believe if my kids were younger, and I wanted to eat dinner that late, I would make other arrangements for my child.

 

Heck I have teenagers and they requested the earlier seating so they could get on with their evenings. :p